'68 Camaro Pro-touring Project "No Name"

[Mkelcy]

I've made reference to my '68 Camaro project, but haven't done a good job documenting it; so here goes.

It started out as a '68 350 SBC, Saginaw 4 speed, 12 bolt rear car with slapper bars.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/001startingpoint-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/002engine-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/003rearsuspension-1.jpg

It's going to end up as a pro-touring build with a GMPP 376/480 crate engine backed up by a a Viper T56, running on a 21st Century Street Machine front subframe and a Lateral Dynamics 3 link rear. Current plan for the color scheme is 2009 Corvette Cyber Grey, with black stripes.

The plan was to install the LD 3 link, mini-tubs and subframe connectors, have it media blasted and primed and then go off for body work and paint. Unfortunately, following the media blasting, there was more rust than I'd anticipated, so there was a detour for rust repair to the passenger rear quarter, replacement of the driver's rear quarter, repair of the rear window channel, repair of the trunk lip, repair of the passenger side door and repair of the driver's side foot well. While I did the install of the mini-tubs, subframe connectors and LD 3 link, I farmed the rust repair out.

Back to our story. The first thing I did to the car was cut some big holes in it for the DSE mini-tubs and the LD 3 link. Here you can see the narrowed section of the rear frame rail and the fill-in plates as well as the LD rear cross-member that the watts link hangs on.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/004framepatchopentrunk-1.jpg

The upper link of the three link attaches to a crossmember installed just in front of the torque boxes, and makes a full rear seat impractical.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/007patchtotorquebox-1.jpg

The position of the rear (Watts link) crossmember also requires the removal and replacement of a portion of the trunk floor.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/009trunkthroughtocrossm-1.jpg

Here's a shot of the rear interior of the car, showing the front crossmember (that accepts the front of the links) as well as the sheet metal box enclosing the upper link, the driver's side inner mini-tub wheel house and the DSE subframe connectors.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/011ainteriorrearshowing-1.jpg

Same shot showing the passenger side.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/011binteriorshowingpass-1.jpg

For the subframe connectors, I wanted (at least initially) to allow the subframe to be pulled from the car, so I modified the DSE subframe connectors by installing two 0.50" ID DOM tubes, about 8" apart in the connectors to prevent them from collapsing when the bolts for the brackets were tightened and made up some 0.25" plate brackets for the subframe (the "ears" at the extreme left of this shot)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

The brackets are fastened to the subframe connectors with two 1/2" bolts on each side. I'll have to see how effective it is. If it doesn't work, I'll just weld the brackets to the subframe connectors.

Of the three jobs the mini-tub was the most difficult, least fun and most time consuming; the LD 3 link was surprisingly easy but still a bit involved, and the DSE SFC's were pretty easy.

We replaced a portion of the driver's side floor but, as it turned out, not enough.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/012frontdriversfloor-1.jpg

Here's the car ready to be put on the body dolly and sent to the media blaster.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/014trunkshowingtubandup-1.jpg

I'll detail the rust repair in the next post.

[Mkelcy]

Rust repair:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/015passdoor1-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/016passdoor5-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/017passdoor7-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/026rearwindow1-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/028trunk1-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/030trunk6-1.jpg

This is by no means all of it, but we've all probably seen enough pictures of rust.

[Mkelcy]

In addition to rust repair, I had the exisiting shifter hole closed, but saved the original reinforced opening for reinstallation when I know where the shifter hole needs to be with the Viper T56:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/031shifter-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/032shifter1-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/033shifter3-1.jpg

I also had the shoulder belt anchors moved forward about 6 inches, because I hate the way the belt digs into my neck in my current '68 Camaro.

Here he's cut out the old mounting points:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/shoulder2-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/shoulder1-1.jpg


Here the mounting points have been welded to a heavy piece of steel plate:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif


and here the plates have been welded back into the car:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/shoulder5-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Either I'll redrill the headliner bow holes or I'll be "forced" to use a Marquez Design headliner. :bananna2:

From this point the car went to the body shop for initial body work, priming and undercoating (Lizard Skin). It's back here at the house, and I've installed the front and rear suspension so it can go back for paint. I'll take some shots as it sits now and post them soon.

Too many pictures?

[1971CHEVELLE]

Car looks good :) solid project to start with

[1969CamaroRS]

Wow impressive metal work. Please keep the pics coming!

[Mkelcy]

Well I promised more pictures and here they are.

The 21st Century Subframe uses C5 upper control arms (UCA), lower control arms (LCA) and the upright (aka, spindle). I ground the casting flash off the arms, painted them and installed VBP polyurethane bushings, top and bottom. Although the bushings are listed as a full set for the front and rear of a Corvette, VBP was happy to sell just the front bushings.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/uca-1.jpg

I didn't have nearly as much trouble getting the old bushings out as Steve Rupp did - no torches were required.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/lca-1.jpg

The 21st Century subframe uses circle track racing "slugs" for the UCA mounts. If you look at the UCA picture above or at the picture of the bushing below, you'll see the slugs behind the bushing shaft. The slugs in the car now have the holes drilled in the center, but you can get offset slugs that allow the UCA pivot point to be raised or lowered. If I can get the Pozzis to drive the car, I'll be very curious to see if they think a change would be useful.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/ucabushing-1.jpg

Here's a shot of the LCA bushing. The 21st Century subframe is also designed to use the factory C5 eccentrics in the LCAs for alignment. I'll have to see how well the car holds an alignment for my use. If it's an issue, Steve Rupp has already found the solution in the Pfadt Camber Kit.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

The subframe is also set up to use a splined sway bar that attaches to the LCA by an arm. My arms needed to be bent more to get close to the LCA mounting point. They're about 5/8" solid steel, so it's not a "stick it in the vise and wail away with a hammer" deal. I found a very nice guy at a place that manufactures after market Porsche exhaust systems who had a big press who did the job for me. The new bend is the one on the right in the picture.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/passengerswaybararm-1.jpg

The subframe comes with a 1" solid front swaybar (the bar at the bottom of the picture below); and there's not much you can do to go up from there. Because (for obvious reasons) I've been following the Penny build and development, I ordered a 1.25" bar, arms and pillow blocks to allow a greater range of sway bar "stiffness" in the future.

The subframe also uses an AGR rack in the front steer position. Payton King - who also has a 21st Century subframe - is going to give me some advice on the power steering setup. Apparently the stock LSx power steering pump puts out too much flow for the AGR rack, leading to leaks and overheating. You can also see the stock C5 eccentric alignment bolt in the picture below.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/passengersidefrontsuspe-1.jpg

I'm using Autokraft plates, swapped left for right, and they locate the engine almost perfectly on the subframe.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/engineplate-1.jpg

With the stock F-body oil pan on my mockup engine, I get some slight interference with the balance tube between the two boots on the rack. The boots - and the balance tube - can be rotated forward eliminating the interference. I'm presently using the short wide motor mounts with the plates. I ordered some tall narrow motor mounts to raise the engine a bit. I'm still thinking about which oil pan to use. The LS3 comes with a stock Corvette pan, however the sump on that pan may be too close to the front crossmember. Then it would be either the stock Fbody pan or the Autokraft pan I have.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/balancetubeoilpan-1.jpg

The passenger side head is the farthest back on the LSx engine, and I have about 1.25" or so between the head and the fire wall. The fireall is also sprayed with the Lizardskin, but it does, indeed, sand pretty easily. I'm planning on the fire wall and inner fender wells being satin black. Those are the 21st Century stepped headers they make for their frame.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/passengerssideheadtofir-1.jpg

I'll post more on the rest of the car in the next post.

[Mkelcy]

Here's the undercarriage. You can see the "ears" running from the subframe back to the DSE subframe connectors, as well as the front ends of the two bottom links. I installed crush sleeves in the SFCs so the two bolts on either side won't collapse them. The body bushings are also the DSE aluminum pieces. I'll remake a transmission cross member once I get the car back from paint and put in the "real" engine with whatever oil pan I end up with.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/undersidetowardfront-1.jpg

Here's a longer view showing the LD 3 link in all its glory. The welding on the entire LD rear is spectacular. Again, when I get it back from paint, I'll blow it apart and either send most of the undercarriage out for final finish coating or paint them myself.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Here's the body as it sits today: primed, undercoated and going back to paint on Thursday.


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/bodydriversside-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/bodypassengerside-1.jpg

The interior has been sprayed with the Lizard Skin. I'm probably going to drive it with factory style insulation and carpeting just laid down to see how much more than the Lizard Skin I'll need. If I don't need the weight of a mass based sound deadener I'd just as soon skip it, but this car is going to be used for multi-thousand mile trips, and I'll need it reasonably quiet. I'm also a little curious to see how well a product like FatMat will adhere to the Lizard Skin. The big bolt is the front mounting point for the upper link. It will also be interesting to see how much noise that transmits into the passenger compartment.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/passengersidewheeltub-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/driverssidewheeltub-1.jpg


I haven't yet determined how I'm going to handle the rear seat area.

My current plans for the front are good supportive seats (Recaros parhaps), no console - just the shifter coming up through a boot, and a custom lower center section for the dash to house the gauges. I'm presently planning for 2 5/8" fuel level, fuel pressure, oil temp, oil pressure, coolant temp and voltmeter gauges. I'll use the stock '68 instrument panel with a 5" tach and speedometer.

So, back to paint on Thursday, and I should have it back at the house in less than a month. (Tip - Always use a paint shop with EXTREMELY limited car storage space.) Then happy months of assembly, wiring, spending money like a drunken sailor and maybe even driving in the late fall.

[clevorguy]

How much lizard skin did you use?

[castine917]

you can probably do narrow and individual seats similar to a fourth gen camaro or firebird for the rear if you want seats back there.

[Mkelcy]

How much lizard skin did you use?

That's three 2 gallon containers of the Lizard Skin and about 1.5 gallons of a two gallon container of their sound deadener. I'm actually going to need some more, because they didn't spray all the way up the inside of the firewall and I want the inside of the roof done.

There's a thread out there somewhere on the internet about using glass microspheres and latex paint as a substitute for the Lizard Skin, which is pretty expensive. However, this wasn't a car I wanted to experiment on. I will say that the Lizard Skin is extremely light.

[Motown 454]

Awesome build, you do nice work.

[Mkelcy]

you can probably do narrow and individual seats similar to a fourth gen camaro or firebird for the rear if you want seats back there.

I was torn between something like that and doing a nice sort of package tray. I'll never carry passengers back there and won't have seat belts for the rear seats, so all I'm looking for is something cosmetic.

[Chevrolaine]

Love it, can't wait to see the paint!

[rlplive]

nice!

[craigs73]

nice work i like it

[Mkelcy]

Putting wheels on to ship it back to paint. These are 275-40-18's:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/rearwheelwell-1.jpg

Passenger side:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/rearwheelwellpassenger-1.jpg

That's just crazy!

[joejaze]

Looks like a killer project. Cant wait to see more...

[1969CamaroRS]

Passenger side:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/rearwheelwellpassenger-1.jpg

That's just crazy!

Hard to tell from the pics, but what 3-4" of extra space? Can we say 375/20/21 sized tires? :machine:

[Mkelcy]

Hard to tell from the pics, but what 3-4" of extra space? Can we say 375/20/21 sized tires? :machine:

Probably not that much, but certainly as much tire as I can afford!

[Mkelcy]

Well paint took longer than I expected, but three months versus (a hoped for) one month isn't too bad. Here's the car almost ready for color:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0263m-1.jpg

And here's the color before cutting and buffing:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0267u-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0266n-1.jpg

The color is BMW Stratus Gray Pearl.

I should get the car back this week and then the real work starts and the money for interior, powder coating, exhaust and all the little stuff starts flying out the door.

Reminder of the build - 376/480 LS3, Viper T56, 21st Century Street Machine front subframe with QA1 single adjustable coilovers, Lateral Dynamics 3 link rear suspension with AFCO M2 dual adjustable coilover shocks and 4.11 gears, DSE subframe connectors and mini-tubs, probably Z06 wheels on billet adapters to start.

I'm seriously thinking about flush mount front and rear windows - any thoughts?

[Damn True]

How the hell did I miss this thread?


Mike,
That looks fantastic. Great color.

I'm in the midst of installing my 3-link right now. Take a peek at my thread and if you have any knowledge to drop on me please do!

BTW, where did you get those dummy shocks? That is a far more elegant solution that the angle iron with holes drilled in it that I am using.

[HILLBILLY68]

looking good!

[Mkelcy]

How the hell did I miss this thread?

Mike,
That looks fantastic. Great color.

I'm in the midst of installing my 3-link right now. Take a peek at my thread and if you have any knowledge to drop on me please do!

BTW, where did you get those dummy shocks? That is a far more elegant solution that the angle iron with holes drilled in it that I am using.

It looks like you're doing the 3 link pretty well. I found Mark's instructions to be very accurate and complete with no surprises (unlike, e.g., the DSE minitubs). I did mine at the same time I did the minitub, so it may have been a bit easier to locate and fit the rear crossmember with no rear inner wheel houses. The sheet metal welding (the center link house and the close out for the trunk where the rear crossmember goes) tested my (very limited) welding skills to the max.

The dummy shocks are simply swedged tubes and heim joints from (in my case) SpeedwayMotors.com as follows:

4 - 1750105 - STANDARD RH MALE HEIM, 1/2" SHANK/HOLE
4 - 1750305 - STANDARD LH MALE HEIM, 1/2" SHANK/HOLE
4 - 91034212-14 - SWEDGED STEEL TUBE, 1/2" THREAD

Total with shipping was about $97.50 for four dummy shocks. Pricier than angle iron, but seemed worth it to me. The down side is one more thing to store because "I might need it again."

[tones2SS]

Great job Mike!!
Great skills and the paint color looks good.

[tom_a]

Looks great. Love everything about your plan/build...but I would vote no on the flush mount glass. Keep us posted.

[Mkelcy]

Looks great. Love everything about your plan/build...but I would vote no on the flush mount glass. Keep us posted.

Yes, I asked CarlC's opinion on our "Cruise the Crest" on Sunday. He said (and, upon reflection, I agree) that it might look good today but be dated five years from now. So it'll be standard glass and polished factory trim.

[Hidro]

Nice color choice looks really good!:)
You can allways add flushmount later and just spend it all on the wheels/tires now..:idea: Either way its will look great.:smoke:

[Payton King]

To finally get it painted. Lots of long hours in your future, but this is the fun part. Putting it together for the last time. Take you time and enjoy the build.

The most camber I could get out of my sub was 1.2 degrees. You can have the face of the slugs machined down to get a little more caster. I believe 1/4 of an inch is about another full degree. Even if you do not plan on running 2.2 degrees of camber the extra room will help to get the caster adjustment to 6 or 7.

After you have your car aligned...you can drill a 1/4 hole through the eccentrics and frame. Thread the hole and install a bolt. This way you just pinned the eccentrics and they will not move under load.

Send your stock LS pump to Turn One and tell him you are running an AGR mustang II rack. May want to call AGR and get pressures and flow for that rack. I ended up sending my pump and rack both back to AGR. I had a rack problem but also wanted a heavier feel in the steering. They changed the torsion bar out to a .245 and reworked my pump. Feels like my wife's M3 now.

I am running 450 lbs springs on my shocks up front. I think Rupp is running 500.

I have been wanting to mess with the slugs up front. The suspension has .5 per inch camber gain. I think you could lower the UCA and increase that amount. If I could find someone with a suspension program with a 2000 Corvette plugged in I could figure that out.

Sorry to get off track. Look forward to following your progress. You are going to love the way that thing drives.

[Damn True]

^^^ See, that's why this place is great! ^^^


I'm on the no to flush mount glass side as well.

[Mkelcy]

The most camber I could get out of my sub was 1.2 degrees. You can have the face of the slugs machined down to get a little more caster. I believe 1/4 of an inch is about another full degree. Even if you do not plan on running 2.2 degrees of camber the extra room will help to get the caster adjustment to 6 or 7.

Can you put the slugs on the back side of the UCA mount, or does that give you too much uncorrectable camber?


After you have your car aligned...you can drill a 1/4 hole through the eccentrics and frame. Thread the hole and install a bolt. This way you just pinned the eccentrics and they will not move under load.

I was considering this, but want to get the ride height dialed in before doing so.


Send your stock LS pump to Turn One and tell him you are running an AGR mustang II rack. May want to call AGR and get pressures and flow for that rack. I ended up sending my pump and rack both back to AGR. I had a rack problem but also wanted a heavier feel in the steering. They changed the torsion bar out to a .245 and reworked my pump. Feels like my wife's M3 now.

Do you have the contact info at AGR and what they did? I'm going to try to take advantage of your trail blazing on this.


I am running 450 lbs springs on my shocks up front. I think Rupp is running 500.

I'll probably go with the 450's as well.


I have been wanting to mess with the slugs up front. The suspension has .5 per inch camber gain. I think you could lower the UCA and increase that amount. If I could find someone with a suspension program with a 2000 Corvette plugged in I could figure that out.

Mr. Pozzi, paging Mr. Pozzi.


Sorry to get off track. Look forward to following your progress. You are going to love the way that thing drives.

Payton, nothing off track at all. I appreciate your time and advice.

[Rybar]

Very nice build Mike, I am also not sure how the hell I missed this thread.

[Damn True]

The upper link of the three link attaches to a crossmember installed just in front of the torque boxes, and makes a full rear seat impractical.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/007patchtotorquebox-1.jpg

The position of the rear (Watts link) crossmember also requires the removal and replacement of a portion of the trunk floor.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/009trunkthroughtocrossm-1.jpg

Here's a shot of the rear interior of the car, showing the front crossmember (that accepts the front of the links) as well as the sheet metal box enclosing the upper link, the driver's side inner mini-tub wheel house and the DSE subframe connectors.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/011ainteriorrearshowing-1.jpg

Same shot showing the passenger side.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/011binteriorshowingpass-1.jpg



Hey Mike.

Do you have any more photos of these steps in the process? Kinda stumped on cutting the relief for the upper link and integrating the cut into the provided boxes.

[Mkelcy]

Hey Mike.

Do you have any more photos of these steps in the process? Kinda stumped on cutting the relief for the upper link and integrating the cut into the provided boxes.

PM me your email address and I can send a few more pictures that may help. Any particular questions I can help with?

[mc84_zz4]

Nice build! I also am really diggin the paint color, it looks great.
BTW, for rear seats; the 70+ Camaro seat buns may work, BUT the 2004-2006 GTO seats, which also have rear buckets, and you can remove the center portion. Those could just fit around the box/tunnel for the upper link.
The center divider is separate from the seats..
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/1353515_IMG-1.jpg
But sorry to say, the seats as are will not fit the f body without shortening them a few inches.
The lower seat portion have almost identical dimensions to the seat buns in a 77 Trans-Am.
The T/A Camaro rear seat height ends about where the headrest are on the GTO seats.
HTH

[67SSDan]

How the hell did I miss this thread?

Yeah, I missed it somehow too. Awesome looking project!

Dan

[WILWAXU]

Congrats Mike! The project car is looking good!

[nicks67camaro]

Looks great. Any new updates?

[Mkelcy]

The car's back from paint and I've been inspecting the paint job as I work on it. So far, the painter will have to redo both rockers, but otherwise I'm pretty happy with the (relatively inexpensive) job. I have to keep it outside, so I've got it covered with soft cotton sheets and then it's under a car cover. I spent about an hour dusting it before putting on the sheets, so hopefully, it's okay.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0283ifo-1.jpg

Sorry just teaser shots right now, it takes too long to dust it off for storage if I uncover it.

I've disassembled and pulled the front and rear suspension. I was a little worried about leaving the front sheet metal in place with no inner fender wells to provide additional support, so I lowered the lift to the hard stops (as I always do) and then set a couple of jack stands to support the front end at the core support. And then to make it really idiot proof, I shut and locked out the power to the lift. Raising it is no big deal, but acute brain fade leading to lowering it with the jack stands in place would be a VERY expensive mistake.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0282y-1.jpg

I had the subframe, inner fender wells, rear housing, links, upper and lower grill trim, trunk latch, gas tank straps, rear bumper brackets, steering arms, sway bar arms, brake pedal, clutch pedal, pedal bracket, tail light covers and the bracket for the electronic gas pedal all powder coated satin black. I thought about doing the links a different color to make them stand out, but this car is all about being understated.

Here's the subframe:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0281jwf-1.jpg

The subframe is sitting on a collapsible subframe stand I made a few years ago that has proven to be an absolute joy to have. It'll support a subframe fully loaded with engine, trans and front suspension, yet is reasonably light, easy to move and collapses for storage. If anyone's interested, I can detail the construction. I was pretty pleased with it because for (almost) the first time in my life, I didn't grossly overbuild something. (Heck, even my kitchen cabinets are 3/4" 15 ply plywood.)

The front and rear window trim is out to be repaired and polished and I've been ordering from here and there - everything from a battery box, to a hydroboost unit, to a radiator setup from Prodigy to a Marquez headliner.

Here's a teaser shot with the "small" 275's on the back end before I blew it apart.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0279wre-1.jpg

One thing I've been wondering about is that the Lizard Skin in the interior of the car is pretty rough and may not hold a Dynamat type product very well. I'm not too concerned about the floors - I may simply run the OEM style sound deadener over the Lizard Skin, but the firewall presents a different issue. I was thinking about going with a factory firewall mat, but then I'd have to put new holes in my semi-smoothed firewall. I was also thinking about using something like the Second Skin Spectrum Sludge - trowelling it on the firewall if nothing else to give me a better surface for an adhesive backed sound mat. Any thoughts on that?

As much as I'd love to start throwing the engine and transmission in, I figured I'd start building it from the firewall out. I need to locate and install a manifold for the AC, figure out the wiring runs for the electronic gas pedal, the ISIS system, the DSE wipers and the gauge inputs, install the steering column, actually install the AC and so on. All of that will be much easier without the engine in the way.

I'll take some more pictures as I put the suspension back in and post up again soon.

[CarlC]

Nice work Mike!

If shipping to AGR becomes too expensive you may want to consider taking the whole enchillada to Lee's and let him work his magic.

[1badchevelle]

Nice work. love the color of the car.

Can I take the f-body pan of your hands?

[Mkelcy]

Nice work. love the color of the car.

Can I take the f-body pan of your hands?

If you mean the LS1 oil pan, probably, but it will likely month or more before I get there - there's a lot to do.

[Mkelcy]

Nice work Mike!

If shipping to AGR becomes too expensive you may want to consider taking the whole enchillada to Lee's and let him work his magic.

Good thought! That'll be one the the tasks for next week. I assume the hydroboost doesn't take much flow, just pressure, right?

[CarlC]

Very little flow. Both my old P-pump and the current CB are set up for 1400psi @ 3gpm, but that's for a 600 box. HB function is fine.

[Mkelcy]

Well it's been hot and smoky around here lately. We're about three to five miles as the crow flies from the "Station" fire in La Canada and seem to be under the flight path for the water tankers. Here's the view from my back yard:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0288ffi-1.jpg

and a water tanker flying overhead:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/08/img0289kmz-1.jpg

We're not in any danger, but the air quality is so bad that I can't work on the car without really affecting my breathing.

Check that - we've been under a "mandatory" evacuation order since Saturday, but have decided to stay. We're so close to the boundary of the evacuation zone we could walk out. We've got the cars packed with what we can move, but the '68 is on the lift with no front or rear suspension, so - as they say - it is what it is.

I watched trees up on the ridges above us burst into flames at 2:00am Sunday morning, and we were like a war zone with all the helicopters and fixed wing planes doing drops yesterday afternoon, but things have calmed down a lot since then. Fire crews were up in the hills behind us today with chain saws and bull dozers widening the fire break. Between the fire break and the (hopefully) exhaustion of fuel in our immediate area, we may skate by on this one.

[67 ls1 vert]

great project Mike. All I can say is, good luck with your family, house, pets, and camaro. I lost everything in the fires back in '07. 67 rs fully redone and my 85 rock crawler cj. My other 67 vert was in the shop on the lower part of my property and it made throgh fire. The building is made of steel good thing.

[Mkelcy]

Well, we've survived intact after a few days of pretty intense activity in the local mountains. Sunday afternoon it was like a Vietnam combat zone up in the hills, as helicopter after helicopter made drops on the fire. There were at least a half dozen working a pretty small area.

The air quality is awful, so I won't be doing much on the car for a bit, and I need to figure out where to walk the dogs, as every good walking site we had has gone up in flames.

[CarlC]

I was getting pretty concerned about you Mike. I'm glad to hear that, for now, the worst has past.

Don't worry, with the rains coming soon you can take the dogs out mud-whomping as they chase the bears.

[Mkelcy]

I was getting pretty concerned about you Mike. I'm glad to hear that, for now, the worst has past.

Don't worry, with the rains coming soon you can take the dogs out mud-whomping as they chase the bears.

Thanks. I'm afraid that the wild life up there - including "our" bears - has probably been pretty devastated. Once they open the ANF up again, I want to walk our old walks just to see how they did.

[m6z]

very nice so far. can't wait to see it finished.

[Mkelcy]

I'm trying to figure out how to route the HVAC lines in the interior of the car. I'm using a VA Gen II Compac unit with the DSE bracket. I'd like to put a 4 way bulkhead plate where the old blower motor was, high on the firewall just underneath the passenger side fender; that's pretty easy. What's stumping me is how to run lines from the bulkhead plate - which is in the cowl air plenum - to the Compac unit, which is in the interior of the car.

Pictures will help. This first shot shows where the bulkhead plate will be mounted - through the hole where you can see the 2 o'clock to 7 o'clock bluish portion of the blockoff plate. The large hole is sealed to and covered by the kick panel.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/interior2-1.jpg

I've got good access to the area above the Compac unit. I was thinking about using 2-10AN male bulkhead connectors (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AER-FBM2776/) for the two heater lines (the white circles shown low and toward the front). The sheet metal there is on an angle, so I was planning on using two 45 degree 10AN to barb fittings (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-220708/) and running them to the Compac unit inside the car and up to the 4 way bulkhead on the firewall.

For the AC lines, I was thinking about using a 6AN and a 10 AN 90 degree bulkhead fittings (something like this http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AER-FBM2795/) for the high and low pressure AC lines as shown in the higher locations below, with short lines over to the Copmac unit.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/bulkheadlocations-1.jpg

Comments (other than the fittings will cost more than the AC)?

[dhutton]

I would be worried about all those unions giving more chances for a leak. I would try to use one hose all the way. VA sells some 5/8 inch grommets that you could run the hoses through. If you use the Aeroquip lines you could also use the grommets at the fan motor outlet and avoid the bulkhead connectors there too. Fewer connections means fewer leaks in my mind.

[Mkelcy]

I would be worried about all those unions giving more chances for a leak. I would try to use one hose all the way. VA sells some 5/8 inch grommets that you could run the hoses through. If you use the Aeroquip lines you could also use the grommets at the fan motor outlet and avoid the bulkhead connectors there too. Fewer connections means fewer leaks in my mind.

I agree with the more connections means more chances for leaks concept. Both heater and one of the AC lines are 10AN, so 5/8" ID and probably at least 7/8" OD. I'd prefer to use hose and grommets, but I also need to seal the cowl plenum for air leaks, and then I need to get the hose (and the hose fittings) through the grommets. As you can tell, I'm very much on the fence about this. Thanks for your input, it gives me more to think about, particularly since I was thinking to myself as I was posting, "Boy, that's a lot of fittings!"

[CarlC]

Mike, I've not done one like this before, so my suggestion may be way out in the loonie zone. I too would require a single hose. No bulkhead connectors.

If you cannot see where the hoses pass through, since they are way up under the fender, what about using a removable split plate? For example, if all of the hoses were aligned vertically, fabricate a split plate so that the grommet holes in the plate are on the vertical centerline of the hoses. With this the hoses could be removed individually to repair (my Achilles heel for builds) while still maintaining a reasonably clean look.

So.....

1) Layout the hoses in the necessary pattern to fit in the allotted area. Hopefully on a single vertical line.

2) Transfer the pattern to a the split plate. Allow sufficient room around the perimeter for your fastener of choice (I'd look hard a flush-mount Phillips aircraft fastener.) Drill the holes for the fasteners.

3) Cut the split plate in 1/2, with the cut line through the center of the hole pattern.

4) Mount the split plate on a piece of wood. Drill pilot holes on the split where the hoses pass through. Finish with the appropriate hole saws or mill cutter to fit your grommet.

5) Cut an appropriately smaller hole in the firewall to fit the plate. Use J-nuts, weld nuts onto the firewall, etc. to be able to mount the split plate.

Or something along those lines. With a bit of time finishing and a small amount of sealant or foam, I think it could be done quite well.

[Mkelcy]

Mike, I've not done one like this before, so my suggestion may be way out in the loonie zone. I too would require a single hose. No bulkhead connectors.

If you cannot see where the hoses pass through, since they are way up under the fender, what about using a removable split plate? For example, if all of the hoses were aligned vertically, fabricate a split plate so that the grommet holes in the plate are on the vertical centerline of the hoses. With this the hoses could be removed individually to repair (my Achilles heel for builds) while still maintaining a reasonably clean look.

So.....

1) Layout the hoses in the necessary pattern to fit in the allotted area. Hopefully on a single vertical line.

2) Transfer the pattern to a the split plate. Allow sufficient room around the perimeter for your fastener of choice (I'd look hard a flush-mount Phillips aircraft fastener.) Drill the holes for the fasteners.

3) Cut the split plate in 1/2, with the cut line through the center of the hole pattern.

4) Mount the split plate on a piece of wood. Drill pilot holes on the split where the hoses pass through. Finish with the appropriate hole saws or mill cutter to fit your grommet.

5) Cut an appropriately smaller hole in the firewall to fit the plate. Use J-nuts, weld nuts onto the firewall, etc. to be able to mount the split plate.

Or something along those lines. With a bit of time finishing and a small amount of sealant or foam, I think it could be done quite well.

That's a good idea. I'll have to look at the area I'm dealing with to see if something like this might work. I really don't like the idea of all the fittings, and came here looking for better ideas. It's working! Thanks

[Mkelcy]

It's funny how when you sit back for a moment you see what's right in front of you. I was going back over the thread and looked at the pictures again of the under dash area. What do I see, but the hole (that I'd have to plug up because it's no longer needed with the VA setup) from the cowl air plenum to the interior of the car.

You'll see what I'm talking about in the picture below:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[Mkelcy]

Well, as they say in the NFL, "on further review" the large hole won't work. It's too far to the rear of the car relative to the hookups on the Compac unit. The test coolant hose I tried crimped trying to make the turn. I'll go to plan "B" and copy what LanceW did with his '69, using a vertical 4 way manifold with 90 degree fittings on the engine side so they immediately disappear up behind the fender.

[Lance-W]

The way I did it becomes very tight and busy under the dash. I'd mount my bulkhead fitting farther from the edge of the VA unit if I was to do it again. It's VERY busy where the hoses try to attach to the VA unit and then route to the bulkhead fitting. Yes, You're right the fittings are going to cost a fortune but they sure are easy to use and they look nice too. I think there's 18 fittings total. They're roughly $25 a pop.

[Lance-W]

You can run them upward into the area under the cowl grill and thru the firewall behind the fender if you want. That's where I ran the two giant LS wiring bundles to the ECU I mounted above the glove box. You can't see them at all after you put the cowl grill on......

[Lance-W]

You can see the entry point thru the firewall here. Close to where the old blower hole was.......

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[Mkelcy]

Now I'm thinking of running all the lines through grommets using the Aeroquip E-Z Clip system for the AC lines. You can make the lines up yourself: so run the hoses through the grommets, then intall the fittings.

Lance, it's funny I had the picture you posted open in another window before I saw it here.

[Lance-W]

If you ran each line through it's own grommet you could probably use the ones I did. Not saying they're better than the EZ clip ones but at this point putting them together is a no brainer. The fittings I used have an o-ring on them and the mating interface is guided together. Hard to explain without having one in your hand. I don't think there's much chance of a leak. I've had zero leaks so far.

[Mkelcy]

Did you use braided steel lines in the interior? Any condensation issues? I was hoping that the non-metallic outer skin of the E-Z Clip hose might cut down on condensation and also make the AC slightly more efficient.

[Lance-W]

Yes I used braided on the inside for the AC. I used rubber on the inside for the heater lines. I have not noticed any condensation. But then I've only used the AC a few times. I prefer to drive with the windows down unless it gets crazy hot outside. You could always wrap whatever you use. I actually covered the lines with black shrinkwrap on the inside of the car to disguise them a bit. They all hang down in view above the passengers feet.

[Mkelcy]

Yes I used braided on the inside for the AC. I used rubber on the inside for the heater lines. I have not noticed any condensation. But then I've only used the AC a few times. I prefer to drive with the windows down unless it gets crazy hot outside. You could always wrap whatever you use. I actually covered the lines with black shrinkwrap on the inside of the car to disguise them a bit. They all hang down in view above the passengers feet.

Whose bulkhead manifold did you use and did it have nipples or threaded fittings for the heater hoses inside the car?

[Lance-W]

Vintage air. It has threaded "ac type / o-ring" interfaces on both sides of the firewall. The VA kit I bought came with adapters for the heater hoses.

[Lance-W]

Bottom left on the page here.

http://www.vintageair.com/catalog09/09%20VintageAir%20Catalog%2065.pdf

[Mkelcy]

After a lot of thinking and internet searching, I've decided to run one piece hoses for the AC and heater, installed through grommets in the firewall (near the top of the firewall where the old heater blower motor was mounted) and the interior sheet metal (from the cowl air plenum to the interior of the car). Running one piece lines pretty much requires that I use an AC hose/fitting system that can be assembled at home.

Although not the prettiest fittings, I went with the Aeroquip E-Z Clip system and compatible hose, primarily because the bend radius for the GH134 hose is about half that of the comparable Aeroquip braided stainless steel hose. The smaller bend radius should make the install easier as I need to snake the hoses through the tulip and the interior sheet metal. I'm locating the hoses where they will be out of sight except for final runs to the heater connections at the engine and the AC connections at the compressor and drier.

The GH134 hose: http://www.aeroquip.cc/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=8282 (http://www.aeroquip.cc/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=8282)

The comparable braided hose: http://www.aeroquip.cc/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=3031 (http://www.aeroquip.cc/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=3031)

The not so lovely fittings: http://www.eatonhydraulics.com/products/pdfs/fc/A-HC-TI-0001-E.pdf (http://www.eatonhydraulics.com/products/pdfs/fc/A-HC-TI-0001-E.pdf)

Once I get the hose here, I'll measure it to see what the OD is (yes, I know it's in the chart; I like to confirm things) and then order up some grommets with a matching ID, as well as some sheet metal punches matching the grommet ODs. I could drill, but I want clean holes and the punches do a nice job.

Other than worrying about the HVAC hookups and line routing, I've been installing Damplifier Pro on the inside of the firewall, including the area behind the cowl and the underside of the dash. I was worried about how well the Damplifier Pro would adhere to the rough Lizard Skin surface - not to worry, I don't think it will ever come off.

This is being built as a long haul, Pro-touring car, so interior noise control is pretty important.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0363y-1.jpg

I'm trying to be careful not to install the Damplifier Pro where I may need to drill, cut, etc. as the stuff really messes up the cutting edges of tools. Ultimately I'm going to do the entire floor, the doors and at least the floor of the trunk with the Damplifier Pro and Luxury Liner Pro, while the roof will get Damplifier Pro and then Second Skin's Heat Wave Pro.

I've also reinstalled and torqued to spec the subframe, the front suspension including coilovers, the brake rotors and the steering rack. The front end still needs brake calipers and the sway bar. I had the steering arms and sway bar arms powder coated.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0374b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0375nt-1.jpg

The front shocks are some single adjustable QA1's I had lying around (don't ask me how that happens) with 450 lb./in. Eibach springs. By way of comparison, I use 650 lb./in. springs in my stock subframed '68. I expect to use a lot more sway bar in this car than in my driver '68.

The rear suspension and brakes are also in and torqued, including coilovers. The subframe, rear end housing and all the links were powder coated. I painted the two cross members and the link brackets. Those are Wilwood brakes with the internal parking brake. I'm using red Z06 calipers on the front, so hopefully the colors are reasonably close.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0367he-1.jpg

I'm running some corrugated plastic wiring harness cover over the shock reservoir hoses, mostly as a tattle tale to detect rubbing. I left it off the passenger side so your could see what the stock hose looks like.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0368-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0372vm-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0373f-1.jpg


The rear springs are Eibach 200 lb./in. with custom valved, double adjustable remote reservoir AFCO M2 shocks. The spring rates are based on what Bad Penny is using as well as Payton King's suggestions. I haven't made any attempt to set spring preload yet.

The reservoirs are mounted in DSE mounts made for this purpose. Just to illustrate how time consumming all this can be, I spent about an hour reseraching zero pressue loss schrader valve chucks to make sure I had enough room to get a hose on the shock reservoirs if I needed to adjust the pressue.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0369v-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0370j-1.jpg

I can't get a good picture of the overall car while it's on the lift, but these will give you some idea of the color:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0377t-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/11/img0378io-1.jpg

I keep having to remind myself that this is a marathon, not a sprint.

[BuddyP]

Beautiful! Fabulous build, I can only hope my '68 comes out this nice. Love the color, I plan on silver buy may have to make it a darker silver.

[HotRod47]

WOW...... Really nice car!!

[406 Q-ship]

Damn I missed your build thread Mike. Another Camaro that makes me have to step up my game to run with.....:enguard:

[CarlC]

Is there sufficient room to run a tailpipe through the 3-link crossbar relief? It looks pretty tight where around the shock reservoir hose fitting.

[Mkelcy]

Is there sufficient room to run a tailpipe through the 3-link crossbar relief? It looks pretty tight where around the shock reservoir hose fitting.

Good question. I'll have to check, but I think I can rotate the shocks 180 degrees.

[Lance-W]

Is there sufficient room to run a tailpipe through the 3-link crossbar relief? It looks pretty tight where around the shock reservoir hose fitting.

Even if the hose fitting wasn't there it'd be too close to that shock with the exhaust pipe heat. Your just not going to be able to take advantage of that notch with the shock mount that close to it.

[Mkelcy]

Even if the hose fitting wasn't there it'd be too close to that shock with the exhaust pipe heat. Your just not going to be able to take advantage of that notch with the shock mount that close to it.

You may be right. When I get the gas tank up there I expect it to get even tighter. Fortunately, I already planned on a hand built exhaust.

[jtm311]

Nice work Mike looks great.

John

[70ssracer]

great detail. Love your ride and also some ideals to use on mine

[ZuperZport]

Mike -

Your Camaro is looking really good!

Looks like the handling will be tremendous.

Continue to keep us posted.

P.S. As I told you before, your avitar pic always cracks me up. :)

[Damn True]

Looking good Mike!

[tones2SS]

Awesome looking build Mike!!
She'll be a nice car when complete.:1st:

[Mkelcy]

Well some progress.

My shop was a complete pit, what with all of the parts for the project '68, a bunch of parts for my project '67, left over parts from my driver '68, wood working equipment, plumbing stuff, etc., etc., etc. It got so every flat surface was covered by a chronological layer, finding anything involved an archeological dig and there was no floor space with the 4' by 8' work table, table saw, router table, three engines, transmissions, jack stands, trans jack, hoist, parts cleaner, blah, blah, blah.

The only thing that kept me from killing myself out of frustration was that I invested in and installed a wall hung tool storage system so I was at least able to find my tools pretty easily.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0403s-1.jpg

This weekend I finally bit the bullet and stuck the LS1 engine I had sitting in the middle of the shop in the '67 chassis; gave the SBC short block I had sitting in the middle of the shop away, and created a little room. I think I'll be able to dig out pretty well, now that I have enough room to move around.

Here's the LS1 "stored" in the '67. By the way, it fit fine with an Fbody oil pan and mounts that have a single bolt going through the lower hole in the traditional motor mount and the front bottom hole of the adapter plate.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0404s-1.jpg

Back to the '68. I took a look at the rear cross member exhaust notches and the shocks, pictured below.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0400lc-1.jpg

There's clearly no room to rotate the shocks, so I'll just have to work around the issue when it's time for the exhaust. I definitely want the pipes to dump at the back of the rear wheel wells, so there will be some interesting routing.

I hung the pedals a while ago, along with the hydroboost unit and the clutch master cylinder. I had to relieve the clutch master cylinder bracket I purchased at the top to fit the master cylinder. I also used a stock clutch pushrod seal by cutting the end off and fitting it around the clutch master. You can see it in the second picture below.

The master cylinder (I think it's a McLeod unit, I picked it up with a T56) was too long for the Camaro, so I threaded a die on the shaft, double nutted it, and cut new threads as far down as I could. Then I shortened the shaft and used a clevis I picked up from McMaster Carr (they have all the money Summit Racing hasn't gotten).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0401-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0402l-1.jpg

I finally tackled the job I was most concerned with - the HVAC line routing. As I mentioned, I decided to run single uninterrupted lines for the heater and the AC, so I opted for the Aeroquip E-Z Clip system and compatible the "matching" GH134 hose. I got the hose, confirmed the OD sizes and ordered some grommets to fit the three hose sizes (heater, AC return and AC supply).

I laid out the pattern for the firewall first and drilled it, installed the grommets, fed the AC supply hose through and then started locating the holes to pass the hoses from the cowl plenum into the interior of the car.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

On the interior my original plan had been to have the AC lines come in above the AC unit, but the bend would have been too much for the return line. I ended up with the AC supply line coming in as I'd planned, and then put the two heater hose lines and the AC return line much more over toward the side of the car, like this:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/12/img0398u-1.jpg

It turned out that it was easist to feed the lines from the fire wall into the plenum area, start them through the grommets, and then feed through firewall, feed through grommets until I had enough length inside the car. I used water to lube the AC hoses and white grease to lube the heater hoses. All in all, it was easier than I expected. It also turns out that there are several layers of sheet metal coming together in this area, so you need to scope it out pretty carefully. I used drill mounted hole saws, which did an amazingly good job cutting the holes for the grommets.

I used this routing because I just couldn't bring myself to mess with the sealing of the kick panel to the cowl, since there's potentially so much water flow through that area.

While I was contemplating the HVAC system, I did a little work on the fuel system. I have a Rock Valley tank for the car, which I finally pulled out and set up with the gauge sender. I'll put a connector on it for the sender and the fuel pump, wax it, and then install it.

In the meantime, maybe I can continue to dig the poor shop out . . . .

[Lance-W]

Heads up on the gas tank. I don't know which one you have width wise. I have the Rick's "standard" width non mini-tubbed tank (I wanted the capacity). I clipped the front corners for clearance with the exhaust. I have 3" exhaust and it's very close. Without clipping the tank it wouldn't have fit.

[Mkelcy]

Heads up on the gas tank. I don't know which one you have width wise. I have the Rick's "standard" width non mini-tubbed tank (I wanted the capacity). I clipped the front corners for clearance with the exhaust. I have 3" exhaust and it's very close. Without clipping the tank it wouldn't have fit.

Yes, I'm hopeful because I've got a tank for a minitubbed car, but I wouldn't be surprised if there are issues. After reading all the posts about how poorly these tanks do on a track, I might end up going in a different direction, but have no idea what that direction might be.

[Lance-W]

Yes, I'm hopeful because I've got a tank for a minitubbed car, but I wouldn't be surprised if there are issues. After reading all the posts about how poorly these tanks do on a track, I might end up going in a different direction, but have no idea what that direction might be.

Yup, In hindsight I would have made alot of changes to the way the inside is setup after knowing how what I have performs. Besides the starvation problems the fuel gauge in mine changes about 1/2 tank in it's reading just by stopping at a stop light. Next time I'll make my own!

[ratmotorred511]

Very cool project looks like it's coming along well:woot:

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Awesome project Mike. We're pretty close, so I might come by and see that AC set up!

(or borrow your backyard lift :) )

Ron

[Fesler built]

where did all the pictures go

[tankhunter]

looks good

[Mkelcy]

Well, doing lots of work now that doesn't make for good pictures.

I finished the HVAC install and the heat/sound insulation for the firewall. Let me tell you, it's tight up there. I'm pretty pleased with how the HVAC plumbing has turned out. It should be completely out of sight when the fenders are installed. I've ordered Infinity 4" plate speakers for the kick panels. When I get them, I'll cut the kick panels, install and wire the speakers and install the kick panels into the car. Then I can do things like emergency brake pedal and dimmer switch.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0591i-1.jpg

I mocked up the DSE/Rock Valley EFI fuel tank with the stainless steel straps, I had to manufacture a tool to get the straps up to the bolts in the car - a piece of angle aluminum, notched to allow for wrench clearance clamped to a jack stand to force the straps onto the anchors in the car. I've marked the break points on the straps (the black lines in the picture) where they go around the tank, then I'll drop the tank for plumbing and wiring and bend the straps. Hopefully, they'll go in easier next time.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0596m-1.jpg

I'm starting to do trim, door and window hardware, some weather stripping and so on - changing it up to keep it interesting but trying to press ahead.

I installed the tailights, trunk lock, trunk springs and the billet fuel cap. The tail lights are actually LED lights. I ordered repro light sockets that the LED's plug into. The white sockets I got were complete trash - they didn't so much snap in as press in waiting for the slightest bump to fall out. If you're ordering sockets, make sure they're black like the originals rather than the white POS's.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0588j-1.jpg

The billet gas cap is Larry's piece, manufactured by Ride Tech. I haven't done more than install the billet fuel filler and cap in the car. I need to pull the tank, plumb and wire it and then complete the gas cap install. I did notice that the filler neck is significantly not centered in the hole through the trunk.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0595b-1.jpg

I may have to relieve the trunk pan to avoid abrading the hose that connects the cap to the tank. I also think plumbing all this through the stock rubber seal tube may prove interesting.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0589j-1.jpg

It's also amazing how bad the repro sheetmetal is in so many ways. My drivers rear quarter is repro metal. In addition to having fitment issues, which I expected, I spent about 45 minutes to an hour putting the weather stripping in the trunk area. Of that time, about five minutes was spent installing the weather stripping in all the stock locations and the straight runs on the repro metal, and the balance of the time was getting the weather stripping around the upper and lower corners of the driver's side quarter panel. The weather stripping channel is simply too small, and required a lot of patient prodding to get the weather stripping in. I used the Classic Industries latex weather stripping, and like it a lot.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0590n-1.jpg

I'm also working on the doors. I threw some Damplifier Pro on the outer skin, and then installed the outer handles and the window tracks. Today was a lot of time cleaning and lubing door locks, repairing one of them, fitting them into the doors with the inner handles and confirming that the locking/unlocking functions all work. I'll be using Electric Life power windows, so I'll be interested to so how that goes. I'll need to power the windows to get them and the weather stripping adjusted.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/03/img0594h-1.jpg

Other than that, I'm planning the ISIS install, still looking for front seats and a solution for the rear seating area, and ordering all these GD'd little pieces that cost an arm and a leg.

Once I get the side windows in and adjusted, fit the Marquez headliner and feel like I'm in good shape on the interior, I'll probably throw the engine in, fix the trans cross-member and start working on the engine and chassis wiring.

[CruizinKev]

car looks awesome so far! keep up good work :twothumbs

[Motown 454]

Great work Mike it looks awesome. The Va install was very informative,that will be a long way off for me but your build will be a lot of help. I'm using the electric life power windows too so you'll answer a lot of my questions on that too. Please keep the updates coming. Thanks

[CarlC]

Nice Mike! It is hard to imagine how much time the little thing take to get done correctly. In the end, you will thank yourself for doing it right.

[Damn True]

Looking good Mike.

Boy the shape of that trunk seal is a lot different from the OE as well.

[Rybar]

Nice work, all of these details take up alot of time, but worth it in the end.

I remember trying to bolt up my Ricks tank and had the same "fun" with the stainless straps. lol

[soundqdoug]

I really like this build. The BMW color is very unique...way to take a successful risk!

[Rod]

looks Awesome !! :throw: makes me want to do more to mine!

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Any updates Mike?

[Steve1968LS2]

I can't wait to see this car done.. It's the only car I know of running the exact same suspension systems as Penny. Considering both companies are out of business we should remain an exclusive club. lol

Lookin' good Mike!

[Gitter Dun]

Wow, first time to this thread and read the whole thing, congratulations, what a beautiful car, and great narration and pic's too!!

[Mkelcy]

I've been chipping away at the car slowly but surely. I spent a weekend installing the driver's side door glass, outer trim, window weather stripping, the Electric Life window lift and the braided steel wire loom for the wiring from the car into the door. After several trips to the Fisher Body manual I finally figured out the window lift linkage. Fortunately I bagged and tagged pretty well when I disassembled the car, so finding hardware hasn't been an issue.

Adjusting the window with the Electric Life power regulator meant I needed to power the lift in order to run the window up and down to make my adjustments. I started off using a battery and manually reversing the leads to run the window up and down as I was adjusting it. That got old very quickly, and really slowed the process down. So I spent about an hour with the Electric Life wiring diagram (utterly confusing) and then got out the trusty multi-meter and one power window switch to see if I could jury rig the switch. Once I figured out how they use the switch to reverse the power to the motor, I made up a little wiring harness and it was clear sailing - at least as far as running the window up and down went.

I installed the window to make sure the area in which the wire loom would go was clear, pulled the window out, and then tried to drill the door and car body. I planned on drilling a small pilot hole from the outside of the door to locate the dimple, and then drill the hole from inside the door. Unfortunately no drill bit I had was short enough to get into the available space, even with a right angle drive drill. Fortunately, I have a cheap set of drill bits. Put a bit in the vise, put on the safety glasses, whack it with the BFH, and instant short drill bit. The braided wiring loom fought hard not to make the required bend, and installing the locking collars with an allen key unable to see what I was doing while making sure the collar was tight on both side of the sheet metal was an exercise designed to teach patience.

Once I got the window roughly adjusted, I installed Classic Industries latex weather stripping (I like it a lot) and then did the final adjustments on the window. This is a pretty critical step because I REALLY want to minimize wind noise, and the window-to-weather-strip-seal is crucial. I'm pretty happy with it as it sits now, but I'll continue to check it out and perhaps even drive the car before I button up the doors with sound insulation.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0631r-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0630r-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

In addition to my bald head, you can see the bolt for the front center link mount at the rear of the driveshaft tunnel. I haven't even thought about what I want to do in this area yet, other than knowing that I'll never carry passengers back there.

After reading on this board the issues folks have had with the Electric Life power windows, and after figuring out how long the power runs are in the Electric Life harness, I've decided to make my own harness. While I was doing the window install on the driver's side, the Electric Life motor powered the window up strongly, sealing very well against the new weather stripping. However, that was using short, 12-14 gauge wiring directly from a battery. I'm going to try to do something similar with the permanent wiring, I'll have 4 switches - one for each window - mounted on a custom center console that will get power over a 10-12 gauge feed and then run a 12 gauge feed from the switch out to the window motors. I'm hopeful that the issues people have been having are caused by the extreme length of the Electric Life harness and the voltage drop given the current demand and the (relatively) small gauge of the wiring in the Electric Life harness.

I installed the rear bumper and that turned out to be another trial and error process. I picked up a re-chromed bumper from Bumper Boyz in LA and had the five bumper brackets powder coated satin black. I assembled the brackets to the bumper and then the bumper and brackets to the car. It all went together well and the brackets seemed designed to settle into the crease of the bumper but for the life of me I couldn't get the bumper level, front to rear.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0696bh-1.jpg

After installing, removing, filing the bumper bolt holes and reinstalling the bumper about 5 times (each time painting the filed surfaces, making sure I had caulk around all the bolt holes and fearful that I was going to scratch the paint), I finally gave up and posted for help on Camaros.net. I quickly got a response back suggesting that I needed to adjust the brackets at the front of the short section of bumper that wraps the quarter to raise the front end of the bumper. I did that, installed it once more and called it good.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

I got a set of Stewart Warner gauges for the car quite a while ago. I liked them primarily because you could get a tach that was 0-8,000 rpm. (Most of the Autometer tachs are 0-10,000 rpm, and it just bugs me.) I slipped the Autometer tach and speedometer in my blue '68 in from the front of the instrument carrier, relieved the factory metal piece (the green piece in the picture below) to fit around the gauges and used the Autometer gauge retention bars to hold them in. The SW's ended up being a much cleaner and easier install. I simply put them into the instrument carrier from the back and used the factory metal piece to hold them in.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0546af-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0714e-1.jpg

You can see the turn signal indicators at the top of the two nacells, one of the side lamps will be an ECU code light, and I'm still undecided what I'll use the other one for. As you can see, I still need to clean up and repaint the instrument carrier.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0547ub-1.jpg

And here's a rear shot with some of the wiring done:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0716i-1.jpg

The SW speedometer uses an external calibration switch, so that's what the second smaller connector is from the left hand gauge.

I've been working on the kick panel area - installing Infinity Kappa 462.9cfp speakers into the kick panels, and running wires for the speakers, the power windows and the door jamb courtesy light switches out to where I can hook them up when the time comes. I used one of the many templates out there to cut speaker holes in new kick panels, mounted the speakers from the front and decided that I didn't like how far the speakers and grills stuck out from the surface of the kick panel. So I mounted the speakers on the back surface of the kick panel, put the speaker grill on the front and then epoxied a foam speaker cover over the back of the speaker to protect it from water.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0676x-1.jpg

I test fit everything and, while tight, it all goes together well.

In my last update, I'd installed the Damplifier Pro on the fire wall, ran the HVAC lines and installed the AC box. When I installed the EZ-clip fitting on the high pressure line and then pulled it the last 1/2 inch to hook it up to the AC case, one side the grommet in the cabin that protected the line came out and there was no way to reach it with the sound insulation installed. I debated whether to take it all out again, trying to convince myself that the line would never vibrate enough for it to be damaged, but fate decided the issue for me.

About two weeks ago, I noticed that some of the Damplifier Pro I'd installed on the upper portion of the firewall was coming loose, and within a few days the balance of the Damplifier Pro that was essentially hanging from the inside top of the cowl area came down (some of it with help from me).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0701kd-1.jpg

The Damplifier Pro installed on the vertical surfaces seemed fine. I checked what the cause might be with Second Skin and they concluded that I'd allowed the contact cement to dry too much before mating the glued surfaces. Apparently the 60-90 seconds for the contact cement is pretty critical, and when you're spraying the inside of the car and the piece to be glued, it's easy to go over the 90 seconds on one of the two sides. The contact cement adhered well to the two surfaces, but didn't seem to hold one to the other in some places. Because I had to pull some of the hanging Damplifier Pro down, I'm hoping that it's just a matter of timing it more carefully. If the glue continues to fail, I'll use some of the pre-glued Dynamat foam product on the problematic surfaces.

I've been pondering my electrical wiring for some time now. I got in on the first ISIS group buy and sprung for a 3 Powercell setup - one for the engine bay, one for the cabin and one for the trunk area. Briefly, the ISIS system has a Mastercell with a series of inputs that are triggered by connecting them to ground. When the Mastercell inputs are triggered, they are programmed to activate an output on up to two Powercells. The Mastercell can be programmed to provide, for example, a patterned output for a turn signal. The system is very flexible and can also provide good anti-theft security. The only downside (if you want to call it that) is that the maximum safe amperage you can draw from a single Powercell output is 25 amps, and they don't recommend "ganging" outputs for higher amperage needs.

In my case, the Vintage Air wiring harness has a 30 amp circuit breaker, the power window harness has a 30 amp fuse, the DSE wipers have a 30 amp fuse and the radiator fan will surely draw more than 25 amps. After debating whether I could get away with powering these items from the Powercells, I decided to play it safe and go with relays.

I found a nice little four relay setup from Auto Rod Controls (through Summit) that has 4 - forty amp relays mounted on a printed circuit board, with a provision for fusing the 12v switched input to each relay if you want.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0711g-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0712ag-1.jpg

I also purchased one of Joe Lutz's glove box inserts (https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62277 (https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62277) - nice piece) to mount my ISIS Mastercell and interior Powercell. I mounted the Mastercell and the cabin Powercell on the insert and did a test fit to see how it would all work.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0708rj-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0709fm-1.jpg

My plan is as follows: the engine bay Powercell will directly power the turn signals, parking lights and side markers, headlight low beam, headlight high beam, horns and provide the Ignition 12v power to the ECU. I'll install a set of relays to provide power to the fans, the DSE wipers, the power windows and the AC.

The cabin Powercell will directly power the turn signal indicators, the high beam indicator, the radio, provide ignition only power to the gauges, provide always hot power to the courtesy lights and radio memory and provide accessory power to the power seats and two auxiliary power outlets.

The rear Powercell will directly trigger the starter solenoid, power the turn signals, parking lights, side markers and license plate light, the brake lights, the backup lights and a relay to power the radio power amplifier.

All of this requires some reprogramming of the Mastercell and Powercells. I'm extremely pleased to report that I sent an email to ISIS at about 9:30 California time last evening, and had the revised programming in hand by 2:00 in the afternoon today. Mike Weber at ISIS was very helpful, caught an error in my plans and even sent me an Assembly Instruction Manual schematic confirming his advise. He answered all my emails very promptly. I couldn't be more pleased or impressed with the customer service.

As mentioned I'll be using a trunk mounted battery and starter solenoid. I'll run a 0/1 cable to the starter, and a fused 4 gauge cable up to (I think) the driver's side of the radiator core support to provide power for the ECU, engine bay and cabin Powercells and the ganged relays.

Finally, I've been trying to resist the temptation to drop the motor in the car, but after trying to figure out the physical locations for the various electronic items in the car, I think I need to get the motor in and start to figure out engine wiring harness runs, ECU location and the like.

Sorry for the disjointed writeup - but it pretty much reflects my disjointed work on the car.

[Motown 454]

Very interesting write up Mike, I enjoyed reading it. Nice work.

[Roadbuster]

Looking good Mike! Nice find with the relays!
Jon

[BA.]

Ditto! Nice going with those relays man, that's good planning.

I wasn't aware of the Electric Life issues some have had so thanks for bringing that up. I'll be on the look-out for it and try to plan around it when I do mine. :)

[Mkelcy]

Well, I've decided to bite the bullet and install the engine. I'm just not going to be able to figure out the wiring, cable runs, etc. without knowing where all the engine wiring is going to go. I moved all the crap in the garage that was in front of the engine out of the way and rolled it out to the shop. (I'd stored it on a furniture dolly to make this step pretty easy. I'll need to fill the space formerly occupied by the engine before the wife reclaims it.) A few minutes removing the lag bolts securing the crate, and popping open the front end to slide the crate out of the way and voilà - 480 horsepower of LS3 beauty:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0717ky-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

I pulled the flex plate and ordered a pilot bearing that won't be here until Tuesday. I'll probably wait to install the pilot bearing before hanging the engine in the car.

When I test fit an LS1 in the car, I barely had clearance over the steering rack and had about 1.5" between the passenger side head and the fire wall. The F-body pan on the test LS1 was a bit shallower than the Corvette pan fitted to the LS3, but I'd like to avoid changing oil pans on the LS3.

LS1 Fbody pan showing depth of pan and how close it is to the rack

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/04/balancetubeoilpan-1.jpg

LS3 Pan is a little deeper

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0723u-1.jpg

I'm going to try placing the LS3 a little farther back in the car and a touch higher. That's accomplished with a combination of different LSx adapter plates and the older style motor mounts.

I originally test fit the LS1 using Autokraft adapter plates (the aluminum plates in the picture below).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0721jg-1.jpg

In the picture, the black adapter plate is from Doug's (Pertronix) and the aluminum plate is the Autokraft adapter I used for the test fit. If you look at the two adapter plates there's a triangular pattern of small holes in the Doug's plate and a similar triangular pattern of the two studs and a small hole in the Autokraft plate. The triangular pattern is the mounting point for the traditional motor mount and is where the mount bolts to the chassis. The four bolt hole pattern is where the adapter plate bolts to the LSx engine. As you can see by comparing the relative position of the triangular and rectangular patterns in the two plates, the Autokraft plates locate the engine about 1" farther forward than the Doug's plate. The Doug's plate gives you two fore-aft mounting points, while the Hooker plate shown below with the Doug's plate gives you just one, which is the same as the more rearward position on the Doug's plate.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0719kl-1.jpg

Both the Hooker and Doug's plates also raise the engine slightly as compared to the Autokraft plates.
The second way in which I hope to gain a little more room for the LS3 pan is to use "tall-wide" motor mounts rather than the "short-narrow" mounts I used for the test fit. The picture below shows the difference:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

So engine in probably next weekend.

By the way, the "fitment" LS1 has since been rebuilt with an LS2 factory crank, LS2 floating pin rods, forged Mahle pistons and a pretty healthy cam (227/231 .614/.617" 113LSA) and will get an LS6 intake, TFS 215 CNC'd heads, an LS2 MAF and a ported LS6 throttle body before it's slipped into the '67.

[Motown 454]

How do you think this will affect your header fitment? Was there a lot of room before ?

[Mkelcy]

How do you think this will affect your header fitment? Was the a lot of room before ?

The only issues I can think of might be the steering shaft down to the steering rack or header interference with the fire wall.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/passengerssideheadtofir-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

I think I'll be okay, and if nothing else I can use the intermediate positon on the Doug's adapter plates. If all else fails, I've got the original Fbody oil pan as well as an Autokraft pan sitting around.

[Motown 454]

You should be able to get one of those setups to fit. The car looks great nice work.

[nor_cal_67rs]

Sweet build!!! I cant wait to see this machine on the ground...What do the Stewart Warner gauges look like at night do you have any pictures?

I agree with you on the whole 10k RPM tachs, I'm not planning on an engine that spins that many rpms :revto9k: ... I was looking for a 5" tach that read 8K~ish RPMS and Stewart Warner gauges are always nice

[Mkelcy]

Well, I had to review my own build thread to see where I'd stopped writing. I feel like I'm not making any progress, but then it seems I do take a couple of steps forward from time to time.

In my last post, I'd detailed how the Luxury Liner Pro had come off the under side of the cowl and dash. I decided to move on to something else while I considered what to do with the LLP.

One of the perverse "benefits" of storing the car outside during the build is that you get to see what rusts. Over the winter with all the rain we got, I've found a number of bolts and other pieces that have rusted, including some of the hardware on the rack. I removed the rack, cleaned up the rust and painted it a fairly bright red. It's something I actually want people to notice when the hood's up. You can see the rack in some of the pictures below. While I was at it, I also painted the heads of a lot of the front end hardware.

After painting the rack, I decided I needed to install the engine (LS3 480/376) and Viper T56 transmission to start figuring out my wiring harness layout. Prior to the install I had the headers made by the subframe builder coated "titanium." For the engine install I tried using the most rearward position on the Pertronix plates (SK100) - about 1.0" back and 0.25" up, but the passenger side head ended up too close to the firewall for my taste and the LS3 pan still didn't clear the subframe cross member. So I swapped out the LS3 pan for an AutoKraft pan I had on hand just in case the LS3 pan didn't work and reinstalled the engine with the headers using the more forward mounting position (which is the same as the Hooker plates) - about 0.5" back and 0.25" up relative to the AutoKraft/ATS plates.

Everything went in well, with the exception that the AutoKraft pan uses an oil filter adapter that mounts the oil filter much more outboard than the stock pan. As a result, the cover that routes the oil out of and immediately back into the oil filter adapter wouldn't clear the number 7 header tube.

Here's the adapter and the headers:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/06/img0729cx-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Here's the cover that needs to be bolted to the adapter right where the headers are nearest to the adapter:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/06/img0732tm-1.jpg

and here's the adapter, before machining:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/06/img0731zf-1.jpg

After considering my options, I had the oil filter adapter hogged out between the two sides, so the crossover otherwise provided by the cover is entirely within the oil filter adapter, and had a flat plate made to seal the opening.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/machinedadapter1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/machinedadapter2-1.jpg

I like that the machine shop even angled the end of the plate to match the angle of the oil filter adapter.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/machinedadapter3-1.jpg

Here's the finished product:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/machinedadapter-1.jpg

The rear mounting pad on the Viper T56 is about 1.5" to 2.0" lower from the centerline of the output shaft than on an LS1 T56. As a result, although the location was pretty good without a transmission mount

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/crossmember-1.jpg

I had to cut up and re-weld the transmission cross member in order to lower and move the mount somewhat forward from the position it ended up with when this was a SBC/LS1 T56 build.

I cut out the center of the rectangular tube cross-member and used 0.25" x 2" plate steel to make two legs and a new center section. I'd planned on re-using the original tubular center section, but the added depth had the cross-member about an inch or so below the subframe, which didn't seem like a good idea. I used gussets on the inside of the center section to add vertical strength. If it turns out that's not enough, I'll add gussets on the outside as well. As it is, I can hang from the cross member while it is supporting the engine and transmission and it doesn't deflect, so I'm guessing it's okay.


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

The last thing I did was cut the hole for the shifter and weld the original 4 speed shifter hole back into the transmission tunnel.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/shifterplate-1.jpg

I'm not planning on running a console in this car, so my plan was to try to run an original style 4 speed shifter boot using the stock mounting plate. If that doesn't work, I'll use something from Lokar (probably) and make an adapter plate to adapt the stock mounting plate to the Lokar boot.

So, back to the Luxury Liner Pro.

I reinstalled all of the pieces that had come down, carefully timing the drying time for the adhesive. Unfortunately, a few days later it was once again sagging. So I took it all out (from the under side of the cowl and dash) and installed 0.5" thick Dyna Liner. It's a lighter product and, as a result, seems to adhere well. We'll see how it is in a few days.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/dynaliner3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/dynaliner2-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/dynaliner1-1.jpg

Between reinstalling the LLP and then the Dyna Liner, I installed Second Skin's Damplifier Pro (think DynaMat) and Heat Wave Pro on the roof. The Heat Wave Pro is a 0.5" thick "foil faced, fire retardant heat and noise insulation mat made out of natural fibers" (chopped up fabric). I made paper templates for the front and rear sections and cut the Damplifier Pro and Heat Wave Pro to size. I taped the edges of the Heat Wave Pro (and may have to untape one edge to run the courtesy light wire).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/hwpu-1.jpg

The Heat Wave Pro is a lighter product than the LLP and seems to be adhering well to the roof.

The thermal results are really impressive. As I've mentioned, the car won't fit in the shop, so I keep it on a pad out in the sun when I'm working on it. Here in SoCal with the sun blazing down on the car, it got really hot in there. After the install of the HWP last week, I checked the outside and inside temperatures on the roof of the car just now (11:00 am), with the car pretty much heat soaked. The pictures tell the story:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/outsidetemp-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/insidetemp-1.jpg

I'm pretty certain the HWP will make a big difference in how effective the AC will be.

Here's the engine and front end now:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/engine3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/engine2l-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/engine1p-1.jpg

and passenger side head to fire wall:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/08/headclearance-1.jpg

So, I need to get the paint shop to make up a spray bomb of my body color for the dash and steering column, then paint and install those items; I need to continue to work out the physical wire runs for the ISIS system and re-install the glove box insert for the master and body power cell, plan the engine harness install and so on, and so on, and so on.

[CarlC]

It's coming along well Mike!

[67SSDan]

Ahh, new inspiration for my own build. I dig it man!

Dan

[Motown 454]

Its looking great.

[Rybar]

Looking real good, nice job on the driveline install.

[beyonda68]

Just finished reading this thread. Very informative. Thanks. the car looks great.

[mincharlie]

Keep up the good work!

[Mkelcy]

Tiny little update, not even any pictures.

I test fit the GM front accessories (19155167 - GMPP Accessory Drive System Without A/C - Fits LS2, LS3 & LS7 Engines http://paceperformance.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=248708) and the Kwik AC compressor bracket today in preparation for taking them in for powder coating. Everything lined up well and it was a delight - after all the after market stuff that's taken days to get right - to simply bolt stuff on to the engine and have it all fit, including the Kwik bracket, the way it should with no need to fabricate or alter anything.

After I took everything off again, I spent a good portion of the day smoothing casting flash and other imperfections on the main accessory bracket. I then took the PS pump up to Lee Manufacturing to have the flow reduced (because of the rack) and the pressure increased (because of the hydroboost). They said if that was all I needed, they'd do it while I waited. So $20 and about 8 minutes later, my PS pump is done and ready to go.

On the way back from Lee, I dropped the accessory brackets off at the powder coater for satin black powder coating. (It's great living in SoCal where you can just pop by and get things done.) They should be ready next week. I'll reassemble and take pictures.

My kitchen is a mess right now with ISIS boxes and wiring tools and parts everywhere. (The wife's out of town.) I think I've figured out how I'm going to do the ISIS wiring.

As I've mentioned, I'm putting the Master Cell and body Power Cell on an aluminum chassis (manufactured by a forum member) in the glove box area. The MC has two 32 wire cables and the multiplex cable coming off it, and the body PC has two 6 wire cables, two heavy gauge power wires and the multiplex cable from the MC coming off it and headed to another PC. In addition, I wanted to have a small 4 position terminal strip for "ignition" ground, "accessory" ground, chassis ground and a spare. (All inputs to the MC are ground signals.) So, long story short, there's a lot of wire running around on this chassis and I wasn't sure how to keep it all under control.

My plan is to simply route all of the cables straight out the top or bottom of the chassis, returning those that need to go onto the terminal strip through the chassis. So when you look at the chassis, you'll see the MC, the PC and the wiring routed out by the shortest route. I'll need to shorten the multiplex cable from about 4 feet between the MC and PC connectors to about 6", but that's not an issue.

Finally I need to get the two heavy (10 gauge maybe?) power wires to the PC on the glove box chassis. My plan for those is to run them out of the cabin into the cowl air plenum then through the firewall near the HVAC hoses and then to the radiator core support where I'll mount the ISIS 4 gang fuse box (2 for the body PC and 2 for the front PC). There'll be another 2 fuse box in the trunk for the rear PC.

My plan for this car is long distance cruiser (think SoCal to Maine.) So stock parts and easy servicing are all important. After laying out the GMPP harness and being initially disappointed that I either pull the engine to cut a pass-through into the cabin to hide all the wiring or stick the ECU out in the open, I've come around to liking the idea of the ECU being mounted in the engine compartment.

I'll mount the ECU and the rather large fuse box for the GMPP harness on a piece of either powder coated sheet metal or heavy plexiglass side by side on the fender. You'll see the big main portion of the harness and the harness to the fuse box coming from the engine to the passenger side fender, but I'm not sure that bothers me.

So, pictures with the next update as the front of the engine and the wiring starts to come together.

[Motown 454]

Nice progress. Let me know when you make that trip to Maine so when you go by Mass. I can see the car. lol

[LV42DAY]

i love the project name. its even better then mine, lol

[Mkelcy]

Got a little more work done today. I picked everything up from the powder coater and put the accessory drive back on the engine. I'm pretty pleased with what will turn out to be a fairly inexpensive set-up.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0773ki-1.jpg

Remember this is a long haul cruiser, so easy serviceability and ready availability of parts is key. The GMPP front drive w/o AC was about $600, I just picked up a Sanden compressor for about $210, and the powder coating was about $150. With the Kwik bracket, the hardware, the powder coating and the modification of the steering pump, I'll be around $1,200 for the complete accessory drive.

I like the looks of the Kwik AC compressor brackets, but the hardware (as you can see) was a very bright silver - not my taste. So a little time on the McMaster-Carr site and an obscene (for just a few bolts) amount of money later, I have nice black oxide hardware on the way. When the hardware gets here I'll put it all together and post a completed picture.

I'm installing a Gen II Vintage Air system in the car (that I picked up from a member) so I need to piece the balance of the system together - which was the idea. There are a lot of Sanden compressors out there, but the Kwik site actually made some recommendations which I followed. I got the Sanden 4645, which is a truck AC compressor with the biggest displacement of the fixed displacement Sanden compressors. Again, long distance hauler and I don't want to be sweating as I tour.

I also finally figured out how I wanted to run the wiring for the ISIS master cell and the body power cell mounted on the glove box insert. So I drilled my various holes and then had the glove box insert powder coated. I'll work on actually getting it back into the car this weekend, but I'm pretty content with the way it's coming out.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0776a-1.jpg

The little 4 post terminal strip (which I'll straighten when I replace the mounting hardware with prettier socket head bolts) will be a distribution point for chassis ground, ignition ground and accessory ground, with a spare for future needs.

And because I wasn't already spending enough on this project, I ordered one of the Vapor Worx fuel tanks. Having had EFI in my blue '68, I really don't want to worry about fuel starvation when I get to a half tank of gas (although the tank I had built for the blue '68 worked very well and was under $1,000).

[CarlC]

You have to like $20 to get the pump tuned-up. Those guys are great.

Your tank is in the works Mike. Thanks!

[Mkelcy]

I had some time today to continue working on the ISIS install and the front accessory drive.

I bit the bullet and started cutting and crimping connections to install the terminal strip and the multiplex cable that communicates between the master cell and the power cells.

I ran my 4 ignition inputs to the master cell to one pin on the terminal strip and then ran a red wire from that to go out to the ignition switch and other things that are supposed to operate only when the ignition is on - such as the reverse lockout and reverse lights. I ran my 4 accessory inputs to the master cell to another pin on the terminal strip and then ran a pink wire from that to go out to the ignition switch and other things that are supposed to operate when the ignition switch is in the accessory position - such as the parking lights. And I grounded the master cell to a third pin on the terminal strip and then ran a black wire out to go out to the ignition switch as the "power" in and other things that are supposed to operate all the time - such as the horn. One of the nice things about doing my own harness is that I can decide what gets juice when.

I also had to shorten the distance between two connectors on the multiplex cable from about 4' to 6". I cut the wires on each connector so the crimps and heat shrink insulation were staggered along the 6", so the wouldn't make a big bulge in the center of the joined cable.

Finally, I ran the multiplex cable through its access hole in the glove box insert and installed an 8 pin connector so I can make up a cable with the correct length for the run out to the front power cell.

Here's the progress to date:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0777h-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0778x-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0779t-1.jpg

I received the hardware I ordered from McMaster-Carr by mid-morning, so I finished up the install of the front accessory drive.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0780c-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0781u-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0782as-1.jpg

On reflection, I also decided to get the Katech tensioner pulley, which is adjusted and then locked down rather than spring loaded. When I get the Katech tensioner, which is also black, I'll get a belt and finish the install.

Next jobs, in no particular order, are: run the power cables for the power cell on the glove box insert; install the glove box insert in the car; paint, reassemble and install the steering column; repair a ding in the instrument cluster and paint it; adjust the passenger side windows' and so on.

One thing I'll also do is install the kick panels. I had them installed it seems like six months ago when I realized that I couldn't install the glove box insert with the Vintage Air evaporator unit in, and I couldn't remove the Vintage Air evaporator unit without removing the kick panel and I couldn't install the glove box insert without figuring out all the wiring I've been doing. So those kick panels have been haunting me for a long time. When I get the passenger side kick panel in, it will actually feel like I'm moving ahead again.

[Damn True]

Lookin good Mike!

[parsonsj]

Agreed. I like the wiring "box". Very nice.

jp

[Kybosh]

just read through the entire build so far, incredible work. The subtle touches and attention to detail is really making this something special. Keep it up. Looking forward to seeing it completed.

[Flash68]

Jesus. Another highly-detailed build thread all done at home. Very impressive and looking great!

[Mkelcy]

From my last update: "Next jobs, in no particular order, are: run the power cables for the power cell on the glove box insert; install the glove box insert in the car; paint, reassemble and install the steering column; repair a ding in the instrument cluster and paint it; adjust the passenger side windows and so on."

Thursday was paint day for the gauge cluster and steering column components.

I fixed some big divots on the rim of the two gauge housings, hit the inside of both nacelles with flat black, masked it all off, painted it to match the exterior color and then hit it with some flat clear.

This is what I started with:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/05/img0714e-1.jpg

and this is where I ended up:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0794v-1.jpg

There are left and right turn signals at the center top of each side, the high beam indicator is in the usual place, the indicator on the left side of the left nacelle will be for an engine warning light from the LS3's ECU and the indicator on the right side of the right nacelle is tentatively a parking brake warning light, but if I need it for anything else I'd change it, I don't actually need a warning light for the parking brake.

Here's the back side showing the final wiring:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0795v-1.jpg

Because the wires going to the various lamps are so small, I zip tied the harness for the lamps to the center screw holding the gauges in for strain relief.

I also ran the power leads for the ISIS body power cell from the interior into the plenum and then out through the firewall below the HVAC lines. The power wires runs through grommets at each penetration of sheet metal.

Once I had the power lines run, I installed the glove box insert with the ISIS master cell and power cell into the car. Here's how it looks:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/10/img0796zx-1.jpg

You can see the power lines for the power cell going into the plenum on the right side of the picture.

I also tried to install the Katech tensioner for the serpentine belt drive, but it won't work with the Kwik AC compressor bracket (the tensioner is mounted to the Kwik bracket), so I'll just go with the factory part and see how it goes.

So, from the list I was able to check off (1) run the power cables for the power cell on the glove box insert; (2) install the glove box insert in the car; (3) paint the steering column components (but I haven't reassembled it yet); and (4) repair a ding in the instrument cluster and paint it.

Next I'll assemble the steering column and put it aside. I've got a lot of wiring to do and don't need the column in the way. I'll install the various switches (once I find the trim pieces I ordered over a year ago) and then start in on wiring the ISIS inputs and outputs.

[White05GT]

Just read through all 7 pages of this awesome build. I don't mean to be harsh but one thing I've noticed is the small dent above the glove box on the dash. Sticks out like a sore thumb in the pics, to me anyway. Can't wait to see this baby done, you do great work.

[Mkelcy]

Just read through all 7 pages of this awesome build. I don't mean to be harsh but one thing I've noticed is the small dent above the glove box on the dash. Sticks out like a sore thumb in the pics, to me anyway. Can't wait to see this baby done, you do great work.

Yes, I saw the dent in the pictures too. The pictures really emphasize it; in person it's not nearly as noticeable. I may decide to live with it rather than repaint the entire dash.

[Motown 454]

Nice neat work it looks great. That ISIS system looks like a killer set up.

[68KMARO]

great build mike!
whats new with your car.


rich

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Hey Mike - any updates on the car?

[Mkelcy]

So, three and a half years after my last post, I wanted to let you all know that "No Name" is still alive, has been driven on the road and only needs a few tweaks/fixes before it's fully road worthy.

I won't bore you with what's gone on personally, but let's just say my dog and I moved from SoCal to southeastern Washington since my last post.

I dumped the ISIS system, not because I didn't like it (I still have it) but because I wasn't happy with the wiring job I did. I went with an AAW classic update kit to get the car on the road. During one of our winters here, I'll go back and do the ISIS setup, but for now the car's functioning well electrically.

Here's a description of the car as it sits now:

Engine – General Motors Performance Parts LS3-376/480 - 480HP, 376 CI; GMPP ECU and wiring harness; powder coated GMPP C5 accessory drive; powder coated KWIK compressor bracket, Sanden SD7H15 compressor; 21st Century Street Machine stepped headers; custom made and coated exhaust system; Summit Racing compact starter

Front Suspension - powder coated 21st Century Street Machine subframe; C5 Corvette upper and lower control arms, C5 spindles and hubs; rack and pinion power steering; QA1 front single adjustable coil over shocks with Eibach 450 lb./in. springs; and Speedway Engineering hollow 1.25" sway bar with powder coated arms

Rear Suspension - powder coated Lateral Dynamics 3 link rear suspension with Watts link; AFCO M2 double adjustable shocks with remote reservoirs; Eibach 200 lb./in. springs; Ford 9” True Trac rear with 4.11 gears

Transmission - Borg Warner Dodge Viper T56; custom made driveshaft

Brakes – CPP Hydroboost; front C5 13” rotors and calipers; rear Wilwood 12.19” brakes with internal parking brake; custom made rear emergency brake cables

Wheels & Tires – Forgeline ZX3R wheels – 17x10 front with 275-40-ZR17 Michelin Pilot Sport tires; 18 x 11 rear with 295-35-ZR18 Michelin Pilot Sport tires

Interior – Recaro Ergomed heated and ventilated leather seats; factory style interior door and quarter panels; Dynamat sound insulation; custom underlayment, carpet custom, custom rear seat area; Vintage Air HVAC; Marquez Design package tray

Electrical - DSE 7 speed interval wiper; Electric-Life power windows with custom wiring harness; Stewart Warner Maximum Performance gauges – 5” tachometer and speedometer, 2.375” fuel level, oil pressure, oil temperature, coolant temperature and volt gauges in custom gauge panel; American Autowire Classic update wiring harness; battery relocated to trunk, Optima yellow top battery; remote solenoid

Fuel System - Rick's stainless steel fuel tank; Gen 5 Camaro in-tank fuel pump; VaporWorx regulator

Stereo – Kenwood KVT-696 head unit (7” LCD screen) with Garmin GPS, Bluetooth and Sirius radio; Alpine MRP-F300 four 50 watt channel amplifier powering Infinity Kappa 462.9cfp front speakers and Infinity Kappa 693.9l rear speakers; bridged JVC KS-AX4302 two 100 watt channel amplifier powering Rockford Fosgate P1S4-8 subwoofer; Metra 44-PW32 power antenna

Body – ’68 Camaro; BMW Stratus Gray with black stripes; Detroit Speed subframe connectors, Detroit Speed deep tubs, Global West solid body mount bushings, Ride Tech billet fuel filler; Lizard Skin heat and sound insulation

And a few pictures:
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As compared to many PT cars it sits high, but I plan to use this car for long trips and don't want to worry about dragging undercarriage bits.

I'll review the thread and try to fill in some detail on what I did and how I did it.

At the present time, I'm waiting for (1) a set of rear axle bearings and seals, together with the Currie bearing retainers which are supposed to seal better than the Wilwood pieces, (2) a GPS based input for the speedometer, because the VSS in the Viper T56 appears to be fried, and (3) stops for the steering rack, which has too much travel. In addition, the pushrod from the hydroboost unit to the MC is too long, so I'll be doing some grinding. I also thought that I had an alternator issue - the voltage gauge was reading right at about 12.3 volts or so when I drove the car from the alignment shop to my house, but after a lot of internet research, I discovered that the ECU essentially tells the alternator when it needs to get to work, and I simply looked at the voltage gauge when the ECU had the alternator shut down.

I took the car to a local suspension guy for an alignment - center the rear, align rear to car, set pinion angle, align front end - and he sort of looked at the car and said "nice car." But then he got it up on his alignment rack and spent the next 10 minutes under the car going "Wow, that's great," "That's really sweet," "Would you look at that." He loved the suspension pieces.

I managed to run over the rear spoiler and crack it, so it's out being repaired. The same shop doing that will take a run at redoing some of the front end panel alignment.

The exhaust was done by a SoCal guy and is simply incredible. Nice tone, nicely flanged so you have easy access for pulling the tranny, and solid as a rock with no interference anywhere - which with a 3 link and remote canisters on the rear shocks is an accomplishment. It wasn't cheap, but worth every penny.

I've obviously done or redone a lot since the last posts - changed out the oil pan, changed bell housings, had to figure out the weather seal for the shifter, etc., etc. As I said, I'll try to go back and hit some of the highlights. If anyone has specific questions feel free to ask.

[Damn True]

Can you shed some detail on how you routed the exhaust?

[Mkelcy]

If you want anything in more detail, let me know. The exhaust guy, as I said, really did a nice job. Some of the clearances look tight in the pictures, but they're all good.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/1pej-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/x3qw-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/qyrn-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/4ls9w-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/0p11-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/r26y-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/erdg-1.jpg

[Damn True]

Something is amiss with your photo links.

[Mkelcy]

Something is amiss with your photo links.

What are you seeing? I see the pictures (linked from ImageShack) in both Chrome and IE11. If nothing else, PM me your email and I can send them to you.

[Damn True]

Must be my network. I can see them on my phone. Strange. The pics of the car in your previous post appear just fine.

[Mkelcy]

Must be my network. I can see them on my phone. Strange. The pics of the car in your previous post appear just fine.

Yeah, I left the box marked something like "Download and store" for linking to pictures checked for the first set, but not the second.

[Mkelcy]

I've had the car on the road since April 29th, about 48 days ago, and have about 1,700 miles on it. The longest trip I took was a drive over to Vancouver, Washington to have it tuned and back - about 500 miles total. We ended up chasing gremlins at the tuners for a lot of the day, finally got it all sorted out, and pulled 438 RWHP on a Mustang Dyno, with me asking the turner to emphasize drivability rather than peak power. I was very pleased. I was even more pleased with the 24 MPG I got on the drive home. My suspicion that the LS3 would be able to take advantage of the 0.5:1 overdrive in the Viper T56 through the 4.11s in the rear are panning out well. It turns about 1,600 rpm @ 60mph in 6th gear, but can accelerate up a hill in 6th. Drop it into 5th, and it simply goes like stink. The car is turning out to be everything I hoped for. It still needs some sorting out - spring rates, wind noise, gear whine from the 4.11s in the 9", but you can tell the bones are very solid and it's just a matter of continuing to pay attention to the details to get it where I want it. I figure I'll drive it a lot this summer, see what needs to be done to it, and address the issues I discover over the winter.

[Auto Rod Technologies]

I like the color choice,, and nice work!!

[CarlC]

Mike, you may want to check the tire rub on the remote shock reservoir hose (second photo from the bottom). It's rubbing and may get very ugly soon.