Car Craft In and Out list 2009

[Pro-Tour Heavy Chevy]

Just recv'd a Car Craft September issue and they have there annual
In and Out list and the First item was this.
IN: Street Machines Converted into Gasser Style cars
OUT: Pro Touring....:machine:WTF!

I know this is just some ones opinion and hey I like Period correct gasser cars, but some people look at magazines a trend forecasters and some sort of authority.
Since I was a kid I always built my cars with Handling,Braking, and modern upgrades as a priority. So what are your thoughts on this...
Is this the beginning of the end or will it be a just a name change.
Trends come and go or, I believe in our case, may just change its name.
Thoughts... Anyone.:lurk:

[Denvervet]

My response:bsjerk: the :smoke:

[Damn True]

They also listed the color "copper" as out.

I think they are screwing with that Rupp kid down the hall.

[novaderrik]

it's cheaper to throw a solid axle and old Cragars under something and call it a gasser than it is to add a bunch of aftermarket suspension parts under a car and call it a pro touring car.
and cheap is going to be the trend over the next few years..

[79-TA]

Well, note that Carl's Camaro was just on the previous cover. Also ironic is the fact that they do a bit of automatic transmission bashing yet have a 200 4R article in the same issue (the exact CPT one I want infact . . . )

[Twentyover]

In- Stirring up a controversy to boost sales in an economic recession

Out- Relevence to me

[LateNight72]

I doubt Pro-Touring is every going to be out. People are always going to want to make their cars ride, handle and brake better then stock. Sure, there may be certain trends within P-T that may fade (Two Tones, Exposed Carbon, etc.)

[XLexusTech]

Why would you care? Seriously though I can give a rats A@# about what is "IN" vs "OUT"

[CarlC]

Thanks for the mention Brett.

[chicane67]

Pro-Touring out huh ?? That's funny... it only took 40 years for that to happen... considering that Pro-Touring started back in the mid 60's (they used to call it Trans-Am cars with license plates.)

Oh yea... Car Who ?? Car Craft ?? Do they still publish that rag ?? I though it went out with Pro-Street in the early 90's ??

[bigvegan]

It's funny. Being a not infrequent visitor to this site, and finding pro-touring the logical evolution of hotrodding (modern brakes/suspension/engine under old sheetmetal, isn't that the WHOLE POINT?), I sometimes forget that pro-touring is a drop in the bucket of the hot rod genre as a whole.

I went to the annual Glendale Cruise night tonight, and out of the 450 or so cars on display, I saw ONE car (http://www.corvettefever.com/featuredvehicles/corp_0905_1966_chevrolet_corvette/index.html) that could properly qualify as pro-touring.

The guys on the "old coots" thread sure were right about the doo wop music though. Good grief.

[JV69z/28]

Pro-Touring out huh ?? That's funny... it only took 40 years for that to happen... considering that Pro-Touring started back in the mid 60's (they used to call it Trans-Am cars with license plates.)

:twothumbs Cafe Racers (originated refering to a style of motorcycles) was a term thrown around for a while also.

[vintageracer]

Pro-Touring out? Maybe!

Depends on what you call PT. I certaintly do not think that modern mechanics in old cars is slowing down any at all. If anything the trend is growing as people have decided to drive and enjoy their cars with the same conforts as a new car.

The changes may come in the lack of 30 series tires and tubs in the back, road racer roll cages in street cars and over the top $250K Camaros. Obsurd 14 inch brakes, 1,000 HP twin turbo engines and roller skate tires and wheels may well become a thing of the past. That's what many people I see define as PT now. Is that reality, No not really but that's what the average guy at a Saturday night cruise that I talk with think of when they hear the term "Pro-Touring".

I think the hardcore heavy performance, high horsepower, big brake, heavily modified supsension type of PT car has begun to lose it luster. That's the evolution of the car hobby. It cost's LOT'S of money to build a high end PT car and disposable money is something that many folks no longer have!

I think the PT hobby will continue to evolve with those trend setters still building over the top cars but the average guy will throttle back (nice pun) on their builds to a car that is well built, well engineered and more "off the shelf" when it comes to parts. After all, what good is a car is you are unable to drive and enjoy the car. Too much money invested, you built a trailer queen, your worried about "damaging" you dream, you pick the reason.

The last 5 years has seen a great revolution is the car hobby and car shows. The static car show sit in a lawn chair all day for a trophy has dwindled. Events that emphasis driving and enjoying your car have blossomed. 5 years ago who would have ever thought Goodguys would have an autocross at their events. Now the autocross is possibly the main focal point for spectators at their events for most of the weekend. Look at the Run To the Hills event in Pigeon Forge and the huge participation in recent years on the Power Tour as indicators.

PT will evolve in the future and we should evolve with it lest we end up like the mini-truckers or the ricers!

[SatisTraction]

The changes may come in the lack of 30 series tires and tubs in the back, road racer roll cages in street cars and over the top $250K Camaros. Obsurd 14 inch brakes, 1,000 HP twin turbo engines and roller skate tires and wheels may well become a thing of the past. That's what many people I see define as PT now. !

agreed. i never did see the need for 1000hp when the car cant use over 250 the way it was set up. :machine:

20 and 22" combos are just as obsurd and look like poo poo to most.

[caper150]

Saw this at Car Craft yesterday:

A Gasser style car:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/07/1stuff012-1.jpg

With a LS motor:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/07/1stuff013-1.jpg

Maybe thats what they mean:confused:

[novaderrik]

Pro-Touring out? Maybe!

Depends on what you call PT. I certaintly do not think that modern mechanics in old cars is slowing down any at all. If anything the trend is growing as people have decided to drive and enjoy their cars with the same conforts as a new car.

The changes may come in the lack of 30 series tires and tubs in the back, road racer roll cages in street cars and over the top $250K Camaros. Obsurd 14 inch brakes, 1,000 HP twin turbo engines and roller skate tires and wheels may well become a thing of the past. That's what many people I see define as PT now. Is that reality, No not really but that's what the average guy at a Saturday night cruise that I talk with think of when they hear the term "Pro-Touring".

I think the hardcore heavy performance, high horsepower, big brake, heavily modified supsension type of PT car has begun to lose it luster. That's the evolution of the car hobby. It cost's LOT'S of money to build a high end PT car and disposable money is something that many folks no longer have!

I think the PT hobby will continue to evolve with those trend setters still building over the top cars but the average guy will throttle back (nice pun) on their builds to a car that is well built, well engineered and more "off the shelf" when it comes to parts. After all, what good is a car is you are unable to drive and enjoy the car. Too much money invested, you built a trailer queen, your worried about "damaging" you dream, you pick the reason.

The last 5 years has seen a great revolution is the car hobby and car shows. The static car show sit in a lawn chair all day for a trophy has dwindled. Events that emphasis driving and enjoying your car have blossomed. 5 years ago who would have ever thought Goodguys would have an autocross at their events. Now the autocross is possibly the main focal point for spectators at their events for most of the weekend. Look at the Run To the Hills event in Pigeon Forge and the huge participation in recent years on the Power Tour as indicators.

PT will evolve in the future and we should evolve with it lest we end up like the mini-truckers or the ricers!

right on- people might still build old cars that handle and stop better than they did stock, but they aren't going to try so hard to emulate the $200k one off project cars that they see in the magazines. they will just build good solid and dependable cars that work good enough for what they actually use them for.
if you are one of those people that are gonna get upset becasue some editor at a car magazine that doesn't really cater to this particular build style for the most part says your favorite build style is "out", then you are doing this for the wrong reasons and should consider a new hobby. who cares if the hot roddign world has moved on to the next big thing- just keep doing what you want. hell, there are still people building 80's style Pro Streeters and 70's style street machines.

as for the gasser with the LS engine in it- at the Car Craft show either last year or the year before i saw a car with an LS engine that had a sheetmetal tunnel ram with a pair of dominators on it that was backed by a powerglide. the rest of the car wasn't anything special, so i can't even remember what it was. but i thought the drivetrain was cool and probably hauled the mail at the drag strip. this is the nature of true hot rodding- take the best of the new and integrate it into your car of choice.

[Hidro]

Car Craft = OUT :idea: ...done

[moreHP]

Car Craft = OUT :idea: ...done

Beat me to it! I havent bought a car crap mag in over 10 years!

[PT Sportwagon]

Let me see, mmmmm.
40 Willys gasser style:cool::cool: pro touring :cool:
55 Shoebox gasser style:cool: pro touring
70 Chevelle gasser style :barf::barf:pro touring :cool:
77 Trans Am gasser style:barf: pro touring:cool:

Car crap needs to get a clue one what is cool on what type of car. But then again Car craft needs to get a clue period

Tim

[Pro-Tour Heavy Chevy]

Being around and in the car industry, I've come to accept what other people think as IN or COOL as there opinion and to leave it at that. Some styles are Iconic, such as the Gasser. I also think Pro-touring has made such an impact that it wont go away. It may go under different names, but I believe its here to stay regardless what some Corporate mag says.

[CarlC]

I agree with the comments about static car shows. I lived in Glendale for 12 years. The show was only two miles from my house. I never took the car. It still drives me nuts to sit in a lawn chair while a bunch of dudes discuss the finer elements of how to display their creepy dolls and the 1930X Ford chrome bumper. Ugh.

Let's go drive, no matter what it is.

[CHRIS67]

Let's go drive, no matter what it is.


My thoughts exactly. I builing my car with my likes and dislikes in mind without following the latest trend. If it wins a show OK, if it doesn't that's OK too becasue I still have the pleasure to drive it home.

[toofun]

IN: Driving my "out" style 65 pro touring mustang with modern day handling,6 speed gearing, cornering, performance, a/c, suspension, modern electronics and stereo.

Out: Being that poor sap in his gasser sitting on the side of the road with antifreeze and oil pissin out the bottom listening to his Ipod in 90 degree heat waiting for the tow truck to show up while I blip the throttle and beep the horn sippin on a smoothie:)

[Taylor1969]

IN: Driving my "out" style 65 pro touring mustang with modern day handling,6 speed gearing, cornering, performance, a/c, suspension, modern electronics and stereo.

Out: Being that poor sap in his gasser sitting on the side of the road with antifreeze and oil pissin out the bottom listening to his Ipod in 90 degree heat waiting for the tow truck to show up while I blip the throttle and beep the horn sippin on a smoothie:)

Yep...

How can my 383 Stroked, 6 Speed, Air Conditioned, handling car be out?

I can see how the styling of two tone paint jobs, flames, exposed carbon fiber, etc. can come and go, but classic styled functioning cars will never be out of style

[Steve1968LS2]

Out: Stories on crashing buses

In: Relevance

[Steve1968LS2]

I agree with the comments about static car shows. I lived in Glendale for 12 years. The show was only two miles from my house. I never took the car. It still drives me nuts to sit in a lawn chair while a bunch of dudes discuss the finer elements of how to display their creepy dolls and the 1930X Ford chrome bumper. Ugh.

Let's go drive, no matter what it is.

I would disagree on one part.. The one (and only) part I enjoy about static car shows it talking with people about cars. This includes the "joe publics" that come by. It's also a good chance to educate people that these cars can actually be driven hard.

I say away from anyone with a creepy doll in front of thier car... lol

[Twentyover]

......
I stay away from anyone with a creepy doll in front of thier car... lol

Because some of them have an even creepier doll at home....

[badlanguage]

My El Camino may be "out" now, and "in" again when it's finished!

I'm just putting together a car I like that I'll enjoy driving. Poop on what anyone else thinks.

[derekf]

Out: Car Craft
In: Camaro Performers

[CarlC]

But that is where the GoodGuys shows with the autocross events really sets it apart from other static shows. There are others with a common interest, and you're all hanging out together.

[Nine Ball]

I would like to see non-driven "pro-touring" cars hit the road. Whether that means get driven more, or leave the scene...you pick :)

[Vegas69]

Good....I like being unique.

[MarkM66]

Out: Car Craft
In: Camaro Performers

I agree with Car Craft being out. I just couldn't get my self to re-subscribe the last time around. Even with it's cheap subscription fee.

I think next on my list to go is CHP, same old tech, same uninteresting car features.

[Steve1968LS2]

Out: Car Craft
In: Camaro Performers

I'm liking the way you think... lol

[Tony_SS]

I agree with Car Craft being out. I just couldn't get my self to re-subscribe the last time around. Even with it's cheap subscription fee.

I think next on my list to go is CHP, same old tech, same uninteresting car features.

Agreed. I wont be renewing on either of them.

[79-TA]

Agreed. I wont be renewing on either of them.

Sigh, I recently let my CHP subscription run out after more than 7 years of subscription. There really were some great issues and very applicable tech articles, but it just started getting redundant and I never liked the new layout. That and 3 cars later I still don't own a Chevy. Knowing my subscription was about to run out, I could have crawled under a rock when I spotted Henry D and some of the other CHP guys at the Costa Mesa Goodguys show. I might resubscribe though . . . 2 years and a hat for 20 dollars . . . I'm a sucker for hats.

[Pro Stock]

Nice of CC to dump on 1/2 of their advertisers, that rag doesn't even make for good TP (toilet paper). I suppose that next they will declare that the stimulis is working !!

Dale

[PT Sportwagon]

. I suppose that next they will declare that the stimulis is working !!

Dale

Well if you listen to the prez it takes time. :bsjerk::bsjerk:

Tim

[Ishmael]

Beat me to it! I havent bought a car crap mag in over 10 years!

I stopped subscribing when they went to a A.D.D/ 3 minute toilet read format that catered to the trailer park crowd. The last time I picked it up there was a 4 door doing a burn out on its own hood in the woods. Quality read.

[79-TA]

I still don't hate Car Craft fwiw.

[vintageracer]

Nice of CC to dump on 1/2 of their advertisers, that rag doesn't even make for good TP (toilet paper). I suppose that next they will declare that the stimulis is working !!

Dale


Go take a look at 5.0 Magazine. The sales manager there deserves the advertising industry Saleman of the Year Medal!!!

I actually counted the ad pages back in February. Out of 163 pages, 119 total pages were devoted to nothing but advertising. That's all the magazine has turned into is an ad rag for the Mustang industry.

The remaining 43 pages were articles, re-occurning monthly columns and the contents page.

Absolutely a pitiful magazine if you can call it that. It really is a monthly ad page!

[Ron L]

While simply saying PT is "out" is rather vague I can sort of see what they're getting at, which is pretty much what Vintageracer/Mike said. For example, you could say Pro Street is currently "out" but there are still lots of dual-purpose street/strip cars out there running fat drag radials and front skinnies on the street. What's gone are the ridiculous mag queens with 2 nitrous bottles, 4 turbos and 2 blowers. IMO Pro Street cars with 33-inch MTs with a rearend so narrowed there's only enough room to fit coilovers is just as absurd as a PT car using a $5k 3-link Watts setup to drive to the grocery. Oh wait, the $15k paint job might get scratched at the grocery! At least we're seeing a lot of high-profile PT cars getting flogged at the track. When was the last time you saw a chromed-out Pro Streeter with his quad-Paxton blowers at the strip? Or the street? They make lots of promises and strip-time guesses in the articles but you know it's all BS. PT articles aren't much better with "plans" to run Silver State or what-not, then never to be heard from again.

PT is just a loose term as PS was/is, and it's the high profile cars that "define" (in Joe public's/adzine readers' eyes) PT that are on the way out. Love them or hate them, there's something to be said about spending over $150k for just parts and labor on a car that can barely out-perform a car that can be had/built for $40k. The mag queens will always be around but even I gotta have something to gawk at every now and then. Pro Street went to "real street" as one mag described it. I think that's where PT is headed, or isn't that where we came from to begin with?

Oh, and Camaro Craft = :bsjerk: They were funny back in the early 90s but now it's meh just like ever other mag.

[toofun]

IN: Anything you build,customize,change, leave alone,hop up, slam down,drag race, street race, slow ride or leave in your garage that makes "YOU" happy or proud to own it!

Out: Car Craft Cronies trying to be the authority on whats "in" and whats "out"...

Nuff said...:drive:

[ProdigyCustoms]

In: Internet forums!
Out: Car Craft!

[68Formula]

In: Magazines that cover cars.

Out: In and Out lists (have been for years guys so stop printing them in magazines!)