ProdigyCustoms
07-18-2008, 01:55 AM
The new and improved Project EmptyNest is ready and rolling. It’s a long story, but the original plan for EmptyNest was a sheetmetal tuned port style front TB intake with Ram Air, paying tribute to the “Ram Air” so famous on early Pontiacs. Well, long story short, a intake company whom shall remain nameless bailed on us 3 weeks before the show letting us know they would not be able to finish the intake. Yes, I hate them now! So here is the BIG problem with not getting the intake. The only intake made for these raised port Tiger heads is a 13” tall single dominator drag race intake which was not going to fit under the stock TA hood very well. So we welded in some injector bungs and wacked 3” off the intake, stuck a dominator T Body on it and a air cleaner lid.
So we had to ditch the “Ram Air” idea, and also ditched the idea of driving in door at the show as it was not going to run with this set up. It simply would not work. As it turned out there were other issues that would have prevented us from running anyway. Problems that come along with using prototype products, like the engine block and heads. No big deal. There is no shame in not running at SEMA. It is not uncommon for the best cars at SEMA to be rollers. One of my friends won the GM award of Excellence with no radiator hose, among other things, LOL!
So after SEMA we had some other show commitments for December and January we did with our “dummy” motor and intake set up. We then took the engine back out for final machining and dyno time. I contacted Tim at Hogan’s about making a intake for us. Tim is a craftsmen, a artist, a mad scientist of sorts, and a true gentleman that meets his deadlines and commitments! Tim and I dreamed up what is probably one of his baddest intakes ever. What he made us is a dual throttle body, twin plenum, cross ram, long runner concoction that is simply incredible. The cross ram design and 13” long runner is great for torque, but keeps the overall height the same as a tall intake and T body set up. We used twin Accufab “Viper” 70MM T Bodies and thru a little 400HP shot of NX fogger nitrous on for good measure! I cannot say enough about the intake. It is one of those things that when it came in, I just wanted to be alone in a room with it for a while, LOL! I brought it home and set it on my desk while I waited for the engine to come back from the machine shop.
So about the engine. So remember my comment above about prototype parts! Well, we got a pretty good dose of prototype pain with the engine. We REALLY wanted to keep this thing ALL PONTAIC and have already received much praise for doing so. But wanting to build the most exotic street Pontiac ever was a chore. Our friends at All Pontiac provided us with one of the few aluminum blocks ever made. All these blocks are pre production prototypes made from temporary molds. The raised port Tiger cylinder heads are also prototype. So with prototype comes R and D. Well let me tell you, I had not planned it, but right now I am one of the worlds foremost authority on these engines, LOL! I have to thank my engine builder Dave Hartman of Hartbeat Racing Engines in Mount Dora, Florida. Dave fought through all these “R and D” issues to give us a bad ass motor. Most engine builders would have thrown me out of their shop early in the build. It was frustrating at best as so many things were SO CUSTOM! Every time we turned around we had to have a special part made.
The All Pontiac guys are working towards production pieces and with some of the things we did they may be even closer now to final product. When they do get the final product, they will have some bad hombres on hand! Dave Butler of Butler Performance also played a huge part in getting this motor finished. Dave took unlimited calls, including nights and weekends, from me and my builder. Dave is truly one of the “good guys” in this industry and comes highly recommended. Thanks Dave.
So we got the engine done and went to the all important dyno 2 weeks ago, 10 days before Street machine of the Year in Columbus. The dyno numbers are encouraging but unfortunately come with a asterisk. So we ran the motor in for 30 minutes. Good oil pressure, no temp problems, no weird noises. We had the timing set REALLY conservative at 32 degrees. It is a 11.2:1 compression motor and we wanted to be really safe and make sure there was no detonation. The air fuel was super fat, 11.0 actually. We were using the massacred dominator intake we sawed 3” off for SEMA, and a borrowed dominator off a 600 CI dragster that was way too big.
So after 20 minutes we decided to make a short pull to 5500RPMs (it’s a 7200 RPM motor) and see how she does. Look everything over then make the big pulls. So right from 3000 RPM sustained the dyno operator throttles down and made the 5500 RPM pull. You can here is laughing in the video as we blew through 6000 HP at 5000 RPMs already and we had not turned up the timing, leaned out the carb, or ran it to redline. It was pretty obvious she would make some power. So this is the beginning of the asterisk! So the results at 5500RPM were 610 HP (way fat and real low on timing) and 645TQ at 4200 RPM.
So we shut it down, pull the valve covers to check lash………………………… MILKSHAKE! Water in the oil! The head studs are seeping. Now this is not uncommon for all aluminum motors and nothing alumiseal would not fix. BTW, in the car alumiseal worked fine). But the dyno runs a self contained water system, and alumiseal on the dyno was not a option. We had a lot of conversation and decided the oil was not diluted enough to have hurt anything, but we were not going to make a Hail Mary pull on it either on that oil. For a few moments we decided to change the oil, make a quick pull, get a big number and go home. I sent Michael to the parts store for oil while I drained the motor. Having a few minutes to think clearly, just me and the motor in the dyno room, I thought………………… this has been a long 4 moths fighting this thing to finally get it done. SMOY is 10 days away! Why the hell do you want to torture this thing and risk a bigger problem and possibly miss the show. We know the big number is going to be stupid anyway…………….. So I called Michael back and took the engine off the dyno and brought it home after the one pass.
So that is the asterisk. The what if? What could it make? Since TQ is a low RPM number, we probably got an accurate number to build from. The experts all agree, Had the timing been higher (38-39 is probably more like it) and the air fuel correct (proper size carb and not ruined intake would help), the experts agree we should have seen 675 + for TQ. Because the intake was so short, and the carb so big, we all agreed 700 + TQ would be possible, but again, this is all speculation. For horsepower, it was climbing at a fast rate so it only makes sense we would easily see 700+ with another 1700 RPMs of pull. Good intake? Good carb? 750? Probably, but again all speculation and I like to deal in facts.
It doesn’t really matter. At the end of the day it is a nasty motor with more power then the pour little 345 / 30 / 19s can hold anyway! And there is 400HP of giggle gas to make up for any other short comings!
Also, we made a couple other changes to. I pretty much hated the shadow box instrument cluster we had in the car at SEMA, so we made a new dash. Also, we had to redo the trunk and fit some 3LB nitrous bottles in. These little bottles are teed together and are probably good for 1 pass at 400HP, or a few passes at 100 - 150HP. I did not want to fill the entire trunk with a huge bottle. I seriously doubt we will grab the nitrous very often anyway.
So here are a couple videos, firing it up at the day we left for Columbus, the dyno pull 10 days before Columbus, and another of Scott Pruitt driving it around the autocross.
And of coarse some pictures of the new and improved Project EmptyNest.
Enjoy.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
Posing before going in the car. 535CI
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
Me likey!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03053.flv)
Yeah, that's me laughing!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03107.flv)
Firing it up. Yeah, I am tired after a all nighter! But so happy it just fired and ran on the FI!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03113.flv)
Sweet music
So we had to ditch the “Ram Air” idea, and also ditched the idea of driving in door at the show as it was not going to run with this set up. It simply would not work. As it turned out there were other issues that would have prevented us from running anyway. Problems that come along with using prototype products, like the engine block and heads. No big deal. There is no shame in not running at SEMA. It is not uncommon for the best cars at SEMA to be rollers. One of my friends won the GM award of Excellence with no radiator hose, among other things, LOL!
So after SEMA we had some other show commitments for December and January we did with our “dummy” motor and intake set up. We then took the engine back out for final machining and dyno time. I contacted Tim at Hogan’s about making a intake for us. Tim is a craftsmen, a artist, a mad scientist of sorts, and a true gentleman that meets his deadlines and commitments! Tim and I dreamed up what is probably one of his baddest intakes ever. What he made us is a dual throttle body, twin plenum, cross ram, long runner concoction that is simply incredible. The cross ram design and 13” long runner is great for torque, but keeps the overall height the same as a tall intake and T body set up. We used twin Accufab “Viper” 70MM T Bodies and thru a little 400HP shot of NX fogger nitrous on for good measure! I cannot say enough about the intake. It is one of those things that when it came in, I just wanted to be alone in a room with it for a while, LOL! I brought it home and set it on my desk while I waited for the engine to come back from the machine shop.
So about the engine. So remember my comment above about prototype parts! Well, we got a pretty good dose of prototype pain with the engine. We REALLY wanted to keep this thing ALL PONTAIC and have already received much praise for doing so. But wanting to build the most exotic street Pontiac ever was a chore. Our friends at All Pontiac provided us with one of the few aluminum blocks ever made. All these blocks are pre production prototypes made from temporary molds. The raised port Tiger cylinder heads are also prototype. So with prototype comes R and D. Well let me tell you, I had not planned it, but right now I am one of the worlds foremost authority on these engines, LOL! I have to thank my engine builder Dave Hartman of Hartbeat Racing Engines in Mount Dora, Florida. Dave fought through all these “R and D” issues to give us a bad ass motor. Most engine builders would have thrown me out of their shop early in the build. It was frustrating at best as so many things were SO CUSTOM! Every time we turned around we had to have a special part made.
The All Pontiac guys are working towards production pieces and with some of the things we did they may be even closer now to final product. When they do get the final product, they will have some bad hombres on hand! Dave Butler of Butler Performance also played a huge part in getting this motor finished. Dave took unlimited calls, including nights and weekends, from me and my builder. Dave is truly one of the “good guys” in this industry and comes highly recommended. Thanks Dave.
So we got the engine done and went to the all important dyno 2 weeks ago, 10 days before Street machine of the Year in Columbus. The dyno numbers are encouraging but unfortunately come with a asterisk. So we ran the motor in for 30 minutes. Good oil pressure, no temp problems, no weird noises. We had the timing set REALLY conservative at 32 degrees. It is a 11.2:1 compression motor and we wanted to be really safe and make sure there was no detonation. The air fuel was super fat, 11.0 actually. We were using the massacred dominator intake we sawed 3” off for SEMA, and a borrowed dominator off a 600 CI dragster that was way too big.
So after 20 minutes we decided to make a short pull to 5500RPMs (it’s a 7200 RPM motor) and see how she does. Look everything over then make the big pulls. So right from 3000 RPM sustained the dyno operator throttles down and made the 5500 RPM pull. You can here is laughing in the video as we blew through 6000 HP at 5000 RPMs already and we had not turned up the timing, leaned out the carb, or ran it to redline. It was pretty obvious she would make some power. So this is the beginning of the asterisk! So the results at 5500RPM were 610 HP (way fat and real low on timing) and 645TQ at 4200 RPM.
So we shut it down, pull the valve covers to check lash………………………… MILKSHAKE! Water in the oil! The head studs are seeping. Now this is not uncommon for all aluminum motors and nothing alumiseal would not fix. BTW, in the car alumiseal worked fine). But the dyno runs a self contained water system, and alumiseal on the dyno was not a option. We had a lot of conversation and decided the oil was not diluted enough to have hurt anything, but we were not going to make a Hail Mary pull on it either on that oil. For a few moments we decided to change the oil, make a quick pull, get a big number and go home. I sent Michael to the parts store for oil while I drained the motor. Having a few minutes to think clearly, just me and the motor in the dyno room, I thought………………… this has been a long 4 moths fighting this thing to finally get it done. SMOY is 10 days away! Why the hell do you want to torture this thing and risk a bigger problem and possibly miss the show. We know the big number is going to be stupid anyway…………….. So I called Michael back and took the engine off the dyno and brought it home after the one pass.
So that is the asterisk. The what if? What could it make? Since TQ is a low RPM number, we probably got an accurate number to build from. The experts all agree, Had the timing been higher (38-39 is probably more like it) and the air fuel correct (proper size carb and not ruined intake would help), the experts agree we should have seen 675 + for TQ. Because the intake was so short, and the carb so big, we all agreed 700 + TQ would be possible, but again, this is all speculation. For horsepower, it was climbing at a fast rate so it only makes sense we would easily see 700+ with another 1700 RPMs of pull. Good intake? Good carb? 750? Probably, but again all speculation and I like to deal in facts.
It doesn’t really matter. At the end of the day it is a nasty motor with more power then the pour little 345 / 30 / 19s can hold anyway! And there is 400HP of giggle gas to make up for any other short comings!
Also, we made a couple other changes to. I pretty much hated the shadow box instrument cluster we had in the car at SEMA, so we made a new dash. Also, we had to redo the trunk and fit some 3LB nitrous bottles in. These little bottles are teed together and are probably good for 1 pass at 400HP, or a few passes at 100 - 150HP. I did not want to fill the entire trunk with a huge bottle. I seriously doubt we will grab the nitrous very often anyway.
So here are a couple videos, firing it up at the day we left for Columbus, the dyno pull 10 days before Columbus, and another of Scott Pruitt driving it around the autocross.
And of coarse some pictures of the new and improved Project EmptyNest.
Enjoy.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
Posing before going in the car. 535CI
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
Me likey!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03053.flv)
Yeah, that's me laughing!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03107.flv)
Firing it up. Yeah, I am tired after a all nighter! But so happy it just fired and ran on the FI!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://s169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/ProdigyCustoms/?action=view¤t=MOV03113.flv)
Sweet music