Varishock installation

[wmhjr]

I started installing the Varishocks I just got. Quickset2 for front and rear. Going on the Pontiac, which as OEM style spindles, and the SC&C stuff (tall ball joints, adjustable UCA, tubular LCA, SPC springs, Hellwig tubular sway bar).

To be honest, it's been a PITA so far. Since the shocks are too large to fit through the opening in the tubular lowers (or stock ones, for that matter) the LCA needs to be separated from the spindle to allow the shock to be installed inside first. So you have to bolt the ears of the shock bottom to the LCA, then slide the coil spring over, then (here's the combination) rotate the LCA up, align the ball joint with the spindle, keep the coil indexed properly, and get the top of the shock shaft through the upper mount. Whew! After a bunch of head scratching and multiple attempts I did get one on. BTW, I did know in advance that I'd have to do this, but didn't expect it to be quite as much of a pain.

Here's the question for any of you Varishock users out there. In order to maintain clearance of the adjusters to the coil, the adjusters must be facing the rotor (toward the outside of the car). Unfortunately, with the springs correctly indexed, one of the adjusters is hidden by a coil. You can't get the tool (allen wrench basically) in there at all. You can barely get your fingers in a little to adjust it, but since each click up (clockwise) has a little more resistance I'm not sure you could get it much more than to a setting of 6 or 7.

Has anyone else used these or have any info? If I have something incorrect I'd rather find out now.

I'm going to do the other side tomorrow if I have any garage time, along with the rear Varishocks - which are a far easier proposition.

[ROBS6T8]

Wow... sounds like my installation was a heck of a lot easier! Actually I cut the lower control arm shock opening a bit bigger, bigger than I was expecting! I have not had time to play with the shocks though. I can tell you that I have room (slight room) to adjust the shocks with fingers. I'm going to buy an extra allen wrench and do some custom cutting/grinding to make it easier to get in there. I couldn't get an allen in there now!
Yes, the back will be a breeze!

[jocko124]

I installed mine while redoing the entire front end, so it was a breeze.

[Chad-1stGen]

I'm also curious how easy these are to adjust inside the coil spring. Anyone have these on a 1st gen Camaro? How is it to adjust the front?

[nicks67camaro]

I have them in a first gen with Hotchkis springs. I can get my finger in and adjust them not too hard just gotta get a good grip on it.

Back to the original post, are you trying to adjust them with the car on the ground? If so maybe you can take some of the load off the suspension just to give more room between the spring coils.

[Chad-1stGen]

I have them in a first gen with Hotchkis springs. I can get my finger in and adjust them not too hard just gotta get a good grip on it.

Thanks Nick is this something you can do at the track without lifting the car? Such as turning the wheel to expose the front or back of the suspension?

[wmhjr]

On mine, the car is on my 2 post lift, no weight on the suspension. Wheels have to be off. no way to get in there with the wheel on.

[wmhjr]

I installed mine while redoing the entire front end, so it was a breeze.

Curious about that Lee. I essentially disassembled the front end. Sway bar is removed. Took the hub/rotor/caliper off. So, there is really no difference than if I were doing it from scratch. In order for the ball joint to go into the spindle, the spring does need compressed a little. I had to lower the car on the lift with a jack stand under the LCA, while both keeping the coil aligned and pointed correctly - AND trying to get the shock upper shaft through the hole. The correct installation is for the ears to be mounted on the TOP of the LCA and not cut the LCA. Both Mark - and Alston Chassis Works confirmed this. I know there are some older instruction sheets out there that do it differently.

[jocko124]

Agreed--the ears mount on top of the LCA. I actually did this by myself, so I used some wire to hold the spring in place then I attached the upper shock mount (which is just a shaft that fits through the top and bolts on) and I left the shock hanging compressed while I attached the lower ball joint. I then attached the lower ears....well actually I couldn't attach them because at full droop they shocks are about 1.5" too short. But both Marcus & Alston say this is okay and to lower the car on the wheels/tires & attach the ears to the LCA. Apparently as long as your front end is not going airborne while driving this is not an issue!!

[wmhjr]

How did you attach the lower ears to the LCA after the coil spring was already in? I used 5/16-18 bolts with locknuts and washers to secure the lower ears to the LCA. You can't access the bolts inside the coil, so you have to bolt those ears to the LCA prior to putting the coil on - and then you need to rotate the LCA, coil and shock up. The coil has to both be centered in the pocket on top as well as indexed. The shock shaft doesn't align real good with the upper hole - you have to kind of deflect it a little to guide it in the hole. Even at full extension, the shock shaft doesn't start going through the hole until the coil is compressed a bit.

[jocko124]

I used the same hardware as you to attach the ears to the LCA. However, I attached the top of the shock and left it compressed. After attaching the lower ball joint, I put the bolts in the ears, extended the shocks and manuvered the bolts (while they were sitting in the ears) into the holes in the LCA. A little tricky, but not too bad. I actually used the adjustment knob to push the shock down--and I had the adjustment knob set to the lowest setting for ease of movement.

[nicks67camaro]

Thanks Nick is this something you can do at the track without lifting the car? Such as turning the wheel to expose the front or back of the suspension?

yes I have adjusted them with the car on the ground with the wheels at full lock to expose it easier. one thing I noticed is getting a firm click to know that you're at the right spot. I have had to back one all the way off and start over because the click didn't feel firm and I had questioned the setting.

[wmhjr]

I'm guessing you have very little backspacing? I'm running 5" so far in my application it doesn't seem likely that I'll be able to do that.

[wmhjr]

I used the same hardware as you to attach the ears to the LCA. However, I attached the top of the shock and left it compressed. After attaching the lower ball joint, I put the bolts in the ears, extended the shocks and manuvered the bolts (while they were sitting in the ears) into the holes in the LCA. A little tricky, but not too bad. I actually used the adjustment knob to push the shock down--and I had the adjustment knob set to the lowest setting for ease of movement.

Hmmm... Still confused. How did you hold the bolt from turning when you tightened the nuts on the bottom of the LCAs? That's the direction I would have gone but I couldn't figure any way to do that. The pretty fat coil springs really obstruct being able to get a wrench of fingers in there at all - plus the pockets on the bottom of the SPC tubular LCAs are pretty deep. I'm using Grade 8 bolts with locknuts.

[ROBS6T8]

I have them in a first gen with Hotchkis springs. I can get my finger in and adjust them not too hard just gotta get a good grip on it.

X2
Alston confirmed the trimming of the LCA with me. Nick, did you have to do some trimming? And not just for the adjustment knob!

[nicks67camaro]

yes I am running the factory lower control arms and had to clearance it a bunch. Getting the shock to have enough room I needed to open that hole up some. I actually ended up welding in reinforcement washers where the shock mounts to since it looked weak after opening the hole up. I also enlarged the hole and use a bolt and locking nut to keep the shock there instead of the factories welded nut set up. I had just enough room to get a small wrench in there and tighten everything up.

I think the after market lowers and the different coil spring manufacturer is why your having some trouble. I used to have a set of BMR lowers that I got rid of since they didn't work with what I wanted to run, the varishock shocks and hotchkis spring. It also had a pretty deep pocket where it can be had to access the adjustment knob.

Is the A-Body a much different spring set up? Can you run the shock on the top of the LCA and just get is high enough to get out of the interference with the spring? I haven't heard good or bad about running the shock on top.

[wmhjr]

I got mine in - no need to clearance for fitment - but one of the adjustment knobs on one side is REAL hard to access. I can get at it but would hate to be trying to get it on one of the "upper" settings.

On another note, I'm now installing the rear Varishocks. Another massive PITA trying to assemble the shock! Trying to get the cantilever bolt through the poly bushings inside the lower shock eyelet? My god. I could absolutely have designed a better solution. There ought to be at least some bevel to allow the cantilever bolt start through but instead it's the opposite - a very hard edge. I'm very impressed with the quality of the Varishocks but not so much either the documentation or some of the details.

[wmhjr]

Got it done. Took some pics which I'll post tomorrow. Had to sand the edges of the poly bushings on the lower mounts of the rear Varishocks. Glad that's over!

[jocko124]

Bill I sent you a PM but your box was full!

[wmhjr]

Sorry - I'll clean it out now. Didn't realize.

[wmhjr]

Made room in my mailbox.

Also, a few other things.

First of all, I made a comment about the Varishock design I should be more clear about. The unit itself from a design and quality perspective seems excellent and well beyond anything I could ever do. Hopefully performance will mirror my first impressions. My comment was really just about the bushings. The only way I was able to get the lower cantilever assembly together on my rear shocks was to send the hard edges off. Even then it required some fancy vice support, being very careful to not damage or scratch up the shock. Those bushings really ought to have a beveled leading edge. That, and the documentation, I'm not so crazy about. Also, I wish the adjustment knobs had a bit more protruding surfaces so that when a coil obstructs the center and you can't use the tool, it would be easier to get a firm grip with the tips of your fingers. Seems obvious to me that many people won't have much access. To be honest, the front installation and subsequent concerns over being able to really get to the adjusters made me wonder if I didn't screw up, and should have just installed coil-overs.

Also, now that I've mounted the wheels back on it appears as though I maybe can adjust the fronts with the wheels still mounted, though it will be very very difficult.

Finally, I'm very embarassed to say that I expected it to take about an hour total to install these things, and it took many times longer than that.

[wmhjr]

OK, as promised here's a quick primer on my experiences installing the Varishock Bolt-In double adjustable shocks. I'm running the SPC springs, Howe tall ball joints, SPC "race" adjustable upper control arms, SPC tubular lower control arms, Hellwig tubular front sway bar, Wilwood 14" 6 piston front and 12.2" 4 piston rear brakes, Moser crate 12 bolt rear end, Currie Currectrac rear upper and lower arms. Rear sway bar (Spohn 1") removed in preparation for installation of the enroute Hellwig tubular adjustable unit (expected in this week). Bilstein shocks removed, front and rear. On the front, using one flat spacer and one aluminum spacer.

Here's the passenger side ready for installation. Caliper, hub and rotor removed.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4916-1.jpg

This is the first spacer, which gets installed at the bottom of the LCA spring pocket
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4919-1.jpg

Both first spacer and aluminum spacer seated in the spring pocket of the LCA.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4921-1.jpg

Here you see the shock mounted in the LCA without any springs. Note how "deep" those 5/16-18 bolts are. When I droppedthe spring around the shock, I just couldn't see a good way to be able to secure those bolts and tighten them if the spring was in place, which is why I elected to mount the bottoms first.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4922-1.jpg

Drop the spring over the shock and into the pocket. Make sure that the top of the spring is properly indexed into the upper pocket.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4923-1.jpg

Next problem was two-fold. With those spacers, there's no way the LCA can be pushed up enough manually to seat the ball joint into the spindle. Ordinarly I use 1/2" all thread with large washers and a bracket I made to go where the shock normally goes, and pull the control arms together. However, since the shock must be inside the LCAs first in this case, that's not an option. Had to support the LCA from underneath and lower it, pushing the LCA up, guiding the ball joint into the spindle. The second problem is that the shock itself needs to have the upper shaft go up and through the upper mount hole - but there are 2 issues. First, at rest it isn't aligned. You need to pull it "forward" to line it up with the hole. Furthermore, the shaft is about 1.5" too short, so as you're compressing the LCA up, you need to keep the coil spring aligned correctly, keep the ball joint aligned with the spindle, AND align the upper shock shaft with the mounting hole - for which you are primarily blind.

Installed configuration:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4924-1.jpg

With the brakes back on - you can see the rotor (out of focus and fuzzy) to the right. Note the two adjustment knobs. This is the drivers side, and the dampening knob is the real "hard" to get to one. The rebound isn't as bad. The passenger side is just barely a hair better.

Then for the rear, which I though would be far easier. First of all, I realized that the upper bolts securing the eyelets to the frame crossmember had almost no clearance above them. On the drivers side I also had the pleasure of having the hard stainless fuel supply and fuel return lines right next to it, in the way of course. On the passenger side, I had mounted my fuel pre-filter nearby which also ended up getting in the way. I could have removed the exhaust which would have made a little more room, but obviously not anything in terms of vertical clearance.

For assembling the shocks, in the pic below you seen the cantilever bolt and one of the poly bushings. The non-threaded part of the cantilever bolt is .624" outside diameter. The poly bushing is .578 inside diameter. Both have sharp 90deg edges on them. Then, the ouside diameter of the bushing is 1.133" and the inside diameter of the lower shock mount is 1.117". But that's really not accurate. Because when you have the cantilever pins in the bushing, it expandes the outside diameter quite a bit. And again - both the OD of the bushing and the ID of the lower shock mount are 90deg "sharp" edges. After struggling with this, I lightly sanded both the ID and OD edges of the poly bushings to allow them to lead in the shock mount.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4932-1.jpg

After that, it was simply an exercise of trying to get and hold nut/bolt in the very limited space above the rear crossmember to tighten it.

Finished product - not yet wiped down...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4933-1.jpg

And very fuzzy pic of the inside - sorry for the poor pic quality.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4934-1.jpg

[ROBS6T8]

Looks great. Thanks for the pics. I'll keep that rear shock thing in mind when it comes time to do mine.

[jocko124]

How low is the front end now?

[Chad-1stGen]

With the brakes back on - you can see the rotor (out of focus and fuzzy) to the right. Note the two adjustment knobs. This is the drivers side, and the dampening knob is the real "hard" to get to one. The rebound isn't as bad. The passenger side is just barely a hair better.



Maybe I'm missunderstanding but I didn't see a pic that matches this description and it would be the one I'm most interested in. It is curious that these adjustable shocks may be so difficult to adjust if not in a coil over format.

[wmhjr]

Maybe I'm missunderstanding but I didn't see a pic that matches this description and it would be the one I'm most interested in. It is curious that these adjustable shocks may be so difficult to adjust if not in a coil over format.

Sorry - you're right. Here it is.

Hard to see, but:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4913-1.jpg

This is a better pic. The dampening adjustment knob (on left) is actually even harder to get at than it looks.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4914-1.jpg

Hope this helps....

[ponchoblue]

i also had a real pain installing them i have single adjustable varishocks i knew nothing about indexing the front springs i just rotated them where i thought was best to get to the adjuster still did not help is that a problem that there not indexed i am going to try again by compressing the springs with clamps so i can rotate them i do wish the mounting was closed eyelets instead of slots it would have been a bit easier to get the bolts to stay put as far as the rears they are tight against the exhaust i used a press to put the bushings in at least that was easy they do feel a bit better than the bilstiens but i will never change them again

[wmhjr]

Front springs in particular need to be properly indexed. There is a pocket for the end of the spring pigtail. If it's not indexed correctly, it effectively lengthens the spring in the pocket.

[11thhourfabrication]

Hi wmhjr
I am not trying to be a wiseass but you should have gone with the coilover varishocks. You have control arms that will allow you to use them and it make adjustments and spring changes easy. I tried to get shockwaves and multiple brands of coilovers to work in my 60 and finally found the varishock, It was the only one with the proper dimensions to fit. I had the same problem with tight bushings but if you use some energy suspension poly lube they go on alot easier.

[wmhjr]

Hi wmhjr
I am not trying to be a wiseass but you should have gone with the coilover varishocks. You have control arms that will allow you to use them and it make adjustments and spring changes easy. I tried to get shockwaves and multiple brands of coilovers to work in my 60 and finally found the varishock, It was the only one with the proper dimensions to fit. I had the same problem with tight bushings but if you use some energy suspension poly lube they go on alot easier.

Thanks and not taking it as wiseass, but there was a reason I didn't go with the coilover. Suspension travel. There is measurably less suspension travel with the coilovers than with the coil/shock combination. Not picking on the Varishocks in any way - and am not saying that there is anything wrong with them (the coilover bolt-in model) whatsoever. Just that when you look at effective shock travel I decided (after talking QUITE a while with Marcus) that since my spring rate was where I wanted it, my height was where I wanted it, and the only thing I wanted to change was damping and rebound, the bolt in double adjustable was optimal for my use. BTW, I'm saying this in reference ONLY to the "bolt in" Varishocks for the 1st Gen A-body compared to the traditional coil/double adjustable varishock, and NOT comparing coilovers in general. IF I were running an Alston, Schwartz or Roadster shop chassis rather than an actual A-Body frame, I'd have coilovers.

Hope this makes sense.

[Roadbuster]

This is a better pic. The dampening adjustment knob (on left) is actually even harder to get at than it looks.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/04/DSC_4914-1.jpg


wmhjr,
Did you try a screwdriver handled ball driver (bondhus) like
http://www.amazon.com/Inch-Hex-size-Plastic-Individual/dp/B001AJK5SC?

That is what I use to adjust my front varishocks and the size is 7/64". Because of the ball tip you can get at the allen in the center of the knob to turn it.

[CFster]

I can see where it would be difficult. With my QS1s, I can usually get a finger in between a coil, and another up past the bottom of the shock through the hole in the bottom of the LCA. But just barely. I don't know how you would get to an additional knob in a different location like on a QS2.

[wmhjr]

wmhjr,
Did you try a screwdriver handled ball driver (bondhus) like
http://www.amazon.com/Inch-Hex-size-Plastic-Individual/dp/B001AJK5SC?

That is what I use to adjust my front varishocks and the size is 7/64". Because of the ball tip you can get at the allen in the center of the knob to turn it.

I can do that on the passenger side, but not with one of the knobs on the drivers side. The spring is just indexed to the perfectly wrong alignment, but that's where it needs to be. I can get my finger tips in to adjust them so it's no big deal, but I've passed along my ideas for how to improve the design to Alston.

[cspecken]

Did you think about notching the lower control arms so the shocks could be installed from the from the bottom (http://cachassisworks.com/Attachments/Instructions/899-031-203.pdf? I will be running the SPC Upper and Lower Control arms with the Varishocks.

[wmhjr]

Did you think about notching the lower control arms so the shocks could be installed from the from the bottom (http://cachassisworks.com/Attachments/Instructions/899-031-203.pdf? I will be running the SPC Upper and Lower Control arms with the Varishocks.

I thought (briefly) about it. I also talked directly to Alston and to Mark Savitske. Both indicated that I should NOT do that with the SPC lower arms. I have some ideas as to what I'd do again - I'd make an adapter plate. However it's not important enough for me to rip the front end apart to do it now. Note that in that PDF, those are stock LCAs. The SPC unit is MUCH thicker and frankly, you never know what changes you'll make in the future. I would be very unhappy to cut them up and find out later that a future front suspension mod required the notches to not be there :(

[ponchoblue]

ok so i originally indexed them in the spacer plate i did not know thats what they called it it was a real $%#CH to install

[cspecken]

I thought (briefly) about it. I also talked directly to Alston and to Mark Savitske. Both indicated that I should NOT do that with the SPC lower arms. I have some ideas as to what I'd do again - I'd make an adapter plate. However it's not important enough for me to rip the front end apart to do it now. Note that in that PDF, those are stock LCAs. The SPC unit is MUCH thicker and frankly, you never know what changes you'll make in the future. I would be very unhappy to cut them up and find out later that a future front suspension mod required the notches to not be there :(



Bummer, sounds like I will need to do what everyone else has done too! I hope nothing goes wrong with the shocks, not looking forward to dropping the control arms. I would be interested in hearing about your adapter plate idea.

[wmhjr]

Chris, here is what I was thinking of.

Machine a round adapter plate that would go between the lower control arm pocket (machined to the same OD spec) and the lower shock mount. Countersink two grade 8 bolts from under the adapter, securing through the lower shock mount (on the shock). The height of the adapter would not create a travel issue as the shock (fully extended) is actually slightly short as it is, and at full extension like when the car is on a 2 post lift, the shock shaft is limiting travel to begin with.

Then drill and tap two holes on the bottom of the adapter, so that you could assemble the shock to the adapter, mount the shock in the upper perch, then raise the lower control arm and compress the spring, just allowing the assembly to slide into the pocket of the lower control arm, then run the bolts in from the bottom. I would probably machine a lead, or angle on the bottom outside edge of the adapter to allow it to guide easily into place in the pocket as the lower arm raises.

Don't know if I'm over-thinking this, but it makes sense to me.