View Full Version : Protouring My 2nd Gen Trans am
My project over the next week is to install Protouring F-bodies suspension kit on my 1977 Special Edition Pontiac Trans-Am.... The car starts with a 1999 rebuilt suspension as part of a ground up home done rebuild, body work and paint all done by me as a first time project so its not great but I am ok with it, and it has many street miles and some track time so it is dirty and not a show car so please excuse the dirt etc...Living down a grravel road does not help either....
I must say I am so far impressed with the parts and Dave over at Protouring F-body.
So far I have the new tires mounted Kuhmo 285/40/17 rear and 275/40/17 front. I took it on a test run and so far no rubs at least with the stock suspension. Wheels are Year One Cast Gold Snowflakes 17 X9 ".
Tonight I unpacked everything took a few pictures and removed one leaf spring from the car. Next time I hope to get the other side out and the new springs under the car along with a little clean up...
The Before Picture
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/100_1246-2.jpg
The After with New wheels and stock suspension minus 1/2 coil off the front springs.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/100_1254-1.jpg
Goal is to be ready for a club autocross day december 6th.
srh3trinity
11-21-2009, 05:47 PM
Looks like a great starting point. I have one of these mapped out in my head and have been wanting to build a TA since I saw the Killer Customs Bandit TA. The wheels look great.
critter
11-21-2009, 06:07 PM
That car sucks. I can't believe you'd bring that junk over here and post it. ;););)
Hey, you need to call me on the steering box thing. I may have one for you. No promises on how good it is but I have one Barry pulled off a wreck and gave to me that I never used.
LeighP
11-21-2009, 06:24 PM
Gee, Chris...go easy, mate.....lol.
Nice 77 SE.....I've got a full set of Dave's gear including all the bracing, to add to my 71. I should be picking up the boxes next week.
NOT A TA
11-21-2009, 06:30 PM
Wheels and tires look good! You'll be busy getting that done by the 6th. Keep us posted!
critter
11-21-2009, 06:44 PM
Leigh, I've known him for years. He and I have history. I can assure you, he gives as well as he gets. This is the same guy I drug to a National F-Body Motorsports Event in Memphis with me year before last and he rewarded us all by winning the danged drag race. He was putting some high dollar cars on the trailer in the drag race while rowing the gears in that Tremec. I still haven't forgiven him. LOL.
All I got was the car show award. :(
I want the box I'll call ya tomorrow .
The 2008 NFME was awesome great guys and I had some good luck winning that race I ain't kidding myself .
I hope to attend another, could I place in the autox and drag next time Now that is setting a high goal for the ol black bird ain't it.
I got springs, bushings, A-arms, and subframe braces to bolt on and get it aligned. It's a lot to do solo.
critter
11-21-2009, 07:45 PM
Dude, you got the new shop. Get the girls to help! ;)
Give a shout. No promises but the price is right. You can get it when you pick up that other stuff.
Yeah the more female interlopers that come out there the more floor space I loose !
LeighP
11-22-2009, 03:24 AM
Chris...kinda figured you knew him..... :)
GM_muscle
11-22-2009, 04:39 AM
looks better the way it sits now.
tazzz25906112
11-22-2009, 06:44 AM
That's a nice TA and I'm sure you'll love the new handling characteristics,,,, congratulations
1971CHEVELLE
11-22-2009, 08:06 AM
Looks Awesome :1st: welcome
CruizinKev
11-22-2009, 08:59 AM
very nice man :twothumbs
Well things did not go well.... worked on putting one leaf spring together and the parts just do not seem to fit.... It is a prototype set-up and I have sent email and called protouring F-body to get some help so I am now waiting for a return email, call...
The front Eye bushing is too short to locate the spring... These are using a spherical bearing to allow the spring to camber kinda like the cat 5 stuff from global west made to work with the caltrac bars...
I'll report back after hear from Dave.
opnwide
11-22-2009, 08:42 PM
Very interesting. I'll be watching this thread for inspiration.
cdoggy81
11-22-2009, 09:43 PM
Good looking car! I'll be following this one. Glad the 285/40/ fit in the rear as I wanted to use the same size but in an 18"
T_Raven
11-23-2009, 07:35 AM
Nice looking TA! I'll be interested to hear how you like this suspension once it's done.
I spoke with Dave this morning and took some measurements for him and he is working to make the needed parts today. Hoping to have something before the coming weekend... I guess I can move to the front while I wait on the new spacers.
I am excited to see how much it improves things when it is done too !
I need a new steering box I think now too has some slop it seems......$$$$$ keeps adding up.
Phishfud
11-23-2009, 04:50 PM
Very sweet! Almost identical to my 78, but I went with Hotchkis springs, SPC control arms, and PTfbody g-braces. I added a Lee 670 box over the summer and it made a world of difference. Love the car!
I spent the day working on the front suspension and got the front springs and Upper A-arms installed with tall Ball joints. Parts fit well and other than issues getting the driverside arm off and back on due to problems with the Steering shaft being in the way it went pretty well. I had some help from my 7 year old Daughter and some from my 13 year old son so it was a fun day pretty much pulling wrenches. Tomorrow I hope to finish up a few details from todays work and start working on the new body bushings. I spoke with Dave today and he was finishing up the machine work on the proto type rear spring Eye bushings to work with the caltrack bars and they should ship out tomorrow.
critter
11-24-2009, 06:34 PM
See, I told you that you would make progress if you got the girls involved. I guess the other one was inside with mom? ;)
Yeah Michaela was in the house with Mom. Mckenzie was in the shop with me some. Brought us a bag of candy and took a hundered pictures of everthing from the dog to trash to wasp flying around....
Heres a few pictures we took today...
One year I'm going to take this thing all a part and do a critter like clean and detail on it:1st:....Till then:6gears:
formula
11-24-2009, 09:50 PM
is that a GN I spy in the back, good sir?!?!
Yes ! That is my other car project... 1987 Grand National.
Its pretty factory down to the paint 60k mile car...
Its a fun driver and I am tweaking it to be quicker in the drag mile keeping it pretty much stock... I upgraded the chip and put a set of used 42 lb injectors and a water / alcohol system on it. I need to replace the bumper fillers in the short term and eventually repaint it... Its kinda taking a back seat to the TA this year. Not enough Money or time to fix either one up like Id like much less both, but It's fun to tinker a little on both from time to time. I am hoping to crack the 12's with it next year, but I need some drag radials to have a prayer I think. Anyone got a set of 275/50/15 drag radials they would swap for aMT 275/60/15's.... almost like new about 12 passes...I think they are too tall for the GN.
I've thought about some GNX style wheels for it, but I'm not sure.
critter
11-25-2009, 09:37 AM
LOL. Now you have something else to pick up at my house. I have a set of MT 50's. They're well used but you could use them to make a few passes still.
I'll hook up the trailer.
:)
I am taking a break before I do any more damage. I cannot get the body bushings out. The front ones behind the front wheels spun the nuts so I took the inner fender loose got that off then took out the rear leaving only the core support. Then no matter what I do I can't get the sub to seperate from the body. I have subframe connectors and they were welded. I cut through one side were I used a 1x1 square tube as a bridge, But it still will not move. The only way I will get these suckers apart is to take the sub frame connectors out and that will mean cutting and grinding out a bunch of welds and putting new sub frame connectors in place. I think I am going to tack weld the part I cut back where I cut it and defer to next year on the solid body bushings . I guess I will only do the springs this go around and put in the bracing next year. Yes I am bummed I was not able to get it all done before the Dec 6 auto x. I gotta put the dang fender back in now. Yes I am pissed.
critter
11-25-2009, 12:01 PM
Ah, that's just part of working on old cars. Don't get mad. Walk away and fight that battle another day, just like you say you're going to do. The solid body bushings won't make that big a difference.
The 6th, huh? I might have to find better tires and wheels for the Fiero by then. ;)
UNmolestedTA
11-25-2009, 12:15 PM
Nice car! I hope my first attempt will be half as nice as your car.
Thanks unmolestedTa...I'm sure you can do at least as well as I have on my car. I swear I think I lack the patience for issues like this these days. I called Dave and the rear spring parts are shipping today. He suggested I take a sawzall and cut through the rubber bushings that would free them and allow me to slide in the new aluminum ones in from the sides whithout droping the sub as far down.... That sounds possible... I tried briefly, but my blade was dull and all I made was noise till the crappy battery ran down.... I am debating on pressing forward with the change after getting a fresh blade and corded saw.... What say you ? Worth a shot or just go back with the rubber till I have more time ? I will be out of pocket through saturday starrting tomorrow so I will have 1/2 day Sunday and evenings next week to finish things up.... not a lot of time...
Thanks
Well the bushings are in under car. I ground and cold chiseled the welds on the sub frame connectors so I could get the nessary seperation. I'll tack weld them back when I'm done. Had some problems a job that should have taken a couple hours took to 1:30 am this morning and I also had fender door gap issues that got me some chip paint. The parts fromprotouring fbody are first rate I just messed up on the install. Going to go eat turkey but next up is front frame braces which will require removing the hood or finding short drill bits. That and the rear springs and it us ready for the alignment shop.
Hoping for no more suprises.
cdoggy81
11-29-2009, 07:39 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing how she turned out :) I bet you are excited for the 6th!
sounds great. I'm stoked about the new adjustable frame braces from PTFbody. Those look nice and well worth the $300 or so asking price
NOT A TA
11-29-2009, 08:43 PM
Can you get a right angle drill in there to avoid hood removal?
68byrd
11-30-2009, 07:20 PM
The car looks great. Those wheels look really nice. The larger size makes the car look tough. Keep up the good work!
formula
11-30-2009, 07:30 PM
Can you get a right angle drill in there to avoid hood removal?
it'd be tight. Reeeeeel tight.
Update....
I put the rear leafs under it Wednesday I had to improvise. The rubber washers Dave sent initially were to thick with the caltrac bars so he mailed me some thinner ones, but I knew if I did not have the leafs under it Wednesday Id never have it ready for this weekend. So I went to the hard ware store and purchased some neoprene 1/8" washers and cut the hole size out and put it all together. The washer came in the mail this evening thanks to the good old post office....I need to say this shperical Bearing system Dave is making for the caltracs is a prototype I am testing it for him so this is not a negative reflection on Dave in the least he has been beyond great helping me via email and on the phone. Great guy and his parts are great as well. I may have to drop the springs out after this event and work out some bugs so Dave can market this system for other caltrac bars once we get it right.
I got it aligned this afternoon. 1 deg neg Camber and 5.8 degrees caster 1/32 toe in. It drives ok and feels really stiff... The ride is not really that much if any worse though really... It also did not scrap one time. I di dnot get the frame braces on. I may try tomorrow... I have some other Honey do things that I fear may keep me out of the shop, but I also need to put in a new battery cable the end broke on my old one. I have a concern with the amount of shims needed to get the camber /caster right. There is not a lot of stud left to put on the frame braces. The nut will be right at the end of the stud... Maybe if I loctite it that would be ok... probably not a bad Idea anyway.... The car feels very good and more stable at speed and it corners very flat.
:drive1::drive:
It was cold today and man do these tires get slick when cold... it was spinning in third gear from a roll just hitting the gas.... not even WOT in 2nd and it was spinning like mad ! I know they work great when warm but they sure get hard when cold.... I'll try to get a new picture tomorrow, but It seems to be ready to chase porsche around the Auto X Sunday !:smoke:
NOT A TA
12-04-2009, 06:40 PM
Nice! Have fun with it this weekend!
Taman
12-04-2009, 07:39 PM
I had the Hotchkis TVS setup. I did like it. I am currently getting my subframe replaced with a Heidt's tubular setup with rack and pinion steering. For the rear I will use their 4 link setup. Going to run 275 or 245 40x18 front and 295 40x18 rear. I'm not sure how 275's will fit in the front. If I can afford the 10.5" wide rims I will run 305 30's in the rear.
Well It was fun... I sucked pretty hard in the morning got confused on course on the first 2 runs got DMF's and then spunout on run 3... got a sucky time.... Had time to reflect while I got to be on course watching peoiple that knew how to drive run the course and did much better then the morning still nothing great compared to the SM class field ( man 2 of the fastest cars period were in SM 3 actually.... Dang 4wd WRX's are fast !!! not hardly fair for the 2 wd cars imo... ok thats another topic...
I'll include some pictures of the car and some on course ... It handle better much tighter, but I could not get forward traction for anything.... had good side bite my Dynolycious skidpad thing shows .95 to 1.05 G's peak fwiw.... Mostly I think the driver needs work but I think there is some balance to be found in the set-up as well...
critter
12-08-2009, 05:37 PM
He forgot to mention that temps in the mid-40's, cloud cover and blustery winds had us all contemplating our heat output more than our cars on Sunday. I saw several cars that were running less than full race rubber having traction problems. That parking lot is dirty and cold asphalt and rubber do not connect.
The car has a lot in it, he just needs seat time and practice. It had to be like driving a new car after the upgrades he did.
cdoggy81
12-08-2009, 07:56 PM
Man, she looks really good! Excellent job on everything, stance, rims/tires. Again, good looking ride :)
Funny b/c I too just downloaded that Dynolycious app to the GF' s phone when she wasn't looking. Now if I can only get that damn thing out of her hands for more than 30 seconds I can try it out... Have you checked the 1/4 mile times on it yet?
T_Raven
12-09-2009, 02:36 AM
Pics look geat! Glad you're able to go out and have some fun with it.
LeighP
12-09-2009, 07:36 AM
Top job....looks great. I would love to try autocross...doesn't seem to be something that happens around here though.
critter
12-09-2009, 08:08 AM
Drive to the outback and go around the termite mounds as fast as you can. Same thing. :)
LeighP
12-09-2009, 08:10 AM
lol.....you don't want to hit one of our "outback" termites....doesn't help the car much, and just annoys the heck out of the termite...
Very cool seeing you using the new upgrades, car looks great with the new shoes.
Randy(D&Z Customs LLC.)
[email protected]
1-262-347-9741
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