MILITARY: Yays Or Nays? [Archive]

derekf

08-14-2009, 04:17 AM

I joined the Marines in 1989, well, out of spite.

I was failing out of college, and my parents gave me a choice: Move back home, get a job, and pay rent, or join the military. I think they were thinking I'd go National Guard reserve or something, but I marched right into the USMC recruiter's office with my list of requirements: 4 years, active duty, guaranteed combat arms. The recruiter was, of course, thrilled to have someone ASK to be in the infantry, but my parents not so much.

On reflection on my time in.. infantry doesn't really lend itself to post-military job skills. However, if I was to have the opportunity to do it all again, I think I'd still do it the same way; there's a pride that comes from being in the front lines compared to supporting the folks in the front lines. I might have pushed for a shorter enlistment, had a couple of folks in my unit on 2 or 3 year stints.

anarchy99

08-14-2009, 04:35 AM

It really depends on what your looking for out of the military. I've been in for around 10 years and have loved every second of it. What type of job are you looking for?

cudaman

08-14-2009, 07:00 AM

I was in Army Aviation and loved it tremendously. However, I was single at the time. It is no life for a family, though, in my experience. I was also an Army brat, so my I know that aspect from both angles. Don't get me wrong, it's not the worst option if you have a wife and kids, but it ain't the best, that's for sure. If you're young and single, there's no better way to grow into an adult than being committed to something larger than yourself.

You'll make the best friends of your life.

If you do it right, you can have money saved up by the time you get out. Most don't have the discipline to do this, however.

VA mortgage backing means you can buy a house with no money down.

Outstanding college payment options. Also applies to trade schools.

Other GI Bill benefits.

Since you appear to be an auto enthusiast, most posts have garages with lifts and tools that are free for the using. You just have to reserve a block of time.

Outstanding advantage in gaining post-service employment, particularly if you have a technical MOS.

There are many others, I'm just not able to type indefinitely today. As far as what branch, they all are good. I personally view the military as a chance to do something that you'll never have the opportunity to do again, so I would pick a career path that you really want to pursue, but can't get outside of the military, like infantry, for example. It doesn't translate well into a civilian job, but you'll always swell with pride thinking about being part of the essence of the military. You know yourself better than anyone, maybe you'll get just as much satisfaction from being a nuclear tech on a naval vessel. If that's the case, go with the technical job. The Navy and Air Force might have an advantage in the technical jobs as far as civilian opportunities.

Two more points:

If you're thinking the military might be something you want to do, and then don't do it, I guarantee you will have regrets about it at various times in your life (I have known countless men in that category). If you go in and make it out okay (extremely likely), you will not regret it. Live your life with a zero regret policy- whatever that is to you. Just don't be married while you're in and get out before you get married. Especially if you get deployed alot.

Also, as a suggestion, don't tell others to "STFU" in the same breath that you're using to ask advice or help. This is an example of how the military may help you.

Good luck.

Ollie8974

08-14-2009, 07:36 AM

Retired Air Force, with 35 years, 6 years active, 29 years in the reserves. Trained as a Jet Engine Mechanic, Vietnam era. After discharge went to A&P school on hhe GI bill. Worked at Boeing and Goodrrch Aviation. I recomend serving a 4 year enlistment then joining the reserves.
Joining the reserves means giving up one weekend a month and two weeks a year for annual tour. The extra pay always kept my in a nice daily driver and parts for the project.
The medical benifits and extra income plus good 401K, premitted my wife and I to retire at 62.

6'9"Witha69

08-14-2009, 07:46 AM

I never joined, disqualified for the same reason I lost college basketball scholarships, knee. I have had many friends who did go, and I can share some pointers. Have a rough idea what you want to do and go for it. If you really want an IT advantage go AF. If you want to go into law enforcement, become an SP or MP. GI isn't good for many civilian jobs, but you learn discipline and work ethics either way.

The only thing I don't currently know about, since noone I know has been in combat, is how easy it is to choose your position right now.

va72mlibu

08-14-2009, 07:56 AM

Been an Army Aviation officer for 10 years, currently getting ready to leave my pregnant wife for a 1 year Afghanistan rotation. Did a year in Iraq in 04-05 as well, but was single then. They don't call it "Service" for nothing. That being said, it's been a great life so far for myself and my wife and I wouldn't change a thing. I don't know your situation or what your goals are, but from my foxhole, being in the military seems a lot better (and certainly more lucrative) with officer brass on. I also taught ROTC and there are some seriously good scholarships to be had if you're interested in college $ before service. Like many things in life, your experience in the military will be reflective of what you put into it. Feel free to PM me if you have more in-depth questions.

Ollie8974

08-14-2009, 08:02 AM

If it's Technical Traing you are looking for, join the Air Force. Plus I always had three hot meals, a day, and a hot shower and warm bed at the end of the day.

WILWAXU

08-14-2009, 08:34 AM

I originally joined because I wasn't sure what I wanted to do with my life, but knew that my appetite for cars/toys wasn't going to pay for it's self.

I've got 19yrs in the Navy now, still haven't figured out what I want to do when I grow up, but I've had a great career, traveled the world and had a decent time doing it.

Jake616

08-14-2009, 09:30 AM

As for telling whomever to STFU, It was out of no disrespect...I am on a couple other forums and the guys arent as good about keeping threads where a serious question is being asked on topic or it gets completley full of drame that its not even fun to sort the BS.... So no disrespect at all on that part. I have just had alot of BS other places I have asked. :spam:

The branch I was considering was the NAVY due to my grandfather being retired NAVY and Air Force, but as for a job title.... I was unsure. I just want to consider it as something I would enjoi post-NAVY if I left is all, so I am not stuck with knowledge and training that gets me no where in the civilian world.

Yes, I am a car enthusiast so the idea of garage access w/ lift sounds appealing :) and I od live my life with a No regrets attitude for the most part. I know there would be things I dislike, havent had a job yet where I havent. Just trying to get an idea of what the "dislikes" were for the most part, as well as the "likes"...

Thanks for the info so far! I appreaciate it alot!
-jake

69stang

08-14-2009, 10:34 AM

Ex AF here. Spent 10 years in aircraft maintenance as a jet engine mechanic through the eighties. I traveled extensively though for the most part during peace time. I enjoyed my time in though I didn't care much for the politics. I imagine that's not so much during war time. Peace time politics were part of the reason I got out after 10. That brings me to a warning, realize, before you join, we are currently in a 2 front war. You will, more than likely, be deployed to a war zone. Don't be one of those (like many during the first gulf war) to join for education benefits then cry about going to war. Its the military. I gave my son the same speech over 2 years ago when he joined the navy. He's a corpsman (medic) and recently returned from Kuwait where he was assigned to an army EOD unit. He loves his job and is currently assigned to Parris Island so if you go through marine basic at the island, you'll meet him. Come the first of the year he gets reassigned to a marine unit at camp Lejeunne (sp?) and said he'll be going to Afganistan. My oldest daughter's bf is thinking of joining the AF also. It is a great way to grow up and learn about life.

anarchy99

08-14-2009, 10:59 AM

I'm in the navy and love every bit of it. The navy, like every other branch has tons of jobs for someone to do, from electronics, to SEALs, etc. Alot of the job skills from all of them can be used in a civilian job once you get out. I would figure out what type of job your looking for whether it's messing with airplanes, or kicking in doors, etc.

cudaman

08-14-2009, 11:07 AM

It's better if you fly a King Air or Apache like va72mlibu.:razz:

70TWO NOVA

08-14-2009, 11:45 AM

Been in the Air Force Reserves for about 5 years now. My dad (also Air Force) convinced me to go Reserve first to see if it was really for me rather than just go active duty. Im glad he did becuase although I like the Air Force I dont think I would have enjoyed it as much in active duty. In my short 5 years Ive gotten opportunities to do and see things I never would have otherwise.

69Pony

08-14-2009, 12:28 PM

My father was in the Coast Guard for 27 years. Went in just after college and retired at the age of 50. With good investments and smart savings (you won't be a millionaire in the military) he was able to stay retired. He worked with the reserves on a part time basis to get a total of 30 years in and is now living on 3/4 base pay plus the benefits....

Not bad - retired at the age of 50 with 3/4 pay and the ability to take another job if so desired. Not bad IMO....

Added benefit - seeing the world. I have been in every US state, Canada, Mexico, France mostly due to direct postings or the trip to get to the posting.

va72mlibu

08-14-2009, 12:33 PM

It's better if you fly a King Air or Apache like va72mlibu.:razz:

No arguments here. I'm just a regular blue-collar upbringing guy. All it took was a little hard work and determination and Uncle Sam handed me the keys to two different high-performance machines and told me to operate them at the ragged edge of their capability. Oh, and get paid well to do it.

(you won't be a millionaire in the military)
Not neccessarily. I've met a few people that bought real estate at each new duty station and then rented it out when they left. Millionaires (at least in assets) after 20 year careers.

cudaman

08-14-2009, 12:48 PM

If you play it right, you can leave the service with a lot of money and a nice pension. Then you can go onto something else while you're still relatively young.

I have an old friend and college roommate who is a Marine aviator who has a boatload of money from saving and investing. He will be retiring as a colonel, which doesn't hurt, but any rank over E-3 can do it. When you're deployed or otherwise tied down alot while serving, it's easier to exercise fiscal discipline.

I personally don't know any military retirees in the poor house.

va72mlibu

08-14-2009, 02:45 PM

Just trying to get an idea of what the "dislikes" were for the most part
Time away from family is definitely the biggest detractor. One year combat rotations are way stressful, even without getting IED'd, shot at or mortared. Only upside to those is more $

It's a disciplined life. Getting up early to do PT every day is a commitment. There's no "sick days". Integrity is non-negotiable. You will ALWAYS have a boss, some outstanding, some atrocious. You could spend significant amounts of time being cold, hungry, wet, homesick, scared, hot, eaten by bugs, eating MRE "food", or just plain BORED.

You will move. A LOT. 3 times in the past 18 months for me. And I'm not talking to the next town. In the past four years I moved from Germany to Virginia to Arizona to Alabama to Texas. This is actually a positive for me and my family as we like the bedouin lifestyle, but it's not for everyone.

On the contrary, I could write pages about the positives. First and foremost is serving with and becoming friends with some of the finest human beings you could ever hope to meet. All of my very best friends are people I've served with and there are a few I trust with my life. And I promise you, that is not hyperbole.

2yellow69

08-14-2009, 05:28 PM

va72mlibu pretty much sums it up except fo calling MRE's "food"! Now granted, they are edible. But then again I've been out for awhile.

I was in the Army. Most of it I loved but there were definately crappy times. My friends from that time in life are the best. I can still depend on them now and in the future.

What a lot of people don't realize is that the military is just like a huge company (plus you get guns!). The same political crap happens in every "business".

I would not trade my military experiance for anything!! Just the stories you'll be able to tell all your civilian buddies will make it worth it.

Declawed69

08-14-2009, 05:46 PM

Aww c'mon MRE's aren't that bad! It's sorta like canned food, except one meal is something like 1600-2000 calories, but at least you can warm it in the field and have a hot meal. If your college age/in college/want to enroll now I'd say got for ROTC all the way, if not you can always go for OCS later. Plus with ROTC you can sorta "feel" it out before you contract, military is not for everyone.

Yelcamino

08-14-2009, 05:56 PM

Following high school in Phoenix, I did the typical construction jobs for a few years and finally realized a life of hard work under the AZ sun was not for me. I initially looked into the Marines but ended up in the Coast Guard. My original plan was to do four years and move on. The first job that caught my eye was aviation but the wait list for the initial A school was two years long so not wanting to wait that long, I went a completely different direction and become a Sonar Tech (ST). To get the ST school I had to extend a year which turned my original hitch into a fiver. True to my word though, I left the CG and went back to Phoenix at the end of my enlistment.

It was when I was back in Phoenix that my eyes were opened up to reality. Yes I had quality electronic training, but no college, no job lined up, no place to live. I quickly fell back into bouncing around at dead end jobs until one day I realized I actually missed being in the CG and what it was all about. With my head screwed on straight, I went down to the recruiting office and reenlisted and I've been in ever since. This month I’ll have 21 years of service. It would have been 22 had I not left after the first enlistment. My plan is to stay at least until 30 years.

Thanks to the CG I've been fortunate enough to see the east and west coast from Canada to Mexico, the Gulf, Columbia, Alaska, Hawaii, Guam, and a lot of places in between. I also had the opportunity to attend Officer Candidate School (OCS) w/o a degree and I've had my commission for over eight years. I’m an O-3E (the E is for prior enlisted) and next summer I’ll be in zone for O-4 (the E is dropped at that point).

Some of the finer points of being in the CG vs. the big four are: very rarely are you deployed overseas (overseas assignments are typically voluntary and you have to submit an application if you're interested), you get all the same pay/benefits, the CG, while a military service, its role is more humanitarian in nature, i.e. Search & Rescue, Marine Safety, Homeland Security, Aids to Navigation, Ice Patrol, etc. Another nice thing is when you first join you're not required to choose your MOS, or as we call it, your job rating, prior to boot camp (which BTW is eight weeks in Cape May, NJ). You can join unassigned and after you’ve been in and had the chance to see the different jobs in real life you can then make an informed decision and put your name on the school list of your choice. When your name comes up, orders are issued, and off to school you go (this is what I did). Another good thing is you can apply to OCS without a degree (I think the CG is the only service that allows this).

If you want more info about the CG, go to www.gocoastguard.com

Tom Welch

08-14-2009, 07:13 PM

If you do raise your right hand and swear an oath to defend the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic, then how can you go wrong? I did it for 91/2 years, medically discharged after suffering injury at the special warfare center and school at Ft Bragg. I would do it all again if I could. My oldest son graduated from Parris Island today, a newly minted Marine. I do love it so. I always did and always will, love my country and the God that created us all.

para67camaro

08-14-2009, 11:32 PM

I will say this, if you do decide to go in. Pursue the Special ops community. It will benefit you a lot when it comes time to get out. Yes you deploy a lot more but it is for a lot less. 6 months is the longest deployment I have done. You travel a lot, not just to combat areas, and you get just about any school you would want, to include civilian schools. I have been in for 7 1/2 years and I have enjoyed it a lot. You also get to keep you hair longer, I do not know if this is a plus for you, it was for me.

Jake616

08-15-2009, 01:20 AM

I am 23 years old and spent a few solid months when I first was thinking of joining right after a summer of working after high school. I didnt because I was with a girl I was wanting to spend the rest of my life with... Spent over 3 years with her and it ended...I could of almost been out by now! Not 1 regret though, I loved her more than anything and I guess we are still close so thats good.

I joined the Union in 06 as a Carpenter because thats what I did in vocational school in high school and liked it/the trades and was doing that until work seemed to die everywhere! Then went to working from warehouse work, to running a powdercoat shop,etc....

Ive just realized I need to think more about my future, because job hopping isnt what I want to be doing. The school poortunitys sound great in the military! Thats a huge plus, as is the traveling and skills learned. Thats why i started this thread :) I know its the military, so I am not gonna expect an easy path....just a rewarding one i hope.

I appreciate all the input so far! Keeo it coming if there is more you can provide!? :)

PATA67CAMARO- When you say special ops, do you mean like Army Rangers and Navy Seals?

para67camaro

08-15-2009, 05:47 AM

I am in the ARMY so I mean Rangers/Special Forces/JSOC. That last one is joint so any branch can try out. Bare in mind that special ops also needs support, and those guys get pretty crazy tech schools for free.

SatisTraction

08-15-2009, 06:02 AM

i spent 6 years in the navy as a nuclear machinist mate. I learned to operate a nuclear power plant on a submarine. 2 years of school and 4 years on the boat.

It has gave me a HUGE advantage in life.

Advice:
1. go in as an officer if you can.
2. if not an officer get the longest and most technical school that you can.
3. dont go infantry or MP (no disrespect meant). once you get out there are only so many security guard jobs and the pay sucks. Get a career while you are in there.

TnBlkC230WZ

08-15-2009, 06:52 AM

BAD68GTO

08-15-2009, 07:33 AM

NAVY=Never Again Volunteer Yourself

Was a Sea College participant in 87-90, crappy pay, treated like **** because it was a bad command and did NOT receive training. the Sea College program was designed to enhance the quality of individuals in the Navy based on the highest ASVAB scores. We were supposed to get the GI Bill of 1984 and a “kicker” for Sea College. They did NOT give any of us A Schools, but instead in their infinite wisdom, had us painting ships, doing supply and other not intellectually demanding tasks instead of working on complex algorithms doing cryptographic work or the like. I got out of the Navy in 1990 and went to college in 1996. I applied for my GI Bill and Sea College and was granted the GI Bill but not the Sea College money. When I asked why I was denied, they said it was I broke the contract of not doing the reserve time of 4 years afterward from my active duty time. When I said they were downsizing the military in 1990 and we were told we did not have to report and do the 4 years as they shed 1/3 of the military at that time, they said “do you have it in writing?” and my response was “no, they told us all that and none of us did the reserve time” and hence I was denied despite protests. I graduated Magna Cum Laude from The Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania with a double major in 2003 after 8 years of college. It ended up costing me $100K out of pocket even after getting academic scholarships and the GI Bill. With the VA/Navy cheating me out of the Sea College, the only reason I went in, is inexcusable as they released me from my obligation along with everyone else in the program. I also have hearing damage in both ears from my time and that too was dismissed despite it being very clear from when I got in and the week before I got out of the Navy. The VA I call Veterinary Assistance and I for one would not recommend the military for most folks. I now own a technology company in New Jersey, and with their brilliance they had me chipping paint and painting my ship for my tour alongside the other Sea College participants-some of the brightest guys in the entire Navy, because we were chosen for the highest test scores, and only 43 slots for each state-oh yes, GO NAVY-not.

josht

08-15-2009, 11:32 AM

Having been an MP for 3+ years:

If you want a career in Law Enforcement when you are done or have a military career path such as in investigator then chose MP.

MP's don't all work the road, some work the equivalent of corrections stateside or deployed.

The deployment cycle is higher then some MOS's.

MP's are combat support not a combat MOS like infantry but with "more" firepower. MP are considered multipurpose because of the many missions missions we can perform.

CarlC

08-15-2009, 08:32 PM

I have not been in the service, but have interviewed and hired many that were leaving it to join the civilian world.

I can't think of another field where someone can get as much experience and responsibility at such a young age using some of the most technologically advanced equipment in the world. Most all had very good resumes, and quite a few make me feel like I had failed miserably at some point in my life.

But what separated them? What made one of them more attractive than another? The most desirable candidates were not only very successful in the military, having risen through the ranks quickly, but they also have enthusiasm and people skills that make them great overall people. This may not sound too important now, but if you ever plan to join the civilian job market it makes a lot of sense to work on every skill in your logbook.

cudaman

08-15-2009, 08:50 PM

Just as a point of illustration between the relative quality of life between the services:

While I was stationed at Ft. Rucker, AL, my brother, an infantry officer at Ft. Benning, GA, picked me up before heading to Panama City, FL. for the weekend. Before hitting the beaches there, we checked into a BEQ (enlisted quarters) at Tyndall Air Force Base because the BOQ (officers quarters) there were all full.

It should have come as no surprise that the AF enlisted rooms were equal to or better than the Army officer rooms. We rented a 17' Boston Whaler for the day for about $5 and took it out to the beach (not authorized, I'm told - inner harbor only) for the day. After much public relations work on behalf of the Armed Forces with the local female population, we returned the boat that evening to a Tech SGT whose job it was to man a tug boat, of all things. Who knew the AF had so many boats?

Moral of the story: If you want great technical training and to be catered to a little more, go into the AF. If you like the way that it sucks to be cold and tired, then go into the Army or Marines.

I remember a cartoon posted in the Flight Ops room:

It had four panels-

The first panel had a cartoon of a regular infantry soldier huddled down in a rain-filled, muddy foxhole. The caption said, "Man, this sucks."

The second panel had an Airborne soldier in the same conditions. Caption said, "I kinda like the way this sucks."

The third panel had a Ranger in identical surroundings. This one said, "I wish this would suck even more."

The fourth panel had an aircraft pilot looking out his window as he flew overhead. What do you think he said? "Man, it looks like it really sucks down there."

There are many jobs in the military and an infinite number of degrees of the aforementioned "suckiness" that accompany them. Determine what your personality is like and choose accordingly.

para67camaro

08-15-2009, 08:54 PM

One last thing. While I was up for my reenlistment, I noticed that a lot of contract jobs, ie Northrop, Boeing and pretty much any corporation that has an affiliation with the US government, has a check box on their application for either SF or Ranger as one of your qualifications. A lot of guys that work for these companies served and really look out for each other once you get out. With that in mind be mindful of your Ranger buddies and they will remember you when you get out, who knows they might be the ones you are doing your interview with.

OLDFLM

08-16-2009, 05:00 AM

Senior Master Sergeant, USAF Retired. I servered for 20 years and enjoyed every year. It truely is a way of life, but it is not for everyone. If you are a loner or unable to work as a team, you will be misserable. If you like a big family, get along with your siblings and respect your mother and father; you will thrive.

I must say, I am were I am today because of the military. I've got my training, management skills and two degrees in the Air Force.

Start with a short enlistment untill you know what you want to do. I strongly encourage everyone to work on a college degree while in. Even if you don't finish, you will have transferable classes.

I just re-enlisted again last month (7th time I've raised my right hand!) so I'm biased but I couldn't agree more! Again, I'm biased but for quality of life the Air Force just can't be beat... but if you want to be in the infantry or be a Marine you already know what you'd be signing up for... I think every young person should do at least one tour in our military. But that's coming from a guy with nearly 24 years on active duty who just signed up for 4 more. HTH

317millhand

08-21-2009, 09:16 AM

I spent 4 years in the Marine Corps Infantry got out and spent 8 years in the Kentucky National Guard. I grew up lower class in a bad community full of people going nowhere. The Marine Corps made me grow up and let me see the world. After seeing the world you TRULY appreciate how well we have it here, and how much we take for granted. My advice would be to test the waters in the reserves if you are not sure if the military is for you. This way you only have to do it for a weekend every month after your initial training. The reserves and National Guard will pay for you to go to college as well. If you like the military life, the go active once your reserve tour is done and get a job that will transfer and pay well in the civilian world. Nuclear jobs in the Navy are priceless. It is also possible to transfer into active duty before your reserve obligation is done. I would also suggest doing time as enlisted before trying to be an officer. The best officers that I ever know were all prior enlisted. No disrespect to any officers on this site that were not prior enlisted, Im just giving my opinion. Good luck with whatever you decide.

Scott Parkhurst

08-21-2009, 12:44 PM

I did 4 in the AF right out of high school. I use the lessons learned every single day. I was an aircraft flight control specialist- and was hoping for a career in commercial airline maintenance. I could have done that, but went into other things instead (hot rod-related, all good!). But, you learn things they don't tell you about in the brochures. Stuff like self-discipline, taking care of your own business, being on time for everything, building friendships and trust, learning to work with (and for) people you don't necessarily like, but whose abilities you respect...stuff like that.

I'd have to agree the AF treats their enlisted troops best. We had decent dorms, good food, and well-equipped bases. I spent plenty of time at the base hobby shop building hot cars, and got plenty of support from the staff there. It was a great experience and really prepared me for life in the professional world. I left right from home living with my parents, and when I got out I was fully capable of supporting myself on my own. Glad I went in; glad I got out with honor and good conduct, ready to take on the world.

I have recommended the experience to many others, and the key is to get some job skills you can use in the civilian world. Shooting guns and loading bombs might sound real cool, but when you get out, you want something solid to put on a resume.

They do play head games, of course. Play along but realize the reality. The same stuff happens at almost any job you'll ever have, so it pays to get used to it, and get good at it. LOL!!