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Boyd
06-05-2009, 09:50 PM
Will be starting on a new house soon and I've been thinking of all the things I can do with the garage since it'll be a clean sheet design. Back in the mid 90's Hot Rod (I believe, could have been Car Craft) did a story on the ultimate car guy garage - there was even an overhead layout showing cabinet/tool placement. Does anyone remember that story? I remember thinking it was very well thought out and detailed, but can't find the issue it was in for the life of me.

I'm not talking about a garage-mahal, large-budget type garage, just a normal 2 car garage (3 car in my case - although the wife's car will undoubtedly take up one of the spaces) with your normal assortment of car guy tools - a couple of tool chests, an air compressor, shop vac, work bench, welder, floor jacks, jack stands...etc.

I'm really looking for that issue with the story, but I'm willing to take any advice/input on how to set up the garage. Some of the things I already have in mind:

1. 50a/220v outlet for welder/compressor
2. Electrical outlets 36" high spaced every 4' along two walls - normal spacing on third wall.
3. Plumbed for small sink - for hand washing, non-toxic parts washing.
4. Multiple outlets in ceiling - for additional lighting, ext. cord on a reel, fan
5. Insulated walls (builders in Texas don't normally insulate garage walls)
6. Insulated garage doors.
7. Absolutely level floor (you would be surprised how many garage floors have a slope to them)
8. House will have gas, so I'm thinking of adding a drop in the ceiling for a future garage heater.

That's about it so far. I want a lot of cabinets, but don't know what I'll do about them yet. Gotta be cheap - craigslist maybe?

Damn True
06-05-2009, 10:43 PM
City code where I'm at required a slope on the garage floor. You might want to check your municipality.

Nine Ball
06-06-2009, 04:00 AM
How can you call it "ultimate" without including a lift? Ask for 10' ceiling in one bay, along with 6" thick concrete. Now your 3-car garage becomes a 4-car, for only a few grand.

thedodgeboys
06-06-2009, 04:23 AM
The slop sure help with water drainage if you park dirty cars in the garage and need to clean it out you will like it.(it snows in my area)
I actually wash and wax my cars in the garage on hot and windy days.
I had my garage extended 10 deeper so I have workspace in front of the cars for all my stuff makes for a great work space.
After I finish my convertible, I would like to tile the extra space.:idea:

Steve Firebird
06-06-2009, 04:31 AM
How can you call it "ultimate" without including a lift? Ask for 10' ceiling in one bay, along with 6" thick concrete. Now your 3-car garage becomes a 4-car, for only a few grand.
X2 try to work a 4 post lift with bridge jacks into the budget or at least set one spot up for one.
try criags list for cabnets tools ect..

avewhtboy
06-06-2009, 05:43 AM
I personally would ad a drain in the floor of the garage for washing cars, wetsanding, rinsing out the garage. Also move the compressor outside and just run cheap pvc pipe into the garage with a few different places to plug in for air.

bulldog19
06-06-2009, 05:55 AM
x3 on the lift, if anything think where you may put it and put a 2-Pole 30amp circuit in for it. Also being in Texas how about a Mitsubishi Slim Jim A/C unit as well. Also do you have Neon signs and or clocks? Put receptacles high on the walls and have 1/2 operated by the switch so you can turn them on via a switch instead of having the strings hanging. Also a dedicated recpt for a fridge is nice too. Another thing i wish i had done is provision for washer and dryer for all the dirty car towels. Definitely a telephone jack, TV Jack and internet jack if you are not going to have a wireless router. Also stereo speakers in the ceiling and put the receiver in mechanical room or closet and pull the speaker wires back to there.

Boyd
06-06-2009, 09:01 AM
City code where I'm at required a slope on the garage floor. You might want to check your municipality.

I've already checked into that. I just moved from Denver where it was code to have a sloped garage floor, but here in Texas (where I live, at least) there is no such code. The sloped floor would drive me nuts every time I used a tool cart or anything else on wheels - I'd have to unlock the wheels to move it where I wanted it, then lock them back to keep it in place, then unlock them again to move it...on and on.


How can you call it "ultimate" without including a lift? Ask for 10' ceiling in one bay, along with 6" thick concrete. Now your 3-car garage becomes a 4-car, for only a few grand.

Okay, scratch the use of the word "ultimate" (adequate, maybe?) The lift is a great idea but the cost of the lift, combined with the cost of the framing modifications to the garage and extra thick concrete it would require, puts it out of my budget. I could swing a few grand, but I bet the cost would actually be double or triple that, if not more. I understand that now is the time to do it, but, until my 3 girls are grown and out of the house I will be on a very strict budget with all of my projects - garage included.


...Also move the compressor outside and just run cheap pvc pipe into the garage with a few different places to plug in for air.

The original design had the water heater closet in the garage, but we will be using a Rennai tankless water heater that fits inside a wall, so I will use the empty water heater closet for the compressor. I plan on adding a few vents to the door of the closet to allow air flow and also adding extra sound insulation inside the closet to cut the noise. For plumbing, Eastwood has a quick-connect garage airline kit that I'll be using. For about $200 you get everything you need to have 8 drops through out the garage.


...Also being in Texas how about a Mitsubishi Slim Jim A/C unit as well. Also do you have Neon signs and or clocks? Put receptacles high on the walls and have 1/2 operated by the switch so you can turn them on via a switch instead of having the strings hanging. Also a dedicated recpt for a fridge is nice too. Another thing i wish i had done is provision for washer and dryer for all the dirty car towels. Definitely a telephone jack, TV Jack and internet jack if you are not going to have a wireless router. Also stereo speakers in the ceiling and put the receiver in mechanical room or closet and pull the speaker wires back to there.

Great ideas. Definitely had A/C in mind but never heard of the Slim Jim unit - I’ll check into it. Currently don’t have any neon, but want to start collecting them, so the outlets up high make good sense. The garage will definitely be wired for tv and sound. Internet will be wireless.

Andrew McBride
06-06-2009, 09:29 AM
Here is my list for my shop I am building. Concrete thickness varies for what area you live in by the way. I have seen some not even pour footings, which I think is nuts! 4" is just fine in most cases with good footings and ground. One good thing about a sloped floor is to insert a drain and you can do your wetsanding, wash the floors down ect. Cost of the pour would be more because it is a lot more handwork. www.garagejournal.com has some killer interior ideas.


Gravel for Driveway
Dozer for clearingConcrete Safe RoomConcrete FootingsConcrete 39.91 yardsConcrete (Porch, Driveway, and sidewalk) 9 yardsConcrete For Safe RoomFormsrebarSafe Room DoorSafe Room Door Lock SetWell System & Drilling, pumpInterior Water Lines pipePVC pipeSeptic TankSeptic PipeSeptic BlanketSeptic GravelMetal Building 40x80x14(2) Garage Doors (1 w/ garage opener) 11Hx12W(1) Walk-in DoorWalk-in door lock set w/ deadboltMetal Screws(1) Outdoor French DoorOutdoor French Door Lock set(4) WindowsBuilding InsulationShop LightsConduitConduit Fittings and mouting tapsElectrical BoxesElectrical Box CoversPlug-InsExterior Shop Lights Utility Sink (Near Apartment/Kitchen Wall)Utility Sink Faucet & HandlesMetal Paneling for Shop Walls (8" high lining the interior)(3) 220V OutletsOutdoor wiringInterior Electrical Wiring (12-2 & 14-2)Breaker BoxSwitches (12)Switch CoversElectrical CoversElectrical Plug-Ins (15)Electrical BoxesGFCI Plug-Ins (4)Kitchen LightBathroom Light/ventBathroom Mirror LightMaster Bedroom fan/lightMaster Bedroom closet lightLiving Room Fan/lightOffice LightLaundry Room LightDining Room light220V hook-up for laundry room and in HVAC ClosetCable wiringcable boxes (4)Smoke Detectors (6)Telephone JacksTelephone Jack CoversTelephone wiringwire nutscopper ground rodInstant Hotwater Heater (Electric)Complete HVAC system 1.5 ton A/C systemElectronic ThermostatDuct WorkVents (7) & 1 return Laundry Dryer Vent & HoseAlarm SystemCeiling Joist (2x8 on 16" centers)Interior Framing (2x4x8)Interior Insulation R-13 w/ 1040 total ft. sq. @ $80 per 163 ft.Ceiling/Wall Insulation (Foam)Office French DoorsOffice Closet Accordian doorsAccordian Door HandlesBathroom DoorLaundry Room DoorMaster Bedroom Entry DoorMaster Bedroom Closet DoorInterior Door Knobs w/ lockInterior Door Knobs w/ out locksApartment Entry Door w/ windowEntry Door Lock set w/ deadboltDoor Stoppers (4)Closet Rod (4)Closet Wood ShelvingCloset Rod mounts (4)Window BlindsSheetrock (4x8) (130 sheets total @ $7) Sheetrock all purpose mud (13) 5 gallon containers)Sheetrock tapeSheetrock ScrewsSheetrock Metal Edge Trim Tape $12/100 ft.Primer-Sealer for interior walls KilzPaint for Interior WallsSemi-Gloss white for trim and cabinetsInterior Baseboard and door TrimWindow Sill boardsLaminate Wood Flooring Laminate Flooring BarrierStove/OvenMicrowaveRefrigeratorGarbage DisposalDishwasherKitchen Sink TrapKitchen SinkKitchen Sink FaucetCountertopsKitchen CabinetsKitchen Cabinet Handlesice maker water line valveBathtub/showerBathroom Sink/CountertopToiletBathroom Sink FaucetTrap for bath sinkBathtub Showerhead Bathtub Faucet SetBathroom MirrorBathtub Drain set

GRNOVA
06-06-2009, 10:09 AM
Here is the lift I have no post to worry about. Set you back about $4,000

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
http://www.bendpak.com/products/automotive-lifts/specialty-lifts/sp-7x.php

Larry Callahan
06-06-2009, 10:14 AM
Here is the lift I have no post to worry about. Set you back about $4,000

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Cool! Who makes that?

GRNOVA
06-06-2009, 10:22 AM
Bend Pak

http://www.bendpak.com/products/automotive-lifts/specialty-lifts/sp-7x.php
http://www.bestbuyautoequipment.com/Bend_Pak_SP_7X_7000_lbs_specialty_lift_p/bend-paksp-7x.htm

-The Stig-
06-06-2009, 01:06 PM
That's a cool lift.

I found this one, pretty cool. And you can break it down when not being used. Prices start at just under $2000.

http://www.garagejournal.com/?p=325#more-325

oestek
06-06-2009, 01:33 PM
Sink some radiant heat tubes in the floor... nice and warm!

jpdeuce
06-06-2009, 03:30 PM
Make provisions for the lift if you can. Hieght and concrete necessary in at least one bay. You can always buy the lift later. Heck even if you can't go a lot higher get the minimum concrete required for a smaller lift.

More stuff:
sink/shower (3x3 stand up)/ commode
plenty of overhead lighting
floor drains for washing down, etc
tv/cable/phone
extra phone cable for a security system

67 ls1 vert
06-06-2009, 06:10 PM
Here in California, at least where I live, southern Cali you cant have a floor drain. At least one that is in your plans. Not to say that you cant build it and skim coat over it with concrete. I did that with a shower drain in one of my large closets that's attached to a bedroom for the future if I decide to make it another master bedroom.


Just built my new house with 10' ceilings in my garage. Did the 20amp outlets every 6 feet with 220 amp for the compressor. Did the walls in 2X6 and both garage doors are insulated. It measures 34' wide by 27' deep with two 16'x8' and 12'x8' doors. I also added a sink in it for washing dirty hands. That's a must. Keeps the door handle to the house clean. LOL Lots of over head lights and over head outlets too. Right now its a catch all for all the junk and moving boxes. I cant wait to get rid of everything so I can apply floor epoxy.

One thing to remember to do is before you drywall the ceiling is to throw plenty of sheets of plywood up there so you have walk and storage space. Put in one of them drop down ladders from depot that retract from the ceiling. Way cool to have for extra storage for the wifeys junk. :)

shortrack
06-06-2009, 07:37 PM
for a commercial style beam over 2 post lift you'll need a 12 ft cieling minimum.....took me over a year but I eventually found a used one on Kijiji (like Craigslist) for $1200, I called some places locally that sell lifts and they gave me a couple of names of guys who install lifts for them.....I had the lift professionally installed for $400 (highly reccomended).....I already had the electrical run and ready to go.....you need 6" of concrete to support a lift.....dig a little extra out around where you'll install the hoist, (you need 4" for a floor) you'll have way under $100 in extra concrete if any at all, get two or three quotes for the job.

fishtail8
06-06-2009, 07:45 PM
For cabinets, I went to a used office supply place and picked up some nice steel ones with folding doors and such. Most of them are fairly tall, or can be stacked easily. You could even custom paint em if you really wanted too...

shortrack
06-06-2009, 07:49 PM
My nieghbour was tearing out his kitchen....I got his old oak cabinets for nothing.
you can call some kitchen reno places for cabinets too, remember, these guys have to PAY to get rid of the old stuff, they are only too glad to give it to you, and they see tons of it.

there, you just saved enough money for half a hoist.:)

67 ls1 vert
06-07-2009, 10:49 AM
That's a great idea that a lot of people have thought of but when these guys go to a job to do a remodel, they don't take their time and remove the old cabinets carefully.

They pretty much tear them out with hammer claws and pry bars.

Maybe if you slip them $100 or something to save them?

I worked in the construction field for a while to see them do this to them.

Rhino
06-07-2009, 01:05 PM
Sink some radiant heat tubes in the floor... nice and warm!

Radiant heat is nice, but only if you plan to keep it warm. I would rather not heat the area when I'm not using it. All that concrete takes a LOT of time to heat up if it's cold. The flip side of that is that the space heats back up very quickly if you do have to open the door.

muthstryker
06-07-2009, 01:20 PM
maybe i missed something, but i didnt see anything for plumbing for air compressor lines.. and then have the retractable hoses mounted by them.

muthstryker
06-07-2009, 01:21 PM
never mind now i see it, i would hide the air lines from east woods behind the walls. just looks cleaner

vintageracer
06-07-2009, 01:40 PM
I completed the process you are going through 8 years ago.

Build your garage for the FUTURE!. You may not be able to afford a lift now but maybe you can in 3 years. Make sure your building is set up for a lift and the FUTURE. A few extra grand spent TODAY when building your garage is much cheaper than redoing the garage to meet your future needs and more importantly regretting the mistakes your made when building the garage in the first place.

Going overboard on electrical is expensive. You will use 3 or four outlets all the time and the rest will not be used much if at all. Ask me how I know!

Spend your money on the important "bones" of your building. Spend the extra money for the extra 2 ft tall walls and go from 10 ft ceilings to a 12 foot ceiling. Run the gas line, water line, telephone/cable/computer lines, floor drains and a 200 amp electrical service line to the building. Nobody says you have to hook all this stuff up but it is their when the budget is available. Put 6 inch concrete and a 12 foot ceiling where you "ultimately" plan to put your 2 post lift. I have a gas line to my shop that I have never hooked up since the building is so well insulated that I do not need heat or cooling for the building. Have not used it but it is still there if I need it! Consider the design of the building and location of the doors to help you accomplish this by making sure you have great ventilation and airflow. That's how I did it.

All the cabinets, airlines, shower, electrical outlets, A/C, heat, office walls etc can come with time and are NOT a big need in the beginning. It's a real bitch to stand back later and say I wish I did this to the building when I built it when you want something in the future.

Why anyone puts a shower in their shop I will never understand. EVERYONE I know who has a shower in their shop when it was built either uses the shower stall for storage or has removed the show all together because they never used it. Walk your ass in the house to wash off! The location of your compressor and the acceptable noise level you will tolerate is a hell of alot more important than a shower.

Nobody ever builds the perfect garage the first time. To determine the size of the perfect garage is to consider the total square footage for the biggest shop you think you will EVER need and then DOUBLE IT! You might be close at that point. A BIG shop does NOT mean a better shop. A well thought out shop building is the best shop building. Don't get carried away with size of the building but seriously consider the design AND provisions for future equipment that your may acquire.

As important as we think A/C, cabinets, air lines, shelves and all that crap is, consider the bones of the building and the building design first and foremost. Secondly it probably a good idea to talk with your city codes department so you will learn what codes you have to work around to build what you desire. This includes install drains or other items not allowed and then "hiding" them before inspection. Most guys know the drill!

Good luck with the "Dog House"!

jpdeuce
06-07-2009, 05:21 PM
I have a shower in my garage and it has been used, many times. I do not care to be covered in black grease and come in to shower only to have my wife get angry over the stains in the floor of the tub. It may not be for everyone but I like having mine. I do use it for storage occasionally as well.

My compressor sits outside on a concrete pad with a roof. Its alot easier to answer the phone or talk when you don't have to hear the noise.

Bill Howell
06-07-2009, 09:03 PM
make two footers in one bay about two foot wide by four inches deeper than the rest of your floor, and 9 feet wide. Separate them by 4/5 feet and you will have just added the needed concrete for your future lift for about $50, that is a no brainer. This way you have the proper footer for either a two post or four post lift.
The Ceiling needs to be 11 foot though for the four post.
I would also rough in plumbing for a toilet and even shower. So cheap to do that now and so costly later. Again, probably not $400 more to do it now.

Coursey
02-26-2013, 01:53 PM
So how did the garage turn out?

lftnwhls
03-18-2013, 04:11 PM
One thing I didnt see anyone mention is brick! I love Brick.

73118



Radiant heat and my hoist. The three best things I did.

73119

69importkilla
03-18-2013, 04:54 PM
I think I just got sick....Nice place!

TZmtrsprt
03-19-2013, 04:12 PM
Don't forget an oven for powder coating, wired for WIFI, cable TV etc. Maybe a fridge, sink, wet bar, stripper pole (no reason the wife or GF can't get involved in your project).

Coursey
03-19-2013, 05:52 PM
I noticed that you saw cut the floor.

At what floor size should you saw cut?
Mine is 32'x46'

snappytravis
03-19-2013, 07:31 PM
I think you should cut every 8 or 10 ft, I would probably do every 8 ft, It should be cut when it is still green, I am not a concrete guy. I had a pad poured 30x40 the contractor didn't cut it, It cracked, bad deal, court deal, If you look really close when the cut the floor there will be fine cracks down through the cut. Where is the garage with the stripper pole?

lftnwhls
03-20-2013, 04:02 PM
I noticed that you saw cut the floor.

At what floor size should you saw cut?
Mine is 32'x46'

50 x 48

lftnwhls
03-20-2013, 04:05 PM
I was told anything bigger than 15' square.

Boyd
12-24-2013, 01:28 PM
So how did the garage turn out?

It turned out well.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/12/16511c90d3df77af6b4cac75a8361e25-1.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/kvnboyd/media/16511c90d3df77af6b4cac75a8361e25.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/12/20130720_200823_zpsc5f3de95-1.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/kvnboyd/media/20130720_200823_zpsc5f3de95.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/12/20130720_124350_HDR_zpsc77ab495-1.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/kvnboyd/media/20130720_124350_HDR_zpsc77ab495.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/12/20130720_200157_zpsd6fd2141-1.jpg (http://s103.photobucket.com/user/kvnboyd/media/20130720_200157_zpsd6fd2141.jpg.html)

protouring70
12-24-2013, 02:40 PM
Man that is sweet......

Mkelcy
12-24-2013, 04:22 PM
I personally would ad a drain in the floor of the garage for washing cars, wetsanding, rinsing out the garage. Also move the compressor outside and just run cheap pvc pipe into the garage with a few different places to plug in for air.

Worst idea ever.

BMR Sales
12-26-2013, 02:00 PM
The Garage Turned out Nice.

When I designed my One Car Garage, I made sure I had the Ceiling Height for the 4 Post Lift ( I bought a American-Made Rotary), I put the Compressor Outside to get rid of the Noise (But it has it's own enclosure to keep it out of the Elements), Room for the Snap-On 54" Wide Box and of course the Beer Fridge!

T.C.

raustinss
12-26-2013, 04:27 PM
Worst idea ever.

Why is that the worst idea ever...not that kind agree or disagree but man if your going to insult someone you should maybe say why it's such a bad idea in your mind, while you're at it suggest why your idea would be so much better....this is how people learn.....!

Mkelcy
12-26-2013, 08:03 PM
Why is that the worst idea ever...not that kind agree or disagree but man if your going to insult someone you should maybe say why it's such a bad idea in your mind, while you're at it suggest why your idea would be so much better....this is how people learn.....!

A Google search on "compressed air PVC" returns 1,360,000 results. I didn't read all of them, but here's a very brief sample:

http://compressedair.squarespace.com/journal/2012/2/27/can-i-use-pvc-for-my-compressed-air-system.html

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/ruptured-pvc-air-lines-what-not-do-230253/

When PVC goes, it creates shrapnel which, if not imbedded in skin, can do nasty things to paint.

I use copper pipe; others use iron pipe; still other use products expressly intended to last under the pressure of compressed air and the occasional impact that destroys PVC systems.

snappytravis
12-26-2013, 10:54 PM
http://www.rapidairproducts.com/ This is a product similar to some stuff I sold to county shop. It has a lining on the inside. Steel pipe will start to rust on the inside eventually and then you will end up with rust in your tools. Pvc is cheap and easy and has probably been used 1,000 times. I believe the oil from the compressor may eventually break down pvc. Many people do not realize that there is a proper way to install airlines. If you plan to paint cars I would recommend some good moisture filters. I would also put drains on all your lines that drop down from the main airline. I hate to see people spend thousands on a shop and then cheap out on the important things. Just thought I would through in my 2 cents,,

raustinss
12-27-2013, 04:25 AM
A Google search on "compressed air PVC" returns 1,360,000 results. I didn't read all of them, but here's a very brief sample:

http://compressedair.squarespace.com/journal/2012/2/27/can-i-use-pvc-for-my-compressed-air-system.html

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/ruptured-pvc-air-lines-what-not-do-230253/

When PVC goes, it creates shrapnel which, if not imbedded in skin, can do nasty things to paint.

I use copper pipe; others use iron pipe; still other use products expressly intended to last under the pressure of compressed air and the occasional impact that destroys PVC systems.

Personally I completely agree and would never have suggested it either, I just thought that the post was. Lacking in information for someone who may have considered it a good idea. That said I really hope that he was suggesting using the cheap PVC as a grommet so to say for the steel pipe to run thru lol
Thanks for helping others realize the dangers on why it is the worst idea ever
Cheers Ryan Austin

67-LS1
08-01-2019, 06:57 AM
Professional shops know what type of lift will work best for their business. Most professional shops have both two post and four post lifts https://www.elevatorauto.ro/
https://reihmann.de/
2 and 4 post lifts have different pluses/minuses. I put in a 2 post because I think it allows me to do more, ie, lift body off frame, change wheels/brakes/suspension. I don’t need to store a car above another which is something a 4 post seems better at.