400 rebuild...dont wanna forget anything

[yellow1098Greg]

I am doing a rebuild on a pontiac...that has Edlebrock performer Cylinder heads 87cc combustion cambers 2.110" Int/1.660" Exh valves....1.460" valve springs.... .575" max lift...and 7/16 rocker studs...215cc intake ports....roller rockers...Competition headers..and a edleborck RPM camshaft kit...I drive the car with occasional drag race and crusin intentions...but want a fast reliable hot rod...the situation is that its being rebuilt because i spun a bearing….it will have new pistons and bore 30 over..new crank...any and all advice i greatly appreciate my main questions were since I have the car apart what can I should I add along with what im doing...maybe little stuff we wish would have thought of before reassembly..once again i want a fast kick ass car that isnt at risk to be rebuilt again when I step on it...thanks guys :smoke:

[Scott Parkhurst]

Actually, you're pretty okay at that equipment level. Yes, you can make it faster but with the stuff you've got, it's a decent package. That cam isn't too big, the heads are good, and Pontiacs don't need a whole lot compared to other makes. You will want to recurve your distributor and ensure the entire oil system is up to snuff, and you'll need decent round port headers (good luck on a nice fit)...BUT- you've got most of the bases covered. It should give you peak power at about 6,000- no more, maybe less, and that means you won't have to spin it to the moon to enjoy it. RPM is what kills stuff and demands high-end parts.

Gear it accordingly to take advantage of the fat torque curve. Pontiacs rock.

[yellow1098Greg]

thanks man....yaaaa i was thinkin if i put the correct chip in my MSD that should protect alot......i have alot of questions on curving that distributer correctly...

[rohrt]

I have these notes that I saved from post on the PY site....


A customer set out to build the same engine. They even dyno'd it, and it barely made about 360hp and about 490tq. Of course I get a phone call wondering where all the power was at? During a phone conversation, I asked a few questions about the build.
Did you zero deck the block?...no.
Was the block squared in relation to the crankshaft centerline?....No
Did you degree the cam....No.
Did you back cut the valves.....No.
Did you hand fit the ring packs.....No.
Was the spinning assembly balanced.....No.
Did you install high ratio rockers.....No.
Was the block final honed for piston fit with a torque plate....No.
Was the intake separated from the water crossover and marked for perfect alignment with the ports?....No
Was the valve train geometry checked?
Were the exhaust crossovers in the heads filled with solid aluminum?...etc, etc, etc.


Elongater the pushrod holes in the head for 1.65 rockers


Use an adjustable locking nut for hydraulic camshafts and adjust to zero lash. Great "tork" booster.
- 455 motors - Use 472 Cadillac rubber rear main seal. (seal #1495168) (less crankshaft drag)
- 2" 4 hole plastic carb spacer is worth trying.
- Use stainless steal valves for the intake valves only - stainless doesn't disapate heat well.
- Cut down the oil filter bypass spring located in the oil filter adapter. (cut off 2 1/2 coils)
- #4 main journal thrust bearing. (add more relief's to the side with file)
- Mark 1 13/16" for 30 degrees and 2 1/8" for 35 degrees from TDC. (with hacksaw)
- Use AC spark plugs 44TS or Autolite 72.
- 12 degrees initial timing and 32-34 degrees total advance in by 2000 rpm.
- Using 1.65 rockers on heads with casting numbers: 540306, 544127, 9771980
- Rod bolts - direct connection kit - P4120068 (or ARP)


Check and make sure that the plug is installed at the rear of the right side of the block. The plug will be behind the distributor gear inside the block. A freeze plug will cover the hole in the block and then a screw in plug closes off the right hand lifter gallery oil passage.

If the plug is gone, you will have very low oil pressure in the engine but the lifters/ rockers on the driver's side can still get oil. The plug needs to be there.

I typically replace the factory plug with a allen head screw-in plug, that has a .030" hole drilled in the center of it, to let oil spray on the distributor gear but MORE IMPORTANTLY BLEED THE AIR OUT OF THE RIGHT HAND OIL GALLERY quickly on start-up.

If air is trapped in that gallery it might take miles before all of it is gone and the lifters will see minimal oil as will the camshaft lobes for those cylinders. I can typically get all of the lifters/ rockers to show oil in a very short time of running the 1/2" drill motor.

[critter]

You might want to take a look at the Best Gasket brand rope seal for the rear mains. They're getting the best reviews out there for a rear main seal that doesn't leak. The Cadillac and the BOP neoprene seals work as long as the rear main groove was ground concentrically and the main caps haven't been machined. If not, they can have issues.

Also, do a google search for Lee Atkinson's engine building check list. That's a good road map for doing it correctly.

[yellow1098Greg]

rohrt
what is zero decking the block? how do u degree a cam?.....thank you for all the help/ advice....i am having someone help me with the build who is a relative that owns a shop so my situation is that i am learning alot as i go and i am doing everything with him.....i will be sure to show him the post and get everything u said done as best as possible....that way i have a great build with the most out of it i can:)

[yellow1098Greg]

checkin out that google for that Lee Atkinson.......also how do u guys feel about break in oils??

[critter]

Uh, stop. Buy this. Read it twice. You'll thank yourself for taking the time to do it.

http://www.amazon.com/How-Build-Performance-Pontiac-Design/dp/1884089674

[rohrt]

rohrt
what is zero decking the block? how do u degree a cam?.....thank you for all the help/ advice....i am having someone help me with the build who is a relative that owns a shop so my situation is that i am learning alot as i go and i am doing everything with him.....i will be sure to show him the post and get everything u said done as best as possible....that way i have a great build with the most out of it i can:)

Zero decking the block has to be done at a machine shop. The pistons are put in and measured to see how far in the hole they are. Then the machine shop will mill the top of the block to bring the pistons up closer to the head providing a better squeeze or quench factor. some one more verse on quench will need to chime in on this. This is not a must but there is more power to be gained with this mod.

Back in the day you just put a cam in strait up. That would be lining up the dots found on the timming chain. For reasons unknown to me this method is a big gamble. Installing without degreeing the cam could cause you to be to far advanced or retarded and make the car a big turd performance wise. Summit, Jegs both sell degree cam kits that I think come with a video.

Many of these tips are for those that are chasing every last hp they can and some can cost a good bit of change. So talking to your machine shop is a good idea.

Since your first post was about regrets, you might want to consider a roller cam. More power, a better idle and no oil additives to worry about but that can be a big chunk of change.

1 last thing. Make sure you have forged rods and not the stock cast rods.

[hectore3]

I am doing a rebuild on a pontiac...that has Edlebrock performer Cylinder heads 87cc combustion cambers 2.110" Int/1.660" Exh valves....1.460" valve springs.... .575" max lift...and 7/16 rocker studs...215cc intake ports....roller rockers...Competition headers..and a edleborck RPM camshaft kit...I drive the car with occasional drag race and crusin intentions...but want a fast reliable hot rod...the situation is that its being rebuilt because i spun a bearing….it will have new pistons and bore 30 over..new crank...any and all advice i greatly appreciate my main questions were since I have the car apart what can I should I add along with what im doing...maybe little stuff we wish would have thought of before reassembly..once again i want a fast kick ass car that isnt at risk to be rebuilt again when I step on it...thanks guys :smoke:

That Edelbrock camshaft is a copy of the Pontiac RAM AIR II/IV (230/240 @.50). It needs higher compression to make it snap the way it should along with gears. Factory Pontiac gears sold were 3.90-4.33. There are better choices out there than near 50 year old factory rehash with today's fuel octane levels and spiraling costs.

You didn't post the weight,gear,transmission style (auto/manual) of the car this engine is going into. As gear, converter,cam and transmission integration are a must. We need to know targeted compression ratio,cooling systems,intake, tire choice/height etc. Try not to concentrate to heavy on the engine alone. Its a mistake I've made and surely many others here have also.

You might want to search/read over at sites like performance years and pontiac zone forums. It's Pontiac only with many threads on buildups like yours to 6 second screamers with supercharging and turbo's in between. I'm in the middle of a build myself pro-touring style but not with pedestrian LSx power (although I respect them highly). I am using a 1969 vintage 428ci large journal Pontiac V-8.

Like you it all started for me with a spun bearing. Here is my progress to give some insight. Good luck!


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif



428 +.030 (440)
Wiseco custom flat tops
Zero Deck
Eagle 6.625 rods
10/10 crank
Race bearings
Melling MS54D pump
RPM intake.
72cc E-heads
.051" Cometic Head gaskets
Comp Custom Hyd "Extreme Street" lobes 248/254 @.050 .619/.639 lift w/ 1.65's
Crower Stainless 1.65 rockers
Mega brace
11.04:1 on pump gas
Ferra valves
Canton 15-452 road race pan, pickup, and windage diamond stripper
My custom built 1000 HP annular
MSD Drop-in & Blaster 2

[yellow1098Greg]

wow that looks amazing......right now most of my car runs close to stock...the tranny is a the turbo 350 with a small torque converter on it and stock gears....tires need updating to... any and all advice is appreciate as well....also...what kind of oil do u guys use and think i should run to begin with....im running the break in add on with valvoline 50w racing oil to start off with....as for compression trying as well to figure out what would be ideal with my heads and set up