1 question before I call Marcus

[ssick chevelle]

so ive done pretty much all the homework i can, all the forums possible and still not found this simple answer....
Am i able to upgrade from stock disk to c5 disk set up on a 1970 chevelle?. this is the final and only question i cant get a clear reply about. after this i promise im calling sc&c..i promise. :hammer:

The chevelle is a daily driver and will se NO track time at all. just racing fast through seattle streets and highways
i know that the afx is a great product however im afraid it will be overkill and of course like all im on a budgert. i plan on running 20 inchers (i know , i know:rolleyes:) had finger on trigger for the tvs package from hotchkis just rather sped my money on this part first as well as i just received my steering upgrade kit from hotchkis and am ready to proceed finally/ please chime in all info is valuable to me

[MrQuick]

sure you can, its just a short spindle.....same as the f body just with the steering arm on the opposite side....

[ssick chevelle]

thnk you for your post. so which companies make this short spindle? are we talking about a short spindle because i was reading that those arent very good either. ive hear alot about a tall spindle. whats this?

[zx10intn]

a tall spindle simply helps correct some of the gemoetry issues commonly associated with a-bodies

[6spdcamaro]

thnk you for your post. so which companies make this short spindle? are we talking about a short spindle because i was reading that those arent very good either. ive hear alot about a tall spindle. whats this?

The "short spindle" is just the name for a stock style chevelle/camaro/nova spindle. "Short spindles" (stock) can work well as long as you do something to effectively increase the height, like tall upper ball joints.

Here is the C5 brake kit for the gm short spindle.
http://www.kore3.com/proddetail.php?prod=10103-01

[Randy67]

I put C5 brakes from Kore on my 67 El Camino along with a Stage 2 kit from SC&C. I highly recommend both, you will not be disappointed.

[ssick chevelle]

wow thanks alot fellas. i was leaning towards the tall ball joints. im nsure every company will say they are the besr mqnufacturer for a tall spindle. but coming from the actual users which is best for a daily driver for wheels that will be 20" also does anyone know the factual advantages of the tall spindle?

[MrQuick]

not required on a bodies.... I'd stick with the stock spindles and maybe tall upper ball joints. Call Marcus, he's give you the run down.

get comfy before you call him, grab a note pad and several pens.

[6spdcamaro]

wow thanks alot fellas. i was leaning towards the tall ball joints. im nsure every company will say they are the besr mqnufacturer for a tall spindle. but coming from the actual users which is best for a daily driver for wheels that will be 20" also does anyone know the factual advantages of the tall spindle?

When you put a tall spindle or tall upper ball joints, it puts the upper control arm at a steeper angle (down inward). This creates an increased camber gain, meaning that the upper control arm pulls the top of the spindle inward as the suspension compresses. Increased camber gain is one of the things that needs to be fixed with the early suspensions.

[ssick chevelle]

thanks ken that actually makes sense when you break it down like that. Randy what specifiacally are u running on the elky. pen check pad check credit card check! thnks all. uve helped more than u know.

[68nogoat]

I am in the same boat as you. After about 3 months of research, I finally made the call to Marc today and he really is as helpful as everyone says he is. I called from work, and he spent about 2 1/2 hours on the phone with me. Gave me a full rundown of the things I need to do and the things that need to be done. He is simply not like these other companies just trying to sell something. He is more interested in educating you about what works and why then he is on just selling you something you don't need.

I wound up going with the AFX spindles, because the way I looked at it, I can save money on brakes, and get the whole front suspension done, top of the line, and not have to pull it apart to upgrade anything in the future. Its a lot of dough, but it really is the best thing out there if you can swing it. For me it came at the expense of probably waiting to do the rear.

Good luck with your project.

[ssick chevelle]

I wound up going with the AFX spindles, because the way I looked at it, I can save money on brakes, and get the whole front suspension done, top of the line, and not have to pull it apart to upgrade anything in the future. Its a lot of dough, but it really is the best thing out there if you can swing it. For me it came at the expense of probably waiting to do the rear.

is your xcar gonna be a full p/t or daily driving orrr? wouldnt this have alot to do with your decision or is it a bottom line track or street thing with the afx spindle

[MrQuick]

is your xcar gonna be a full p/t or daily driving orrr? wouldnt this have alot to do with your decision or is it a bottom line track or street thing with the afx spindle

For your application I would steer away from the AFX set up. Although it is a nice set up it really doesn't help the A body suspension as much as it does the F/X body.
Also running 20's you are going to want bearings you can service both easily and cheaply.
Put the money you save into quality shocks and sway bars.
Vince

[L & H Kustoms]

If you are looking at Tall spindles with serviceable bearings as Vince stated above you can check out our Pro Billet™ Tall Spindles. We are having a sale right now through the end of the year 15% off and free shipping!

https://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?75259-End-of-the-year-Huge-Blowout-sale-15-off-amp-free-Shipping

Our complete package.
Pro Billet™ Complete Spindle Package $1075 ($913.75)
Comes with Spindles, Hubs and Caliper Brackets and all necessary hardware to adapt C5/C6 brakes.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/02/100_2082-1.jpg

OR

If you just want to run the GM short spindle and add C5/C6 brakes.
Pro Billet™ Billet Hubs $325 per pair ($276.25)
includes billet grease cap, ARP studs, Bearings and seals
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/10/billethubs-1.jpg

Pro Billet™ Front Caliper Brackets $125 per pair ($106.25)
Adapts C5/C6 Brakes to A,F,X Body Spindles. includes all required hardware
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/IMG_1014-1.jpg

[ssick chevelle]

L&H those are truly beautiful spndles. i will be contactin you soon. is this the what majority of the alternatives are using instead of the afx? please exscuse my ignorance of the subject i am just trying to sponge info

[L & H Kustoms]

L&H those are truly beautiful spndles. i will be contactin you soon. is this the what majority of the alternatives are using instead of the afx? please exscuse my ignorance of the subject i am just trying to sponge info

Thanks just give me a call whenever works. Our Pro Billet™ Spindles and the AFX spindles are the top 2 choices for people wanting to update their geometry and suspension. Our Pro Billet spindles work best for the guys who want or need to be able to check and service their bearings vs. the sealed bearing on the afx spindle.

[Randy67]

Randy what specifiacally are u running on the elky.

It had the C5 brakes and Stage 2 setup with circle track springs with hidden adjusters (1000 lbs springs), Pro-Shocks stock mount shocks (front and rear) and 15/16" front bar. Rear was a 3-link with panhard bar, 350 lb springs (a bit heavy but okay as I didn't have a rear sway bar), and LS1 rear brakes. I sometimes wish I still had the car, it was fun.

[ArtosDracon]

For just the brake kit, I'm pretty sure Fly-n-Bye also has both kits and parts available.

[TitoJones]

For your application I would steer away from the AFX set up. Although it is a nice set up it really doesn't help the A body suspension as much as it does the F/X body.


Huh? What gives you that impression?

Tyler

[MrQuick]

Huh? What gives you that impression?

Tyler



A conversation we had a few years ago....I can try to find the thread.

*edit unable to access archives
Vince

[brans72]

Getting heated in here lets see all info fellows as I know Tyler had great products and design was amazing!

[MrQuick]

Getting heated in here lets see all info fellows as I know Tyler had great products and design was amazing!

where? Tyler and I have a good working relationship. Your reading too far into it.

OP asked a question and I answered it as required for his application. As soon as I can find the info I will post it. Although I don't see how it applies here with the OP's needs.

I have used the AFX on many builds F,X and A's Do a search, I have been more than happy with the design.

No caps on my end.

[ssick chevelle]

Huh? What gives you that impression?

Tyler

hey tyler I am aware that you are very educated on this subject. i thin he meant because i dont intend to ever ever track the car just my daily driver that i am deep love with. do you think its over kill for a daily driver? (again im not trying to ruffle feathars or start anything. i just love to learn.

[MrQuick]

pm sent

[TitoJones]

hey tyler I am aware that you are very educated on this subject. i thin he meant because i dont intend to ever ever track the car just my daily driver that i am deep love with. do you think its over kill for a daily driver? (again im not trying to ruffle feathars or start anything. i just love to learn.

I'll just say this-

Do you think someone who daily drives a Ferrari, Corvette or Audi R8 thinks the suspension is 'overkill'? Do you think they will ever have the thought, ' I wish my car didn't handle this good?'

The AFX works as great on the A body as the F/X body. When ATS engineered these forgings back in 05 we specifically looked to the A body crowd for feedback and came up with the AFX spindle. Our only item we were not able to match on the A body vs F/X body was the overall bumpsteer curve. While it is improved over stock, it is not as dialed as the F body. We did use Marcus at SC&C to help optimize the spindle to the chassis and I feel it is the best, strongest, most advanced bolt on available for your car. As for overkill, that's for you to decide.

Tyler

[MrQuick]

I'll just say this-

Do you think someone who daily drives a Ferrari, Corvette or Audi R8 thinks the suspension is 'overkill'? Do you think they will ever have the thought, ' I wish my car didn't handle this good?'

The AFX works as great on the A body as the F/X body. When ATS engineered these forgings back in 05 we specifically looked to the A body crowd for feedback and came up with the AFX spindle. Our only item we were not able to match on the A body vs F/X body was the overall bumpsteer curve. While it is improved over stock, it is not as dialed as the F body. We did use Marcus at SC&C to help optimize the spindle to the chassis and I feel it is the best, strongest, most advanced bolt on available for your car. As for overkill, that's for you to decide.

Tyler does this mean your not mad at me anymore? :thankyou:

LOL

[68nogoat]

I wound up going with the AFX spindles, because the way I looked at it, I can save money on brakes, and get the whole front suspension done, top of the line, and not have to pull it apart to upgrade anything in the future. Its a lot of dough, but it really is the best thing out there if you can swing it. For me it came at the expense of probably waiting to do the rear.

is your xcar gonna be a full p/t or daily driving orrr? wouldnt this have alot to do with your decision or is it a bottom line track or street thing with the afx spindle

My car is going to be a driver and is not really intended for the track although I would love to try that out. I went with the AFX spindle as opposed to the tall ball joints because I think it is a slightly better solution to fix the front end geometry, plus it will allow me to get into big brakes at a very low cost with new GM parts. Total cost to run the C5/C6 brakes with the AFX spindle will be only about $400, with no brackets to buy. The final reason for the AFX was that I am just starting on this car. I am not locked into using wheels or brakes that I already bought for the car, which may be a big factor in some people wanting to go with the stock spindle/tall ball joint set up.

I like the idea of GM brakes because they are GM tested, and as the government proved, GM is not going to be going out of business. So you will be able to get those Corvette brake parts forever. Along the same lines, I like the Corvette sealed hub assembly for a driver car. Although it is expensive, it is designed to last for a long time. I can understand track guys not wanting the sealed hub assembly because they are going to wear it out, but for a street driven car, I think it is a great selling point. I don't know how running 20" rims would impact the pros and cons on the bearing decision

[ssick chevelle]

looks like bearings will differ deoending on my rims size? its kind of baffles me that my whole adult life i bought tons of rims for pretty nice cars and never thought about any of this. Well i do now and guess i need to research the bearings subject now.

[MrQuick]

looks like bearings will differ deoending on my rims size? its kind of baffles me that my whole adult life i bought tons of rims for pretty nice cars and never thought about any of this. Well i do now and guess i need to research the bearings subject now. Not really but bearing life will be dependent on rim size. A larger heavier rim will cause premature wear as compared to a smaller lighter rim. The beauty thing when using a factory type spindle is you can preload,service re-lube and replace worn part cheaply if necessary.

The nice thing about this site is you have alot of talented and experienced members to help you out. I have learned alot myself on a daily basis.

ahhh by the way, have you spoken with Marcus yet? talk about learning a few things.

Vince

[RF GTO]

What exactly is the difference performance wise between the SC&C tall ball joint setup and the tall spindle?

For someone like the OP that is going to drive their car mainly on the street and possibly on the track once in a great while, would they really be able to notice much difference?

The statements from MrQuick have me thinking you probably won't...

[dhutton]

What exactly is the difference performance wise between the SC&C tall ball joint setup and the tall spindle?

For someone like the OP that is going to drive their car mainly on the street and possibly on the track once in a great while, would they really be able to notice much difference?

The statements from MrQuick have me thinking you probably won't...

I think one factor might be whether or not both solutions address bumpsteer. I think the AFX with their steering arms does, not sure about the tall balljoint. The AFX spindle will also let you bolt on low cost C5 brakes which helps offset their cost compared to the tall balljoint. I think you have to cost out the total solution before concluding one is significantly lower cost than the other.

[MrQuick]

I think one factor might be whether or not both solutions address bumpsteer. I think the AFX with their steering arms does, not sure about the tall balljoint. The AFX spindle will also let you bolt on low cost C5 brakes which helps offset their cost compared to the tall balljoint. I think you have to cost out the total solution before concluding one is significantly lower cost than the other. Excellent response.
Don't take any of my posts as being negative feedback towards any product. Again it is a great product but in this case it would be as I felt "not necessary". I like to take every situation and make a recommendation based on needs and requirements of the user with the vehicle in mind.
I PM'ed the op as I refused to take it any further than advising him to contact the vendor in mind and he can then make an educated choice.

Vince