Maxx-Q Data Logger, Accurate? Data Logging in General [Archive]

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rat_rod_russell

01-12-2009, 05:19 AM

I’ve got a Maxx-Q data logger mainly because most of the other guys in my autocross club have them so comparison data is easy to get my hands on. But now that I have it and I’ve got some road course time and I’ve got some data from other guys on the course I see a lot of satellite and that’s making me doubt the data numbers I’m seeing. I’ve seen long steady corners at the autocrosses where I’ve keep 1.2 lateral G’s and I’m only running a 275/35/R19 Michelin Pilots Sports on the rear (not even the PS2’s). I’m in a 57 Chevy with a racing weight of 3450 lbs (that includes my fat 220 lbs butt). I’m running a C4 corvette rear end that I’ve modified the geometry on, I have high hopes for it but that just seems a little off now that I’ve taken some serious time to looks at some of the other data y’all have posted.

Does anyone else have one?
What are your personal / professional thoughts of the unit?
What other data loggers are you guys running?

Thanks
R^3

chicane67

01-12-2009, 01:08 PM

It really depends on what you are looking for in a DA system. Do you just want typical suspension instrumentation... or are you after some other more critical measurements ?? Do you want to also want/need engine and drivetrain measurements ?? Is this more for just a peek into the window... or do you want/need to see the whole picture ?? Are you going to be doing any development ?? How accurate of data are you looking for ?? And lastly, what exactly do you want/need to instrument ??

The real trick to any DA system is the bit resolution and frequency. Some systems will even allow you to change the frequency for individual channels... which is a big help when dealing with recording. Some channels/sensors don't really need to be 'recorded' at higher frequencies and it will eat up memory space. Some times, you will want a specific sensor's sampling rate turned up if you are scrutinizing a specific channel or set of channels. And really... the data and how it is presented also has a lot to do with what you actually record. So... in other words, the data is only as good as the GUI that can properly and correctly represent the data recorded. The MaxQData software interface is actually kind of primative in some respects to others on the market.

Sensors. Accelerometers are the key tools in what you are really after. Most systems have two axis... which allow you to look at for/aft and lateral. A very few systems offer a three axis... which will also let you get into damper (shock) tuning to the specific spring rate and suspension frequency. This is a huge help when you get into adjustable dampers. Again... what are you looking at recording ??

Here are a few other companies with, what I would consider, good systems:

http://www.advantagemotorsports.com/

Their "Professional Data Group" is a great entry level device and is affordable for most.

Their "Leading Edge" system works with OBDII and can read all kinds of stuff from the ECU.

Their "Ultimate Data Group" is more for dedicated efforts and leaning towards development. I have worked with this system quite a bit... and it has some benefits that you will not get on the lower price systems.

http://www.racepak.com/

From the "IQ3," that is a godsend for the LSx crowd... to their "G2X" that covers almost everything else... are quite possibly the best bang for the buck.

http://www.competitiondata.com/packages_pricing/rr_and_ct_midrange.htm

CDS also has some nice 'user' interface features for consideration.

And the following two are also excellent choices... although out of the price range of most.

http://www.motec.com.au/home

http://www.piresearch.com/

rat_rod_russell

01-12-2009, 09:01 PM

WOW, seriously thanks for the information. Yes I will be doing a little development. I'm slowly turning my father (and his shop) to the Pro-Touring world but he's having me take the lead on this one since its going to be a little more involved than "that feels good" or "that looks right".

The real trick to any DA system is the bit resolution and frequency.

Thats what I figures when I started looking around at a few other systems and saw most are 100 Hz and the bad ass Maxx-Q is 10 Hz. One quick question before I start reading and analyzing the systems How do you feal about http://www.vboxusa.com I see there equipment used by a few magazines and other testing groups for there data logging And I will go through this list and come up with a list of questions too.

Thanks
-Russell

chicane67

01-12-2009, 11:11 PM

The VBox is... a Racelogic product. Not a bad product, but they are an overseas operation so tech support and parts can/might be a PITA.

Not to make this confusing or more complicated than it needs to be... I believe I will wait for your requirements before I respond.

But... what would be good questions to ask yourself:

What do I want to interpret ?? What do I want to measure exactly ?? Now and in the future... ??

Suspension: Steering angle. Yaw. Acceleration, deceleration, lateral and vertical. Wheel speed or speeds. Temperatures; tires (IR), dampers.

Drivetrain. Shaft speed or speeds. Temperatures; trans temp, diff temp.

Engine relative. Pressure sensors, oil, water, PS, fuel, boost, brake (F&R), N2O. TPS. WB O2. Temperatures; engine H2O, oil temp, PS temp, EGT (8), IAT.

Do you want or need telemetry ??

I think Advantage's Windows Software ( http://www.advantagemotorsports.com/WS.htm ) has the most user friendly and configurable GUI out there. It is easy enough... that you can drop a laptop in the chassis and view it real time without issue.

stealth71

01-13-2009, 08:31 AM

rat_rod_russell

01-13-2009, 12:03 PM

Sweet, there are some things I didn’t think about logging but when you mentioned it new little worlds opened up and ideas came rushing into my head. IR tire temps; not having to pit, unlock my harness, jump out of the car, grab the pyrometer and notebook then run around the car while my tires cool off and I get mismatched readings because there’s a breeze or I can’t see because I still have my helmet on.

I’m very much a noob so if I say something wrong just slap me and correct me please so I don’t make the same mistake twice.

Just thinking out loud
1) I’m more interested in tuning the chassis than the motor or finding areas for improvement on the drive train. For sure a 3 axes would be nice.

2) Front and rear body roll logging. I don’t remember the proper terminology.

3) I’m going to need to look at what I would need to hook up to get the steering angle to work but that would be all kinds of useful if I can cross it with the Yaw and see the slip angles. With the 3 axes and some equipment hooked to the shock (temp, pressure and or velocity) I could send it to Aaron over at PFADT so we can get the shocks perfect. I get to do a chassis for this 69 Cutlass soon with all C5 / C6 and PFADT already said they would work with me on getting the perfect shock built for the car.

4) I don’t think I’ll need too much engine data logging. I plan to let the EFI Live software do most of that logging but basic RPM, VSS and gear selection are nice to have so you can see up and down shifts vs speed right next to your other data. Good info for picking gear ratios accordingly and seeing if you’re not using your power properly. I have out puts from both the Speedometer and the tack so I don’t think I’ll need OBD2 support. Or would it be better?

5) I never even thought of brake pressure but I can see that being more useful after reading up on the One Lap Camaro with his brake issue from the Optima Battery Invitational’s.

6) 4 wheel, wheel speed sensors would be nice later on, I’m entertaining an AWD idea and I would want to see how well the transfer case computer maintains traction at the different wheels.

I think that about sums up what I will be working on but I'm interested in any info or suggestions your willing to spare. I’m building PT cars and Streetfighters not end all specked race cars. I’m more interested in accurate information in a system I can install into the car I’m working on at that time. I would rather have equipment that I can grow into not grow out of so any suggestions of places or info that will give me a place to start is greatly appreciated.

I’m putting my 57 up for sale so I can get some build a better 55 and get some other equipment too. I’m tired of borrowing scales and the new ones will interface to my laptop so I can save the info to it along with the data acquisition system info and keep organized. I suck at keeping up with paper work but I know a thing or two about computes.

Mr. Chicane67 thank you for taking the time to give me pointers. I haven't cough your name yet so I can thank you properly.

-Russell

rat_rod_russell

01-13-2009, 12:06 PM

I just started writing some software for an Arduino and a 3-axis +-3g accelerometer I bought. Nothing like a full data logging setup, but I will post up after I get something useful going. Planning on integrating GPS as well.

WOW that sounds cool. I took basic C++, HTML and PHP (jsut enough to get in trouble) but wow being able to write up exactly what you need will be sweet and should put you a little ahead. can't wait to see it.

-Russell

Rhino

01-14-2009, 09:10 AM