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ct08
09-30-2008, 03:35 PM
Has anyone used abs or pvc to hard line compressed air in the garage or shop?

meenaggie
09-30-2008, 04:31 PM
I have used schd 40 PVC in my garage with success. Small diameters (<1") are plenty for the flow and pressure rating of most all home use compressors (even larger 240V units). Some air compressor manufacturers recommend against this as they indicate the lubricants used in the compressor will degrade the PVC over time. I have a drier installed on the outlet to minimize oil and moisture carryover. I manage this by lubricating my tools every time I use them. I have carbon steel pipe at the quick connects and drops to give me something solid to anchor the lines to the wall with. PVC needs support every ~5 ft versus ~10+ with carbon steel. I have a flexible lead in line to isolate the PVC from the vibration of the compressor which also made it a lot easir to hook up. PM me if you want some pictures.

Disclaimer: The real concern is PVC is brittle and compressed air stores a lot of energy. If it does go it won't be good. Remember its primary use is for liquid which is not compressable.

parsonsj
09-30-2008, 04:43 PM
I use copper tube. Nearly as easy as PVC and ABS, though you do need to sweat the joints.

jp

Roger M
09-30-2008, 04:47 PM
I use copper tube. Nearly as easy as PVC and ABS, though you do need to sweat the joints.

jp

Co signed

I used copper as well. If you use plastic, make sure it is rated for the pressure.

toxicz28
09-30-2008, 06:53 PM
Disclaimer: The real concern is PVC is brittle and compressed air stores a lot of energy. If it does go it won't be good. Remember its primary use is for liquid which is not compressable.

Just to add to this. When plastic piping fails, it will send shrapnel all over your shop. :scared: :seizure:

Charley Lillard
09-30-2008, 08:34 PM
And the shrapnel will not show up on Xrays. I just replaced my PVC setup in my big shop with copper pipe. I have PVC in my other shop but it is in the wall. If it bursts it will be contained. A friend has it in his large shop. It is usually the joints that fail. If you must use it at least wrap it with duct tape or something to contain the shrapnel a little.

oestek
10-01-2008, 05:38 AM
We ran the Ingersall Rand SimplAir extruded aluminum pipe with the quick-connects / disconnects... super easy to use, rated for the pressure, and easy to mount and hang.

GetMore
10-01-2008, 10:10 AM
I have installed PVC pipe in a friend's shop, and AFAIK he hasn't had any problems, but from what I've read (maybe here) it's a bit dangerous.

Bow Tie 67
10-01-2008, 10:52 AM
I have used it, its rated for 300 psi, my set-up is 14 years old with no issues.

rubadub
10-24-2008, 10:40 PM
Heres a drawing if it will help.

http://www.1969supersport.com/draw1.html

Plastic pipe can weaken from contamination getting inside of it, and if you bump it, it could explode, if it breaks it could whip around something like an air hose.

I have read some where that if you use copper pipe and have a fire it could heat up the connections, then when it lets loose it will fan the fire.

Galvanized pipe has what you call galvanization that could get into your filters.

Black pipe will rust inside, but it cools good, and if you run inline filters, you won't have a problem.

I have spent about 3000 hours reading about air lines on a dozen car forums in the last year and a half, I'm retired I find it interesting reading, yeah I know what your thinking, I need to get a life, your probably right, but i'm just telling you what I have found out.

So black pipe, 3/4'' will work good and run a minimum of 50' before it goes into the first in line filter, the warm air out of the compressor will be cooled by then and turn to water, then your filters can capture it.

60' or 70' is better yet.

You want to run your air lines so you can run a pressurized sandblaster pot, if you can go through a 1000 lbs of sand without back flushing, then you will never have a problem with water getting to your paint gun.

Yes, I run black pipe and i'm blowing my own horn here, but if you run those airlines right, you won't have any problems.

Tp tools has some information on running air lines and what type of pipe to run, these guys sell a lot of blasters and air related stuff, they understand the program, check out there technical tips on what they recommend, its black pipe and they tell you why.

I'll put up a couple of pictures of my setup, its just like the drawing. http://www.1969supersport.com/paintroom21.html

I guess it wouldn't hurt to mention you won't need an air dryer or a dessicant can with this set up.

LowBuckX
10-25-2008, 05:48 AM
I have 100 Ft of 8AN Teflon lined stainless braided that I retreived from a scrap bin that I will berunning for air line..... tryed to sell it but cant give itaway for some reason.....

rubadub
10-25-2008, 11:48 AM
I have 100 Ft of 8AN Teflon lined stainless braided that I retreived from a scrap bin that I will berunning for air line..... tryed to sell it but cant give itaway for some reason.....

You sure can't beat free air lines, but it wouldn't hurt to see how much pressure it can take and if it is safe to use it for compressed air.

Also I would see if you're going to get any separation inside the line, like letting loose and getting stuck in your in line filters. Also if anything else coming out of the compressor will compromise the integrity of it, like compressor oil blowby or whatever, its hard to say, I'm just guessing here, but cover all your bases.

Air compressors and air lines can be dangerous, so use caution, and if its okay let us know.
I assume its somewhat flexible, and if it breaks and starts whipping around, that wouldn't be to good a deal.

Rob

LowBuckX
10-25-2008, 06:23 PM
its used for power steering and outomatic trans lines 3000 psi burst pressure (fluid)

rubadub
10-25-2008, 07:57 PM
its used for power steering and outomatic trans lines 3000 psi burst pressure (fluid)

No doubt she'll take the pressure, whats the diameter of it, it needs to be big enough to aid in the cooling of the hot air, and see if you can find out how it disperses heat.

LSXfan
11-10-2008, 07:22 PM
whats the diameter of it

-8 AN = 1/2"

Jim Nilsen
11-17-2008, 02:20 AM
I have 100 Ft of 8AN Teflon lined stainless braided that I retreived from a scrap bin that I will berunning for air line..... tryed to sell it but cant give itaway for some reason.....

God wants you to have the most beautiful and safest airline possible for no more cost than the fittings :git:

daredvl22
01-14-2009, 12:28 PM
Has anyone here tried the RapidAir system? Eastwood sells a kit w/ just about everything you need for a garage. I'm thinking about going ths route due to ease of use and the ability to expand fairly easily. What do you guys think? Here's the link to their web site.

http://www.rapidairproducts.com/distributors/

Thanks,

brans72
01-14-2009, 06:23 PM
I used black pipe and threaded it myself. I wanna thanks Rubadub for all the help!!!!!

PhillipM
01-15-2009, 03:12 PM
Please don't use PVC for airlines as it is extremley dangerous. All it takes is a mop head or something similar to bumb the pipe to cause it to rupture.

http://www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19880520.html

jonesmoto
01-17-2009, 09:49 PM
Please don't use PVC for airlines as it is extremley dangerous. All it takes is a mop head or something similar to bumb the pipe to cause it to rupture.

http://www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19880520.html
I have to agree. I had installed schedule 40 pipe in my shop about 5 years ago and needless to say just a couple of weeks ago I had a 90 degree fitting burst! Talk about scaring the living s*** out of me!!! I now have copper tubing. Three words,

DONT DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!

David Pozzi
01-22-2009, 01:32 PM
I've used PVC pipe in a couple of shops and recently removed both systems and replaced them with iron pipe. The pipe and fittings were installed for around 15 to 20 years, schedule 40 PVC, the joints were glued with the two step glue, purple primer and grey glue.

Upon removing the pipe sections I was cutting out with a sawzall, I threw some to the floor from an 8' ladder, - they shattered! Some broke as I was cutting them. The pipe became very very brittle. I have had a few friends who had PVC break all by itself. A friend suggested it's the lack of water that may cause the failure, water pipes don't fail like this. Oil from the air compressor? Maybe, but I don't see any oil in the pipe, it looks nice and clean.

I hate the iron pipe I installed, it's blowing out fine particles of rust all the time. If I blow air on my hand, it feels like I'm sand blasting!

In my reading on the web, there is some mention of ABS pipe, it does not break into shrapnel when it fails, IF it fails. I can't find any to buy in my area though. plastic pipe is so much easier to install. Copper is too expensive, the special Aluminum air pipe is costly too.
David

tankhunter
01-22-2009, 04:58 PM
i put 1" sch 80 pvc in my shop 8 years ago compressor runs at 125 psi never had a problem

zero g
02-11-2009, 05:18 PM
http://www.rapidairproducts.com/

This stuff is awesome.

ct08
02-14-2009, 06:21 PM
thanks for the great info...keep it coming!

b-man
02-14-2009, 06:40 PM
The shop where I used to work had white PVC air lines.

We spent too much time repairing breaks in those lines. Quite often they'd break in the middle of the night, any machines that needed air pressure to run at night would be down when we arrived in the morning.

Ended up replacing every bit of it with copper, this was over 10 years ago when it was affordable to use copper for this.

Big-time safety hazard using the PVC pipe. That stuff rockets off in razor-sharp chunks when it gives way, I found pieces that flew a hundred feet across the shop from where the break occurred.

Never use PCV for air lines.

The shop where I now work found an inexpensive and durable solution for running the air lines, rubber air hose that you can buy in bulk. Looks decent if you take some care to install it, most of it is red-colored and attached with straps and clamps to the electrical conduit runs in the building.

Copper would have cost over $100K to run in our big 83,000 square foot shop.

minendrews68
02-15-2009, 12:24 PM
Nibco, a company I used to work for used to sell a plastic of some sorts called (I think) PEK tubing. It was used for air lines and would expand and contract without the problems associated with PVC. I will try to call them and find out what that was and if they still offer it.

oestek
02-15-2009, 01:25 PM
We use the Ingersoll-Rand Simplair system, it's aluminum tube, no rust, and won't grenade if you bump it. Copper water pipe is my 2nd choice, but the push-lock reusable compression fittings of the IR system are really nice and easy to install.

TT302Z28
02-15-2009, 01:42 PM
Ever dig up PVC used for irrigation? It is brittle also so it's not the lack of water.

minendrews68
02-15-2009, 06:57 PM
OK it's not PEK tubing it is called Chem-Aire made by NIBCO, Inc. This was in the making back when I worked for NIBCO. This stuff really works quite well. The following is a link to their web site
http://www.nibco.com/assets/ChmairOvrw.pdf
Sorry, being of the illiterate type I don't know how to imbed a address into this thread. Go here and see what you think.
Carl
Looks like it put the link in here itself. I would like to take credit but I didn't do it.....I need all the help I can get.

David Pozzi
03-02-2009, 12:25 PM
Ever dig up PVC used for irrigation? It is brittle also so it's not the lack of water.

We have miles of PVC pipe buried on our farm, no problems after 30 years, and it's still not brittle. I personally think it's the sunlight that kills PVC. I just bought 700' of PVC 1 1/2" and it had laid out in the pipe supply yard too long, it broke just unloading it.
David

jpdeuce
03-02-2009, 08:00 PM
Sunlight and UV rays is what kills PVC pipe.

CarlC
03-02-2009, 09:27 PM
Sunlight and UV rays is what kills PVC pipe.


Ding Ding Ding! UV radiation breaks down the polymer chains in PVC. The shorter the chain, the less flexibility the pipe has. If the pipe is exposed to light it should be painted, at a minimum, to help reduce UV degredation.

jpdeuce
03-03-2009, 07:17 PM
It can also be wrapped in electrical tape to protect it. We've switched some of our PVC at work from white to black piping. That has helped alot.

gto406
03-22-2009, 07:57 AM
I second what Kevin say's. If your budget allows go the IR route.

Failing that you can't beat copper tubing. I went copper, and the system works great. I followed the TP tools web-site in terms of routing and drops, and it keeps the lines relatively moisture free.

PVC is a disaster waiting to happen. Why use it, and tempt fate (tape or no tape). It is the kind of thing you want to build and forget about - i.e. the only thing you should be worrying about is clearing your traps, and draining your tank on a regular basis (oh, and oiling your tools).

My $0.02
Brian.