Gen 1 camaro rear suspension triple threat

[XLexusTech]

Of the three G bar, Lateral dynamics 3 link and the DSE Quadra link which would be the best for a car that would need to be a street car, Drag race car and a corner carver.

I had selected the G Bar but after attending a drag racing event this weekend seeing old friends I am now considering a better performing rear suspension in a drag race condition.

So how would one expect the g bar LD three link or DSE suspension perform with 600 hp and slicks :razz:

[Travis B]

Unless going for every tenth, they will all work good.
The lat d 3 link, while adjustable is not really set up for drag racing.
I am building a full chassis chevelle, and built my own perimeter frame, and am installing a jakes rod shop front clip (he customized the lower rails, making them 2x4, not the normal 3x3) so i can tie it into my perimeter 2x4 chassis. Then in the rear i am doing his tq arm offering, which again for every last tenth is not it in drag racing, but for anything driven on the street, etc will work very well. The nice thing about the tq arm is, it hooks very well, for our pro touring type cars at the drag strip, look how well 4th gen camaros run, they have a factory tq arm.

just my opinion
Travis

[XLexusTech]

Hoping to work very closely with Jakes on my car I love his stuff. I just stumbled over Pics of a shop car of his on the lateral dynamics site. Anyone know if that 68 is still under construction... BTW if you read this Jake I have the week off and I am considering a ride up to see you :-)

[hotrdblder]

lol, just give me a call,so we can arrange it.

[David Sloan]

You want be unhappy with the way Jake's suspension works!

[ProdigyCustoms]

I think RTTHs proved all the suspensions mentioned work on the autocross with no clear advantage to one suspension or another except the obliviation of the field by the DSE Test Car. That thing is so tuned, and Kyle is so good.............. I do believe had Bret not had transmission issues and if he would have had his driver we would have seen a closer battle with the Test Car. I can say this because those guys battled week in and week out all year. But there is not doubt right now that Kyle and that second gen test car has the advantage, period

At RTTHs at the dragstrip, the Air bars kicked ass. Nothing hooked like the Air bar cars including Vinnie, Bret and EmptyNest. In fact I think all the low times (G machines) came from Air Bar cars. And most of it was in the 60 foot times.All the other suspensions were suffering for traction.

Watch this video. Both VERY similar motors, lSX based, low to mid 600HP range, one Wegner built, one Mitchell built. The Air Ride car is a Air Bar with the Prodigy Bar treatment, the DSE car is a Quadrlink. It is all in the short time.

http://detroitspeed.com/video/autocross-ride-drag.htm

[silver69camaro]

So how would one expect the g bar LD three link or DSE suspension perform with 600 hp and slicks :razz:

Sounds like you need a true 4-link.

Seriously though, is it a drag car or a handling car? You have to choose, and you can't have both.

[Steve Chryssos]

You can have it all with a new Jake's Rod Shop Torque Arm Kit. It's compatible with Air Ride and there's no floorpan intrusion, so installation is as easy as a g-bar. The front of the torque arm secures to the tail end of the front subframe--the strongest location on a 1st gen.

I was so impressed with the system's composure at RTH4 that I never unloaded my car from Jake's trailer. He drove right past NY and up to Maine. I thought about it during the ride back to NY, called him up on the cellphone and told him to keep the car--put a torque arm in it. I can't wait!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/09/IMG_1558-1.jpg

[dhutton]

You can have it all with a new Jake's Rod Shop Torque Arm Kit. It's compatible with Air Ride and there's no floorpan intrusion, so installation is as easy as a g-bar. The front of the torque arm secures to the tail end of the front subframe--the strongest location on a 1st gen.

I was so impressed with the system's composure at RTH4 that I never unloaded my car from Jake's trailer. He drove right past NY and up to Maine. I thought about it during the ride back to NY, called him up on the cellphone and told him to keep the car--put a torque arm in it. I can't wait!



Nice to see something different from the other offerings. Jake, where are the mufflers, beside the gas tank? It also looks like an x-pipe could not be used, is that the case? Not sure how much you loose without the x-pipe but it seems to be common on most exhaust systems installed on these cars.

I wish this and the AME options had been available a year ago when I was selecting my rear suspension.

Don

[Steve Chryssos]

Different and smart. Full back seat, room for tailpipes, Bilstein shocks, etc.

[XLexusTech]

Now were talking ! .... and for info purposes a torque arm will allow you to get into "Stock" drag classes since the rules are kinda Loop holy. They exclude "4 links" on camaros but allow OE 4 links on G bodies )adjustable arms and South side bars allowed. A loophole is a torque arm on F bodies beacause then come stock on later camaros...

;-) no more weight penalty

[hotrdblder]

Guys, my test car has race bullets on it for mufflers. As you can see the tq arm stays below the driveshaft , thus giving no intrusion into the car, also allowing the use of any size muffler in the stock location. The x pipe can and will work in the normal spot, under the tailshaft of the tranny, I have full 3 inch exhaust with 3 inch tailpipes. You will need to use the smaller x pipe so you can keep it packaged well, but you would want too anyway to keep good ground clearance, with my built headers no part of the rear susp or exhaust is lower then the subframe legs, speed bumps and raised speed tables are a non issue.
I will post a few other pics later and steevos car has and will keep his xpipe
Xlexus, come on up later in the week, we and you can drive my test car and we can mess with tuning so you can feel it in the seat of the pants
Jake

[silver69camaro]

You can have it all with a new Jake's Rod Shop Torque Arm Kit.

Steve, are you that system allows for 100% (or more) antisquat and is preload-adjustable like a four link, which a drag car needs?

Don't get me wrong, torque arms work well, but they aren't a drag-race suspension. They work just as well as any 3-link or triangulated 4-bar at the strip. For those who do use them for the drags, they are definetely not set up the same as a handling car.

Every day we get calls from customers who want their car to be a dragster and a road racer. In the end, you have to choose; but it is easier to mount a set of drag slicks to a handling car to have fun at the strip...just don't expect it to 60-ft like a dedicated drag car.

[Steve Chryssos]

Something's gotta give, right? Lucky for me I place drag racing at the bottom of my list of priorities as follows:
-Street
-Packaging (e.g.: exhaust, floor pan intrusion)
-Auto-X
-Road Race
-Ease of Installation
-Looks
-Price
-Drag Racing

My car runs 13.50's with leaf springs, 285 35 series Nitto NT555 tires and a 480HP small block. If I can run a 12.99 with the torque arm, I'll be thrilled. John Force I ain't.

[silver69camaro]

My car runs 13.50's with leaf springs, 285 35 series Nitto NT555 tires and a 480HP small block. If I can run a 12.99 with the torque arm, I'll be thrilled. John Force I ain't.

Shouldn't be a problem. Art's '55 ran 12.60 in the 1/4 on 275mm BFG KD tires with our tri 4-bar.

[parsonsj]

I'll add my thoughts on the matter (and muddy the waters more, I'm sure).

Kinematically, a 3 link is functionally equivalent to a 4 link, in terms of suspension behaviors in a straight line. (one caveat: most 3 links use a shorter upper link for packaging reasons) I've never tested it, but Katz tells me that my custom 3 link has some IC settings that will rival a drag-racing 4 link in terms of rear tire "bite" (aka anti-squat). I've never moved my link bars (I have two sets of holes in the lowers, and 3 sets of holes in the upper) to see.

jp

[Patrick]

OK-- the timing of this post is excellent!!!

I completed my car a couple of weeks ago and have taken it to the drags 2 times. I cannot get my car to hook up...60fts are a pathetic 2.12 to 2.24 with a best ET of 11.98. I know that my car is capable of low 11s (maybe high 10s) with a solid 60ft time.

So...I am looking for a set up that will hook at the strip and still let me turn a corner.

What kind of 60ft times are you guys running with your setups?
Can anybody give me before and after examples of their 60ft times?



Thanks,
Patrick

[hotrdblder]

matts correct, anti squat is maxed out at around 62%with the tq arm. Xlexus, needs to clarify what he's looking for, i am pretty sure he wants it to be a pro touring style rear susp, that drags races really well, not a full blown drag race set up.
drag racing was down on the priority list, but hey I think 1.50 short times are quick enough for a dual purpose car
1.full back seat
2.don't cut car all up
3.3 link geometry
4.anyone could install it
5.package it with a quality custom valved shock
6. we nailed it. now we need to show you guys how it works, yes there are compromises as there is with any non race chassis. However, i have 3 cars at my shop at different levels, one stock 68, drum brakes and all, steves twist machine car(art subframe,dse leafs) and my 69 test car, come on over and lets drive them, adjust for different driving style, so you can feel it in the seat of your pants, i promise you will be impressed. You will also get to see it happen in front of your own eyes.
with the adjustable roll center, the car performs all aspects of pro touring nicely(raise phb for autox to loosen rear, which makes a huge difference in autox,lower it down for street and road race and it gives you all the confidence in the world in rear traction), although it does perform better on the road course, street, but its no slouch at the strip, i just added some juice to my test car and will bolt vinnys slicks on, and it will run a high ten with a 450 hp ls motor.
Guys, anyone ins the ne area, I have 2 track days at www.nhis.com at end of october, feel free to come out and watch, and at one of them i can have passengers.
edit-
parsons is right, a good 3 link can be adjusted for more rear bite, but lets be serious even if we put slicks on, will our cars have all the drag race duty parts to not break when hammered, or trans brake'd? no, my tq arm with 60% anti squat, and adjustable phb is more then enough, i have a asa cammed ls6, and with phb in lowest setting, it will not spin tires from a roll, now raise phb up to autox setting(very loose,comes around nicely) it will spin the tires at 15-20 mph, these are toyo r888 r rated tire 100 treadwear, 335/30/18 rear, i will be dragging car once nitrous is hooked at quarter mile, i will leave phb up for autox setting, then lower it for some runs to show adjustability. Thats what pro touring is about right? doing multiple things well.

[hotrdblder]

katz, also likes to run 50-60% as on road race, pro touring set ups(low profile 18 inch tires) as it allows you to get into throttle sooner in the turn then higher anti squat, because the rear tires don't get whacked with a bunch of power,when rolling back on throttle at apex. it allows you to be confident in rear traction, especially for us non race drivers. My tq arm allows you to start driving it on road course alittle tight(more rear traction,gives you more confidence.)then you can loosen the rear susp up little by little till the car is nuetral and as fast thru the turns as it or you(the driver wants to push)it.
For autox you can raise phb 2 inches and makes the rear real loose, which is great in autox, but not as comfortable on the street and too loose for pushing the car on road course.

[DJW32]

Jake,
Do you have any video of your car in action at RTTH? I would like to see how much side to side action there is. Again, you have one killer stance on that car.

David

[hotrdblder]

david, here is some video, as 2nd lap starts, that corner had a little speed and you can see the car stays flat, but still uses the suspension to do its job.
http://good-times.webshots.com/video/3091571180090142134sJdSmc

[gmjj13]

david, here is some video, as 2nd lap starts, that corner had a little speed and you can see the car stays flat, but still uses the suspension to do its job.
http://good-times.webshots.com/video/3091571180090142134sJdSmc

man that was fun!:headbang:

[DJW32]

Jake,
Keep up the good work! That camaro sounds nasty. Thanks for the video.

[killer69]

Well Well Well don't you fidnd it interesting how people have the same ideas at the same time???
we are finishing up our torque arm design to display at sema also

this is the first pic i have seen of Jakes system, and it looks good.

ours also has all the same benifets as listed above.

Jake, i guess minds think alike!

[hotrdblder]

Blake, katz and I started the fabrication last november,and had been designing it all last summer.we had the prototype done since april and has been getting driven in all elements since to make sure there was nothing that needed to be tweaked and to learn how my whole package liked to be tuned for different events. Which btw we have learned a ton and can and can save our customers many events of tuning, as we will get them so close all they need to do is dial shocks to where they like the car to be.
And shock tuning if you know the way you like the car to be, we can get you set up. This is a nice thing about have a test car, as I am sure dse knows, the only down side is the customers get really good quick as they only have to get better at driving and not worry about susp tuning. But that's the fun of all of this is seeing guys flog there cars hard and have fun doing it at events like rtth and goodguys autox
As a side note, we worked with bilstein to come up with a killer valving for our rear susp, it is really dialed in to how we use these cars, if drag racing, and a lot of track days I recomend upgrading to the 6 way adjustable bilsteins, we use 3 as our base valving so you can go softer or firmer depending on how you want chassis set up.6 is open jet and really really aggressive for those open track days

[hotrdblder]

Blake, just to make it clear, there have been pics floating around since early july, I wanted the product to be fully tested in street/road course/autox before going on the boards. My website is being updated now with a ton of updates.
Thanks a lot
Jake

[killer69]

yea it looks good, like i say it is weird how it all comes together at the same time, like with car design how everything follows and evolves at the same time.
our big design thought ( like yours) And honestly had not seen the pics before, was to do something that ANYONE could install no cutting, very little welding and something that works well.

[Rhino]

Maybe it's just my eyes playing tricks on me... but is that an infinitely adjustable axle mount for the panhard bar? If so, that's an ingenious idea.

[hotrdblder]

your eyes are not playing tricks, its a male/female serrated phb mount, so you can fine tune phb placement, without worry's of it moving like a slotted mount.

[ProdigyCustoms]

What kind of 60ft times are you guys running with your setups?
Can anybody give me before and after examples of their 60ft times?

Thanks,
Patrick

OK, I know you wanted to know our short times and I remembered to call this time. Sorry.

I called Bret, his short times were from mid 1.70s to low 1.90s on BFG KDW TA2 tires. We got to the dragstrip real late and only got 2 runs with EmptyNest and had some issues with throttle cable. I was simply to burned out to screw with fixing it and wanted to get home. My short times were 1.92 and 1.88. Those short times were also on pure street tires. Michelin PS2s. I do not know Vinnies short times, but I think they were better then mine by the looks, but he was struggling and has run better.

And as Jake mentioned 1.50 short times, I think Vinnie has been in the 1.50s on slicks with his Air Bar. Pretty damn impressive as my street racer goes 1.50s with a drag race suspension. After SEMA I am putting a Prodigy Bar in my street racer and see what happens to the 60' times, going from ladder bars to the Prodigy Bar. Based on Vinnies 1.50s it looks like it can be done. And the rod ends will surely take the abuse.

[Patrick]

In the end, you have to choose; but it is easier to mount a set of drag slicks to a handling car to have fun at the strip...just don't expect it to 60-ft like a dedicated drag car.
Matt-- I agree with you.

I would really be happy to knock off 1.70s in the 60ft.

I have made so many changes to the car mid-build that I probably could have built two....And here I am again, contemplating change...G-Bar, Quadra Link, or Torque Arm.......


Jake, you really have me interested in the Torque Arm set up if you're pulling 1.50s on a multi-disciplined car. Did you do that with street tires?


Patrick

[Steve Chryssos]

I'll be happy to not wheel hop anymore. I think I can bounce the rear tires over the 60 foot lights. :rotfl:

[hotrdblder]

patrick, no that is with slicks, with a dot r rated tire i would expect 1.60 to 1.80 short times with 500-550 rwhp
it will allow this by the 60% anti squat, the body will soak up some hp, but in our pro touring cars that is a bonus as normally they just go up in smoke, even r rated or a street drag radial.
with the tq arm and its adjustabilty we have built into it, you can have it so the car just hooks and goes, with my 450 hp asa cammed ls6, if phb(roll center) is all the way down, it will not spin the tires froma 10-15 mph roll, now raise the phb up 2 inches(moves roll center/pivot point of the body up) it will spin the tires when wacking it wot at 15 mph, not alot but it does and this is with toyo r888 tires, which once you drive on them you will not ever want to drive a street compound tire, plus who needs tires to last 5 years? you can easily get 2 yrs, 8 k miles out of the r888's unless doing countless trackdays etc the performance they give you accelerating, braking, and confidence in grip is so worth the money.

[XLexusTech]

Just something to chew on... the days of 60 foot times being THE key number in Drag racing are over. Now that the technology in power adders (NO2 turbos, chargers) has increased so much you can run some impressive ET's with a less then steller 60 foot. It all about putting the power to the ground @ the right time ... This lends itself well with ones desire to build a multi purpose car....

[hotrdblder]

Just something to chew on... the days of 60 foot times being THE key number in Drag racing are over. Now that the technology in power adders (NO2 turbos, chargers) has increased so much you can run some impressive ET's with a less then steller 60 foot. It all about putting the power to the ground @ the right time ... This lends itself well with ones desire to build a multi purpose car....
well said....
vinnys got a drag day in novemeber where temps are cool, he should be in the nines on a 200 shot,

[silver69camaro]

Just something to chew on... the days of 60 foot times being THE key number in Drag racing are over.

I disagree. I understand what you are saying, leave soft off the line and pull hard up top. But really, even the guys who do that still hook extremely hard. In order to pull off a quick ET with big turbos, you need as much forward momentum as you can when the power starts to kick in or slippage will result.

But say you have an engine built to do just that. How is that a Pro-Touring engine? How can you control that much power leaving the apex? I think that mentality got into the street car crowd (I'm not talking about the Fastest Street Cars) for two reasons:
1. More power is always better.
2. They didn't know how to get the car to hook hard in the first place.

To me, building a car that does everything (drag, street, road course) is like a new Shelby Mustang. It does everything with decent results, but isn't really stellar in any particular category. Take a 911 Turbo; sucks at the drag strip but kicks ass on the curves. Which do you think is more fun to drive?

[ProdigyCustoms]

Really, all the ET is in the first 60'. MPH, that is a different thing., You can MPH even with a car that spins.

[hotrdblder]

guys, i think what he is saying is 1.60-1.80 short times can get you some killer et's, not the 1.35-1.40 dedicated drag car 60 ft times

[XLexusTech]

guys, i think what he is saying is 1.60-1.80 short times can get you some killer et's, not the 1.35-1.40 dedicated drag car 60 ft times

Yes my point is that you can run a very respectable ET without a killer 60 foot. Making a camaro 60 foot is not rocket science a set of caltracs and some 1990's suspension tweaks on you can pull a 10.0 with a 1.40 60 foot. Been there done that. Now would I want to drive that same car in an autocross.. Nope... But if you can build a car that will 60 foot in 1.55 and ET a 10.0 and you can blast it down the autocross your doing something. Again applying power at the right time is key.

This will effectivly mean making more power then the suspension can handle under full power from a stand still.


BTW to answer the question regarding control over the power that is the point of the mention of the tech advances. Boost controllers, NOS controllers (or just closing the valve when not drag racing). Not trying to over simplify here but I think you get the point.

[hotrdblder]

Just to clarify, here are some random shots of my shop car, in action, testing product in all aspects of pro touring. learning how the car likes to be set up in each, as well as learning different driving styles for different conditions. Which in the end, pays off for my customers, as I leap them way ahead in the learning curve of performance driving.
heres the car at www.lecircuit.com track day.8/4/08
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/08/200808040694-1.jpg
heres the track
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/CMTareal-1.jpg
here it is at one of the many local autox's I have done.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/08/IMG_1674-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_1721-1.jpg
here a shot of the stance, notice lca angle
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/08/IMG_1657-1.jpg
pic from RTTH4
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_2371-1.jpg
side view ground clearance with 3 inch exhaust front to back
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_1585-1.jpg
cruising last 80 miles to rtth4 with steve from twist machine on rt 40
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_2757-1.jpg
Drag racing at rtth4
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_2418-1.jpg
random shot from autox at rtth4
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/10/IMG_2377-1.jpg

[Marcus SC&C]

You can have both dig at the drags AND great handling. You just can`t have it yet... Ha! Seriously all of the systems discussed are pretty darn good. As a dead ringer for the Griggs Racing Mustang torque arm system I`d expect the Jakes system to work really good as well. As some have pointed out for a serious drag race suspension you need to have adj. anti squat, IC location etc. though. The soon to be released G-Link should do extremely well in both worlds. It`s basically a cross between the G-Bar which is well proven on the road course and Alstons Eliminator II drag race 4 link which is very well proven in Super Gas,Super Comp and ProMod. They narrowed the settings down to ones you might actually use,which also helped packaging but it`s still got the largest range of adjustment I`ve seen in any of these systems. So you can dial it in for minimal roll steer for the road course,more anti squat for coming out of the turns in auto cross or set the anti squat on "KILL" for the drags all in a few minutes. It`s also the only system discussed here available with a frame mounted (less unsprung weight) adj. rate anti roll bar to tune the oversteer/understeer and aid in launching flat at the drags. The arms use greasable delrin race Center Pivot joints with the movement range and precision of a heim but with much better NVH isolation and OE longevity. No cutting required for installation. Can you tell I`m excited about this one? :) The only problem with it is that we can only take pre orders right now,the 1st Gen version won`t ship (except for some early pre orders) until SEMA. Doh! Pre orders will be locked in at the advertised pre order price though,which will be going up as soon as regular orders start shipping. Mark SC&C

[DJW32]

Jake,
Who is Katz? Their name has been used here a couple of times.

[hotrdblder]

sorry, post again in a min, keyboard is screwed

[parsonsj]

Katz Tsubai was the engineer at Art Morrison. He left there to work at Lateral Dynamics. From there, he consulted for some racers at various road courses.

He knows suspension design, and is the designer of the front and rear suspension of II Much. He and I worked together with many others, chiefly Brian Schein, to design and fabricate my stuff.

Lately, he's been working with Jake, so I'll let Jake tell you about his relationship with Katz in recent years.

jp

[hotrdblder]

Katz is Katz Tsubai. He is one of the, if not THE top suspension design expert in our pro-touring community and other road racing oriented message boards. You can check out some of his posts by looking up his member sn here saltracer. He's worked for a couple of top name pro-touring suspension companies but, like most guys who are the best at what they do does better working for himself as a consultant. He is responsible for most of the engineering work on my front subframe and my torque arm rear suspension. He has a thorough understanding of designing systems for our multi purpose pro touring hot rods. And I'm blown way by how dead on his designs work in the real world. He's on the road right now, but he should be available in the near future to answer any engineering specific questions. All design work was done in Win Geo. As john said above, he designed the suspension on II Much and a few other other private builds. As far as I'm concerned Katz is the best there is, everything he has worked with me on is dead on, and acts just as he describes. thats what i like best about him, is he is a susp engineer, however he is a driver also, so he puts what he feels when he's driving and what works best into his designs. Not what he THINKS works best on paper.
katz and I have a good relationship, and it works for the both of us and where we are going.

[Travis B]

This thread is why I chose to go with the Jakes Rod Shop Apex chassis and rear tq arm. Not only are they easy on the eye, but they work better then they look, and the engineering and testing is there to back it up. Stay tuned for my chevelle build.......
Travis

[77ztwo8]

Jake,

Do have a 3 link system for the 2nd generation camaros?

[MoparCar]

Jake,

Do have a 3 link system for the 2nd generation camaros?

How about Mopars? E-bodies? Is it universal enough to modify for other uses?
Thanks

[hotrdblder]

mopar, yes it is very universal. please contact me thru emails or pm's.
I have 2nd gen tq arm kits.

[ITLBTU]

Where were you guys last year? I have been posting requests for a torque arm setup for 2 years... I think. I'm getting old so I may be exaggerating. I have the G-Bar now. I guess I should have waited. My traction off the line has room for a ton of improvement. I'm guessing I have somewhere between 400hp-500hp. I would guess that my 60' times would be in the 3 sec. range...

[Patrick]

I'm getting old so I may be exaggerating. ..... my 60' times would be in the 3 sec. range...

3 seconds!?!?! I hope you're exaggerating.


Did you not see this-- the yellow car hooks big time with a G Bar.

http://detroitspeed.com/video/autocross-ride-drag.htm

[Damn True]

Jake/Katz,

In regards to shock tuning would the requirements of the Q-arm be similar to that of LD 3-Link?

Same question but regarding spring rates?

[hotrdblder]

similer, but you need to take corner weights, motion ratio etc into consideration, but if i can help just let me know.
jake

[Damn True]

Thanks. I'll be hitting you and Katz up for some help there.

I should'a said shock valving.

[ITLBTU]

3 seconds!?!?! I hope you're exaggerating.


Did you not see this-- the yellow car hooks big time with a G Bar.

http://detroitspeed.com/video/autocross-ride-drag.htm

Well, the last time I had the Camaro at the strip it was 2.3 sec 60' time. My et was 13.2 @ 106mph with a 3.08 posi. That was with leaf springs,BFG Radial TA's, and a TH400 and cast heads. Now with my new alum heads, 3" exhaust, 5sp light flywheel, and 17" wheels with 285/40 Goodyears and the G-bar, on the street I have far less traction than before. I think I'm making at least 50hp-75hp more with the new heads/ headers and 3" exhaust. Not to mention another 15%-20% to the wheels because of the transmission swap. The TH400 was a power hog. My rear ratio is still the same.

[BBPanel]

Any plans for a 2nd gen X-Body? Do you have pictures of the torque arm off the vehicle? -Bob

[hotrdblder]

yes there is, as this canbe adapted very easily to different platforms.
i just got my laser cut parts and am building tq arms for stock as we speak. I will get some photos of the kit laid out for you in the next day or two, and i will be doing a release.
please email me bbpanel
[email protected]

[BBPanel]

...please email me bbpanel [email protected] email sent 10/6 - no reply?

[hotrdblder]

please send it again, some emails have been going to junk email folder,i have caught some but i may have missed some also, sorry for inconvenience.
or pm me here to get started, feel free to call anytime
jake

[BBPanel]

please send it again, some emails have been going to junk email folder,i have caught some but i may have missed some also, sorry for inconvenience. or pm me here to get started, feel free to call anytime jake Resent email - thanks. -Bob

[BillyShope]

The lat d 3 link, while adjustable is not really set up for drag racing.


Yes, I would agree, but, by using the trick Jaguar used with their early C-Types, the 3link becomes an excellent compromise.

Jaguar merely offset the upper link to the right. When properly done, this can result in equal rear tire loading during forward acceleration with any value of driveshaft torque. This is an optimum condition for the dragstrip and, obviously, Jaguar considered it important at Le Mans.

A compromise on antisquat would probably be needed. At the dragstrip, 100% is desirable, but, while "corner carving," some wheel hop during braking would be likely with that much antisquat. So, some squat would be involved in the dragstrip compromise.

My site provides a spreadsheet for 3link setup, but, unfortunately, it's for 100% antisquat. One of these days, I might allow the user to input an antisquat figure. Wait a minute! I just realized that all that might be necessary is a "lie" about the center of gravity height. I'm pretty certain that, if you input a CG height that corresponds to the desired % antisquat, the output will give you what you want. In other words, you'll have the equal rear tire loading, but with squat. (There'll be some oscillatory loading, of course.)

http://home.earthlink.net/~whshope

[XLexusTech]

Just added that tto my Fav links. Now back to reading. Holy cow the great info that is there.!

A+++