Is a V6 restomod PT car a total sin?

[mikedc]

I'm not really thinking of low-budget 1980s/90s V6 Mustangs & Camaros that are waiting patiently for their owners to save up enough money for the eventual V8 swap.

I'm thinking of a dedicated choice of the smaller motor. When the classic musclecar builder can 100% afford the V8, but chooses the V6 purely for performance/handling reasons.



I was reading about the newest 2011 Mustangs. The V6 can fling the car to 60mph in barely 5 seconds and it runs a 13-sec quarter mile. That's honest smallblock V8 territory.

In this case the V6 car only weighs 3400 pounds. Whereas the (all aluminum) V8 gives it another 200 pounds on the nose. I can't help but think the V6's lighter nose might do the car more overall good than the V8's extra horsepower.


Sacrilige?


.

[BuddyP]

I had considered a Syclone 4.3 turbo motor in the camaro. Decided against it but would've been pretty cool I think.

[exwestracer]

Years ago, I had the idea of moving our shop in the direction of catering to V6 and base model engines for just that reason. Never panned out, but using one certainly isn't a sin if it provides the performance you're looking for...

[TonyHuntimer]

Not a sin.

V6's aren't what they used to be.

Tony Huntimer
Camaro Performers Magazine
RaceHome.com

[79PonchoUK]

I'm not really thinking of low-budget 1980s/90s V6 Mustangs & Camaros that are waiting patiently for their owners to save up enough money for the eventual V8 swap.

I'm thinking of a dedicated choice of the smaller motor. When the classic musclecar builder can 100% afford the V8, but chooses the V6 purely for performance/handling reasons.



I was reading about the newest 2011 Mustangs. The V6 can fling the car to 60mph in barely 5 seconds and it runs a 13-sec quarter mile. That's honest smallblock V8 territory.

In this case the V6 car only weighs 3400 pounds. Whereas the (all aluminum) V8 gives it another 200 pounds on the nose. I can't help but think the V6's lighter nose might do the car more overall good than the V8's extra horsepower.


Sacrilige?


.

200lb less weight between two properly set up standard weight cars isn't worth 30hp in most track situations.


Think about past experiences...when you've had 1 passenger in your car, have you noticed a huge difference in handling? When you've added 30hp more...which would you say felt the most improvement?

I know the balance of engine weight is an argument, but moving the battery to the boot is 50% of that kind of change...still hardly noticable.

[novaderrik]

there are a few Buick GN/T Type Pro touring cars out there..
and a few types of other cars with GN/T Type drivetrains in them.

[vintageracer]

Not now with several stock V6 choices at 300+ HP!

[JEFFTATE]

V6's are fine ..
They perform well..

[mikedc]

200lb less weight between two properly set up standard weight cars isn't worth 30hp in most track situations.


Think about past experiences...when you've had 1 passenger in your car, have you noticed a huge difference in handling? When you've added 30hp more...which would you say felt the most improvement?

I know the balance of engine weight is an argument, but moving the battery to the boot is 50% of that kind of change...still hardly noticable.


It may not be hugely noticeable but it's there.


It's all a matter of perspective too. I could shove a cast iron 426 Hemi into the front end of a Mazda Miata and it might turn some fast track times. But the end result would still be a very badly balanced car, fast laps or not. Some might argue that it would be a better all-around car with an aluminum smallblock V8 instead.


I guess it mostly comes down to personal preference.

.

[69496]

How about fords new twin turbo V6 in the Taurus. I think its 360hp. From what I remember reading you can bump it about to about 450 before the turbos max out. Even with the turbos it is a very small compact light package.

[Vegas69]

I think it would kill resale.

[novaderrik]

I think it would kill resale.

isn't the whole point of this hobby to spend a lot of money on a car and then sell it for almost nothing?

[Vegas69]

Usually, but it's not my goal. haha

[79PonchoUK]

It may not be hugely noticeable but it's there.


It's all a matter of perspective too. I could shove a cast iron 426 Hemi into the front end of a Mazda Miata and it might turn some fast track times. But the end result would still be a very badly balanced car, fast laps or not. Some might argue that it would be a better all-around car with an aluminum smallblock V8 instead.


I guess it mostly comes down to personal preference.

.

Very true. Balance is the most important thing on a track car, definitely. A cast iron big block on a 1000kg car is going to be hard to get a great balance with, but a muscle car with such an engine can be set up with, near as you like, as good a balance as with a V6.

What kind of weight distribubtion makes a good handling car changes every year anyway. Look at the fastest production cars around Nurburgrind at the moment...they all used to be mid-engined with rearward weight bias....

Look at them now.

[elitecustombody]

as long as it's out of GNX,T-type, Typhoon,Cyclone,or any well proven turbo platform,like Toyota 2JZ-GTE ,it's not a V6, but a great platform

[79PonchoUK]

as long as it's out of GNX,T-type, Typhoon,Cyclone,or any well proven turbo platform,like Toyota 2JZ-GTE ,it's not a V6, but a great platform


I've got to say though...a turbo V6 is no advantage over a V8.

After you've fitted the turbo, intercooler and pipework, you're up to V8 weight anyway. The 2.5 skyline engines, 3.0 JZs etc (I know they're inline) are as heavy as a Pontiac 400 when everything is installed.
A 3000GT engine is no lighter either.

People think there are weight savings by having a smaller turbo engine over a big cc unit, naturally...but they're wrong.

The Nissan GTR would probably be quicker round the track with a 7 litre V8. lol

It's hard to imagine until think about everything that goes with a turbo setup...
Heavier manifold, a turbo, wastegate, intercooler, pipework between the two twice, mounting hardware...can easily be 50kg all up..often more.

My friend's just fitted an intercooler to his 3dr cosworth, must be 10kg. His 4 cyl YB is barely lighter than an LS1 as standard....let alone with 10kg intercoolers and a T4 turbo.

For the job of speed...there is very little that gives the genuine (not peak) power to weight of a Gen IV V8.

[79PonchoUK]

Normally aspirated V6...if big enough to make some decent power...is a nice idea though. I'd love to see a few more, and I'm a big V8 fan.

Do it. :) But make sure you don't make it V8 weight, or it's pointless.