Electrical Gurus Please HELP!!

[Patrick]

OK, I have a strange electrical issue...

FYI:
LS1 with Kenne Bell SC

Yesterday at the Turkey Run I blew a power steering hose. No big deal, called a rollback and took her home.

Today I am messing around trying to determine where the leak is... Hood's up and crank her over...I hear a little sizzle and I can see that the high pressure side of the power steering hose is glowing red. It is a braided line that is lightly touching the control arm. Not only did I find the source of the leak but also found out that something with the starter is putting a current through entire motor when in the start position???

I have a rear mount battery with a remote start solenoid. I tried disconnecting the starter signal wire (the small gauge to the starter) and hit the key. My test light glowed brightly. Note that test light is connected to the AC compressor mount and grounded at the radiator. I then disconnected the heavy gauge starter cable from the starter and hit the key.... NOTHING from the test light. I checked the cable and there is no damage, fraying or contact that I can see.


Is it possible for a started to go bad and send an electrical current through the block?


What ever the source it is current strong enough to burn a hole through a -4 steel braided line.


I have had no drivability problems or starting issues prior to this. I have several 14 gauge wires grounding the block to the fire wall in different places.

[dhutton]

I am having a little bit of trouble following you but it sounds like your engine block is not well grounded to the chassis and/or battery. How is the negative of the battery routed and how does it make a connection to the block? It sounds like the braid on the power steering hose was providing the ground.

Don

[Patrick]

The battery is located in the trunk and is grounded to the rollbar.

The motor is grounded with 3-- 14 gauge wires in various places and 1 of those braided grounding straps.

[GetMore]

I does sound like you don't have a big enough ground on the block to handle the power the starter uses.
What I don't quite follow is how you are getting current to flow with the signal wire disconnected. At that point the starter should be electrically dead.

[GetMore]

The motor is grounded with 3-- 14 gauge wires in various places and 1 of those braided grounding straps.
You posted this while I was typing.
This is your problem.
You need a wire the size of the power wire to the starter to ground the starter. 14 ga. wire is not enough, nor is a braided strap. They are fine for the rest of the electrical demands (gauges, ect.), but not for the starter.

[comp-spec]

Check you grounds
Body to chassis, engine to chassis ..... sounds like a ground problem
Try to also pull the main wires off the starter in see if you still get a glowing test light. If they check ok swap out your starter.

[hotrdblder]

you need larger then 14 gauge wire to ground engine to chassis/body.
try 2 gauge and prep area for ground.
Also battery would be better if grounded to rear frame rail, weld a stud onto frame rail and use nyloc nut.

[Patrick]

Also battery would be better if grounded to rear frame rail, weld a stud onto frame rail and use nyloc nut.

Even if the rollbar is welded in?

I don't have anything larger than 8 gauge right now. But I did run an 8 gauge wire from the starter bolt to a good ground on the subframe and it did not make any difference.

[Patrick]

Try to also pull the main wires off the starter in see if you still get a glowing test light. If they check ok swap out your starter.


I did disconnect the main wire at the starter--and the test light did not glow. Which makes believe there is something with the starter.

One note--the post on the starter with the cable is pretty loose?

[hotrdblder]

more then likely its from the battery not grounding good, i would ground the battery with 1 gauge or 1/0 to the frame rail.
but you really need to check all the grounds.
the grounds need to be adequate for the amps anyone one thing pulls, so your battery engine ground should be as big as the power cable going to the starter

the post being loose on the starter shoul donly create resistance in the one cable, making it get hot, not ground out

[Patrick]

OK--you guys were spot on....Since I don't have any thing larger than 8g, I doubled them up and added additional grounding from subframe to body and the problem has been corrected. I will replace those with 1 gauge wire over the weekend.

Thank you!

[Mike Holleman]

Be sure you run that large ground cable directly to the engine block. Not to the chassis. Yes that means a long cable, but your grounds should be battery to block, block to chassis.
Mike

[dhutton]

The cable that is grounding the block to the chassis should be the same gauge as the positive cable from the battery to the starter solenoid. You could probably go one gauge smaller since the cable is shorter but the bigger the cable the less voltage drop across it while cranking. It also gives you a little margin for a less than perfect connection.

Don

[GetMore]

OK--you guys were spot on..
You gave us an easy one!

[OHCbird]

And of course, to be a Jonny-come-lately... make sure you clean all the connections & use something like battery terminal protectant (I like the 3M stuff). I have been using it on all kinds of battery terminals and major connections with ZERO corrosion issues.

If you've ever seen some of the import guys with the 'grounding kits' there is a good reason why- THEY WORK! They are very effective at reducing the electrical noise in a system as well.

Jeff

[Patrick]

You gave us an easy one!



What stumped me is the fact that I have been driving it like that for a couple of months and about 1200 miles. It never gave me any issues with starting. I always thought a bad ground or lack of a ground would cause cranking issues (like a slow crank...).

Anyways, thanks.

[hotrdblder]

What stumped me is the fact that I have been driving it like that for a couple of months and about 1200 miles. It never gave me any issues with starting. I always thought a bad ground or lack of a ground would cause cranking issues (like a slow crank...).

Anyways, thanks.
it usually does, but your ps line was doing a really good job