URGENT: I just CANT get my car to stop!

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

From the day I bought this car the brakes have always sucked bad. I have never owned a car that had brake problems like this. My 1979 truck can lock up all 4 tires like nothing but the camaro is driving me insane with problem.

Specs.
69 Camaro
New stock disk up front. New stock calipers. New stock drum in rear. Wilwood race pads up front. New stock master cylinder. All the lines are new. Wheel cylinders on rear are new. Everything is new----besides the booster.

Here is my exact description of the problem. When I push the pedal the first half of the pedal feels like im pushing on a sponge. Then once it is almost to the floor it finally engages. I believe it even makes an air sound too for the first half.
The brakes dont fade once the pedal engages.

Question: Is my brake booster bad? Is the New master cylinder bad? How can I test the booster?

I bled the brakes over and over again with new 400degree+ fluid this weekend too and still crappy pedal.

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dennis68 · 05-23-2005

Originally Posted by CAMAROBOY69

Wilwood race pads up front.

This is a BIG part of your problem. Race pads are not designed to stop at all before they reach optimum temperature, a temperature you would have a very difficult time reaching in a street driving environment. Most race pad manufactures make a point of letting the end consumer know this in advance (the instructions).

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

Just ignore the race pads. Thats not the problem. I just installed them on saturday and to be honest they actually improved the brakes.

**Salt Racer** · 05-23-2005

Adam, check your PM.

Den, I hooked him up with the pads. It's Polymatrix H compound, which starts working at 100*F. All it takes to warm them up is a couple of stops.

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

Have you got a 1 way valve fitted on the vac hose to booster ?

paul67

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

How many clicks does the hand brake go before it locks the brakes

paul67

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

All I have to the booster is 1 big vacuum (actually a fuel line)that hooks to the back of the Holley carb.
I dont have a parking brake but once the brakes engage past the sponge they work great. Its just the first initial push that sucks.
The problem really seems to be somewhere before the brakes themselves. Like booster vacuum. Something around there but im not sure how to check the booster to see if its working properly.

**Rick Dorion** · 05-23-2005

Block off the ports on the MC and see if the pedal comes back. If it does not, your MC is bad. If it does, reconnect one port at a time and see which one gives you the spongy pedal. It sounds like your hitting (or almost hitting) the end of the stroke when the pedal gets hard. You did bench bleed the MC?

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

Yes I bench bleed the MC before installing it about 2 years ago. Of all the vehicles I have owned this is the only one that ever gave me brake problems-ever. My 1979 truck brakes are awesome and I replaced all the same components as the Camaro.

Good idea about blocking the MC. Dang should have done that over the weekend while I was bleeeding brakes.

With race event tomorrow I really dont have any time left for anything.

The reason I am almost to the end of the stroke on the MC is because of the Hydrolic clutch plate I installed when I installed from Tito Jones kit. It installes between the MC and firewall. I love the kit but it did cause my brake pedal to be a lot closer to the floor than I wanted. I tried to adjust it too with no luck. (his kit is still awesome just watch your brake pedal)

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

You need to know how far the brake shoes are away from the drum when you fitted them were the slightly rubbing the drum then backed off 1 click it could be that they are having to move to far ie displacing to much oil before they hit the shoes also the vac should be fitted to the inlet manifold and should be about 3/8" bore with a 1 way valve if you have a daily prodution car check how that pipe to the booster is fitted, you should see what i mean also post a couple of pics if poss.

paul67

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

The rear brakes were pretty much already adjusted perfect. Self adjusters actually worked well for once. The pads on rear barely rubbed at all when drum came off and on so they were almost perfect.

The pipe to the booster is pretty much just a tube sticking out of the booster and thats about it. Nothing special at all there.
SO I should relocate the vacuum to my intake instead of the carb? Ill try to find some old pics. Gotta be some somewhere.

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

how do you post pics into this forum as i have a pics tp post

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

http://www.imageshack.us/
Click "browse" then find your pic and click "host it" and copy any of those links available. Very easy.

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

its loaded see the little valve on the bend and the size of pipe.
paul67

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

I dont see anything?

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

Here are some VERY OLD pics I had at work. yes I know the engine is ugly as hell and yes im repainting it.

I dont even have my 6 speed conversion in yet thats how old these pics are.

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

IP 84.66.179.81
paul67

**Ralph LoGrasso** · 05-23-2005

Adam,

It definitely sounds like a bad booster to me. If you pump the pedal with the car off, do you hear a loud swoosh sound, and does the pedal then stiffen up? Your problem sounds EXACTLY like the problem I had in my Tahoe(the brakes suck on that too, btw, similar to your setup disc/drum). In order to get the truck to stop I had to press the pedal all the way down. The first half of travel did nothing and felt like a sponge. A hydroboost would be a great cure for this, but with 1 day until the track event, this is not going to happen. Hopefully someone here will know a quick fix? My booster finally went a few months back, I replaced it with a rebuilt unit, and the spongy feeling got better, but was still somewhat there. I'd try to trouble shoot that booster if I was you and see what you can come up with.

**CAMAROBOY69** · 05-23-2005

Yes Ralph SWOOOOSH is exactly what I hear. Like I am stepping on the chest of some old man.

Right after that the pedal stiffens up.
Ive been wanting a hydraboost set up but damn I just have too much other crap to buy from this site.

How much is the Hydraboost. I wouldnt consider it for a couple months but what am I looking at for price roughly?

**paul67** · 05-23-2005

looks like you might not have the valve fitted,do not worry what it looks like its no good looking good if it does not work,
paul67 can you see pic

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Thread: URGENT: I just CANT get my car to stop!

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URGENT: I just CANT get my car to stop! Mushy pedal at the top.