1971 Firebird Build ("The Other Woman", a.k.a. Project "T.O.W.")

[carbuff]

Since I have now officially embarked on my latest project, I thought it was time to create a build thread.

The car is a 1971 Firebird. I purchased this car from South Florida in July of this year. The car appears to be an Esprit, originally a 4-speed car with AC. The car was restored in the early/mid 90's, and it seems to have been driven very little since then. The interior is in overall good condition with just a few common issues (dash pad, console door). The exterior of the car is a mismatch of Trans Am front fenders, rear fender flares, and a fiberglass Formula hood.

I saw a lot of pictures of the car before I purchased it, and I had several phone conversations with the seller. Unfortunately, even after asking many many specific questions (this isn't my first second gen), the car arrived with more rust issues than I was led to believe. The reality is that the car is a good 20-footer. I'm not sure if it's painted in the original Buccaneer Red or not, but the red is a good color on the car. Both lower rear quarters have some rust issues, and some small patches on the lower doors be required. But overall, I felt pretty good about the car for what I paid for it, especially given what I could find locally (ie: much worse for more money).

So it's now November, and I enjoyed driving the car a little bit for the few months that I've owned it. It took me a while to get the title straightened out (lesson learned, make VERY certain that an out-of-state seller really has a title in their name), but once that was done, I got to drive it a bit. And clearing the title was also my last hurdle to clear before starting on the big changes that I have planned for this car...

My goals for this car are pretty simple... I don't want to turn this into a show car. I want to build it to drive it. Specifically, I want to do HPDE events at the local tracks, so my choices in drivetrain and suspension reflect that. I also want to drive the car, so it won't be solely a track car. I won't trade off some comfort for outright performance.

Given those goals, I wanted a car that looks presentable enough as my starting point. I intend to replace all of the mechanicals of the car, but don't really want to dive into bodywork if it can be avoided.

After a lot of research, here is the list of items that I've decided to go with on the car. I managed to score a pretty good eBay LS2 built almost like I wanted it. The suspension was a much more difficult choice at first, as there aren't as many choices available for the second gen cars as there are for the first gens... But I'm very happy with my selection, and I can't wait to get this thing on the road...



Engine

LS2 402ci
Ported L92 Heads
Custom Cam (234/242, .602"/.605", 112)
Edelbrock Victor Jr. L92
FTP 4-barrel 1350cfm Throttle Body
F.A.S.T. XFI Controller / Harness
Champ LS oil pan / pickup
JRS Tri-Y LS headers with 1 7/8" primaries, 3" collectors, ceramic coated
Built by Golen Engine Service
Expected output of 550-580 engine HP
Prodicy Customs / Wegner LS Accessory Drive Kit with AC and remote-reservoir PS pump
PRC Radiator / AC Condenser / Oil Cooler / Dual-fan setup


Transmission

T56 Magnum
Prodigy Customs T56 Magnum install package


Front Suspension

JRS's custom built front Subframe
JRS's DOM custom control arms built to C6 dimensions
JRS's Monoball control arm bushings
C6 uprights / hubs
Bilstein single-adjustable coilovers
JRS's splined sway bar
DSE Subframe bushings / bolt kit


Rear Suspension

JRS's Torque Arm rear setup
JRS's Watt's Link
JRS's custom built 9" housing
9" Center Section with 3.89 gears and a True-Trac differential


Brakes

Front - Baer Pro-Plus System (14" rotors, 6P Calipers)
Rear - Baer Pro-Plus System (14" rotors with integrated parking brake, 6P calipers)
Front and rear calipers in black with red letters
DSE Master cylinder and booster


Wheels/Tires

Forgeline wheels (undecided on actual style, leaning towards the GA3 or the SO3, I love them both)

Front - 18" x 10"
Rear - 18" x 12"


Tires are undecided, but likely either the Michelin PS2s or the BFG KDWs

Front - 275/40/18
Rear - 335/35/18




Body Mods

Trans Am front fenders
Trans Am front and rear fender flares
VFN Trans Am Fiberglass Shaker Hood
DSE Mini-tubs


Interior Mods

Seats (Sparco or Cobra)
Ridetech's Tiger-Cage (still debating whether I will go this route...)
Custom Dash Insert with AutoMeter gauges
Prodigy Customs Vintage-Air Gen IV package


Other

VaporWerks Gas Tank
DSE Subframe connectors
DSE Wiper Motor
AAW Classic Update 70-81 Camaro wiring harness with 70-73 Firebird add-on



Those are the big-ticket items that I've decided on so far. Before I get too much further I want to give both Frank at Prodigy and Jake at JRS a big THANX for all of the time and help that they have given me so far. I've spent a lot of time on the phone with both, and they have helped me make a lot of decisions.

So far, I have received the JRS front subframe/suspension, and it's a work of art! I'll post pictures separately. I also have the front and rear Baer brakes. The rear housing is assembled but needs to be powder coated. The engine will be on the engine dyno this week and should be on its way to me by Friday. Most of the rest of the parts are on order and will be shipping over the next month or so...

Oh, about the project 'name'. About 3 weeks after I bought the car, my girlfriend gave me a gift to christen the project. It's a gold Firebird keychain. On the back of the pendant of the keychain was engraved "The Other Woman". Hmm, that didn't take long now did it. ;) But since I plan to use the car frequently on the track, I somehow turned that into "T.O.W.". :) Hopefully I haven't cursed myself with that name choice...

One final note... I wanted to get this post out today, the 1-year anniversary of my father's passing. I owe all of my car knowledge and willingness to take on a project of this magnitude to him, so in many ways this is a tribute to the may things that he taught me.

Ok, enjoy the build, I'll post up some pictures in a few minutes...

[carbuff]

Here are a few pictures that I was sent before purchasing the car:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/dsc01016-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/dsc01011-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/dsc01013-1.jpg

[carbuff]

And a few pictures of the interesting work that had been done to the car prior to my receiving it:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/img_0971-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/img_0972-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/img_1026-1.jpg

[carbuff]

And some of my rust opportunities... Underneath the car is actually surprisingly clean, but I expect that someone just bondoed over some previous problems when the car was restored, and after 15 years or so, those problems have come to the surface...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/img_1007-1.jpg

This is the worst spot:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/img_1005-1.jpg

Also note the runs in the paint... Several spots like that on the car...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/img_0977-1.jpg

[carbuff]

On a brighter note, my JRS subframe and suspension!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1295-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1309-1.jpg

[carbuff]

And of course, the 'gift'. :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/TheOtherWoman-1.gif

[MrQuick]

haaa haaa love the key chain.....this is gonna be a great project to watch. I was a huge fan of your last one.


vince

[tazzz25906112]

Cool memorial post regarding your Dad,,, just lost mine on Rememberance day...... I'm going to love seeing this one come together and I can help you with a carbon TA hood if you're interested just drop me a line....

[LeighP]

Well, as another 71 Esprit (converting to the Formula look) owner, I can only say I'm glad to see another thread that I'll have to follow.....your budget is probably a little beyond mine, but I'm very impressed with your plans and parts selections.
This is going to be very interesting. I checked out you pics of the car, some small issues, but over all it looks pretty good.
Funny, my Esprit was originally Buccaneer Red, but since everyone around here paints their Firebirds similiar shades of red, I'm going for Carousel Red instead.
Good luck on your project...lots of pics would be great!

[LeighP]

PS....I love the throttle linkage....gave me a good laugh when I saw that. :)

[NOT A TA]

A couple weeks ago I was wondering what happened since August and if you were driving it. Nice list of upgrades Bryan! Should make for a fun track toy. I'd take Albert up on his hood offer.

[Bryce]

PS....I love the throttle linkage....gave me a good laugh when I saw that. :)

At least it had two springs.

[Bryce]

This is going to be a really cool car!

[Throttle]

Nice List..

[cdoggy81]

"This is going to be a really cool car!"
I agree!

[Vinz68]

This is gonna be a bad a$$ car!! Very cool!! You got a great parts list so far. Good luck with the project. Jake's chassis and suspension is awesome!! Did you get the headers yet? If not your gonna love them, I seen a few set's at his shop. They are awesome!

[carbuff]

This is gonna be a bad a$$ car!! Very cool!! You got a great parts list so far. Good luck with the project. Jake's chassis and suspension is awesome!! Did you get the headers yet? If not your gonna love them, I seen a few set's at his shop. They are awesome!

Vince,

Thanx! No, I don't have the headers yet... Jake is wrapping up the torque arm and Watt's now, then the headers will be next I presume. I have seen some pictures though, they look great, and clearance should be no problem with them, and for my car's purposes, they should help boost power in the RPM range that I care most about. :)

[carbuff]

So I did some work over the weekend that I didn't get to include in last night's pictures... I pulled the engine (it's going into a friend's Model A project) and transmission, and I was preparing to drop the subframe. Then the real fun began. :)

The engine and transmission came out pretty easily (the hoist was REALLY close to the front bumper on the Firebird, but I managed to do it without removing the bumper). As I went around to loosen the subframe bolts, the one under the AC box broke loose. Oh crap... And there was no way I was getting to that nut without removing the AC box. And there was no way that I was removing that AC box without removing the inner fender. See where this is headed?

The further I got into it, the more little rust problems that I found with the cage nuts that are used to assemble the front sheet metal. I assume that Florida humidity got to them, as most were pretty rusty, and I had 2 break loose. And unfortunately it looks like I need a new radiator support as well...

Now I find myself in a quandry. As I said in my original post, I really wasn't planning to dive into the bodywork on this car. But with it this far apart and needed to replace a couple of items already, should I just go ahead and strip the car down and do the bodywork? Or I should more accurately say, have it done? I don't really have the time or facilities to do it myself right now. Hmm...

Here are some pictures from the weekend.

Old SBC 350 that came out:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1324-1.jpg

My workspace:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1325-1.jpg

The aftermath of the fender, inner fender, and AC box removal:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1329-1.jpg

The pile o' parts:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1330-1.jpg

Rusted out bottom of the radiator core support.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/IMG_1334-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Jake sent me a picture of the rear housing that he is building for me. :thumbsup:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/11/jrs_housing-1.jpg

[LeighP]

They say the new repro rad supports are pretty good.....

[srh3trinity]

Sounds like a great pile of parts going together. I like the JRS Torque Arm setup and I have seriously considered that setup myself at some point in time.

[carbuff]

Leigh,

I was wondering about those. I noticed at least one catalog said that they are not available yet, but I also see them for sale on eBay, so someone is selling them. Do you know if they are all the same, or if multiple vendors are producing them?

Unfortunately I'm not having a lot of luck finding parts locally, and my luck with internet purchases seems to be about 50/50... :\

Stephen,

I can't wait to get it all together! If it all performs nearly as well as it looks, I should be pretty darned happy. :)

[tazzz25906112]

They say the new repro rad supports are pretty good.....

We used one on a little 71TA project I'm doing over at the shop and it worked out real well as far as initial fit etc and would have no issues recommending it's use to anyone so far....

[carbuff]

My DSE goodies arrived yesterday! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_1335-1.jpg

And Jake sent me a few more pictures of the completed rear end housing and Watt's Link mount:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_7332-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_7327-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/IMG_7337-1.jpg

[tazzz25906112]

This is going to be a cool ride Bryan,,,,, looking forward to running with you at one of the events this summer I hope.....

[carbuff]

I received my dyno data the other day from Golen. I found the data very interesting and thought others might as well....

As a little refresher, the engine is an LS2-based 402ci with L92 heads, lightly ported. Originally it had an L76 intake with a 90 (or 92) mm throttle body. I'm replacing the L76 with an Edelbrock Victor Jr. and 4-barrel throttle body since I want to use a functional shaker scoop with my hood (without crafting an airbox. :) ).

There are 3 plots on the chart (I created the chart in Excel from the raw data):


RED - original 242/248 Golen cam and L76 intake (not completely tuned, which accounts for the much lower torque below 4000rpm)
GREEN - my custom grind 234/242 cam and L76 intake
LIGHT BLUE - my custom grind 234/242 cam and Edelbrock Victor Jr. intake


Now, I expected to lose some low-end torque with the short runners of the Victor Jr, but I didn't quite expect to lose 60 ft-lb! Don't get me wrong, this engine should have plenty of power for what I want to do with it, but if I ever do decide to go back to a long-runner composite intake, I will know what awaits me.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/dyno-1.gif

[Doug1]

Welcome to the second gen Pontiac bad ass build club!

[andrewb70]

I received my dyno data the other day from Golen. I found the data very interesting and thought others might as well....

As a little refresher, the engine is an LS2-based 402ci with L92 heads, lightly ported. Originally it had an L76 intake with a 90 (or 92) mm throttle body. I'm replacing the L76 with an Edelbrock Victor Jr. and 4-barrel throttle body since I want to use a functional shaker scoop with my hood (without crafting an airbox. :) ).

There are 3 plots on the chart (I created the chart in Excel from the raw data):


RED - original 242/248 Golen cam and L76 intake (not completely tuned, which accounts for the much lower torque below 4000rpm)
GREEN - my custom grind 234/242 cam and L76 intake
LIGHT BLUE - my custom grind 234/242 cam and Edelbrock Victor Jr. intake


Now, I expected to lose some low-end torque with the short runners of the Victor Jr, but I didn't quite expect to lose 60 ft-lb! Don't get me wrong, this engine should have plenty of power for what I want to do with it, but if I ever do decide to go back to a long-runner composite intake, I will know what awaits me.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/dyno-1.gif

Great project Bryan. Glad to see you back, building cars.

The huge torque loss from swapping to a single plain intake has been documented before. I would much rather fabricate an airbox and keep the L76 intake. What EFI system or factory ECU are you using? The factory ECUs that were designed for the 58 tooth reluctor wheel don't work with cable operated throttle bodies. Just saying...

Andrew

[cdoggy81]

Bryan,
How are thing going with it?

[carbuff]

You have good timing. :) There will be some news for me to share next week. I've changed direction with this project, slightly. More specifically, I sold the red Esprit that I had and have purchased a Formula that is in better condition as a starting point. I should have pictures and some more information next week as this transaction just happened in the last couple of weeks! So stay tuned, more info to come...

[carbuff]

As promised, an update! :)

So Project TOW has taken a little change of direction... Earlier in the year I decided to sell my house and move (still within Austin), but that left me with the problem of what to do with the Firebird. After a lot of thinking, I decided to sell the car. Tough choice, but I believed that I could find a better starting point, and given that I was going to be living temporarily without a garage, it just made sense.

I've been searching since that time for the next car, and about a month ago I found it. This car was located in New Hampshire, about as far away from Texas as I could get of course. ;) I spent a lot of time on the phone with the seller, he had owned the car since 1988 and had done a complete restoration on the car (including the replacement of much of the sheetmetal) during the 90's. So even though I couldn't see the car in person, it was nice to talk to someone who had actually turned a wrench on the car as compared to so many others that I considered that were 'owned' but not 'built' by their current owners.

The plan for the car remains the same, with the exception that some of the work is going to be done by Jake at JRS. Jake arranged to have the car picked up from the seller (about 3 hours away from him) and now has it at his shop. I flew up last weekend to check it out and make a plan with Jake, and the disassembly should start later this week. Jake's going to do a lot of small projects for me that he and his crew can do a lot faster (and better) than I would do myself, such that when the car gets down to Texas, my part of the project should go a lot faster! I'm closing on a house purchase at the start of November, a house with a nice 2.5 car detached workshop btw, so the timing should work out great for me to have the shop all ready for the car's arrival. :)

While I originally really wanted a red car, I love the blue on this car! I found a picture of a 72 Trans Am that was painted in a Dodge Viper Blue color with the white stripe, and I fell in love with that combination. This car isn't quite that dark of a blue, but it's darker than the original Lucerne Blue that Pontiac used. I imagine that someday I will paint the whole car, and I'll go with a slightly darker color at that point. Until then, this car will be great!

Jake is going to replace the Formula fenders with a pair of Trans Am fenders, the hood with the VFN hood that I already have, and the nose with a carbon fiber one as well. I would love to do the entire CF front end, but that's just a bit out of the budget at this time I think...

Jake's also going to install or fabricate the following for the car:


JRS Watt's Link Bracket
DSE Mini-tubs
DSE SFC's, modified to allow the subframe to bolt in
Muffler-back exhaust to weave through the Watt's
Firewall to subframe down-bars
4-point roll bar with removable harness bar
JRS Apex front spoiler/splitter
Front tow hook


There may be a few more items as well, but this is the plan for now. Should keep him busy for a few weeks, but fell in perfectly between some projects that he had on-going.

Look for more progress pictures now that I am back on track! Hopefully Jake can post a few as he makes progress as well...

Pictures from my visit to JRS earlier this week:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/Formula002-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/Formula010-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/Formula013-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/Formula021-1.jpg

[joeko23]

Gonna be awesome! Good luck

[cdoggy81]

It will be very nice!
Also, post a pic of that "72 Trans Am that was painted in a Dodge Viper Blue color with the white stripe" if you can :)

[carbuff]

Sure thing... Here is an album with all of the pictures I was able to get. I love this color combo!!!

http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m23/carbuff69/1972%20Viper%20Blue%20TA/

Enjoy! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/72ta17-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/TransAm72-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2011/10/DSCN5406-1.jpg

[LeighP]

Man, that looks great!!!!!

[cdoggy81]

Nice! Thanks for posting them :)

[carbuff]

Wow, I didn't realize it had been quite so long since I updated this thread here. Although the car has mostly sat during this time, it's finally starting to move forward in the last month...

As a refresher, I sold my house last spring (2011), so I haven't had a place to work on the project since then. All of my parts went into storage, I sold the red car, and bought the blue one. Jake picked it up for me, and I had him do some work on it before shipping it to Texas.

The car finally got here in Febuary '12 after the work was completed. I drove it a handful of times, but mostly it has sat for the year. The one thing I did do was to install a new reproduction stripe on it, which looks GREAT!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/IMG_2255s_zps1d93a917-1.jpg

Fast forward to December, with a handful of drives on the car and no prospect of having a better place to work on it. That's when I first heard about a new fabricator in town named Eric. So those of you who know SW from Austin (I think he is on here, goes by StreetKing), Eric spent the last year building SW's latest project: a silver 2nd gen Camaro. After SW spilled the beans on who built the car, I went over and met Eric just to see his place. The conversation went from there to a discussion about him possibly doing some work for me (since he had some free space in his schedule), and the next thing you know, my car's at his shop being disassembled! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/status1_zps6833161e-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/status3_zpsf124450f-1.jpg

That's Eric's personal project, a '50 Ford, in the background, a really cool car in its own right (which I think may be for sale if anyone is look for such a project).

Eric is basically going to finish most of the build on the car for me. He made quick work of the disassembly, having the car down to a shell in about 2 days. Within a week, the JRS subframe was in place, and the firewall filling had begun:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

It was quickly decided that the transmission tunnel was going to have to be cut in order to have a decent angle on the transmission and exhaust:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Since that time, Eric has been busy on a lot of tasks, moving from one to the other as we hit hurdles like missing parts, or decisions we need to make, or other little problems that you all know we run into with these projects. But as of yesterday, most of the suspension, engine, and transmission mockup is done, so a lot of the harder work has been done. Most of the firewall filling has been done, the transmission tunnel has been reinstalled (raised about 1.5"), the JRS front and rear are in place and some fabrication has been done to make everything fit as it should. I'll paste a few of those pictures below.

In the coming weeks, we should get a lot of the major work done. There is more fab work to do (mounting the radiator/condenser/coolers, mounting the AC unit, building down-bars from the firewall to the subframe, exhaust), but we expect those to go a little more quickly. On my side, I'll be helping out with some electrical work, probably laying some sound deadening under the carpets, reinstalling some of the interior, building a new gauge panel, and whatever else I can do before Eric just hops on it. :)

While I'm a bit saddened that I'm not doing all of the work myself, I can say that the quality of the work that Eric is doing is well beyond what my skills would allow! Anyone in the central Texas area should stop by and check out his shop and work. There's some pretty slick fab work going on at this shop. :)

Here are the pictures. I'll try to keep this up to date now that the build is moving forward again!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/booster_zpsfa20db7f-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/torque_arm1_zpsa9169e82-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/rear_axle1_zps5ebaa6ad-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/torque_arm_front_zps0f13b567-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/torque_arm_front_mount_zps90613d0d-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/trans_crossmember_zps4fbbd73c-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/trans_crossmember2_zps6d26d617-1.jpg

Exhaust collectors:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/header_collector_zps0579be72-1.jpg

After the tunnel reinstall:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0105_22_zps2743d753-1.jpg

Some of the firewall work so far:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0105_21_zps44a9a83b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0105_20_zpsff6dfb6c-1.jpg

The engine with the Edelbrock intake, 4b throttle body, and Wegner front drive setup (minus the PS pump at the moment):

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0105_24_zpsa01a5ccc-1.jpg

[cdoggy81]

Nice!

[carbuff]

Mid week update...

I stopped by the shop tonight to see how things were coming along and to discuss a few more little issues Eric has run into... Pictures will follow below... :)

So this week has revolved around gauges, wheels/tires, sound deadener, and exchanging a few items. After exploring what seems like every possible tire brand on the market, I've decided to run the Falken Azenis RT615-K's in 275 and 315 widths. I ordered those from Discount Tire Direct today, and they will be here by Tuesday. I'm closer to my wheel selection, but I'm going to be using a fitment tool in order to make certain that I have the tires exactly where I want them! And I've been emailing back and forth with Speedhut's support team with questions about the gauges I'm looking at.

For some reason my gas tank straps are about an inch too short. Eric has the tank hanging in place, and the straps will barely reach the bolts. A quick phone call to Rick's today and they are sending me a new set tomorrow which are cut a little longer, even though the length of mine is what they normally provide for a 2nd gen. I like that customer service!

Contrast that with DSE, whom I'm pretty frustrated with at the moment... I called them last Friday to discuss the brake booster / master cylinder angle as shown in the picture above. They seem to be aware of this 'potential issue', and have a replacement set of brackets to resolve the problem. But they want to charge me for the brackets instead of swapping them out. I sent them a picture of my MC, and the sales guy I spoke with agreed that it seems too steep. He was going to grab one of theirs and compare it to my angle and get back to me. That was last Friday. I'm still waiting... So I called back on Tuesday and spoke to a second person. After a lengthy discussion, he was going to talk to the first person and one of them would call me back. Well, 2 days later, nada... Oh, and they have an order in their system for another $500 worth of their goodies that I want for the car which is holding on resolving this stupid $20 bracket issue. Disappointing to me for all of the positive feedback that they normally get...

Anyway, enough of my rant, here's another positive customer service review. Wegner Automotive. Eric asked me the question about whether I had the correct PS pump to mate up to my Ford steering rack. A call to Casey revealed that I did not. I told him I purchased the kit about 18 months ago, and he said no problem, just send them my pump and he would send me the correct replacement. I'm very appreciative of good service like that!

As for Eric, it's more mockup. He stuck the fuel tank in place, made some new spacers for the rear suspension pieces to get everything lined up just right, and assembled the engine/clutch/transmission and installed it for more mockup. He also finished the shifter cover and is going to install the nutserts to bolts it down this week. Tomorrow he's going to work on a set of seat mounts so that we can test fit me on Saturday.

On Saturday I'm going to get dirty scraping and grinding on the inner floorpans to prep them for the Dynamat install. I bought 3 boxes of Extreme and 5 boxes of Dynaliner to seal up the interior. While I plan to do track days in the car, on the occasion when I make a road trip, I'd like to drown out some of that outside noise as best I can. :willy:

Ok, enough rambling, I know you all just want to see pictures. Here are a couple of the engine installed, the Mocal oil thermostat, and the shifter cover...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0110_20_zps43e97da5-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0110_25_zpseab15c7d-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0110_23_zps689f12d1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0110_22_zpsffd10f9b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0110_21_zpsf6d4b933-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Weekend update...

I spent yesterday working inside the car scraping the original asphalt goop off the rear floor and trunk firewall areas. That stuff is a freaking mess! Took me a couple of hours to get it pretty clean. This week Eric is going to prime the front half of the floor area where various metalwork has been done, and hopefully next weekend I'll get to start the Dynamat process.

My front tires showed up on Friday, so we spent a little time trial fitting them in the wheel well. The pictures below are the 275/35, which is just about 1/2" shorter than the 315/30 will be, so it gives me a good idea of the fitment in terms of diameter:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0112_25_zps383d6420-1.jpg

Here's what I'm looking at for the outer edge:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0112_26_zps83772e31-1.jpg

Unfortunately on the JRS setup, as with most setups which use the front spring pocket for a trailing link, the link itself is the limiting factor on the inside:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0112_22_zpsdd92d9bb-1.jpg

I couldn't get a good picture, but that shot shows a little over 2" from the tire to the link. Starting with a 275, that would let me get to a 325 with almost no clearance. And I'm not completely sold on my outside position, so that's pushing it.

You might also notice that we replaced the rear bushing with a heim join to see if we could gain a little room. We get about 1/2" on the rear, so maybe 1/4" where I took the measurement. Without cutting the frame rail, there just isn't much else you can do there... When I get the 315 on Tuesday, I'll do some more detailed measuring. I have a wheel fitment tool that I'll be using to be more confident also.

Eric is also making mounts for the Sparco seats. I knew these were going to be a tough fit (just about any aftermarket seat is) due to the height, and the fact that I'm 6'2. He's got it almost as low as it can sit without cutting the floor, and we have resolved that the floor is going to have to be cut at least some. I like his seat protection method here (garbage bags :) )

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0112_21_zps82ce856f-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0112_20_zps2f51dbe0-1.jpg

I'm going to need a much shorter shifter rod than the one I have, it's way to long/tall. Add that to my shopping list. :willy:

We did a few other small things yesterday. Hopefully we've decided on a mounting spot for the II Much fuel and axle vents. We removed the factory canister that was behind the seat, and there's a flat spot there which we are going to try and use. Eric will make a platform that we can remove, but the opening is in just the right spot to snake the lines around the axle, exhaust, and Watt's link there.

We also looking into all of the plumbing we need to do. The rear brake lines are going to be tricky, again due mostly to the exhaust. I have 4 pages of notes of the AN and brake fittings we are going to need to plumb the fuel lines, oil lines, PS lines, vent lines, and LS steam vents. Can't wait to place that order... ;)

And finally we stared at the shaker setup for a while. If the measurements are correct, the top of my 4b throttle body is about 1 3/8" higher than the Quadrajet which came off the car. I have a 1" spacer on there which we can remove, but that still leaves me 3/8" or so too high, as it was also sitting a tough higher than I wanted. So I will probably purchase one of the aftermarket filter bases which are made for shakers, but then we'll probably have to cut it up to make it fit. We can't lower it much though due to the fuel rails. Tight fit in this area, so we have some work to do here...

[syborg tt]

Contrast that with DSE, whom I'm pretty frustrated with at the moment... I called them last Friday to discuss the brake booster / master cylinder angle as shown in the picture above. They seem to be aware of this 'potential issue', and have a replacement set of brackets to resolve the problem. But they want to charge me for the brackets instead of swapping them out. I sent them a picture of my MC, and the sales guy I spoke with agreed that it seems too steep. He was going to grab one of theirs and compare it to my angle and get back to me. That was last Friday. I'm still waiting... So I called back on Tuesday and spoke to a second person. After a lengthy discussion, he was going to talk to the first person and one of them would call me back. Well, 2 days later, nada... Oh, and they have an order in their system for another $500 worth of their goodies that I want for the car which is holding on resolving this stupid $20 bracket issue. Disappointing to me for all of the positive feedback that they normally get...

Get a hold of Allen ( tell him I said hi ) He was able to resolve my issue with the bracket. Any one that buy there 2nd Gen Booster has a problem. Most people just pie cut the bracket and lay it down for a better angle.


You might also notice that we replaced the rear bushing with a heim join to see if we could gain a little room. We get about 1/2" on the rear, so maybe 1/4" where I took the measurement. Without cutting the frame rail, there just isn't much else you can do there... When I get the 315 on Tuesday, I'll do some more detailed measuring. I have a wheel fitment tool that I'll be using to be more confident also.

The other option is to do a "S" Bend in the bar to gain clearence. We made a set for my car just in case I ever want to put 335's on the car.

[carbuff]

Update time. It's been a couple of weeks... :)

I've worked the last couple of Saturdays at the shop, and Eric's been hard at it. The progress has been slow because of the PITA nature of what we're doing.

First, he's cut out a space to mount the II-Much vents where the original canister was behind the rear seat. He also made a shelf to mount them which we can unbolt to remove. It's going to work perfectly in that space!

Then he's had to cut out some space for the JRS torque arm uprights to clear the floor. Space is tight back there, and as we approached compression on the rear end, the uprights were hitting the floor. So Eric cut out some of the rear seat belt mount plates, and took a BFH to the corner of the floor. He tried not to cave it in too much, and then some cleanup effort.

Also, the rear firewall was loose in several areas. So he made some new upper corners where it will attach to the DSE tubs, and some welding and cleanup from where the previous owner had cut it for a cage. It was also rattling from some loose spot welds, so those are fixed too.

I worked to assemble the rear axle and 3rd member, install the axles, and the Baer backplates. That turned into a bit of a challenge, as the tapered bearings have an outer seal which reduces the clearance for the backplate to slide over the axle. A little massaging with a grinder opened up opened up the edge just enough to clear, so the backplates are no.

Eric talked me into using bumpstops on the Bilsteins, so I ordered up a set from Speedway. Unfortunately that means disassembling the end of the coilover to insert them on the shaft. Thankfully he's done this before on others, so he knew what we were getting into. I have a few pictures of that process below.

Eric also has been making brackets to attach the front coolers. Radiator, condensor, oil cooler, and PS cooler. We've spent a lot of time considering options here and line routing. We've settled on the layout you see below, and we decided to make hardlines from the coolers to bulkheads on the core support. Then I'll run AN lines from the other side of the bulkheads to their respective spots on the engine.

I have a wheel fitment tool on loan at the moment to determine the size and backspacing I want to use on the wheels. So this past Saturday we stuck the rear axle back in place to get some measurements. This caused more frustration for me. After the last round of trimming and beating on the floor, the uprights mostly clear now. However, when we stuck the wheel/tire on and compressed the rear end, the car is still sitting way higher than I want. We have one more step down on the axle housing mounts, so I can get about 1 more inch there. But, in this position it currently is in, we are bottoming out on the floor at the axle housing upright mounts on the top. So we're going to have to do more cutting of the floor to open up space to allow those to move up higher. In the tire picture below, that is full compressed right now. I want that to be RIDE HEIGHT! That's never going to happen though and have any compression left in the coilovers. It will be interesting to see where we end up...

Anyway, I measured the wheel BS for the rears. It looks like I'll be around 7.75" with an 11.5" wheel. I'm running a 315 tire. We are going to roll the lip more than it current is, and that leaves me about 1/4" or so to the lower trailing links. You can see in the picture below that Eric made a spacer for the bushings to push the link in as far as we can.

I've spent a LOT of time lately trying to pull together an order for the AN fittings and line which we are going to need. Damn that is going to be an expensive order! :( We're running PTFE line and fittings for the fuel and vent lines. Eric will bend a hardline from the rear to the front, and soft line to finish the attachments.

I'll be running oil cooler lines (-10) and PS lines (-6), and then I'm going to make a set of steam return lines from -4. That may be overkill, but it seems like the cleanest way to do it. See the following:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/dc606086-1.jpg

I also need to get my gauge order in. Those will take a couple of weeks to make, so that's on my list for this week also. My list seems to get longer instead of shorter.

Ok, that's about it for now. Pictures below. First, Eric's rescue German Shepherd Sophie:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_05_zps5ce84f12-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_01_zps2d5e1034-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_02_zpsce23ffbe-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_03_zpsa695b6e5-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_06_zpscf2bca21-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_07_zps9185da54-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_08_zps84b90b06-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_10_zps86e05f5f-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_11_zps1b032800-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_12_zpsda20e27e-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_17_zps3cea9af5-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_18_zps6ea77de0-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_20_zps8cf305d3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_16_zpse5cfe283-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0126_27_zps381ff4f1-1.jpg

[carbuff]

I stopped by the shop tonight for a mid-week update and to measure for the wheels. I snapped a few more pictures also.

Eric is working on mounting the engine compartment downbars to the front subframe. He's making plates to mount to the firewall along with the collars. I didn't get pictures of those yet since they aren't mounted, but will this weekend.

I also snapped a couple of pictures of the mounting plate he's made for the II-Much vent cans which will go behind the rear seat.

As to the wheels, after a lot of futzing with the MountMate fitment tool and measuring to ensure we had everything right, we settled in on the fronts at 18x10 with 6.5" of bs, and the rear at 18x11.5 with 7.5" of BS. Now I just have to decide on a wheel style and colors! :headscratch:

Not much else to say, so here are the pictures:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_01_zpscbbc122c-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_07_zps02007fcf-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_05_zps9b9a9daa-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_10_zpse8073cd4-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_11_zps4520fa24-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_12_zps52084f97-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_13_zpse0670747-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_16_zps3b866f22-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_17_zpsdb2d09a0-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_18_zpscc4c0643-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/01/update_0130_19_zps40b9ade6-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Dynamat day. I hate laying Dynamat. Enough said... :bang:

Eric primed the floor this week before I put the Dynamat down. I forgot to take a picture before starting, but the solid black floor looks good. If anyone ever pulls all that Dynamat out, the floor should be in good shape.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_01_zpsc8108000-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_03_zpsfe82fea7-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_13_zpsa7d6ce98-1.jpg

Did I mention that I hate laying Dynamat? My back and finger tips are hating me today! And I'm about 1/4 of the way finished, although those should have been the worst areas. I don't expected the firewall to be as bad...

[carbuff]

Meanwhile, Eric has been fabricating away. The firewall downbars have taken more time than we planned, but they appear to be about done. Everything is tacked up now and ready for welding tomorrow... We used the B&B Classics firewall and subframe flanges, and they worked out very nicely. In order to maximize the MC booster clearance, Eric trimmed the drivers side cup a little, and then did the same on the passenger side to match the positioning. I wanted a crossbar for strength, but also wanted it removable, so we got a set of the Ballistic Fabrication tube clamps. Unfortunately those are only available in 1.5" or 1.75", while the flanges were 1.625". So we stepped up to 1.75" tubing, and Eric opened up the flanges a little to accept the oversized tube. Now he just has to be very precise when welding it all together. ;)

Pictures:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_04_zps75bb4c6c-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_05_zpsb08107f0-1.jpg

Note the welds...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_07_zps9091a9a6-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_08_zpsfc3b02f8-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_09_zps762607f8-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0210_11_zps31b39378-1.jpg

[carbuff]

On other fronts... I placed a few orders this week. First, I ordered my gauges for the car. I decided on the Speedhut Revolution gauges. I'm using the 4.5" speedo and tach, and the 2 1/16" gauges for the rest.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/FirebirdGaugeLayout2_zpsc674e07d-1.gif

I may reverse the 2 and 3 rows such that the 3 gauges are on top. I was trying to squeeze in another AC vent, but that's not going to fit.

I've also decided on my wheels... I'm surprised how hard this was, given how long I've been thinking about it. I went back and forth between the Forgeline RB3C, the GA3, the GZ3, and the GA1R. In the end, I decided on the GZ3 as shown below. Satin Gunmetal center, exposed hardware, polished outers. The exposed hardware option finally put me over the top with this choice:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/GA3_zpsbc7d0c69-1.jpg

(that's a Forgeline picture for a set they just did for another car. the only difference on mine is I'm going for a black inner...)

I'm waiting on the finalized invoice to get the order moving forward, but that should happen Monday.

On the car itself, we are still having clearance issues around the rear suspension. The driver's side coilover and Watt's Link mount have been all sorts of problematic for us. If it had been located just 1/2" further inboard, all would be fine. But the spring collar hits at one point, then when we get past that, the shock body itself helps. Right now, that is our limiting point of rear suspension compression. We're going to see what happens when I get my wheels/tires, but I may have to purchase a different set of coilovers which use a narrower shock body and spring to clear.

This week the front end will come back apart for the last time. The inner fenders and radiator support are going off for powder coating, and the firewall will be painted. Then the real assembly will begin. I can't wait!

[carbuff]

More Dynamat hell... I have about 2.5 days into it so far, and I've got one more small section on the rear tunnel, then the doors. Note the plastic buckets that I siliconed into the kick panels. Those will protect the speakers that are going down there. 3 days later, and the backs of my hands are still covered in the stuff. I think it's as bad as POR-15 if you get it on your skin!

And a lot more ordering has been ongoing also! I decided to replace the side glass on the car, and both sides have scratches (the driver's much worse though). I did a lot of searching, and I couldn't find a definitive answer as to whether the Pilkington glass was really better, and who made it. So I went with Auto City Glass. Hopefully it will arrive this week, and I can install the glass this weekend. Then I can Dynamat the doors...

I'm excited that UPS is showing my Forgelines are supposed to arrive tomorrow! Now I just have to find a place to have them mounted that I can trust not to screw them up... :( Maybe SW will have a recommendation, he's had a set or two mounted in town. :)

Eric wrapped up the firewall and painted it last week. We also sent a big pile of parts to the powder coater, hopefully they are coming back this week also.

Here are a few pictures for the week:

The rearend is out as Eric touched up some spots on the bottom of the car. It's a good shot of the JRS setup I have for adjusting the pinion angle:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_01_zps574ea3b1-1.jpg

Some Dynamat shots:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_02_zps8b21282a-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_04_zps217e6015-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_05_zps298ecc21-1.jpg

And the firewall:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_10_zps5ad213a5-1.jpg

[carbuff]

And another surprise arrived today. My Speedhut Revolution gauges came in! We haven't had time to make the gauge panel which will house them yet, but hopefully we can work on that early next week. In the meantime, here are some pictures:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_16_zpsfd7496b6-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_15_zps59160778-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_17_zpse0395b2e-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/update_0226_18_zps24cfb6e6-1.jpg

[maxxom]

Looks great!

[syborg tt]

Looking really nice.

[srh3trinity]

I like the way the downbars look. I wish I could find somebody to put this kind of work into my car. While I am sure I could find it, I am not sure I would want to write the check.

[carbuff]

Stephen,

I'm sure plenty of people are available to do it. But as you said, writing the checks is hard. In my case, I've been renting for the last couple of years as I continue my house search, so it was either keep looking at it, or bite the bullet on writing the checks. I was lucky, I think Eric has a very reasonable rate, and I'm extremely happy with his work!

And yes, I too like the downbars. I think they came out great!

[carbuff]

WOO HOO! Look what showed up today. Can't wait until tonight to see them in person! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/IMG_20130227_114631_zps8496fde2-1.jpg

[ryeguy2006a]

WOO HOO! Look what showed up today. Can't wait until tonight to see them in person! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/02/IMG_20130227_114631_zps8496fde2-1.jpg

I am so jealous of those rims!! Great looking progress so far!!

[carbuff]

Thanx! I was able to see them tonight in person. The pictures simply don't do them justice! They are gorgeous... I cannot wait to get the tires mounted next week and get them on the car! ! !

[srh3trinity]

Stephen,

I'm sure plenty of people are available to do it. But as you said, writing the checks is hard. In my case, I've been renting for the last couple of years as I continue my house search, so it was either keep looking at it, or bite the bullet on writing the checks. I was lucky, I think Eric has a very reasonable rate, and I'm extremely happy with his work!

And yes, I too like the downbars. I think they came out great!
I need to start price shopping and dust off the checkbook. Those wheels are killer. Can't wait to see them mounted up.

[highperf15]

This build is sweet....

[BonzoHansen]

Those wheels look bad ass.

I got speedhuts last year.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/201107281625121Small-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Revolution series with black bezels? One thing I did change from the standard style was the font. I went with the Swis font. I can't want to see them operational! :)

[struck by Lightning]

Awesome Build! I have owned several Firebirds through the years and miss my 71 that sold last year.
.
.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/keff4y-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Another long weekend, and while it doesn't look like I accomplished a lot, I definitely did!

First, another solid day of Dynamat. I went up Wednesday night and did a few hours worth, where I finished with the Dynamat Extreme on all of the floor areas. I still have the doors to do, but I cannot do that until I get the glass in. I had planned to do that this weekend, but........

Do with the Extreme done, I started on the Dynaliner. I used 1/4" Dynaliner to cover pretty much everything so far. I attached it to the bottom of the package tray to make the installation of the tray easier. Then the back seat areas, the mini tubs, and up the floor to the firewall. I realize as I type this that I didn't get any good pictures of this, but I will this week.

Today I started in on the wiring. I ran RCA wires for a stereo, along with a trigger for an amp which I will mount in the trunk. Then I pulled out the AAW kit which I purchased oh so long ago. When I started looking at it, I realized that there's a lot there which I don't need. Honestly, I may have been better off to purchase on of the Highway series kits instead of the Camaro/Firebird kit which I purchased. But I digress... I started removing wires from the harness, and I pulled out a bunch: wiper switch (I'm using the DSE kit), the AC/Heater wires (Vintage Air wires), all of the gauge cluster wires (tach, oil, temp, generator light), then the starter and battery wires also. Eric and I are going to run new wires for those along with the EFI harness wires and gauge wires through the trans tunnel to prevent them from running across the firewall. Cleaner that way...

So after removing at least 1/3 of the wires, I stabbed the harness into place. I connected up a couple of items, but that's about all I had time for...

In the meantime, Eric is starting assembly of all of our parts. The DSE booster and MC are on, as are the clutch MC and DSE wiper. Today he was making the brake lines. I bought a new replacement front-rear line, but custom extensions are needed from where the hard line ends to the frame rails where the flex lines will attach. He also made new front lines which are really clean.

This week there should be some assembly progress. I'll get more wiring done, and Eric will probably stab the engine/transmission back in along with the torque arm and rear axle. The gas tank also needs to go in, then the real fun can begin: assembling the exhaust! I'm adamant that I want it to run all the way to the rear, and weaving some 3" pipes through the Watts Link is going to test Eric's fab skills I believe... ;)

I have a few pictures, and I'll post the current money-shot first! I LOVE these wheels! ! !

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_21_zpsebd0d2c5-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_22_zps0cb06f71-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_19_zps19b26977-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_03_zps7e998427-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_04_zpsee31f25f-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0303_06_zpsf4abaa3d-1.jpg

[carbuff]

It's been a couple of weeks since I've gotten pictures and an update, but progress continues. I've been out of commission due to other life events, but Eric is plugging along.

Eric picked up a load of parts from the powder coater, so final assembly is on-going. And just when you think it's all going to come together, you run into more issues...

But before that, some good stuff. The engine is in for the last time, and the cooling setup is in place too. Radiator, oil cooler, and PS cooler. The hard and flex-lines are mostly made now for those as well. We have also put the Holley EFI wiring harness in place and worked out a few little kinks with that. Eric has run the power cables through the car, using bulkheads are the firewall and rear passenger quarter panel, so the install will be pretty clean. He also started building the exhaust this week, and if not for needing a couple more bends, it would be done. That should happen Tuesday or so when parts arrive.

For my part, I've been working on some wiring as time allows. I stripped out several pieces of the AAW harness which I didn't need, and we've been working on how to integrate the EFI harness, Fan Controller, AC, Fuel Pump shutoff, and AAW all together. I think we have all of our answers now, so it's up to me to cut/splice/shrinkwrap a bunch of connection now. We also found a nice mounting spot for the EFI controller up on the metal cowl area behind the dash.

I also finished the Dynamat on the doors, and installed the package tray with the 6x9 speakers back there. That turned into a half day project, something I expected to be simple. I should know better... I made some wood mounts to lower the speaker since it would have hit the metal of the rear shelf if installed flush (I didn't cut out the factory openings). No pictures, but trust me, they are there... :)

Now for the biggest recent problem... The JRS Tri-Y headers tucked too closely to the block down at the oil filter area, preventing us from using the Mocal thermostat. That's not really Jake's fault, he built them for max clearance to the frame/steering areas I'm sure. But it would have been easy to shape them slightly differently to deal with it. After much deliberation and consideration of our options, Eric and I decided to cut the headers and rebuild the pipe that was hitting. I didn't like the other thermostat options, so this was the best path. Eric finished that up last night, but I haven't seen the final product yet. We will have to recoat the headers, but since we're coating the exhaust anyway, we'll do it all to match.

A few other odds and ends... The brakelines are made, we installed the PCV catch can, we're trying to determine how to connect the gas pedal to the TB linkage (the air cleaner base is going to interfere with out planned method, so that's still an issue), and I still love my wheel selection! :)

Here are some pictures...

Powder coated core support and parts mounted:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_01_zpsf3f0c2a1-1.jpg

Closeup:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_02_zps581de71d-1.jpg

Front clearance, overflow can, and PS/Oil lines:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_03_zpsdf36920a-1.jpg

Things will be busy at the rear of the intake:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_04_zps04abf3d4-1.jpg

Dynamat on the doors:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_06_zpsc09146a1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_07_zps3b083463-1.jpg

Power Cables:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_08_zps65ba0a57-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_09_zps8ae86c26-1.jpg

Driver's side exhaust run:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_11_zps42267288-1.jpg

I didn't believe Eric when he first told me he could route 3" pipes through the JRS Watt's link maze in the back, but sure enough he did:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_12_zpsfb92b112-1.jpg

And this is where he ran out of pipe. No, I'm not leaving a dump there! :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_14_zpsd379bfb7-1.jpg

Norris catch can mounted:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0317_16_zps3d484f17-1.jpg

[70Uglybird]

Top notch man, those wheels are crazy!

[syborg tt]

Looks awesome !!!

[carbuff]

Here are some pictures from Eric of the header rework. I haven't seen it in person, but he says there is plenty of room to that steering shaft... :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/IMG_20130318_205629_zps23faa71a-1.jpg

And from the bottom. You can see the Mocal and the clearance we have now:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/IMG_20130318_205702_zps5c8f470f-1.jpg

The 'new' pipe which is further forward originally tucked right up to the block, which was a nice and tight fit, but interfered with the Mocal. If you were running a remote filter/thermostat, it wouldn't have been a problem. I like the simple installation of the Mocal and wanted to keep it though.

You can see all of the splices he had to do in order to keep a nice radius on the tubes...

[carbuff]

Here are some more pictures of the exhaust. You can see all of the extra 'kinks' which Eric did in the exhaust to get the bends/angles just right. And he got a lot of Tig practice this week. :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_01_zpsaf929844-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_02_zpse381460b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_03_zpsb7df471c-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_04_zpsd73e08dc-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_05_zps96a47b3d-1.jpg

I also like how he set up the band flanges to create a 'positive' locating flange at each joint. But having the 1 pipe stick out about 1/8" and the other pipe recessed about 1/8", when you install the band clamps, everything will stay nicely aligned.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/update_0320_06_zpsdce9faa3-1.jpg

In the meantime, I wired up the trunk of the car the other night. Took me about 4 hours to get everything right, but I made all of the connections to the AAW wiring kit, and I also installed a fuel pump cutoff switch to stop the pump in case of an impact. I got my butt-splicing and shrink-wrapping practice in. :) Tomorrow I'll get back to the interior wiring...

[carbuff]

It's been a little while since I've updated, but I have new pictures. :)

I picked up the exhaust from the ceramic coater's yesterday. It came out great! Because we had to cut/weld on the header, I had them both recoated as well. The header tubes and tail pipes were coated inside and out. I had the flanges and header bolts done as well. Took about 10 days, and I'm happy with the results! The pieces will go on this week...

In the meantime, I've been working on the interior. It took me a ridiculous amount of time to get the door panels installed on the car. I purchased a set of reproduction panels, and as with many reproduction parts, they don't just pop into place as easily as we would like. But after some fitting, they turned out well. I applied the 1/8" Dynaliner to the back, and between that and the Extreme on the door itself, these doors close with a thud now. Should make for a much more pleasant driving experience!

I've also been working on wiring. Again, I've spent way too much time on this, but I wanted it as clean as I could get it. I've wired in the Holley HP EFI, the PRC fan relays, and the Vintage Air control relays. I had to do some research to get the Holley wiring the way I wanted, allowing it to control the fans (specifically when the AC compressor is running). I'm also sending a warning light to the dash from the ECU, which again took some research.

The passengers side of the cabin is wired now, and we are working on the dash side. Eric cut out the new dash panel yesterday and is working on the holes for the gauges. If not for missing 1 hole saw, it would be mostly done. That will wrap up in the next few days...

The plumbing is mostly done now except for 1 oil cooler line. It's proven to be a tight fit up front, and we ran out of line to finish it, so more is on the way.

The engine wiring is in place and mostly hidden, so we're pretty happy with that.

The brake lines and clutch line have fluid in them with no leaks.

I powered up the ECU yesterday and ensure that I could communicate to it from my laptop, and that looks like it's working. I'm not sure the maps in it are very well done though, I have a feeling they were only set for full throttle (ie: dyno) runs. I need to tweak on those and update the firmware in the box to the latest 2.0 version from Holley.

So we're making progress, and getting closer. I suspect we will be close to trying to fire the engine for the first time within 2 weeks. Then we can through the front end together and give it a test drive. :)

Pictures...

The exhaust after the ceramic coating. The coating has flakes of stainless steel in it, adding hardness (as I'm told) and the ability to polish it:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_11_zpsf06db1d2-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_12_zpsefa16e04-1.jpg

Door panels:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_02_zpsa9eae702-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_03_zps442f61dc-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_05_zps248c63a9-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_06_zps9a23e61d-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0407_07_zpse6b821e3-1.jpg

[carbuff]

Midweek update...

I spent last night wiring. 2.5 hours, I think I connected 5 wires. Sheesh! Good thing I'm not trying to make a living wiring cars! :)

Eric trimmed and covered the kick panels. These turned out great!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/IMG_20130409_223931_small_zps51d8dd35-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/IMG_20130409_223850_small_zps53948cb2-1.jpg

Exhaust is going on today, dash panel is cut, and we're going to temporarily wire in the gauges and wrap up the electrical system this week. Fingers crossed, we MAY try to fire her up this weekend!

[carbuff]

The kick panels went in today, so I snapped a couple of pictures before they were wrapped up:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_18_zpsb0f67196-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_20_zpsd2a38929-1.jpg

Instead of attaching the speakers to the kick panel, Eric made an aluminum plate and attached that to the metal structure, then attached the speak to that. So the kick panel is just housing the grill...

[carbuff]

And now for some money shots!!! Got the rear tires mounted finally today (fronts tomorrow, I could only fit 2 in the car at a time!). Damn I love these things! I took a bunch of shots at full suspension compression and at the expected ride height. The fitment turned out perfect with just a finger's width to the fender lip and a finger's width to the lower control arm...

(pardon the crappy pictures, I didn't have my Canon so these are just from the cell phone)

Full compression:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_10_zpsf6b18f1d-1.jpg

Ride height:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_13_zps63e05eb1-1.jpg

And from a few different angles:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_16_zps92a578ec-1.jpg

Compressed:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_12_zps5271b4dc-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0410_08_zps6cfadfb3-1.jpg

[carbuff]

A couple of shots with all 4 shoes on now... I wish the Falken's were available in a 285 or 295 width, it should have fit ok. But I love how it looks with these wheels/tires!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/image004_zpsaf952b93-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/image004_zpsaf952b93.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/image003_zps151318be-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/image003_zps151318be.jpg.html)

[syborg tt]

Bryan - what size are those bad boy's

[carbuff]

Those are the Falken Azenis RT-615K. Sizes below:

Front: 275/35/18 on an 18" x 10" rim

Rear: 315/30/18 on an 18" x 11.5" rim

[LeighP]

Wow, looks great.....love how you're going with this. I like the oil cooler set up. I built my cooler mount for the trans cooler so I can match it with an oil cooler for the other side, kind of sorry I didn't go with it now as I've seen some high oil temps on some initial highway runs.....but the engine was only new. It seems to be a bit happier now, so maybe I won't need it.....
Can't wait to see yours come together.

[LUV2XLR8]

what size tires are you running? car looks great!

[carbuff]

what size tires are you running? car looks great!

Posted 2 posts above yours... ;)

Those are the Falken Azenis RT-615K. Sizes below:

Front: 275/35/18 on an 18" x 10" rim

Rear: 315/30/18 on an 18" x 11.5" rim

[carbuff]

Not much time for a real update this morning, but I wanted to at least share this:

zRb34ez0a3I

(anyone know how to embed a Youtube video here? )

[carbuff]

Here's a little wrap-up of the day yesterday.

I was determined to fire the engine yesterday, knowing we had a lot of work to do to make that happen. I got to the shop early, and Eric and I set out on a mission.

I finished up the interior wiring of the ECU, transmission, and hooked up the gauges in a temporary fashion. I wired them up to the headlight switch to make sure that the lights all worked as well. After all of the wiring work, I connected the battery and had Eric looking for smoke. None came, which was the first big relief of the day.

Then I turned on the ignition switch and saw the gauges move as expected. I started running through the systems that I could, and everything seemed to be ok.

The last step for me was to install the Rick's gas tank filler neck. It's a little tight to do that with the tank installed, but I got it on and tightened up. All good!

Meanwhile, Eric finished up the few remaining plumbing issues. He had to remake the oil and power-steering cooler lines. He remade them this time with stainless, and he was able to reroute the lines to not touch each other.

Next we poured some gas in the tank and turned on the switch again. I saw pressure build on the fuel pressure gauge, which was a good sign that the pump, lines and gauge were all working! We crawled around under the car, and only found one very slight drip at the hardline to AN line fitting. A turn of the wrench, and that drip was gone.

At this point we poured all of the various fluids into their respective destinations, and again started looking for leaks. Radiator, check. Power Steering, check. Oil, check. Transmission, check. Differential, check. Woo hoo!

Then the step I was worried about. Because of the LS setup, I don't know of a good way to prime the oil system. This engine hasn't run for over 2 years, and it's been drained, and we've added the oil cooler, thermostat, and lines, so I knew it would take a while to get oil through all of that. Scarily, it took longer than I would like for it too. Spin, spin, spin. Finally, I saw the oil pressure gauge move a little bit. Then a little more, and finally it crawled up to about 20psi. Phew!

Now for the moment of truth... We reconnected the coils and the injectors. I crawled into the car, pushed down the clutch, and turned the switch. After about 3 seconds, she fired to life! What a sweet sound. I was watching the gauges, and we were both crawling around and under the car looking for any leaks or other signs of problems. But none were to be found! We ran it until the fans kicked on, meaning the temps were up to running temp. Then we shut her down, and let out a collective sigh of relief.

We started it up a couple more times to make sure it was still all good, and everything seems great! No leaks, started right up both times, and the ECU looks to be good. I know it's not tuned well for idle / part throttle (the IAC is definitely off), but she runs!

Now that we are past this hurdle, we should be able to make some quick progress. This week, Eric is going to tackle assembling the front sheetmetal, and I am going to work on wiring the gauge wires. I purchased some connectors to allow quick disconnects, so I need to install those. Then the dash, back seats, and console. I am taking the dash panel which Eric made to be powder coated, and once it is back, we'll get the dash finished up.

It's getting close! I'm getting excited. :)

[Motown 454]

Its coming out awesome....!

[LeighP]

Bryan,congratulations...thats a big step in the project.
I'll all come together quickly now.

[carbuff]

Thanx guys! It was a pretty exciting step for me, after all the time it's taken to get to this point!

Hopefully the assembly this week will go smoothly...

[carbuff]

More progress this week!

Eric has been busy assembling the front of the car, and it's amazing how much different the project looks and feels with the front sheetmetal on again! It's as if I can 'feel' the end of the project in sight now! As seems to be the case for all of these assemblies, there has been a lot of adjusting and tweaking to get to this point, but the gaps are looking great around the front, especially considering these parts were just painted and assembled without any actual bodywork on them...

He also replaced the RB hood pins with the Aerocatch units. I love these, and I'll be a lot more comfortable driving down the road and not watching the pins wiggle their way out of the RB units. We had to mount these sideways due to the inner structure of the VFN hood, but I think they look just fine this way.

I'm trying to determine which of the available drop-shaker bases will be the closest to working for me. Strangely, I'm having trouble find some simple dimensions for the couple that are available. Eric and I have discussed it, and we may just have to buy one and cut it as needed. I need to get something on the way...

As for me, I continue on the seemingly endless saga of wiring this car. I'm really sick and tired of laying in the car on my back and side trying to cleanly route wires. Hopefully I'm finally done under the dash. We stuck the VA evaporator setup in for the last time this week, and I made the used a pair of 15-pin Painless Wiring disconnect connectors for my gauge panel. I had the panel powder coated this week, and I was able to stick the Speedhut gauges in it too.

Then I had to take the painful step of cutting up a brand new reproduction Firebird dash. I bought this piece 2 years ago, and it's been sitting in wait for this day. The Firebird dash has a lot of plastic structure behind the gauges where the heater control, dash vents, etc were mounted originally. With my gauge layout, all of that stuff was going to be in the way. Out came the air saw and the drum sander, and I started cutting. I tried to leave as much as I could, and I still have vertical support across the opening.

Then the perhaps even more painful step of cutting the radio opening for the head unit. The Firebird dash has the radio opening cast into the ABS plastic, so again with the air saw and drum sander. It's a tight fit height wise, but it's in there...

After all of the cutting, I put the dash and gauge panel in the car to check all of the fitment. It looks GREAT in my opinion. :) I sadly had to take it back out since we still have a little under-dash work to do on the AC ductwork, but I was glad to at least see it in place.

Then I started wiring up the gauges and lights. I'm almost done, but needed some small gauge wire to wire the turn signal, brake, high-beam, and warning lights. I picked that up this afternoon, so on my next trip to the shop I will wrap all of that up. The dash should be in place next week.

I picked up all of the bulbs for the rear of the car and installed those too. Thankfully, everything worked. :)

There are a few other odds and ends to be taken care of this week too... Eric is going to heat and bend the shifter stick once we have the console in place, it's a little too close to the dash as it sits now. I already mentioned the shaker, and the stereo amplifier needs to be mounted. We are going to switch the circuit breaker from a 120A unit to a 150A unit. We tripped it once starting the car last weekend, so on a hot day it may pull too much current. I also need to contact Fesler about a set of hood struts. The ones I have don't hold the VFN hood up, so I need to get another set...

Requisite pictures below...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_19_zpscf337ccb-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_19_zpscf337ccb.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_22_zps0fb1c3b4-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_22_zps0fb1c3b4.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_25_zps8a261a6c-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_25_zps8a261a6c.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_30_zpsbf08edc3-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_30_zpsbf08edc3.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_47_zps508b982b-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_47_zps508b982b.jpg.html)

Here was my temporary gauge setup when we fired the engine last weekend. :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0413_01_zps509c51fe-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0413_01_zps509c51fe.jpg.html)

The blank panel after powder coating:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_02_zpsfe8a488f-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_02_zpsfe8a488f.jpg.html)

Panel assembled, without the LEDs:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_46_zpsd96888d6-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_46_zpsd96888d6.jpg.html)

Dash pad after cutting the gauge area:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_15_zps7f1adc05-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_15_zps7f1adc05.jpg.html)

Stereo installed (I may do something to cover up the knob depression areas):

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_37_zps8f01d3db-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_37_zps8f01d3db.jpg.html)

Dash and gauges in the car (you can see how close the shifter handle is, and that's without the knob):

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_39_zps8a3f7ad1-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_39_zps8a3f7ad1.jpg.html)

And working on the wiring:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/04/update_0421_48_zpsd7263d2c-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0421_48_zpsd7263d2c.jpg.html)

[LeighP]

Very nice, I had to work carefully not to run into problems with that dash structure as well....and I wan't trying to fit that many gauges at once. Nice work!
Car looks terrific!

[[email protected]]

Looking Good!

[rickpaw]

Car looks great. Love those Forgeline wheels.

[reedld]

Very nice build! I need to mount my tweeters in the kick panels like you did!

I too had to trim my dash to fit my year one bezel... I was glad I had an extra dash laying around(junk) to experiment and mark the holes.

Again, nice build!

[garickman]

Car is looking amazing! Great job on the build.

[carbuff]

Thanx guys!

I don't have any pictures yet, but Eric mounted the gauge bezel edge trim that the top lip attaches too this week. That small piece of chrome trim along the edge really makes it all stand out! Can't wait to get it finished up and on the road...

[69FB]

I have thoroughly enjoyed reading up on your build Bryan. I am really looking forward to installing my Dynamat and Dynaliner after reading your posts on all the fun you've had. I love several of the choices you made on your project and look forward to more updates. I am currently looking at the same brake system as you chose for your car and have plans to do a Ricks gas tank when I get my fuel injection setup picked out. I love the wheel choice and the JRS suspension components. Great project and the color combo I have always loved.

Keep up the posts and like many here I love the pictures.

[carbuff]

Thanx for the props! We are getting closer now... Eric pulled together a list of odds and ends that we need to work out, and while it feels like a long list, it feels good to see the end is near!

More details and pictures soon... :)

[carbuff]

I'm a bit behind on this thread, but we're making progress. I won't bore you with all of the frustrations that we've run into lately, but just know that it's getting closer to a first drive! If I didn't have plans all weekend, it would probably happen then. As it is, it will be next week.

In the mean time, here was what we got done tonight. :) Installed the shaker tonight. It took a little more clearancing by Eric on the Lokar throttle cable adjuster, but she's in there now!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/update_0514_02_zps1c3abea7-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0514_02_zps1c3abea7.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/update_0514_01_zpsb60c6bd0-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0514_01_zpsb60c6bd0.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/update_0514_04_zpscccf9326-1.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0514_04_zpscccf9326.jpg.html)

I reinstalled the dash and stereo tonight. I also cut the original glove box to clear the VA evaporator and ECU, and we're going to bond a new ABS back to it so that I have have a glove box. I'm losing about 1" of depth.

That is going to turn into the most expensive shaker ever by the time I'm done! I've purchased a new throttle body to lower it, I've purchased 3 shakers to find one that we could 'start' with, and Eric has hours into modifying it to work. We think it's going to be pretty good now that we're at this point, but we won't know for sure until we are able to chassis dyno the car and see what effect the shaker has...

[andrewb70]

Bryan,

I'll take the bet on who has the most expensive shaker...LOL....I spent a small fortune on mine. Call me crazy, but isn't it the point of the shaker to insulate the cold air intake from the hot air under the hood? With all those holes around the perimeter of the base, how is that going to work? I can also tell you that the single plane intake will cost you 40 lb/ft of torque. The build looks great.

Andrew

[cdoggy81]

"Call me crazy, but isn't it the point of the shaker to insulate the cold air intake from the hot air under the hood? With all those holes around the perimeter of the base, how is that going to work?"
agreed

"I can also tell you that the single plane intake will cost you 40 lb/ft of torque."
agreed but you gain 50 points of cool factor :)

As Andrew also said, the build does look great Bryan!

Since I am in the same boat, what TB & shaker / air cleaner base did you end up using?

[carbuff]

I'll take the bet on who has the most expensive shaker...LOL....I spent a small fortune on mine.

Ha! That's a bet I would prefer not to win, but I'm thinking we'd be pretty close. I recall the work you did on your's. On mine, I've purchased 3 different shakers, a new throttle body, and a lot of 'Eric-hours' to make this ultimately work. And I'm still not sure how well it's going to work yet, see below...


Call me crazy, but isn't it the point of the shaker to insulate the cold air intake from the hot air under the hood? With all those holes around the perimeter of the base, how is that going to work?

Not crazy at all. Trust me, I struggled with that decision. It's a long story, but the shorter version is that without those holes, I'm not going to get much air into the intake, period. The shaker base has about 2.5" of depth, and I'm using a 2.5" tall filter. On top of the filter is an aluminum lid. When you assemble those, then sit the shaker itself on top, there is literally about 3/8" of opening around the edge of the lid for the air flow to get from the shaker to the filter. I did some math, and the actual 'area' calculated is pretty low.

So then I thought I would try one of the K&N X-Stream lids. I've read mixed views about how they can hurt absolute horsepower. But if you don't have any air flowing into the engine, that's going to hurt even worse. So I figured that turbulent air was better than no air. Unfortunately, the lid hits both the shaker and the shaker base, so it wouldn't work at all. :(

Eric and I decided to open up the holes around the shaker base to allow at least some air to get in there. Yes, it's engine compartment air, but I need some air. I've come to the conclusion that I will likely remove the shaker and base and install a generic base/filter for any event where I actually care about making power and running cooler (ie: a track day). I will also chassis dyno the different setups and see what kind of power I'm losing.

There just wasn't a better way to do it... I can't go any lower on the base drop. As it is, the inside of the filter touches the base in a lot of area, so the flow is highly restricted. There are a couple of guys who make flat filters that install into the shaker, but I don't like those solutions either for various reasons. Thus, I chose this compromise.


I can also tell you that the single plane intake will cost you 40 lb/ft of torque.

I'm also painfully aware of this. I'm giving up a lot because I wanted a functional shaker on this car!!! See below:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/12/dyno-1.gif (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/71%20Firebird/dyno.gif.html)

The orange torque line is my current setup. If I decide to go back to an LS-style intake, at least I know what awaits me. ;)

[carbuff]

Since I am in the same boat, what TB & shaker / air cleaner base did you end up using?

Well, I've tried several, and none worked without modifying something. There are several factors which affected this for me:


My engine sits about 3/4" further back than stock
The top of the throttle body is way higher than stock
The angle of the engine vs. the stock Pontiac setup


Those are some main ones. The combination of the Victor Jr, the LS setup in general, and the throttle body cause the shaker to see too high. I could step down to the GMPP intake, which is about 3/8" - 1/2" shorter, and that would help a lot. I purchased a replacement Accel throttle body which is 1/4" shorter than the one I had, and in my case, that little bit helped a lot.

Ultimately, we started with the 2.5" version of the PTFB shaker base. It drops about 2" and then has about a 2.5" side height. This ultimately drops the shaker about 3/4" from stock height. Then, due to the angle of the engine (apparently the stock Pontiac intake where the carb sits is angled to compensate for this), Eric ground the angle of the lip that sits on the TB to compensate. That worked great! Finally, Eric cut out the bottom of the shaker from the side, made a new circle from aluminum, slid the side about 3/4" forward, and welded it all back together. So the filter is closer to the side in the back than it is in the front, another reason we opted for drilling the holes.

So my combination of JRS subframe, Trans-Dapt mount plates, LS engine, Victor Jr. intake, Accel throttle body, PTFB 2.5" shaker base, and lots of modifying to the base made it all fit. And I'm still struggling to get enough air into the engine! :hammer:

[andrewb70]

Why didn't you do something similar to what I did or that was on the Year One Bandit cars?

https://www.pro-touring.com/~andrewb/gtov2/photo83.JPG

https://www.pro-touring.com/~andrewb/gtov2/photo84.JPG

*Edit* Looking at your pictures it doesn't look like in a TA there is nearly as much height as there is in my GTO...
Andrew

[cdoggy81]

Thanks for the info Bryan. Originally I was going with:
PTFB drop base
Vic JR
Edelbrock TB

Now I may need to look at the GMPP intake (depending on price) & an Accel TB....
What TB did you have before the Accel?
If you go to a GMPP LMK about that Vic Jr :}

[carbuff]

Looking at your pictures it doesn't look like in a TA there is nearly as much height as there is in my GTO...
Andrew

Andrew, this was one of the places where I've known what I wanted all along, and just haven't been willing to sacrifice form for function... I wanted the 4-barrel 'look', and I wanted a functional shaker. I knew it was going to be tough, but it's just what I want.

But you also hit on a key point: I don't have the height you have! I don't know the exact difference, but the LS-style intake wouldn't be that much shorter than the setup I have not. My shaker base is about 1/2" above my fuel rails, so I couldn't make it much lower even if I changed intakes. So I might be able to build a setup similar to yours, but it would literally have to be 1/2 as tall. I certainly couldn't run a 3" or larger pipe out of it. :(

If I were to try and build something like what you have, then literally my filter would be right on top of the TB. I don't know how well that would work either.

What size is that filter? I'm guessing approximately 14" x 12"? If what we've got really is a horrible power robber, then I might consider building something different.

[carbuff]

Thanks for the info Bryan. Originally I was going with:
PTFB drop base
Vic JR
Edelbrock TB

Now I may need to look at the GMPP intake (depending on price) & an Accel TB....
What TB did you have before the Accel?
If you go to a GMPP LMK about that Vic Jr :}

It's tough to know what combination will work, since every setup is different. My suggestions are to, if possible, take some measurements off of a car based on the firewall. We measured how far forward the center of the original carb was, and how much lower it was relative to the edge of the firewall. That point stayed consistent after the swap, so we at least knew where we were starting from. We were about 1/2 - 3/4" closer to the firewall, and about an inch taller. Without putting it all together though, it's hard to know what you have...

I had a throttle body which I had owned for about 15 years, and the company is long gone. It looks like a FAST, but it's not the same. The Accel is about 1 5/8" tall if I recall correctly. It was actually recommended by another member here. It doesn't match the picture on their website at all, it's a much nicer piece in person. Between that 1/4" saving, grinding down the lip which sits on the TB about 3/16", we managed to get where we needed to be. The GMPP would have made it easier, but like I said in reply to Andrew, I'm almost touching the coils and the fuel rail, so I realistically cannot go much lower. I might get 3/8" more if we pushed it, but after that it's modifying fuel rails (I already have the 1.5" tall injectors instead of the normal 2.5" tall ones) and relocating coils. Stuff I don't really want to do...

[andrewb70]

Andrew, this was one of the places where I've known what I wanted all along, and just haven't been willing to sacrifice form for function... I wanted the 4-barrel 'look', and I wanted a functional shaker. I knew it was going to be tough, but it's just what I want.

But you also hit on a key point: I don't have the height you have! I don't know the exact difference, but the LS-style intake wouldn't be that much shorter than the setup I have not. My shaker base is about 1/2" above my fuel rails, so I couldn't make it much lower even if I changed intakes. So I might be able to build a setup similar to yours, but it would literally have to be 1/2 as tall. I certainly couldn't run a 3" or larger pipe out of it. :(

If I were to try and build something like what you have, then literally my filter would be right on top of the TB. I don't know how well that would work either.

What size is that filter? I'm guessing approximately 14" x 12"? If what we've got really is a horrible power robber, then I might consider building something different.

I hear you on all accounts. Hopefully your setup will work well, and this discussion will be mute. LOL

I don't know the exact dimensions of the filter but it is huge. The application is for a Dodge Ram 3500 series pickup with the cummins diesel. I just went into the parts store and got the biggest filter I could find. One of these days I will get a little CAN bus scanner and monitor AITs, just for giggles. I can tell you that it makes quite a bit of noise when under WOT. Also, when it rains you can see the water droplets on the hood getting sucked in, even under a light tap of the throttle. Although, I have minor issues with drivability if the MAF gets wet...small price to pay.

I know that when I had the shaker with the BBC, my AITs were 5-10 degrees above ambient.

Andrew

[cdoggy81]

Thanks for the info Bryan.
I looked into the GMPP intake but it looks like you have to still machine out the injector bosses. Do they make an already machined one?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-88958675/

I also looked at the Accel units & it seems like there are 3 main ones to choose from for my application depending on CFM requirements. Do you know which model you got; 47202s3, 74202s4 or ?

[cpd004]

Awesome project!

[FirstGenZq8]

good seeing you at HPT today. any new pics/progress report?

[cdoggy81]

any new pics/progress report?
Ya, what's the good word on this bad boy :]

[carbuff]

Wow, I really let this thread get behind. Between the car itself and work and life last year, I just didn't have time to keep everything updated. I did a little better over at Lat-G, but even that's pretty far behind:

http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=29609

Since those posts, I engaged Ron Sutton last summer to help me with the handling of my car. I ordered his custom-valved RideTech triple adjustable coilovers, springs, and swaybars to install on TOW. They made a big difference at the events I ran last year. The car is much more neutral to drive now, and I am now much more educated on how to adjust everything to improve my driving.

I did have a few small problems last year: PS rack blew a seal, O2 sensor died, rod ends in the rear suspension became really noisy. But those were all resolved without too much trouble...

But the latest issue is much more troublesome. I finally took TOW to a local LS tuner to dial in the tune in the Holley HP EFI. You can read the results of that experience here (http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=48834). The net result of that thread is that a $15 valve spring is costing me a full engine rebuild. And it seems that I really got shafted on the engine that I originally purchased. Summary of the issues I've found: crankshaft was previously turned, even though it's supposed to be new; potential rocker arm misalignment with the valves, and WAY higher compression ratio than I was originally told (at least 12.0:1 or so based on my calculations).

Right now I've shipped off the crankshaft to be turned and re-hardened. I found out today that my heads are no salvageable, so I'm shopping for a replacement set. And I'm going to be doing a clutch replacement while everything is apart, even with only 4k miles on the current one...

So I'm a bit frustrated at the moment, but I don't want that to take away from the fun I've had with TOW since getting her on the road! I've enjoyed 6 or so auto-cross events, 2 track days, and 3k or so miles of street driving. Above problems aside, she's a great car to drive and performs really well (especially given my limited experience at these events). I'm hoping that I can get everything taken care of in the next 6 weeks or so such that I can make the Fort Worth GG event in March and the USCA event the weekend after...

That's about it. Thanx for asking! :)

[saltfuture]

Sorry to hear about your troubles, but glad to get an update. I love your car, and it's been a huge inspiration in my own build.