How much soft line is too much??

[LowBuckX]

Im rerunning all my brake lines and added -3 braided DOT lines at all 5 points needed. Front callipers ,rear calipers and body to axle.

I think it would look better to run braided from Master to firewall and transition from briaded to hard line. So I would be adding about 16 or less inches of braided front and back. Main reason is I cant make a nice looking bent line to save my life. :spank2:

Is this OK. With the OG rubber lines brake feel was great. Now with the braided it will stiffen up a bit which is OK for me . Even if I ended up with the same feel as the rubber I would be OK with that. Just not mushy.. What do you think

[parsonsj]

I think it will work... but I also think it will look a bit "under-engineered" The only reason to run flex line is if the components being connected move in relation to each other.

So putting in a flex line between the master and the firewall will be a head-scratcher for most people.

jp

[dipren443]

What are you using to bend your lines?

I have used this one and it makes beautiful bends.

http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/400-Series-Lever-Benders/EN/index.htm

[BonzoHansen]

GM used SS flex lines out of the ABS units on 4th gens. IIRC they were part of the hardline from there, not connected to it, but I think the premise is the same.

[parsonsj]

A hearty second to the Ridgid tube benders. I've got a whole set.


jp

[CamaroAJ]

you can also make the loops in the hard line like GM does. thats there answer to chassis flex and hard lines. if they are bent right then they also look very nice and clean.

[LowBuckX]

Im gonna try it one more time with the ridgid bender I found one I can borrow but still may go ss braided so keep comments comming.

[Apogee]

There's really no performance disadvantage to running the braided stainless hose instead of hard line. The difference in compliance under pressure between the two is negligible. The braided stainless hose does weigh slightly more per foot than 3/16" brake tubing, but that's getting pretty picky if you ask me.

Tobin
KORE3

[6'9"Witha69]

I can't bend worth a damn. Ask anyone who has seen my lines.

Function, just keep telling yourself it's all about function! LOL

[Payton King]

My entire system is run with -3 braided lines. NASCAR does the same thing along with other racing bodies.

[67 455 Bird ragtop]

My entire system is run with -3 braided lines. NASCAR does the same thing along with other racing bodies.

Are there any brands better than other to use? I'd like to do my entire system in braded. Easier to run and no flaring to worry about.

[Apogee]

I agree with Tobin

I think I should make that my signature :thankyou:

As for brands, Russell offers their PowerFlex (http://www.russellperformance.com/mc/brake_hoses/powerflex.shtml) series of hose and hose fittings and Aeroquip offers their Teflon Racing Hose (http://www.eaton.com/EatonCom/ProductsServices/AeroquipPerformanceProducts/HoseProducts/index.htm). Most finished hose suppliers are going to want to supply you with finished hose assemblies complete with swaged fittings...nothing wrong with that, but you'll need to specify all of your lengths in advance.

Tobin
KORE3

[LowBuckX]

I feel confident in the ss line now so I may forgo the hard line battle

[Payton King]

Mine are stainless with teflon inners. Machine made to the length I specified with stainless ends.

[parsonsj]

I did II Much with stainless hardline, aluminum tube flares and nuts and aluminum bulkheads and tees. I used teflon-lined stainless hose at the rotors.

I really didn't have that much trouble bending the lines to fit and look decent, and I had zero leak problems.

I'm sure a quality teflon-lined hose would be fine for a street car, and I can see why race cars use them: make up a list of lengths and ends, put some tie-down inserts in the proper place on the frame, and never bend a line again. Plus it can be easily disassembled (and stored) to allow for cleaning and full bleeding.

But back to the OP: LowBuck has that user name for a reason... and using hose on the whole car has gotta be more expensive.

jp

[sebtarta]

I think I should make that my signature :thankyou:

As for brands, Russell offers their PowerFlex (http://www.russellperformance.com/mc/brake_hoses/powerflex.shtml) series of hose and hose fittings and Aeroquip offers their Teflon Racing Hose (http://www.eaton.com/EatonCom/ProductsServices/AeroquipPerformanceProducts/HoseProducts/index.htm). Most finished hose suppliers are going to want to supply you with finished hose assemblies complete with swaged fittings...nothing wrong with that, but you'll need to specify all of your lengths in advance.

Tobin
KORE3

I think you should

________________________
I Agree With Tobin :thankyou:

[LowBuckX]

But back to the OP: LowBuck has that user name for a reason... and using hose on the whole car has gotta be more expensive.

jp
Short lengths arent bad and fangolia(spelling) -3 hose ends are cheap now plumbing the whole car with ssbraided would hurt. braided Tranny lines hurt a bit more than the -3

[JRouche]

I dont see a problem with running as much hose as you want.

Alot of the hose issues come from OEM hoses, rubber hoses. They DO swell. And even more with time.

But quality teflon stainless steel hoses dont swell much at all, if at all, and last as long as you will own the car.

And Im not sure but I think its the teflon that makes it all happen. Teflon is compleatly resistant to brake fluid. So thats a plus. Where rubber can get a lil soft over time. And the teflon is what creates the "stiffness" and resistance to expansion in the line. I dont think its so much the stainless cover as much as it is the core. The cover is woven. So it will expand and contract. But thats needed to make it flexible. Just the fact that it is flexible without kinking shows that the cover expands. So it looks like the core of teflon is what is taking all the pressure. And teflon tubing has a pretty decent tension strength, not anywhere near steel, but higher then say natural rubber.

Maybe why a rubber cored stainless hose from say aeroquip or russell cant withstand the pressures of their teflon cored hose. Kinda shows that the core tube is what actually takes the load. The stainless cover provides great abrasion resistance and prolly some of the support of the core.

Look at a brake line or nitrous line. They are pretty stiff for the size, compared to a stainless braided hose with a rubber core tube. I think that comes from the stiff teflon core. Its prolly a pretty thick wall for the size. I dont think the stiffness comes from a tighter stainless steel cover. Like say they wrap a high pressure hose cover tighter because its a high pressure hose.

Anyway. Im just thinking out loud and trying to say why I think a teflon SS hose is ok for longer runs over say a rubber hose. I really like SS teflon hoses. I use it for all of my fuel system and use it for alot of other applications away from the car.

Back to your needs.. I still like hard lines for as much of the brake system as possible. And I only use braided hose for sections that need flexibility. Like the wheel cylinders. And not because I dont have the SS hose. I have literally hundreds of feet of quality teflon hose, I use it alot. And I can get hose ends swaged on no problem.

Oh, by the way. That brings up anouther issue. I would never use re-usable hose ends on a brake system, not that you are, but for anyone else watching. For brake lines I think the the hose ends should be pressed on. Swaged. But as it seems, some folks think thats a less secure way to hold the end on. So be it. I still think a factory swaged end from a good company is the way to go. All the brake or nitrous lines I have seen were of the swaged variety.

Oh, and why dont I run the braided hose for more of the system? Well, they work, hard lines. They are pretty much a no look back item. Do it and if it doesnt leak it will be good to go for as long as I own the car. My car is 48 years old and I just removed the original hard lines for new hard lines. The original lines were still in prefect condition. I removed them because I had to change the routing of them.

And I cant bend tubing for squat. Its like an artistry it seems. Cause I dont have any artistic skills I cant bend a line to look nice if I was forced to. But I still bent them and flared the ends. No leaks. Good to go.

For me its about simplicity. And the hard lines were actually simpler for me. And yeah, even with ALL my positive talk about teflon brake lines in the back of my head Im still thinking. SWELL. LOL!!!! Crazy huh. But I do know the hard lines dont swell. And really, they take up less room. My engine compartment is pretty busy as it is.

Anyway. I really think you will be fine with the hose. And heck, the added swell (kidding!!!) will help with brake modulation, kinda an extra buffer :) JR

Oh yeah, an interesting read about some other folks opinions...
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Brake_Lines

[Skip Fix]

My tubing bends look like heck too!