New frame or modify old

[madmax]

Hi,

I am new around here. I just made a post in the Engine section.

First off, please forgive my stupidity.

I have a '69 Camaro I will soon be turning into a PT car. The question is, should I modify my original frame or just buy a new one. The problem here is I can't do body work or weld. I can do most of the mechanics thoughout the car.

I want to make a low 11 second car at the strip, but it will spend 98% of its time on the road as a weekend cruiser. How crazy do I need to get with the frame or suspension? I have been looking at DS&E's kits... but i cant do the custom fab. I can put the kit togher, but can't do any of the mods that require custom fab.

What kind of suspension should I be looking for, and would it be cheaper for me to just buy a new complete frame instead of paying labor for modifying the existing?

Thanks a lot for your time,
Max

[TitoJones]

Welcome to yhe board Max.

Not a stupid question at all. I think that since you lack the skills to heavily modify the stock frame, and that is to be street driven primarily, you should look at the Guldstrand mod for your stock frame.
A set of Global West Del-a-lum bushings on all 4 corners, a good spring/shock and the G mod will produce a great handling street car, that is easy and inexpensive to come by.
The only mod is drilling and cutting, which most people can do with common tools.

Do a search for the Guldstrand mod to get a better understanding of what is, and why it works, as it has been covered here multiple times.

Tyler

[ProdigyCustoms]

I am going thorugh this as we speak with a customer with a firebird convertible in the shop. We have talked it a lot and pretty much decided unless ultimate weight loss, and ultimate handling are the goal, you are best to stay with your stock subframe. Most of the quality aftermarket subframes do benifit from a huge weight loss of the nose, which is valuable in both handling, and weight transfer for drag racing. But the 200LBS is probably not worth the $4000 difference between having a stock frame rebuilt with a good box, urethane bushings, some variable springs and good shocks, if it is mostly a driver and ultimate performance is not the goal.
If the goal is to squeeze every last inch out of the car. Or if you goal is to build an unlimited $$$$ ride to blow away everyone that sees it. Then an aftermarket frame is all you.
I agree with Tito 100%. Even if you have to hire it done it will still be much less then any aftermarket quality subframe, and probably nearly as good anyway.
If you come by the shop, you can see a Wayne Due, a Chris Alston, and A Martz Subframe, and also proabably a stock frame being modified depending on what the Firebird convertible guy decides.

[madmax]

Cool. Thanks for all of your help. How well do the cars handle once they've been updated? What would be the closest late-model car?

I'm not looking to build a car that would wow judges at a national show. One that handles well, more power than anything else on the street (around me, anyway) but nothing excessive; I don't need to go crazy with weight reduction or anything along those lines.

Hopefully this car (years in the making) will start to take shape.

Thanks,
Max

[Steve1968LS2]

Cool. Thanks for all of your help. How well do the cars handle once they've been updated? What would be the closest late-model car?

I'm not looking to build a car that would wow judges at a national show. One that handles well, more power than anything else on the street (around me, anyway) but nothing excessive; I don't need to go crazy with weight reduction or anything along those lines.

Hopefully this car (years in the making) will start to take shape.

Thanks,
Max

Well we just tested a 69 LS1 Camaro with Martz front frame, mini-tub and Truck arm suspension..

It kicked the shiat out of a 2002 Z28 Camaro in the 440ft slalom.. beat it by over 4mph..

Beat it on the skid pad too by a little..

The Z28 beat in in braking.. gotta love ABS :)

[Roger Poirier]

Prodigy Customs

What a relief! From what I have been reading, books, forum etc. I thought my stock A-frame should be headed to the junk yard compared to what most others are doing. Yes, I'm updating with new suspension, steering and baer brakes. I feel much better now.

[baz67]

Roger it is the stock geometry and drum brakes that should be sent packing. Updating it all will do wonders.

Brian

[zman1969]

Welcome to yhe board Max.

Not a stupid question at all. I think that since you lack the skills to heavily modify the stock frame, and that is to be street driven primarily, you should look at the Guldstrand mod for your stock frame.
A set of Global West Del-a-lum bushings on all 4 corners, a good spring/shock and the G mod will produce a great handling street car, that is easy and inexpensive to come by.
The only mod is drilling and cutting, which most people can do with common tools.

Do a search for the Guldstrand mod to get a better understanding of what is, and why it works, as it has been covered here multiple times.

Tyler

ok maybe went bass akwards here, I modified my front subframe with BRP rack setup and also added Global West upper control arms and delalum lower bushings but I didnt do guldstrand mod . now frame is powdercoated and assembled under the car . My question is is it possible to do guldstrand mod to frame witout having to grind off the powdercoating with the tubular control arms? AM I TOO LATE? :hammer:

[TitoJones]

Even with a tubular control arm, you will see a clearence issue. You still need to grind the top of the towers off to get full suspension travel back.

Tyler

[zman1969]

so you think will be worth doing even at this stage of the game? guess i thought upper arms and delalum bushings were good enough. does anybody make a bracket to bolt up so drilling will be accurate? :banghead: