First body and paint job gone wrong...

[drc270]

After getting some estimates to repaint my car, I decided to learn to do it myself.
I learned alot including why body and paint is expensive.
While sanding, I discovered the need to replace both rear quarters, rear filler panel,
a door skin, both front fenders and valance.
The fabrication was time consuming but turned out great.
I took everything including new sheetmetal to bare metal 80 grit, cleaned up all welds
and used "all-metal" for initial filler. Once sanded to my liking, I sprayed entire car with
epoxy primer, did remainder of filler work and one more coat of epoxy followed by three
good coats of 2k primer, blocked hand padded and one more coat of epoxy prior to satin
black base/ clear.
Everything went well until this point. I was told the blushing would fade out with cure
so I have put the car in the sun a few days. First the blushing has not changed at all
but my other problem is the "all-metal" swells up terribly from the heat.
anybody?

[grenade inspector]

at least you figured out what needed done and did it right instead of paying someone to lay paint over a time bomb of problems. I have'nt had any experience with "all metal" filler and cant speak to that, I've seen what looks like blushing on jobs where the coat got wetter in places, perhaps thats the cause?

[Blown73]

How much all metal do you have on the car? Is this in place of the original body filler at the seams?

[lildonn]

I seen this happen,and it was the reducer I used it was for wrong outside temp. Got the wright stuff and was fine as for your blush problem

[elitecustombody]

The blushing is trapped moisture/condensation.If you want the paint to last, sand off the problem areas, do not cover it up with more paint, because it will show in few years by tiny blisters,while you're at it grind out the All-Metal filler and use Everglass

[Off Duty]

The blushing is trapped moisture/condensation.If you want the paint to last, sand off the problem areas, do not cover it up with more paint, because it will show in few years by tiny blisters,while you're at it grind out the All-Metal filler and use Everglass

What is everglass and why over metal?
Just curious, thanks.

[drc270]

Thanks for all the replies guys.
I used the all-metal at all welded seams- sail panels,filled seams between quarter and rear filler panel,
quarter to rocker, and rear pan seams.
I was told yesterday the swelling is a result of stitch welding and should have continuous weld.

Wrong reducer?

I was hoping for a reply from you Stefan. Why Everglass and not all-metal and do I need to do more welding?

[1red68]

do you have pics?

i have used some all-metal and never had an issue. you should ask on of the paint reps, but I'm pretty sure 2 coats of sealer would have prevented this.

[drc270]

I used the all-metal directly over bare metal/welds. I mixed it very well and filled entire cavities with as
much pressure as I could with a metal drywall knife.
Sanded and recoated to fill very few tiny air pockets.
I could not have been more thorough with cleaning and sanding for mechanical adhesion.

[makoshark]

Thanks for all the replies guys.
I used the all-metal at all welded seams- sail panels,filled seams between quarter and rear filler panel,
quarter to rocker, and rear pan seams.
I was told yesterday the swelling is a result of stitch welding and should have continuous weld.

Wrong reducer?

I was hoping for a reply from you Stefan. Why Everglass and not all-metal and do I need to do more welding?

Hate to say it, but what I highlighted here is your problem. At least you caught it before you got paint on it. I have seen this, including the car I bought, on quite a few nice cars that would do this on areas that were not fully welded.

[drc270]

Thanks mako,
Unfortunately the car is painted, but not without issues.
I went with base/clear for a good protective coat but cant believe how easy it will scratch, and
with the flattening agent I am unable to remove scratches without changing sheen of paint.
I am considering resanding, shooting straight clear and cut&buff for gloss black.
Had I known this about satin black I would have gone with different color.

[1red68]

the "blushing" you are having an issue with, is it only on panels you welded on or do you have it on say the hood and deck lid where there was no welding? I'm betting you do....

sorry, but I'm going to disagree with most on this issue. I've stitched and spot welded wheel tubs, box sides and rear 1/4's and as long as i used weld through primer, self etching primer (epoxy), seem sealer and under-coating, I've never had an paint issue due to the welding process.

when i first read your post i was thinking you had trapped solvent from re-coating to quickly and not alowing enough flash time, it been my experience that a good sealer would prevent that, but hey, results may very. :)

Classic Trucks in their paint trouble shooting guide says this and i agree with them 100%.......



Blushing is a common problem when spraying in high humidity/cold conditions. It happens when the air and evaporating solvent from the spray gun lowers the temperature of the surface being painted to below the dew point (the temperature at which air becomes saturated and produces water). This condition causes condensation in or on the paint layer producing a smoky or milky looking cloud on the paint surface. Blushing can normally be corrected by adding a bit of retarder (a slow-evaporating solvent) to your paint mixture and then re-coating, or by letting the finish cure and then compounding and buffing. You can help prevent blushing by using a good-quality thinner/reducer that's correct for your conditions, adding the recommended amount of retarder when spraying in humid conditions, or by applying heat after application to help evaporate excess moisture.

Read more: http://www.customclassictrucks.com/techarticles/0903cct_troubleshooting_truck_paint/solvent_popping_discoloration_and_paint_blushing.h tml#ixzz1OJwhyRhT

[tazzz25906112]

Thanks mako,
Unfortunately the car is painted, but not without issues.
I went with base/clear for a good protective coat but cant believe how easy it will scratch, and
with the flattening agent I am unable to remove scratches without changing sheen of paint.
I am considering resanding, shooting straight clear and cut&buff for gloss black.
Had I known this about satin black I would have gone with different color.

Quick question, did you apply the flattening agent in the black,,, or in the clear??? I've heard of issues with people trying to place the flattening agent in the black and getting blotches/blushing in the paint before...
Please take this post with a grain of salt as this is a second hand understanding,,, I'm not a painter myself but it sounded similar to what I had heard about and hope it may help to shed some light or offer a second consideration to be confirmed by someone here with more experience...

[ROBS6T8]

Thanks for all the replies guys.
I used the all-metal at all welded seams- sail panels,filled seams between quarter and rear filler panel,
quarter to rocker, and rear pan seams.
I was told yesterday the swelling is a result of stitch welding and should have continuous weld.

Wrong reducer?

I was hoping for a reply from you Stefan. Why Everglass and not all-metal and do I need to do more welding?

I thought stitch welding would eventually lead to a continous weld? Is it not in the end? Doing it this way reduces heat build up thus preventing warping of the metal.
I'm glad you took this upon yourself and posted this for all of us "paint in your garage" types!

[elitecustombody]

What is everglass and why over metal?
Just curious, thanks.

Everglass is short-strand fiberglass filler made by Evercoat. IMO it's the best between USC,Dynatron,Bondo brands.It's not as rubbery,less air pockets,not as susceptible to expansion and shrinking by heat or cold.I just prefer using it over All-Metal because it doesn't have as short of shelf life and not as expensive,it sands a little easier as well.

[elitecustombody]

OP, as it's been pointed out, you already answered your question, stitch welding on exterior seams is a big NO-NO. All seams should be welded solid, so now it will be a challenge to get all the filler out of seams for clean weld, I suggest grind as much as you can and clean the rest of the filler with blaster.

What brand paint and clear did you use? was it premixed with flattening agent or you had to add it? I know for fact Matrix clear is very tough, I tried scratching a bumper that had to be repaired and repainted with a key and could not make a scratch, after a while of attempting to scratch the area started to become slightly glossy,the paint was about a year old though. The trick is to use slowest hardener available to keep blotches and blushing away.

[drc270]

Wow! You guys are great!
The blushing is all over the car. To add one more negative to the finish coat- it scratches way to easily,
this paint wont last a season.
It is Dupont chromabase black with hot hues flattening agent added to clear/ Ihave had rattle-can paint be
more durable.
Thank you for the info on fillers as I will try Everglass.
At this point I am considering scrapping the satin, dont want to as the wifes color scheme is cool.satin body
gloss black accents, but...

[drc270]

Hey Stefan,
You mentioned sanding off problem areas and not applying more paint.
I am leaning toward gloss black. Can I just wet sand with 1000, apply another coat or two of unmatted
clear, cut and buff?

[Happyfunballs]

Are the paint materials you used compatible? Sound like a lot going on there. If you have blushing all over the car, you'll need to strip it and start over.

[John Wright]

Even if it takes you a couple of tries to get it where you are satisfied...you have gained a couple of things by enduring through your frustrations. It's not all bad....

Gained experience that you didn't have before.
Saved yourself the frustration of having your car in "Paint Jail".
Saved yourself the frustration of trusting your pride and joy to someone else who messed it all up.
You are only out your time and a few materials...and learned somethings along the way.

[elitecustombody]

Hey Stefan,
You mentioned sanding off problem areas and not applying more paint.
I am leaning toward gloss black. Can I just wet sand with 1000, apply another coat or two of unmatted
clear, cut and buff?

Bad idea if you want nice finish for many years,because you will just cover up a problem,it may not be significant for a while, but it will show up down the road. So it's up to you to decide when/if you want to re-do it. The clear you have on now can be wetsanded and buffed to a decent gloss, you can try that as well,