Choosing a LSX.... Help Please!!

[daytonayellaz]

OK....Please dont shoot me. I have read and read and still just dont have a good grasp on this yet. I have a 67 camaro and want to go LSX 6-speed. I read where a member stated "LS1, LS2 are obsolete" I was already leaning towards 6.0 or larger. So what one?? I have a friend who owns a salvage yard and attends 3 salvage auctions per week. He siad to figure what what vehicle I want the motor from and he will buy it and let me take what i need off of it. I just want to be sure to tell him right the first time. So, car or truck, SUV and what year please? Probably should stick with something thats not to rare....would take a while to find it at the auction. Thanks for any help!!Travis

[Mike Holleman]

"LS1 and LS2 being obsolete" ranks right up there with "protouring is dead." There are many ways to go with LS drop outs. From trucks to Fbodys to vettes to GTOs. If you are after a six speed also, look at 05 and 06 GTOs. There's a ton of wrecked GTOs available. The LS2 is a very good base engine and the six speed in the GTO is already upgraded with stronger internals than the Fbody six speeds.
Regardsless of what you get the drop out from, mounting in your car will be basically the same process. Be sure to get the harness, ECU, throttle pedal etc.
Mike




OK....Please dont shoot me. I have read and read and still just dont have a good grasp on this yet. I have a 67 camaro and want to go LSX 6-speed. I read where a member stated "LS1, LS2 are obsolete" I was already leaning towards 6.0 or larger. So what one?? I have a friend who owns a salvage yard and attends 3 salvage auctions per week. He siad to figure what what vehicle I want the motor from and he will buy it and let me take what i need off of it. I just want to be sure to tell him right the first time. So, car or truck, SUV and what year please? Probably should stick with something thats not to rare....would take a while to find it at the auction. Thanks for any help!!Travis

[neki67]

That reply was given (not by me!) since the LS1 and LS2 have the cathedral port heads which flow significantly less than the square port heads used on the LS3, LS7, LS9, L76 and L98.

"L98, you saÿ?"
Yes sir. This engine is GMs hybrid 6.0L. Starts out with LS2 short block, but has the high flow rectangular port LS3 style heads and intake. It does not have the DoD (Displacement on Demand). The heads are the latest aluminum high flow L92/LS3/L98 castings as used on the new Corvette and HSV LS3 engines and feature 2.16" Inlet Valves and 1.59" Exhaust Valves (solid vales not hollow). The cast aluminum 6 bolt main engine block has a 4.00 inch bore and 3.62 stroke. The compression ratio is 10.4:1. The fuel system is engineered to support power levels well above 600HP with the same high flow 42lb injectors that the LS7 Corvette uses. This engine is setup with 58X ignition. Best thing about the engine: brand new in crate these go for US $ 4500,-.

[BA.]

All in all I think you have the right plan. Personally, I would not rule out a cathedral port setup if the price is right. Parts are plentiful and they still make 500hp and more without too much effort.

Have you seen the latest issue of Chevy Hiigh Performance? It has a nice article breaking out all the LSx motors.
It shows the L92 as: 2007+ Escalade, Tahoe, Silverado, Yukon, Sierra, Hummer H2.

I see the L76 listed as 07+ Silverado, Sierra, Suburban, Yukon, Avalanche and G8 GT.

The pricing on that L98 you referenced is pretty damned good too.

[neki67]

The pricing on that L98 you referenced is pretty damned good too.

I know where to buy it for that price but they're not a sponsor here, so if you would like to know, PM me.

[daytonayellaz]

What wrecked vehicle would I look for to get the L98?

The 4500. L98 you mention come with the harness and any acss.?

[BA.]

From Wiki:

L98

The L98 is a slightly modified version of the L76. Since Holden did not use the displacement on demand technology of the L76, some redundant hardware was removed to form the L98. Power increased to 362 bhp (270 kW)@5700rpm and 391 lb·ft (530 N·m)@4400rpm.

As of February 2009 Holden have used AFM in the L76 block which has been available in all automatic V8s
Applications:
* 2006 (MY06) Holden VZ SS Thunder Ute
* 2006-2007 Holden VE Commodore
* 2006-2007 Holden WM Statesman / Holden WM Caprice
* 2007-2008 Chevrolet Lumina SS
* 2007-2008 Chevrolet Caprice SS

Vortec 6000
The generation IV Vortec 6000 is a V8 truck engine based on the LS2. Displacement is 6.0 L (~366 cu in) from 101.6 mm bore and 92 mm stroke. It is an iron or aluminum engine block that has cast aluminum heads and can be equipped with variable cam phasing and/or Active Fuel Management.

[daytonayellaz]

All in all I think you have the right plan. Personally, I would not rule out a cathedral port setup if the price is right. Parts are plentiful and they still make 500hp and more without too much effort.

Have you seen the latest issue of Chevy Hiigh Performance? It has a nice article breaking out all the LSx motors.
It shows the L92 as: 2007+ Escalade, Tahoe, Silverado, Yukon, Sierra, Hummer H2.

I see the L76 listed as 07+ Silverado, Sierra, Suburban, Yukon, Avalanche and G8 GT.

The pricing on that L98 you referenced is pretty damned good too.

So which would be better? L76 or L92 ? and whats the difference, seems to be some overlap in the vehicles you listed. Thanks!

[BA.]

I noticed that too, that there is overlap.

I don't know what would cause a vehicle to get one engine over another. Could be towing package stuff, assembly plant, availability, I just don't know.

Assuming someone is going to change the cam in either motor, I think it's a moot point unless specifially looking for Displacement on Demand/Active Fuel Management or the cam phasing thing. (like Mast Motorsports is pushing)

[daytonayellaz]

B.A.
I notice you have a LS7 in your 69 camaro. What is a LS7? I dont understand all the designations....LS1, 2, 3 etc. especially when combined with the L76 L92 L98 etc.

[6'9"Witha69]

The LS7 is the 505 hp 427 cid engine found in the C6 Vette Z06.

[neki67]

From Wiki:

The L98 is a slightly modified version of the L76. Since Holden did not use the displacement on demand technology of the L76, some redundant hardware was removed to form the L98. Power increased to 362 bhp (270 kW)@5700rpm and 391 lb·ft (530 N·m)@4400rpm.

362 bhp due to a very tame camshaft. With a mild cam upgrade this engine can easily push 475hp. Basically the same package as described here: http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/tech/0702gm_ls2_engine_l92_heads/index.html


BTW; L98 crate engine is complete from intake to oil pan minus alternator and power steering pump. The water pump is included and is the C6 Corvette model. Water pump and dampener are the same offset as the C5/C6 Corvette. Oil Pan is a rear sump 8 quart used in the Pontiac G8 and Holden Commodore. This engine is equiped with an automatic flexplate.

[cheapthrillz]

Frank just put an L76 in Wes's Formula, and it is pushing 425 at the wheels with just a custom ground cam from Prodigy. That's probably close to 500 at the crank, and I know he got a kick ass deal on it.

[daytonayellaz]

Here's the deal....my salvage yard buddy will probably come very close to just giving me the motor and make his money back parting the rest of the vehicle. Im sure he is not going to buy me a Z06 to pull the motor from, but probably just about anything else. So I want to get the next best thing, maybe something I can later upgrade to the Z06 specs or maybe even better???

I have one shot to basically get a free motor, I want to choose wisely

So for you who actually know something about these motors.....Help me choose please!!

[neki67]

Then I would say: go for the salvage engine! Enough potential for the time being and you can spend money on the rest of the stuff you need to buy.

Unless money is not an object of course . . . .

[BA.]

If he's lucky enough to see one,...the LS3 is probably the best choice since pricing isn't a major issue,...

After that, I'd probably look for any of those L76/L92/L98/L99 kind of motors. (L99 = new Camaro motor for the automatics)

Once you have any of those engines, your costs to make it work in a 1st Gen Camaro or even tweak with a camshaft and intake will be the same.
LS3's are in:
08+ Corvette, '10 Camaro, 08+ Pontiac G8,

You really gotta go pick up the CHP magazine, it's all broken down fairly well. The cover says CRATE POWER with a picture of an LS motor.

Good Luck!

[6'9"Witha69]

Im sure he is not going to buy me a Z06 to pull the motor from, but probably just about anything else. So I want to get the next best thing, maybe something I can later upgrade to the Z06 specs or maybe even better???
LS7 is the only 427 cid engine and only in the Z06.

[daytonayellaz]

Then I would say: go for the salvage engine! Enough potential for the time being and you can spend money on the rest of the stuff you need to buy.

Unless money is not an object of course . . . .



Yeah... this is what Im thinking, because money is a big issue for me here. All the stuff I need to make this work on my car beyond just obtaining the engine...motor mounts, fuel tank/system, cooling system, headers/exhaust system etc. etc. adds up real fast!!

By the way...I do already have a viper 6-speed that was going in the car anyway. I was going to build a N.A. 427 S.B. with a Dart block. Just cant get rid of the bug to do a LSX motor

[cheapthrillz]

Any corvette from 97 to present would be awesome to pick apart for your car. The newer the better. Take the engine, ECM, seats, brakes, suspension, IRS, and transmission. You could build a nice 67 off of those parts.

[cspecken]

Here is the link to the CHP article on the LS series engines:


http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/tech/engines_drivetrain/shortblock/0912chp_performance_chevy_ls_engine_comparison/index.html

[red95t/a]

I would look for an LS2 short block, they are gettin cheaper and easier to find, then you could go with the LS3 heads and intake with a good port job, a good cam and headers then you would be over 500hp at the flywheel easy. We do this combo quite often at our shop and its good bang for the buck.

[ITLBTU]

The '06-'09 SS Trailblazer has the LS2. They're rated at 395hp

[70SS98SS]

the designation for different engines is somewhat confusing. didn't read every post so far but just to clear things up a little. each engine deignation is an RPO code for ordering. some engines are standard some optional all depends on dealer originally ordering.
LS1 was the designation for camaro firebird and corvette engines from 97-02
LS2 came in the corvette in 05 when they changed to 6.0 400hp liter
LS3 is from 08 vette and newer and are 6.2 liter 430hp
LS7 came in 06 and newer Z06 and are 505hp dry sump
L99 is automatic trans Camaro 2010(has active fuel management)
LS3 is camaro stick 2010
the rest they are talking about are for trucks suv's etc if you need specifics let me know I'll help decode won't list all for the sake of space. I have ordered hundreds of chevy cars and trucks and know most applications. hope this helps:lurk:

[daytonayellaz]

Ok guys.....First off, Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to post and help! This is one of my favorite sites fo this reason.

So far the only car that has came along for me to pluck the engine from is a 04 GTO with 2180 miles on it.....Thats not a typo it has just 2180 miles. What do you guys think about using this motor? I can get the PCM and complete undamged wiring harness and whatever else I need for the car. I would like to hold out for 6.0 or larger but this motor sure is tempting! Plus I dont know when the next motor may come along.....and when it does it may not be as nice as this.

[Mike Holleman]

Ok guys.....First off, Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to post and help! This is one of my favorite sites fo this reason.

So far the only car that has came along for me to pluck the engine from is a 04 GTO with 2180 miles on it.....Thats not a typo it has just 2180 miles. What do you guys think about using this motor? I can get the PCM and complete undamged wiring harness and whatever else I need for the car. I would like to hold out for 6.0 or larger but this motor sure is tempting! Plus I dont know when the next motor may come along.....and when it does it may not be as nice as this.

Not a thing wrong with an LS1. Good base engine, lot's of aftermarket goodies available for it and makes good reliable power as is. Also many folks have upgraded their LS2 with heads, cams, intakes etc. You could pick up used LS2 parts very cheap. Not a bad choice.
Mike

[70SS98SS]

have to agree nothing wrong with 5.7 especially if you can get it as cheap as you say with no miles!!!! for some reason 04 gto doesn't bring the same money as (05 and up) 6.0.... still a screamer

[lipe33]

Another viable option is a 5.3 from a truck. They are dirt cheap and can make 500 hp without using high dollar exotic parts. See the link below:

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56501

[LSXZ28]

Ok guys.....First off, Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to post and help! This is one of my favorite sites fo this reason.

So far the only car that has came along for me to pluck the engine from is a 04 GTO with 2180 miles on it.....Thats not a typo it has just 2180 miles. What do you guys think about using this motor? I can get the PCM and complete undamged wiring harness and whatever else I need for the car. I would like to hold out for 6.0 or larger but this motor sure is tempting! Plus I dont know when the next motor may come along.....and when it does it may not be as nice as this.


I would jump all over that! You can put a cam in it and be equal to the LS2 in a heartbeat... or do heads and cam, and far surpass the LS2 very quickly...

[lipe33]

Speaking of cylinder heads, the smaller combustion chamber of the 5.3 heads lends itself to a natural increase in compression without changing any internals. Furthemore, a company call Total Engine Airflow is known for the full CNC treatment they perform on 5.3 heads, making them a VERY economical option to produce considerable power. Please refer to the images below:

[daytonayellaz]

have to agree nothing wrong with 5.7 especially if you can get it as cheap as you say with no miles!!!! for some reason 04 gto doesn't bring the same money as (05 and up) 6.0.... still a screamer

I want to say Im getting it for free, but he has asked me to do some home improvement work on his house.....This is what I do for a living and if I were to bid this at full price would total up to about 2200. Of course I wouldnt charge him full price anyway because of all he has done for me over the years anyway. I have heard this setup is worth north of 3500. ?? not that it really matters I guess.

[daytonayellaz]

Also, this car did not come from the salvage auction. It was in the original owners garage who had bought it back from the insurance co. He had planned on fixing the car but went ahead and sold it. 2100 miles......still has the original oil in it and air filter etc. You could darn near eat off this motor

[BA.]

Hey man, you know that saying "to each his own" right?

It seems like this GTO motor might be really good for you, especially if you're not into modding the motor like I would be.

You put a new cam in that motor, leave everything else alone, and you're practically done. Buy headers, motor/tranny mounts, maybe an air filter intake, maybe a flywheel. that's it.
That should be good for 430-450 motor hp. (The LS1 is about 350hp stock, LS2 400hp stock, LS3 is about 430hp stock)
Cam swaps in the LS motors are SUPER easy my sister could do it. :)

The less you mess around with the motor, heads and intake,..the more you can focus on the ancillary stuff like getting the mounts, radiator, DBW pedal mounted, etc.

[daytonayellaz]

Yeah....I just couldnt get this deal out of my head! I wanted to hold out for the latest and greatest but Im weak man....You should see this thing its so clean. I was thinking of how much power Im actually going to be able to use. Its going in my 67 camaro vert, that is not going to be a drag car or anything. Im thinking the cam change is all I will do and save money for the necessities, like you said Allan. My wife wants to drive the car...I want to go on the power tour. My wifes family is in northern MI (400 miles each way-800 total) and we want to take it to reunions and gatherings etc. So Im thinking this has me written all over it.....

[syborg tt]

another option would be to call Kris and see if this motor was still available

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61449

[66ls2]

Hi is your freind that is parting out this car interested in selling the rear seat? Is it black? I allready have the front seats just need the rear.
Thanks

[daytonayellaz]

Hi is your freind that is parting out this car interested in selling the rear seat? Is it black? I allready have the front seats just need the rear.
Thanks

Yeah, they are black. He has sold a ton of stuff off the car already, and I thought they were sold. I will ask him for you though.

[BonzoHansen]

What about an LY6? Any reason to shy away?

[93Polo]

Speaking of cylinder heads, the smaller combustion chamber of the 5.3 heads lends itself to a natural increase in compression without changing any internals. Furthemore, a company call Total Engine Airflow is known for the full CNC treatment they perform on 5.3 heads, making them a VERY economical option to produce considerable power. Please refer to the images below:
I ran TEA 5.3 stg 2s on my C5 and turned 436rwhp/415rwtq on a stock LS6 intake and TB, Futral F11 228/230. A friend with the same setup was turning within 5rwhp on the same dyno same day later swapped to a FAST/90mm and turned just over 450rwhp. A few guys with F13s (230/232) were in the upper 460s rwhp with the FAST. Both were 6 speed cars.

[93Polo]

Hey man, you know that saying "to each his own" right?

It seems like this GTO motor might be really good for you, especially if you're not into modding the motor like I would be.

You put a new cam in that motor, leave everything else alone, and you're practically done. Buy headers, motor/tranny mounts, maybe an air filter intake, maybe a flywheel. that's it.
That should be good for 430-450 motor hp. (The LS1 is about 350hp stock, LS2 400hp stock, LS3 is about 430hp stock)
Cam swaps in the LS motors are SUPER easy my sister could do it. :)

The less you mess around with the motor, heads and intake,..the more you can focus on the ancillary stuff like getting the mounts, radiator, DBW pedal mounted, etc.

IMO it is not cost effective to mess with maxing out a Heads and Cam motor. My old roommate just swapped to untouched 243 casting heads (LS6/LS2), FAST 90mm, a healthy cam and turned 441/415 with some lower budget long tubes in a 6 speed C5.

I would keep a traditional throttle cable, the throttle response IMO is better. It was just enough to annoy me with my C5 but most will never notice. I have a '99 F-body PCM to run the LS based swap when I get the money to finish my Chevelle.

[86_442_kID]

What about an LY6? Any reason to shy away?

The only reasons I can think of anybody not talking about the LY6 engine is because either theey don't know that much about it or because its a cast iron block and it weighs a little more then the aluminum LS2 based engines. Regardless I think the LY6 iron block is awsome engine to do a swap with oh and plus on top of that, it already have the L92 heads on it!

[Blitz]

Does anyone have a scan of the cover of that issue? I can't find my copy and I need some help identifying it easier. TIA