Emergency brake cables on back-halfed 1st gen ??

[67 455 Bird ragtop]

Anyone who has back-halfed their 1st gen F-body and had to fab their emergency brake system I'd like to hear what you did and/or some pics??? I plan to look at my system over the holidays and would like to see what others have done. My front cable mount is still intact. So I'm mainly curious how you connected the intermediate and rear cables together. I have a cpl of ideas in my head but am always curious to see real-world solutions.

[silver69camaro]

The Lokar cables are easy to make work, I'd stick with that.

[JRouche]

I dont have a Firebird or Camaro, but I do have a "back-halved" Nova. Art Morrison 4-link rear section. I used Lokar's E-brake cable setup. Super easy to adjust and get working. And I use their full length cable along with their brake handle. But their cable should work just fine with the stock lever. But if you have a foot operated lever Im not sure, they prolly have a cable for foot operated E-brakes too. JR

[smhigh]

I used the Lokar's E-brake cables and hooked them to my stock foot operated brake.



This picture is similar to what I did.

http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll18/rogers98_photos/DSCF2392.jpg



Entire article

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=309425



I haven't had any luck getting mine to work properly yet as I have the stock foot operated brake cable slipping
from the Lokar connector.

I may try this setup

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a115/Thayer00/ebrake3.jpg

[kryptik]

The Lokar setup is cheesy...I mean come on...allen set screws for a "DOT approved" EMERGENCY brake cable?

Give Control Cables of Southern California a call, Vic is great to deal with and can hook you up with a true OEM style cable setup. No set screws, no BS. They can fab the cables up in any configuration, and are even familiar with Wilwood style internal drum brake systems.

I just got a set of their cables in for my '70 Camaro w/ Wilwood Internal Drum Parking Brake...top quality, OEM style, any cable end, any configuration, and any length. Just gotta give em a few measurements.

Phone # is 1-562-949-0455

And no, I am in no way affiliated with them...I'm just a happy customer :)

Cheers,
Matt

[morrisclassic]

I use the stock emergency brake pedal and cables & using the
Rear cable from Touring Classics. Works well with no changes
Billy

[smhigh]

Matt

Your Control Cables of Southern California set up sounds good. Any chance of getting some pics? I agree with your statement "The Lokar setup is cheesy...I mean come on...allen set screws for a "DOT approved" EMERGENCY brake cable?" I have had no luck getting it to work as I'd like.

[JRouche]

The Lokar setup is cheesy...I mean come on...allen set screws for a "DOT approved" EMERGENCY brake cable?
Matt

Cheesy? What about the allen screws? Which ones? Ill have to take a peek under my car, I forget what they look like cause its been 12 or so years when I installed the cable. Where are the cheesy allen screws. Im usually pretty careful, ok, sometimes LOL I do some hack jobs also.. But to be honest I didnt see any safety issues with the lokar cables.

And granted they are not as nice as OEM type cables, but I dont see a failure point with them. If you dont have some info on failure or specific examples how failure is to be expected then its a moot point.

Yeah, you like your cables, no doubt they are great. But unless you have some concrete info on why the lokar cables are cheesy then you just sound shallow.

And NO, Im not saying you are shallow LOL But the reply sounds weak and shallow without any history to back it up.

Oh, by the way, we are neighbors :) Im just down the hill (Cam). Id love to see your ride. Im just itching for a fight, oops, I meant ride in my car.. KIDDING!! LOL No really, nice to see a local guy.

And really, Im always looking for an excuse to take my junker on the road. I finally get to drive it after 15 years in all its glory (primer paint job and NO interior).

A putt up to TO to meet up with a local guy would be a good excuse. Gimme a PM if you want to grab a bite or a good fight! Haaa, kidding again.. JR

[kryptik]

A few reasons, and this is purely my opinion...agree or disagree.

1. It is relatively rare to find a situation which would truly test these cables. I mean...how many people on this planet are using Lokar E-brake cables on their street rod and have also ended up in a situation where they needed to seriously put said cables to the test (who knows what it could be...brake fade perhaps?). Not many I assume. I'll give you another example: on December 10, 2009 I was involved in THIS (https://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?64019-Morris-Seat-Belts-Invest-in-your-Safety) accident. Before this I have never heard of Morris Classic Customs Seatbelts being put to the ultimate test. Fortunately, because of their No-BS construction they saved both my own and my passenger's life. Real world test...fairly rare.

On to my impression of the Lokar cable construction:

2. The Lokar setup employs three cables. A front main cable which interfaces with the footpedal or handbrake, and two rear cables which snake off to each rear brake. Both the front cable and rear cables use a bracket to secure the sheath to the frame...so far so good as long as these brackets are bolted securely or welded. To me, the setup is questionable where the actual inner steel cables attach to each other. In order to maintain a universal design, Lokar gives you lots of extra steel cable and sheath. This extra cable has no "end" per say like the OEM's do (the OEM setup uses cylinders which are permanently attached to the steel cable end...these comply to DOT specifications and will not come apart...no matter how hard you slam the pedal or pull the handbrake). The way Lokar intends that you secure these cables together is by inserting bare cable into a junction block, and then tightening two set screws which are supposed to pinch the cable into the junction block. Though they can be tight, there is no way I see to truly guarantee that the cable will stay secure.

3. I have never heard of OE's using a design like this...and I just have trouble trusting it. I'm not saying it won't work...but there are always better ways of accomplishing a task. Sure I can crimp an electrical connection AS MANY AFTERMARKET COMPANIES CALL FOR...or I can solder a connection (or use an OE style machined crimp). Both ways will work...but one is obviously much better than the other in terms of longevity, performance, and professionalism. Not to mention that the Lokar set which I was originally going to use came with one of the sheaths split open...says a lot about the durability of the sheath.

I must admit I'm guilty of being a perfectionist :-P ...and my engineering background makes me very critical of any crucial parts such as brakes, suspension, steering, tires, etc. One must be this way in Aerospace or it can result in injury or death.

Anyhow...it's great to finally find someone from this board who is local! I drive my Maro down to Camarillo quite often...gotta love the long open roads :) Unfortunately all this rain is hitting us so we won't be able to do much cruisin' this week...bummer. I'm itchin' to get my baby on the road.

I'll shoot ya a PM right now JR...definitely lookin' forward to chatting with another Pro-Touring member.

Cheers,
Matt

[JRouche]

Yeah, the rain is dumping right now. Sucks cause I was ready to try some other tuning tweaks for my EFI. Been having some issues with rich conditions and backfire. When the computer was showing lean conditions. I think the rich condition was causing an exhaust backfire and the O sensor was showing me a lean condition during backfire. So the computer was giving me a false lean reading during backfire when I knew it was rich overall. I wanted to play, now its really wet, no playing.

Oh and the cables? Yeah, I can see your desire to get everything "just right". Not a bad thought. But sometimes cost for superior products just aren't in the books. But when it comes to certain safety items, like steering, brakes, seatbelts and other items I agree a person should spend more on those items even if it means waiting for the money for a performance part.

But that being said I still dont see a failure point with the lokar cables. They are tried and true. They have been in use on ALOT of cars and I have yet to read or hear about a failure. And to be honest, my car is a 62. The lokar cables are heads and shoulders above what GM had in place in 62.

Ahhhh, Engineer? Thats it!! :) Im a technician by trade, electronics, not mechanical. While working "for" engineers" (yeah, I didnt work for them, I worked for the company, but the engineers felt better if they thought I worked for them directly, so I went with the ego boost) I learned to adapt the real world into their plans. It was always their ideas that needed to be brought into physical life. It was usually, what? What do you mean it doesn't fit, it works out on paper perfectly. Yeah well, the real world goes beyond paper. Environmental conditions and physical interaction can be thought up on paper and it should work. But in the real physical world sometimes there is a lil hitch. And the tech can usually figure out a work around. Im a technician, not an engineer. You would be amazed with how much the simple tech knows and maybe what separates the two is a thin sheet of paper.

Yup, Im loving the rain, we need it. Ill be happy when its done also so I can play with my car. JR

[kryptik]

What kind of EFI system are you running?

I agree with you...most often buying parts in certain finishes like chrome is a total waste of money. But to me...tires, brakes, suspension, and steering all have to be the utmost in quality. OEM quality or better to say the least.

And just because I'm an engineer I'm not one of those desk-jockey's who designs and builds everything through a keyboard. I do all of the work on my Camaro...and let me tell you it's quite a lot, especially after my accident and injury.

I enjoyed the little debate we had goin' on here; when the weather clears up come on down and show me your car.

Take it easy,
Matt

[JRouche]

What kind of EFI system are you running?

I agree with you...most often buying parts in certain finishes like chrome is a total waste of money. But to me...tires, brakes, suspension, and steering all have to be the utmost in quality. OEM quality or better to say the least.

And just because I'm an engineer I'm not one of those desk-jockey's who designs and builds everything through a keyboard. I do all of the work on my Camaro...and let me tell you it's quite a lot, especially after my accident and injury.

I enjoyed the little debate we had goin' on here; when the weather clears up come on down and show me your car.

Take it easy,
Matt

Well, at the expense of hijacking 67 455 Bird ragtop's post Ill keep it short, solly ragtop. The EFI is an edelbrock unit, pro-flo 3500. Bought in 1995 and just now getting around to using it. Its an old system but all that was available at the time for the money. Still not a bad system today, but there are better and for better money.

And no, we didnt have a debate. Just a discussion. Im not looking to persuade anyone and certainly not writing here as a contest. I have no agenda. Im just throwing out my ideas and experiences so folks can get a lil info. Im not here to change anyone's mind or preference. I do my stuff here, at home, its a hobby. And I show alot of it here with words and pics. Why? Because I also look at other peeps work. I enjoy a new look at things. And I get alot of that here.

But for the most part I dont try to correct anyone. Even if it looks like a real hack job. Id rather give them positive comments and praise. Why? Because I have been there and am still there. There are alot of car guys that just get by. They do what they can with the tools they have and the cash on hand.

Im more of a dumpster diver type than a rich yuppie. I cant afford all the latest and greatest parts. Ill scrounge and dig through the wrecking yard for parts. Hell, my car is chuck full of wrecking yard parts. And yes, chuck full of some high quality parts tool. But I wont turn away a nice wrecking yard part if it fits the build.

I dont visit this site to diss anyone's ideas. I come here for ideas. And so far its worked out. Im prolly more suited for a "rat car" forum. But I do like to talk about some of the technical sides of cars too.

Im a dumpster diving car enthusiast. JR


Oh, solly 67 455 Bird ragtop, didnt mean to invade like I did. Ill stop bustin in to your thread with off topic posts. JR

[kryptik]

I get ya...wasn't trying to insult you or anything like that...perhaps my opinions just came off a bit strong.

[69X22]

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_1070-1.jpg
Test

[69X22]

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_1069-1.jpg
I'm not the best at posting pictures, I made this out of 19 gauge metal and bent it with a brake, I used nut serts to attach it to the subframe, and it willhave 2 more attaching it to the floorpan. It will be painted black and you will not be able to see the cables unless you look up under rocker panel lip, should be done with it in about a week.

[67 455 Bird ragtop]

Thanks Tony for the pics. Gives me something to build on.

[69X22]

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/01/ATT00001-1.jpg

[another69]

How is that working out for you? I have the Lokar cables with Wilwood internal rears, and they only LOOK functional. They won't hold my 3100# car on even the slightest grade. If I push hard on the pedal, the cables break free! Not sure what to do next, but I really hate this setup.

[69X22]

I adjusted the parking brake shoes, to where you could barely feel a drag and they seem to hold, but thats pushing down hard on the parking brake, and it also helps that I live outside of Houston where it's flat. Wilwood parking brakes defiantly have allot to be desired.

[GrnDragon]

I unfortunately bought 2 sets of the Lokar cables, for my 95 TA that has the internal Wilwood rear e-brake setup and for my 69 Camaro that has a custom external E-Brake Single piston mechanical caliper. I have had 4 sets of cables, the crimped fittings on the ends keep pulling off when I pull the e-brake lever. THAT SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN!!! I have had to silver braze the ends on, but I still don't like the joining design either. I really don't trust the allen set screws for an e-brake setup. I might call the company mentioned earlier in the thread.