Weird Michelin PS2 deal

[Steve1968LS2]

Was working on Penny today and noticed something odd.. my front tires don't match in regards to treadpattern.

Huh.. imagine that..

Come to find out there are at least 4 different part numbers for the PS2 275/25/18 tire

84530
94902
36599
43657

The 32611 is a run flat, the 84530 is for the Viper, three of my tires are 94902 and my "odd ball" front left tire is a 36599.

I think one of these is for a Porsche and one is for a Mercedes.. The 36599 is also quite a bit cheaper than the other tires with the Viper version being the most expensive but a couple of bucks.

I thought I remembered reading that these tires had slightly different grip (compound modifications) in addition to the different tread patterns. I'm sure if one of my front tires is softer than the other that it's not helping in the handling event.

Anyone hear anything on this? I was trying to Google the PNs to find what cars these are for but no luck.

In any event just be aware of this if ordering PS2 tires for your car.

[sik68]

+1. I thought something was funny about the PS2's as well.

On tire rack, they sell 245/45/17 and 275/40/17 for my front/rear...but they aren't considered a matching set; so when you shop for tires "by size" it won't return results. You need to add them to your shopping cart as pairs.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+PS2 Here they list many of the sizes multiple times...which to me indicates multiple tread patterns or other differences.

These tires have been out since 2003? IIRC, so I'm sure there have been tweaks.

[Van B]

Do you mean your fronts don't match the rear or the fronts don't match each other?

I remember when I was researching tires for the Optima RA event on TireRack there seemed to be a lot of OE applications and wondered if they could be mixed.

[Boatmark]

Weird. That brings an interesting question. In theory the car should have been affected by the different compounds / patterns. But in practice?

Looking back now, was there any indication that one side was different, or the car reacted or required set up changes different one way or another? Did the car react differently when pushed harder by Mary Pozzi, than when you were still getting up to speed?

Interesting if there is something to learn here.

[Steve1968LS2]

Do you mean your fronts don't match the rear or the fronts don't match each other?

I remember when I was researching tires for the Optima RA event on TireRack there seemed to be a lot of OE applications and wondered if they could be mixed.

My front left doesn't match my front right with the front left being the odd ball tire.

If that tire is harder I doubt that is helpful.

[ProdigyCustoms]

I am sworn to secrecy!

Yes, some are softer then others. The advantage is ...........well.............Unfair!

Good detective work, You found one of our secrets!

Seriously, usually N spec Porsche tires are the most aggressive compound. Vipers are pretty gooey too.

[BRIAN]

So if a mag does a test and lists simply Mich PS2's and not the exact tire one could have an advantage over the other. Think about when they are a few years older and they merge the numbers together.

Interesting!

[Steve1968LS2]

I am sworn to secrecy!

Yes, some are softer then others. The advantage is ...........well.............Unfair!

Good detective work, You found one of our secrets!

Seriously, usually N spec Porsche tires are the most aggressive compound. Vipers are pretty gooey too.

Well I'm finding out that my left tire is rather hard.. much more so than my right...

What part number is the Porsche one?

I'm feelin' all hillbilly with my mis-matched tires.. lol

[ProdigyCustoms]

I do not see a 275/35/18 in a Porsche tire. I see Viper and Mercedes. No Porsche in that size. The Viper tire should have a C1 on it. Porsche tires should have N1, N2, N3 N4 on it. Which is softest, I have not found out, but I do know they are all poured with different coupmonds to manufactures spec, and all carry the 220 wear rating which makes them legal for Pro Touring events

I do not have a part number listing.

[BonzoHansen]

If you have a good Michelin dealer nearby they should be able to tell you which is which. Or if your magazine contacts includes a MAST (BFG, Michelin) rep drop them a line.

That was common, different tires with same name. We saw that a lot with the MXV... line. Multiple tires/part#s for a 205/60/15 MXV4 for instance, even in the same speed rating. You had to know what questions to ask when people called looking for one or two specific hoops.

Steve, the cheapest one is likely the aftermarket replacement market tire.

[slowcamaro]

I remember there being a big hoopla over track times when the GTR was released and special compound tires this and that.

How do the tire durometer readings stack up?

[MrQuick]

Was working on Penny today and noticed something odd.. my front tires don't match in regards to treadpattern.

Huh.. imagine that..

Come to find out there are at least 4 different part numbers for the PS2 275/25/18 tire

84530
94902
36599
43657

The 32611 is a run flat, the 84530 is for the Viper, three of my tires are 94902 and my "odd ball" front left tire is a 36599.

I think one of these is for a Porsche and one is for a Mercedes.. The 36599 is also quite a bit cheaper than the other tires with the Viper version being the most expensive but a couple of bucks.

I thought I remembered reading that these tires had slightly different grip (compound modifications) in addition to the different tread patterns. I'm sure if one of my front tires is softer than the other that it's not helping in the handling event.

Anyone hear anything on this? I was trying to Google the PNs to find what cars these are for but no luck.

In any event just be aware of this if ordering PS2 tires for your car.
yep, wife (Porsche dealer parts manager) says there are N1 through to N4 as Frank stated, Porsche versions.
She says PS2 275/25/18 tire isn't a Porsche size....??? Frank says 275/35 and you have 275/25 posted???? just 285/30 and 295/30


Dodge has a C1 in 275/35/18 and pn 84530 for viper
Mercedes has a MO rating and pn 94902
no rating 36599 open make
no rating 43657 open make

edit, sorry Frank, didn't see your 2nd post.

[Steve1968LS2]

yep, wife (Porsche dealer parts manager) says there are N1 N2 Porsche versions.
She says PS2 275/25/18 tire isn't a Porsche size....??? Frank says 275/35 and you have 275/25 posted???? just 285/30 and 295/30


Dodge has a C1 in 275/35/18 and pn 84530 for viper
Mercedes has a MO rating and pn 94902
no rating 36599 open make
no rating 43657 open make

Sorry.. I meant 275/35/18

So I guess the Viper PN would be the way to go? Hmmm..

[mpozzi]

I am sworn to secrecy!

Yes, some are softer then others. The advantage is ...........well.............Unfair!

Good detective work, You found one of our secrets!

Seriously, usually N spec Porsche tires are the most aggressive compound. Vipers are pretty gooey too.

Damn, now EVERYBODY knows!!! I was wondering if anyone else had figured that out and was hoping to keep this secret my own ...

Cheers,
Mary Pozzi

[MrQuick]

Sorry.. I meant 275/35/18

So I guess the Viper PN would be the way to go? Hmmm..
ok am I missing something...did you make a track tramp build thread or?? sorry Track car you got going togther?

Im sure you can get 285's on Penny for some stickier Porsche tires.

Vince

[MrQuick]

Damn, now EVERYBODY knows!!! I was wondering if anyone else had figured that out and was hoping to keep this secret my own ...

Cheers,
Mary Pozzi
soooo much deception going on :smoke:


LOL

[Steve1968LS2]

ok am I missing something...did you make a track tramp build thread or?? sorry Track car you got going togther?

Im sure you can get 285's on Penny for some stickier Porsche tires.

Vince

You're missing the fact that I'm taking about Penny.. Track Rat is a long ways from needing tires.

I can fit 285 tires up front.. but I'm not sure I want a low profile like a 285/30/18

[John Wright]

I'm feelin' all hillbilly with my mis-matched tires.. lol
:idea:I guess you better send the car over to me so I can wear that set out for you so you can buy a matched set. Really, I don't mind at all.:smoke:

[James OLC]

I found the tech guys at tire rack to be really helpful (more so than the sales guys) with this. There are (at least) three different 335/30-18 options as well - some that are on sale more often than others. When I was shopping for tires before OLoA there were some really intesting conversations regarding tire choice - exactly the same but totally different comes to mind.

But you have a durometer in your night stand... why not check it out yourself and give us some hard numbers...

[silver69camaro]

This is why I always say that treadwear rating is pretty much irrelevant when comparing tires!

[John Wright]

But you have a durometer in your night stand... why not check it out yourself and give us some hardness numbers...Fixed it for ya...LOL

[Yelcamino]

My front left doesn't match my front right with the front left being the odd ball tire.

Steve, remember this?

"That means the 12 bolts cost me just over $400 or $34 PER BOLT! All because I wanted open ended lug nuts and I'm f-d up in the head.. lol"

So how long before the mis-matched tires drive you mad? :poke:

[68Formula]

I'm feelin' all hillbilly with my mis-matched tires.. lol

Embrace your inner redneck Steve, and just run 'em. LOL!

[BonzoHansen]

Steve, remember this?

"That means the 12 bolts cost me just over $400 or $34 PER BOLT! All because I wanted open ended lug nuts and I'm f-d up in the head.. lol"

So how long before the mis-matched tires drive you mad? :poke:


Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy
Mis-matched tires and $34 bolts make Steve crazy……….


:hah: :seizure:


:cheers:

[John Wright]

^^^^ all while wiping off the El Camino......LOL

[GrabberGT]

"Battle of the Supercars" on SpeedTV talks about Micheline and there programs to develop tires for specific cars on a few of their episodes.

[sik68]

I called Tire Rack on this issue...the guy I talked to had no clue. "I'm not aware of any designations other than the Treadwear."

Ugh.

Mr. Quick, would you mind looking up the 245/45/17 and 275/40/17 for any "stickiness" designations or OEM applications? 81039 and 39119 Thanks a bunch!!

-Steven

[ProdigyCustoms]

Sorry. No sticky tires 4 U. Nothing is available in those 17" sizes.

[sik68]

Sorry. No sticky tires 4 U. Nothing is available in those 17" sizes.


Thanks for checking Frank, Tirerack (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+PS2) and Michelinman.com show them as sizes though, 81039 and 39119. 2 years ago when I bought my Goodyear F1's they weren't available, but now apparently they're here. I'd like them for a stiffer sidewall than my flimsy Goodyears.

[sik68]

OCD kicking in. Here's a blurb from the "Car Bible." (http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html) on N ratings:



Porsche designs and manufacturers some of the highest performance cars in the world (with the exception of the butt-ugly Cayenne). All this design and performance is worth nothing if you put cheap Korean tyres on your Porsche though, and because of that prospect, Porsche introduced the N rating or N specification system. In order for a manufacturer to be an OE (original equipment) supplier of tyres for Porsches, they must work with the Porsche engineers at the development and testing stage. They concentrate on supreme dry-weather handling but they also spend a considerable amount of time working on wet-weather handling. Porsches are typically very tail-heavy because of the position of the engine relative to the rear wheels, and with traction control off, it's extremely easy to spin one in the wet. Because of this, Porsche specify a set of wet-grip properties which is way above and beyond the requirements of any other car manufacturer.
OE tyres for Porsches must successfully pass lab tests to prove that they would be capable of adequately supporting a Porsche at top speed on a German Autobahn. Once the lab tests are done, they must go on to track and race tests where prototypes are evaluated by Porsche engineers for their high-speed durability, uniformity and serviceability. If they pass all the tests, Porsche give the manufacturer the go-ahead to put the car tyres into production and then they can proudly claim they are an N-rated Porsche OEM (Original Equipment Modifier).
The N-ratings go from 0 (zero) to 4, marked as N-0, N-1 etc. This N-rating, stamped into a tyre sidewall, clearly identifies these tyres as having gone through all the nauseating R&D and testing required by Porsche as described above. The number designates the revision of the design. So for a totally new design, the first approved version of it will be N-0. When the design is improved in some way, it will be re-rated as an N-1. If the design changes completely so as to become a totally new tyre, it will be re-rated at N-0.
If you've got a Porsche, then you ought to be aware that as well as using N-rated tyres, you ought to use matching tyres all around because many Porsches have different sizes tyres front and rear. So for example if you have a Porsche with N-3 rated tyres and the rear ones need replacing but the model has been discontinued, you should not get N-0's and put them on the back leaving the old N-3's on the front. You should replace all of them with the newer-designed re-rated N-0 tyres. But then you own a Porsche so you can certainly afford four new tyres....
One final point. You may go into a tyre warehouse and find two tyres with all identical markings, sizes and speed ratings, but one set has an N-rating. Despite everything else being the same, the non-N-rated tyres have not been certified for use on a Porsche. You can buy them, and you can put them on your car, but if you stuff it into the armco at 150mph, Porsche will just look at you and with a very teutonic expression ask why you didn't use N-rated tyres.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[Steve1968LS2]

Well, since I don't want a 30-sidewall (to get a Porsche spec tire) I will do the next best thing and get some Viper C1 replacement front tires.

[66SuperSport]

I found the tech guys at tire rack to be really helpful (more so than the sales guys) with this. There are (at least) three different 335/30-18 options as well - some that are on sale more often than others. When I was shopping for tires before OLoA there were some really intesting conversations regarding tire choice - exactly the same but totally different comes to mind.

But you have a durometer in your night stand... why not check it out yourself and give us some hard numbers...

James

Anything special I should know about the tires I bought from you???

[James OLC]

James

Anything special I should know about the tires I bought from you???

Just that they are the best
:)

[Matt@BOS]

Intriguing....

BTW James, did you sell all of your extra tires, or do you still have a set? I sort of need to replace mine after being hit.

Matt

[SLO_Z28]

"Battle of the Supercars" on SpeedTV talks about Micheline and there programs to develop tires for specific cars on a few of their episodes.
^this.

When I worked for SHC they had literature for sales personnel explaining the differences.

[xxxturbo6]

Just curious, Has anyone tried the TOYO Proxis T1R tires yet? If so, how do they compare to these PS2's?


I'm running the TOYO proxis T1R tires 255/35-18 (front) & 285/40-40 (rear) and they seem to be nice a real nice overall tire, Great in the rain!, Great on dry pavement and I can cut 1.80 60' times with them at the drag strip.
I would like to know how well they compare to the PS2's.



Scot W.
GNS

[xxxturbo6]

Knowbody?




SW.