Mastercool flare tool

[317millhand]

Im thinking of getting the Mastercool universal hydraulic flare tool set number 71475. Will the Mastercool tool double flare hard stainless lines? I have a stainless line kit from Right stuff and need to add a prop valve in the front to rear line and convert to flex lines for my new rear discs. This is not the annealed type tubing. Eastwood sells what looks like the Mastercool set for over $500 and says that it will not do stainless. I want to get a good tool that I can keep forever and use on other projects in the future. By the way Eastwood has a nice tool out now as well that is my other choice. http://www.eastwood.com/professional-brake-tubing-flaring-tool.html

[NOGO]

I have had a Snap-on flare tool for 10 years and it works great.

[megaladon6]

i haven't done SS with it, but a bunch of guys here have. you shouldn't have any problems.

[oestek]

We've got that Eastwood pro tool and it's really nice. We've not double flared stainless with it yet, but I'm confident it would have no problem with it.

http://v8tvshow.com/content/view/759/45/

[317millhand]

I have had a Snap-on flare tool for 10 years and it works great.

Will it double flare stainless. I've got a good rigid brand flare tool that will single flare even the hardest stainless, but not capable of double flaring. Some folks say the hard stainless lines do not need double flaring, but I get alot of different views on this.

[JRouche]

Will it double flare stainless. I've got a good rigid brand flare tool that will single flare even the hardest stainless, but not capable of double flaring. Some folks say the hard stainless lines do not need double flaring, but I get alot of different views on this.

And I also saw some yes and no discussions if it will do SS. The eastwood tool says NOT for SS. And it is the same tool as the mastercool. I think they are all the mastercool type, havent seen any that are not.

I have the MC but havent done any SS. The only issue I see would be the clamping die being able to hold onto the tube with enough force to keep it from sliding. The pump will bend it, but it may try to push the tube out causing a short flare.

And for me thats the major downfall of most flaring tools, they just cant grip the tube with enough pressure to keep it from creeping when the flare is being formed. JR

Ok Ill add a lil more opinion. Double flare or single. The double flare is used IMO on soft steel tubing because the cut edge is so soft and thins out with a single flare and the double flare basically creates a new edge by folding the cut edge in. So you have a thicker outer edge on the double flare and its not gonna tear or thin out. The thinning of the metal on a single flare is what causes them to fail.

Now with stainless it may not thin out as much as the soft steel brake lines. And I say steel but they are not steel, not completely. I thought I remember reading they do have copper or some other soft metal in them. Maybe not. But, if the wall thickness of a stainless line was sufficient to be able to thin out a lil without becoming too thin then a single flare should work. If it is gonna be a single flare the cut needs to be perfectly square and burr free. Now if the wall thickness is too large I dont see you double flaring it. Any idea what the specs of the stainless brake line is? And it is brake lines right, cant use stainless tube not meant for it. JR

[CarlC]

Why do you need to double flare stainless?

[BonzoHansen]

I thought the need for double flare was because of the seam that SS does not have.

[MonzaRacer]

Why do you need to double flare stainless?


Yes all automotive brakes systems with inverted flare needs double flair or it will leak.

[MonzaRacer]

I thought the need for double flare was because of the seam that SS does not have.


UH NO, double flare uses the crimping action of the inverted part to get a high pressure seal, single flare is only rated to like 200 psi or some such low number. Remember it from IVM class in tech school.

[MonzaRacer]

As for the Mastercool hydralic flaring tool, BUY ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You will NEVER GO BACK unless you have too.
It will also if its big kit, give you the ability to do ISO or "Bubble" flare, GM old school FI fuel filter flare thate uses the orings and FI style filter. And it will give you the ability to make the push connect flar for say Ford fuel filters too and lots of stuff like buying the 37 degree adapters give you a way to to the AN flare too.
I spend $468 on snap on truck and its best nearly $500 investment I have made yet.
I even use the older GM fuel line flare to put a rib on fuel lines and tranny cooler lines when using hose clamps, the hose will never slide off unless it gets a LOT of pressure.

[MonzaRacer]

Oh yeah saw one on Amazon.com for like $300 or so. AFTER buying mine but I financed mine when up grading my DSO too.

[megaladon6]

http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/p-3494-mastercool-71475.aspx
screw snap on, save $200!

[BonzoHansen]

UH NO, double flare uses the crimping action of the inverted part to get a high pressure seal, single flare is only rated to like 200 psi or some such low number. Remember it from IVM class in tech school.

Then I have been misinformed, thanks.

[317millhand]

I got it today and tried it with some scrap tubing. Made a good straight cut on the tubing with a bandsaw and filed of the rough edges and reamed the inside. It double flared the 3/16 stainless tubing perfect on the first try very quickly and then some 1/4 inch stainless brakeline perfect as well. The dies clamp down very hard. Good quality that is definately worth the price. I believe it will handle whatever you throw at it. I paid $275 for the universal kit that will handle all the things monza racer mentioned. They also have the kit that does only the double flare and push connect flare for $235. heres where i got it after searching for the best price http://www.tooldiscounter.com/ItemDisplay.cfm?lookup=MAS71475
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[JRouche]

http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/p-3494-mastercool-71475.aspx
screw snap on, save $200!

The toolwarehouse has a guarantee 110% price matching policy. NOT!!!! They want 331 for the 71475 kit. Tool discounter sells it for 275. Would they match it??? NOPE. So with the 12 bucks of shipping the Tool Discounter still kills them.

Whats up with a written guarantee?? Guess it only holds true if it suits them. They should prolly re-word their guarantee to suit their needs.

Just shows, I does pay to shop around.

275 for that set is a STEAL!!! Get one there if you were thinking about it. Thanks Millhand for the link for the great price!!! JR

[megaladon6]

why wouldn't they match it?

[317millhand]

The toolwarehouse has a guarantee 110% price matching policy. NOT!!!! They want 331 for the 71475 kit. Tool discounter sells it for 275. Would they match it??? NOPE. So with the 12 bucks of shipping the Tool Discounter still kills them.

Whats up with a written guarantee?? Guess it only holds true if it suits them. They should prolly re-word their guarantee to suit their needs.

Just shows, I does pay to shop around.

275 for that set is a STEAL!!! Get one there if you were thinking about it. Thanks Millhand for the link for the great price!!! JR

no problem

[The WidowMaker]

UH NO, double flare uses the crimping action of the inverted part to get a high pressure seal, single flare is only rated to like 200 psi or some such low number. Remember it from IVM class in tech school.

ive been intending on using a single 37* flare for both the brake and fuel system on my car. i had initally heard that this wasnt a problem as long as the proper tube nuts were used and the fittings were converted pack to pipe thread at all the inlet/outlets. after reading the above, i decided to do a little more reading.

the consensus was that double flaring was three fold. first, it provided a stronger flare in weaker tubing (aluminum), it allowed it to crush and therefore seal, and it folded the outside seam over, thus putting it on the inside and out of the way of the seal. seamed tubing that is single flared WILL leak. some success has been had with using the soft metal washers in the joints to act as the double flare does.

also, i looked into the pressure ratings, and although this is only one site, it says that 3/16" stainless tubing with tube nuts is rated to 5000lbs. they state a 4:1 safety factor, so im not sure if that puts it at 20,000 psi, or the more likely 1,250 psi.

heres the link http://www.sealexcel.com/37degree-flared-tube-fittings.html#pressure-rating

hopefully somebody will have access to accurate numbers from a published manual.

my plan was to buy the 71480 which only includes 37* mandrels.

Tim

[JRouche]

why wouldn't they match it?

The sales guys I spoke with, Lee was his name said they would take a loss. They would loose money. Guess they dont have as low of a pricing from the manufacture as the other dealer. Just how things work, different pricing for different dealers. And I get that, but dont say you guarantee your pricing. Theres no guarantee there. They lost sight of what a guarantee means. Pretty sad if you ask me. They want to puff themselves up touting superior pricing and they are sure of it, no matter what so they can toss around guarantees like they were words in the wind. Weak is what I see. They cant hold true to their word. Thats poor business. Almost sounds like a politician. Yeah, I guarantee Ill do this and that if you elect me. The crunch comes and they talk out of the side of their mouth. Mumbling all the while trying to say why they couldnt hold to their word. Decent business owners held true to their promises years ago. Even if it meant taking a loss. Not so anymore. JR

Oh yeah. Ill add, its not about the money, it was 20 bucks after all was said and done. But its principle. I piss away 20 bucks at a moment. But the principle of staying true to your word is what gets me.

[megaladon6]

yeah, that's a load of crap. the guarantee doesn't say anything about THEIR problems. i think i'll have to talk to my brother about the other place. he does a lot of business with the toolwarehouse, but maybe he'll the tooldiscounter more.

[MonzaRacer]

ive been intending on using a single 37* flare for both the brake and fuel system on my car. i had initally heard that this wasnt a problem as long as the proper tube nuts were used and the fittings were converted pack to pipe thread at all the inlet/outlets. after reading the above, i decided to do a little more reading.

the consensus was that double flaring was three fold. first, it provided a stronger flare in weaker tubing (aluminum), it allowed it to crush and therefore seal, and it folded the outside seam over, thus putting it on the inside and out of the way of the seal. seamed tubing that is single flared WILL leak. some success has been had with using the soft metal washers in the joints to act as the double flare does.

also, i looked into the pressure ratings, and although this is only one site, it says that 3/16" stainless tubing with tube nuts is rated to 5000lbs. they state a 4:1 safety factor, so im not sure if that puts it at 20,000 psi, or the more likely 1,250 psi.

heres the link http://www.sealexcel.com/37degree-flared-tube-fittings.html#pressure-rating

hopefully somebody will have access to accurate numbers from a published manual.

my plan was to buy the 71480 which only includes 37* mandrels.

Tim

If you can find a distributor that sells the addon kit for 37 degree mandrels and such , I am looking for the 37 degree stuff to add to it.
Oh and if you just happen to snap the 3/16 push die(the one with the pin in it just find snap on dealer they can warranty or just call mastercool. Very nice people.
But no sales to individuals.
This kit is THE BOMB.

[MonzaRacer]

I believe the 71480 is the large set doing everything EXCEPT 37 degree flares.
The 71098 kit is the 37 Degree add-on kit going for between $61.99 here:
http://www.automotivetoolsonline.com/71098-37-degree-Flaring-and-Double-Flaring-Adapter-Set-Mastercool-71098_p_12131.html


http://www.etooldirect.com/manufacturer/mastercool?gclid=COvl5tSp-JwCFcZM5QodDUfzbQ&p=4


$69.99

http://www.tooldiscounter.com/ItemDisplay.cfm?lookup=MAS71098
$69.96

figure it with all these parts you can flare the world!

[The WidowMaker]

monzaracer - the 71480 kit ONLY does 37* stuff. its about 240 for the kit, so if you dont intend on doing 45*, its the perfect kit.

Tim

[WS6]

37* is AN and 45* is all the inverted flare stuff correct?

Man I need to get my hands on one of these kits. I hate flaring with those hand powered twist ones.

[JRouche]

37* is AN and 45* is all the inverted flare stuff correct?

Man I need to get my hands on one of these kits. I hate flaring with those hand powered twist ones.

37* is not just AN. AN is the standard that describes what tolerances the fittings are to have. For automotive the standard for 37* is JIC. So you can get the 37* fittings in either AN standards or JIC standards.

As for the hydraulic flaring tool the 71475 kit does all the brake lines that are common and the add on kit 71098 does the 37* stuff. Thats the route I would go. The 71480 is just the 71098 with the pump. So you would be lacking the ability to do brake lines.

You can get the 71475 and 71098 delivered for about $360 and you will have all the flares covered. JR

[MonzaRacer]

ooppss thanks for correction guys got in hurry and hit wrong link i guess but adding on the 71098 would make kit complete.
but since I found big jump box for work I wont be adding it till next month or month after.
sometimes my "toy" buying gets the best of my extra cash even if I am a tech!

[The WidowMaker]

The 71480 is just the 71098 with the pump. So you would be lacking the ability to do brake lines.

not sure i agree. there are plenty of guys doing brake lines with the 37* fittings (tube nuts) and seamless stainless. correct me if i'm wrong.

[gkring]

I have the main kit and have just flared things normally then broke out my cheapie Summit 37 degree kit and wnet over the flare again to massage it to 37 degree (or at least close enough). Haven't had a problem with it so far. I saw they had the 37 degree cone available seperately, but for $60 the add on kit is worth looking into for sure.

[youthpastor]

As for the Mastercool hydralic flaring tool, BUY ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You will NEVER GO BACK unless you have too.
It will also if its big kit, give you the ability to do ISO or "Bubble" flare, GM old school FI fuel filter flare thate uses the orings and FI style filter. And it will give you the ability to make the push connect flar for say Ford fuel filters too and lots of stuff like buying the 37 degree adapters give you a way to to the AN flare too.
I spend $468 on snap on truck and its best nearly $500 investment I have made yet.
I even use the older GM fuel line flare to put a rib on fuel lines and tranny cooler lines when using hose clamps, the hose will never slide off unless it gets a LOT of pressure.

totally agree, bought mine off the Snap-ON truck and it is TRICK!!

[JRouche]

not sure i agree. there are plenty of guys doing brake lines with the 37* fittings (tube nuts) and seamless stainless. correct me if i'm wrong.

Thats interesting. I havent heard of it but I imagine you could use 37* for brake lines.

But personally I like to stay with the industry standard when its available. And seeing how the standard is 45* and there are plenty of off the shelf products for 45* brake systems thats the way to go.

Not to mention many of the parts that arent tubing, like master cylinders, proportioning valves and wheel cylinders are 45* it kinda make sense to stick with the standard. I dont see any advantages of using a 37* flare for brake systems. JR

[The WidowMaker]

i havent got that far (brake plumbing) on this car, and the last one was done in all 45*. but, if i remeber correctly, all the joints are either btwn lines, or threaded into something (distribution block, p valve.....). therefore all you need is a tube adapter on the end of your line (you would anyways), and then a conversion from 37 to whatever thread.

the main argument ive heard for the 37* is just consistency throughout the system. brake and fuel would all be the same, look the same, and go togther the same. plus you save on tools.

Tim

[CarlC]

Thats interesting. I havent heard of it but I imagine you could use 37* for brake lines.

But personally I like to stay with the industry standard when its available. And seeing how the standard is 45* and there are plenty of off the shelf products for 45* brake systems thats the way to go.

Not to mention many of the parts that arent tubing, like master cylinders, proportioning valves and wheel cylinders are 45* it kinda make sense to stick with the standard. I dont see any advantages of using a 37* flare for brake systems. JR

Brake lines can be done with 37* flares but the fittings must also be 37*. No mixing and matching of SAE and AN.

As for the question of 37* vs 45*, if the system is close to stock where many of the stock components are used, then 45* may be the best option. For full-on custom systems AN is far easier due to the variety of available fittings and the ease of mounting them. If a stock appearance is needed then AN is not the way to go. Most aftermarket adjustable proportioning valves have 1/8" NPT fittings so fitting either 37* or 45* is the same. Just about all master cylinders and OE-type proportioning valves can be converted to 37* using by means of an adapter made by Earl's, Aeroquip, Russell, the local hydraulics store, etc.

The conical AN sealing washers work very well. I have used them in several applications, including high-pressure hydraulic systems, with good success.

[The WidowMaker]

carl, are you using the washers for all the fittings? thats what i thought they were intended for, but some have just used them when a fitting leaked.

Tim

[CarlC]

Only when the fitting leaks.

[64Chevelle]

Anyone know if the Mastercool tool can be repaired when the hydraulic part has a leak?

[dipren443]

Anyone know if the Mastercool tool can be repaired when the hydraulic part has a leak?

Yup, just had mine rebuilt!

[David Pozzi]

I have the Mastercool tool and love it too! The only fault with it is when doing the smallest lines, the blocks that hold the tube are not on center with the cylinder. This may cause a misshaped flare from time to time. I made a piece of shim stock out of .040" aluminum and put it opposite the screw that clamps the blocks together. It upped my success rate double flairing the small lines to something like 99%.
David

[megaladon6]

Yup, just had mine rebuilt!
how much did that cost? and did mastercool do it directly or was this through snap on, mac etc?

[MarkM66]

Only when the fitting leaks.

Where do you get these sealing washers?

[CarlC]

Aircraft Spruce has the best selection and the lowest prices. It's worth it to get a variety of sizes to fit your systems just in case you need them on midnight before track day.

[dipren443]

how much did that cost? and did mastercool do it directly or was this through snap on, mac etc?

Sorry, missed this post. Yes, it was through Mastercool. I don't remember the exact cost, but it was around 100 bucks.

[MarkM66]

Aircraft Spruce has the best selection and the lowest prices. It's worth it to get a variety of sizes to fit your systems just in case you need them on midnight before track day.

I still cant find them, lol. Can you post a link? :smoke:

[CarlC]

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/del37fittings.php

[Rick Dorion]

I recently got a 92 volvo free that needed alot of brake work. One nice aspect of the M-tool was that I could flare anything under the car I could reach with one hand once I got the die, etc. set up. It's come in so handy over the years.

[D Impala95]

Thanks for all the info fellas. I think my next investment is this flaring set.