Ponitac power steering line

[ho428]

Got an interference coming off the pump, using an inverted flare to -06 adapter and -06 90 fitting.
It hits the head at the header flange.
I cannot find an inverted flare -06 90 fitting, don't think it's made.

Suggestions?

Can the pump be drilled and tapped NPT?

[andrewb70]

What hoses are you using for the power steering? It looks like regular rubber, braided steel lines.

Andrew

[gearheads78]

What hoses are you using for the power steering? It looks like regular rubber, braided steel lines.

Andrew

Thats what I was thinking. You need to look at high pressure hose and fitting designed for high pressure hydraulic use.

A 45 fitting might help the clearance problem

[ho428]

I just got off the phone with Earls as they listed a low profile 90, but it's only 1/8" difference. 45 wouldn't even go on.

They confirmed what you guys said though, I need to change the pressure side hose and fittings. Return is ok.
But, they still didn't have an answer to the clearence issue.

[gearheads78]

How about this. Its all one piece. That will give you a ton more clearance. Not sure if this is right size for your pump but you get the idea.

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM1392&N=700+115&autoview=sku

[andrewb70]

Go to a local industrial hydraulic hose maker and see the steel fittings that they have available. I bet the crimp style fittings are lower profile than what you have there.

Andrew

[ho428]

I'm going to take what I made to the local line shop tomorrow and see what they can do. It's a race car so I don't really care if it matches, I just didn't want the factory rubber lines.
If that doesn't work I have an old factory line. Steel sharp 90 coming out, I might could cut it at the rubber, put a -06 nut on it and have it flared for the -06 fitting.

I posted a couple of weeks ago about running these lines, never got a reply, sure could have used this info then, would have saved a world of grief, not to mention money spent on fittings and lines.
Oh well, parts for the spare parts pile now.

[NEokcTERROR]

Problem solved. Aeroquip FBM4042 is a 120deg fitting. Fitting degree listing are so assbackwards. A 45deg fitting is really 135deg. 120deg fitting is really a 60deg. etc.

Type the number into www.summitracing.com (http://www.summitracing.com) and there'sa good pic of it.

[andrewb70]

Problem solved. Aeroquip FBM4042 is a 120deg fitting. Fitting degree listing are so assbackwards. A 45deg fitting is really 135deg. 120deg fitting is really a 60deg. etc.

Type the number into www.summitracing.com (http://www.summitracing.com) and there'sa good pic of it.

That is not the right fitting for high pressure power steering hose. Fitting names are right. Take the 120 degree fiting above. Follow the fluid path. It goes straight, then the fitting turns 120 degrees away from the original flow.

Andrew

[ho428]

This is turning into a real PITA. Local hose shop doesn't have the inverted flare size I need, nor fittings for braided hose, just rubber. I'd run a stock pressure hose before running a fabricated rubber line.

The guy at Earls was no help either, all he said was I would have to make something up, jeez man that's why I called you.

I cannot be the first person to try and install braided lines on a Pontiac power steering. There's got to be an answer out there somewhere.
Someone on this board posted about a month ago where they installed PS lines, I tried a search but couldn't find it again. Anyone?

[gearbanger]

I had this same probelm trying to use stainless hoses on my pontiac. I probably didn't take the easy way but I ended up adapting a late model ps pump to my car and using the stainless hoses. I never could find a hose fitting that would clear the head and allow me to use the stainless hoses with the early model PS pump.

[ho428]

I just got back from Clements racing, they build a lot of engines complete with dry sump and PS attached ready to drop in. Their shop is about 1/2 mile from here, Jeremy runs in the Nationwide series.

Anyway they gave me a non swivel short radius 90 that is about 1/4" shorter, that will probably clear, he said they run aluminum AN fittings, showed me the whole pegboard wall of them, but if I was concerned I could get a steel inverted flare adapter for the pump and gearbox. To me that's the weakest link anyway.
He said they have no issues running the lines and fittings I have on the pressure side, he showed me a row of engines all with standard aluminum AN fittings. They run high temps and pressure through the braided rubber lines.
So for now I'll put it together and see what happens.

[gearheads78]

This is turning into a real PITA. Local hose shop doesn't have the inverted flare size I need, nor fittings for braided hose, just rubber. I'd run a stock pressure hose before running a fabricated rubber line.

The guy at Earls was no help either, all he said was I would have to make something up, jeez man that's why I called you.

I cannot be the first person to try and install braided lines on a Pontiac power steering. There's got to be an answer out there somewhere.
Someone on this board posted about a month ago where they installed PS lines, I tried a search but couldn't find it again. Anyone?

Did you miss what I posted above? What size is the inverted flare you need? Aeroquip makes this in a few different flare sizes.

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=AER%2DFBM1392&N=700+115&autoview=sku

[ho428]

That fitting would probably work ok. The 120 would not and would still need an adapter.

I'll put it together with what I have so I can get it running, but next order I have from Summit I'll probably order the steel fittings.

[Mike Holleman]

The fitting pictured is an Aeroquip TFE -6. Came from Paul at Hydratech. TFE is teflon with SS braid. This is on my 421 Pontiac. Std. pump on a March system. Hope it helps. Sorry for the poor quality.

[Mike Holleman]

Had to resize.

[NEokcTERROR]

That is not the right fitting for high pressure power steering hose. Fitting names are right. Take the 120 degree fiting above. Follow the fluid path. It goes straight, then the fitting turns 120 degrees away from the original flow.

Andrew

True on the degree discussion. I should have made myself more clear. I think you know what I meant anyway.

Now as for the fitting working properly in this application. This pumps specs as follows concerning internal bypass pressure specs: 1,000 to 1,250. Operating pressure 80-125psi engine running static no load. My own experience with a pressure gauge shows maximum working pressure of 500PSI turning the steering wheel with the engine running while standing on the brakes. The only time I see over the 500psi range is with the wheels at full lock. This fitting and corresponding hose is rated at 1,000psi working pressure continuous. In a nutshell the fitting and hose is at the edge of safe, but if you never just lean on the steering wheel against the locks everything is within tolerable limits.

[MrQuick]

how about a longer belt?? Would that help?

[ho428]

how about a longer belt?? Would that help?

I picked up a 1/2" longer belt yesterday, between that and the shorter 90 it clears, I'll still change the adapter to a steel fitting and probably order the steel 90 with inverted flare to see if it will replace both fittings at the pump.
I don't like running an adapter off the pump anyway, the extra fittings and vibration with pressurized fluid aiming right at the headers just seems to be asking for trouble. :drive2:

[MrQuick]

I picked up a 1/2" longer belt yesterday, between that and the shorter 90 it clears, I'll still change the adapter to a steel fitting and probably order the steel 90 with inverted flare to see if it will replace both fittings at the pump.
I don't like running an adapter off the pump anyway, the extra fittings and vibration with pressurized fluid aiming right at the headers just seems to be asking for trouble. :drive2: no doubt, better than over the collecter!!! :eek:

[ho428]

It clears ok now, but like I said though, that aluminum adapter has got to go, but for now I can start adding all the fluids to fire it up.

Thanks for all the input guys. I was kinda :banghead: on this car lately. Some days it fights you, other days it goes smooth.

[paul67]

can you not make spacer plates so that they pump moves out from the engine ie towaeds the fender.