Pictures of my project

[in2protour]

http://imageevent.com/ls1z28/bospictures/1967camaross

Since my last post got locked, here's a link to pictures of my Camaro.

[1971CHEVELLE]

Wow nice I love the car

[parsonsj]

This is the whole complaint?

Write it down on a sheet of paper, get your drivetrain installed by your buddy, take it back to BOS, and have them fix it. I'd guess 8-12 hours max.

jp

[Vegas69]

Something is tweaked on that car badly.

[in2protour]

There's more, like interior and exterior hardware loose, missing, and wrong screws used. I have to buy all new hardware. Parts add up. See the steering column? That's how I got it back.


This is the whole complaint?

Write it down on a sheet of paper, get your drivetrain installed by your buddy, take it back to BOS, and have them fix it. I'd guess 8-12 hours max.

jp

[lvrpool32]

It was stated you wanted to pull the car out of their shop to go to a mechanic..is that true? How much notice did you give them? did you tell them you planned to return the car for finishing?

Not accusing anyone here, I just want to get both sides of the story.
If the car left the shop as "ready to go" and a "just bring it back for any little bits you may find" remark, then I can see why you are unhappy, but if it was bolted together quickly so you could remove it and it was intended to go back, you need to take it back.

Nick

[Chevrolaine]

I'd like to see BOS address each issue in the comments section of the photos. But, yeah - it definitely has problems.

I can understand they can't do anything unless you bring it back, but why in the world would they let it leave like that in the first place?:eek:

To me, just being a bystander and reading all the other threads, it sounds like you guys had differences of opinions on the build and they (BOS) just got sick of all of it, threw it together and said - Here!

You, on the other hand should have never signed anything to accept the car until the problems were fixed.

Good luck to all of ya. Wow

[TonyL]

You, on the other hand should have never signed anything to accept the car until the problems were fixed.

Good luck to all of ya. Wow

Exactly. you recieved the car. you *asked* for the car unfinished. You planned to have final assembly done by your own guy. By your own admission.

It's VERY common for a body shop to mock things up, and go over it with a fine tooth comb before shipping the car out of the shop. This includes using "wrong" fasteners temporarily to mock them up.

For all we know, they'd planned to go and finish the car on final assembly, then you showed up and wanted the car right then and there, the way it was. Why else did you leave the shop with the car unfinished? Everyone who's got an ounce of sense knows that right up until final assembly panels need to be adjusted for final fit. Same goes for suspension. If you'd have left it to BOS to actaully, you know, *finish* the car, I doubt you'd have a complaint.


Why did you take the car anyway?

[skeeters65]

TAG for further information..

[fantasygoat]

And why not bring it back to get them to fix it?

On another note, didn't someone say they'd seen the car and the gaps "looked fine"? Was this person looking at a different car?

[Mr.VENGEANCE]

uh oh...

[6'9"Witha69]

I love how 0.39" is closer to 7/16 than 3/8. :confused:Use a calculator. Or a conversion chart.

If your gonna nitpick and slam a shop, do it accurately.

I think there is something amiss with the sub or shell. The 2 holes are out of alignment in a way that could almost never be true to the holes. That is why those were good enough to align bu 1968 standards, but 41 years later it needs to be plumb bobbed for alignment. Was that done by you or your guy? You could be pissed about a non issue.

Take a couple pills and call BOS in the morning. If they're the type of guys their reputation says they are, they will still make it right.

[Mkelcy]

To the OP: What is your goal here? Nothing you've said and none of the pictures you've posted have in any way changed my opinion that BOS is one of the premier paint/restoration shops in SoCal. If I had the money, my car would be there in a heart beat.

[Dougs67camaro]

That sucks! Seems like an awfully nice paint job aside from all the grand canyon gaps.:eek: It's quite obvious that something is majorly tweaked somewhere! I'm not sure what has transpired here, this is just my opinion of the pictures.

[class67]

Something is tweaked on that car badly.

Agreed!!!

What REALLY happened to that car?

[67speedfreak]

Man that car has issues.

I tried not to post on this but I feel I have to.

You guys are being way to hard on this guy after seeing the pics he definitely has a legitimate complaint.

To the guys that are saying just take it back and give them a chance to fix it, I think you would feel different if you were in his shoes. I have been in your shoes and paid good money for a service just to be let down and it can be devastating, ecspecailly if it is you baby(Camaro).

I for one am not blaming anyone because I don't know the whole story nor do most of you, but if I took my car to someone and got it back in that condition I would never go back.

If indeed what this customer is saying is true you should be thanking him for posting this not flaming him. It could save someone else from the same fate. We have seen this kind of thing happen before and a certain someone giving a shop another chance only to find his car dropped in his driveway a mess.

I am not trying to offend anyone and I know some of you guys are friends and customers of this shop and I'm sure they are great guys but you have to admit after seeing the pics his car is not right. If you yourself felt wronged by a business and did not get what you felt you paid for I don't think you would want to give them another chance.

I just hope all of this gets worked out and everyone is happy, but I doubt that will happen.

Can't we all just get along!!



I am always getting in trouble for saying what's on my mind but that's just who I am, sorry if you don't like it.

[texasdvldog]

tagged for more info

[Rag-Rat]

The panels can be re-aligned with a few hours of patience, but drilling emblem holes crooked in a NOS fender would get me upset too.

[jilge71]

i would like to see an estimate of repairs and more pics of the subframe...you cant straighten these subframes like a full frame.i would still give them a chance to fix it and if it comes back the same or still not happy then you have a serious issue!

[Vegas69]

After reviewing the accident photos some things stand out to me. The damage doesn't look extenisve enough to bend the sub or the body. The emblems were crooked before the accident. Without knowing the details it seems the car may have very well had structural problems pre crash.

[vp23271]

Tommy,

I took a look at the pic's and I think I remember your car. When I was down at Best of Show getting the engine/tranny swapped in my 64 C10 I remember your car with the front end completely disassembled. But the car I saw was getting some additional custom work done to it. The car I saw was getting the complete firewall smoothed? Was that your car? I liked the way it looked and plan on doing the same to my 68 Camaro.

You said it took 1.5 years? Was it an insurance thing? A money thing? Waiting on parts to arrive thing? Or did BOS have a waiting list with other cars already in line?

Are the gaps only bad on the front end? How are the gaps at the back of the doors or rear deck lid? If those gaps are good and the front ends are bad, I think it just needs to be properly aligned. I also saw all of the shims, unfortunately thats just the nature of the beast with old sheet metal. I got just as many shims as you if not more.

If BOS could get your sheet metal aligned without having to reshoot your paint, I would bite the bullet and take them up on the offer before they change their minds.

[in2protour]

to answer some questions: subframe was replaced with a used, OEM, powdercoated subframe picked up by BOS and checked by BOS for squareness and straightness. Radiator core support, OEM used, also picked up by BOS. Fenders, upper cowl panel, lower front panel, new OEM that I purchased from ebay. Both driver and passenger door skin replaced with new, OEM panel I purchased from ebay. I signed over the insurance check to BOS and they cut me a check for purchasing the parts from ebay. Why did I wanted to pull the car out of the shop? Because it's been in the shop for about 14 months. I call every month to find out the status of my car and said they're still working on it. After SEMA, I called for a status, BOS told me my car didn't get worked on for a couple of weeks because "Penny" was there to get ready for SEMA in November. D!ck said that Steve thought I wouldn't mind if they worked on "Penny" since there was no car show event. That is why Steve is involved in this mess because I PM him and told him what D!ck had told me and I told him that he owes me one. Why did I sign the release? BOS wouldn't of let me take my car out until I signed the release. I was told the car was done. I had made arrangement to have a flatbed tow truck pick up the car at BOS. D!ck told me after my mechanic get the car running to bring the car back to them for minor hood adjustment, that's it. Why not bring it back to BOS to fix? Would you bring the car back to them? After you were told the car was done, and my mechanic noticed the huge gaps between body panels. Then I get a call almost everyday my mechanic telling me that some screws and bolts were loose, missing screw and bolt, mis-matched screws used, broken or missing part that was on the car before the accident, the list goes on and on. Mind you, the same mechanic was the one who restored the whole car together with all the correct screws and parts in the first place. So he should know my Camaro inside and out.

[DvBoard]

I think the only way out of this is for you to take the car back to BOS and let them fix it as they have offered. You really have nothing to lose at this point so why not give them a shot? I'm sure they want to put this behind them and no better way to do that than having you post pictures of the fixed final product.
Another option is for another mechanic to fix it like it should be and BOS to pay for it.

It's not a this or nothing issue... Although it would be nice if BOS could pick up the car, fix it correctly and return it in the fashion it should have been released from the shop the first time.

[Steve1968LS2]

BOS has offered NUMEROUS times to look at and fix the car if they are at fault, but you refuse to do this.

What's funny is that you spent HOURS going over the car when you picked it up (remember when you had to wait two hours for your tow truck to arrive?). And then you signed off that the paint/body part was good and that you knew the car was not in mechanical working order per your request. BOS also gave you a large check for the work that Haggarty paid for, but they didn't do.

Again, I'm sure there were some screwed up bolts, that happens whey you ask for the car in a non-finished state, but BOS has offered to fix it no charge.

I even offered to supervise the car at BOS if you take it back there and make sure you get a fair shake.

Anyways, I talked to BOS today and thier offer is still open.

Here's a couple of pics I took of the car in the final phase. As you can see the panel alignment and gaps look perfect at this point. I'm digging up my pics of it in the "ready for pick-up" stage and will post those later.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/01/118gjcy-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/01/2na3bsk-1.jpg

[Steve1968LS2]

Link to the other thread with comments from Tommy, Best Of Show, and other BOS customers. For reference.

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51821

The release you signed is also there. Again, BOS said they will fix the car if they did anything wrong. Even though it's been messed with for two months at your mechanic's house.

[Steve1968LS2]

With you and BOS behind it, he would have to be out of his flippin mind to decline the fix. There is two sides to every story, but at the end of the day they are willing to fix it. Do it!

There was some pithy saying in the other thread.. something like "There's my truth, his truth, and THE truth"

Which is an entertaining way of saying that in any story the turth falls somewhere in the middle.

Myself, and BOS, just want Tommy to be happy but he has to meet them half way and be willing to work it out.

Still, the offer is out there. I will handle towing to BOS and I will keep an eye on and photo document the car while it's there.

[TonyL]

Still waiting for Tommy's response. I will say that the shots of how the car left the shop, rather than the shots of the car, as it sits two months later tell a pretty telling story.

They've offered to fix it. I'd let them.

[dmc69]

I say let'em fix it. If this was infact a mistake and they offered to correct it, I would let them do just that. Its really no sense dragging this through the mud any more than you have to. Good luck with completing the build either one way or another.....

[Steve1968LS2]

Steve did you ever get those delivery day pics?

How about you Tommy? Take any pics of the big day?



I'm working on the pics and will add them within the week, I think I'm back there on Tuesday. I didn't take them, BOS did. Today we went to guys house to install his front end.. funny, they had a frame gauge and everything. lol

Although I did see them eyeing his spark plugs... hmmm

[Steve1968LS2]

This thread in nearing an end, it serves zero useful purpose.

The OP stated his case. BOS has offered to fix anything they didn't do right. I have offered to cover shipping the car to BOS. I really don't know what more the guy could want.

It's up to the OP what he wants to do. If he sues BOS or if the BAR reaches a finding I will make sure that it's posted, whatever the outcome.


Note: I went through the thread and removed all of the opinions. From both sides including myself. It's easy to get all wrapped up in the drama and since I believe in the work done by BOS I can't consider myself and objective party.

The basic facts remain:

1. Tommy hired BOS
2. Tommy removed the car from BOS in an unfinished state to take to a less expensive shop
3. Tommy has complaints about the car
4. BOS has offered to look at the car and fix anything they were responsible for
5. I offered to pay the tow bill back to BOS in the interest of love and harmony
6. Tommy has a complaint filled with the BAR and the BAR is reviewing the case

And there it sits. We can all sit around blaming the other side and giving our opinions, but that's not what this site is for. Both sides gave thier side and need to work it out with each other.

I tried to handle this as fairly as I could. The posts I removed didn't offer anything to resolve the complaint. The only way that can happen is for the parties involved to talk or in a court of law.

If I hear of any judgement, either for or against, I will post them. I will also post pictures from the day of pick-up since they were requested. But remember, you can only tell so much from pictures.

Both parties have each other's phone numbers. I suggest they talk and work it out.