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View Full Version : Speed Ventures @ Buttonwillow - March 11th & April 15th



Salt Racer
02-08-2005, 10:18 AM
Anybody up for a Buttonwillow event? Carl? JonB? Spanky?

http://www.speedventures.net/2005_Schedule.asp

Both Mean69 and I are plannning to do one of these two events. Don't know which one yet. We'll let you guys know as soon as we decide.

I got the official blessing to run in white group from John Wurth, so I'll be in either white or yellow. I'd like to be in different group than Mark's so I can ride shotgun with him and help sort out his car.

My Riv will have extra 30~40 hp, stickier tires, and less severe understeer.

If anyone new wants to try, don't be shy! All you really need is a basically safe, street-legal car with 3pt. or more seat belts (unless you have a convertible) and a helmet. You don't need 500hp motor or trick suspension, though I do recommend having decent brake system. Here's the link to tech form http://www.speedventures.net/tech.htm

Registration is open for March event.

alcino
02-09-2005, 01:22 PM
I'm up for either of the dates. The last time (and the first time) I went to a speed ventures was the Dec 17, 2004 and I was the only old school car there. Still had fun, but I felt a little out of place around the new corvettes and G35 infinities. Would definitely like to go if I knew there would be some people from here going.

MrQuick
02-09-2005, 11:14 PM
Hey Katz, what type of and how many groups, do they class but mods or experience? Dennis, Allen, this would be a great bachelor party for me!?!? I just may dust off the 3rd gen and do some concrete body work... Katz is that 30hp or 150lbs???? jk

zbugger
02-09-2005, 11:25 PM
heh... Which one? Let me know. I think I may be able to pull one of them off. If I can afford it.

Salt Racer
02-10-2005, 06:40 AM
alcino,
Excellent! I'll see you at the track.

Vince,
You're getting married, huh? Congrats!
Usually there are four groups - red, blue, white and yellow (school). It's more of an experience thing, but people with faster cars are sometimes asked to move up the group (like JonB w/ his 600+hp Firebird). First timers have to run in yellow. If you've done OT a couple of times before, they'll probably let you run in white group.

I just got a custom ground Comp cam, fresh set of heads, and a pair of shorty headers (this is more of weight saving than hp increse). I hope I can button everything up in time.

MrQuick
02-10-2005, 06:23 PM
Damn, I can only go on weekend events. Yep getting the big "W". She deserves it, she put up with all my crape (and its been alot) and she still loves me. I hear it all changes after but I've been through worst...plus she loves cars and hasn't complaint about me working on them.
Anyways have fun guys. Does speed ventures allow non registered cars? Insured but not up to date due to smog.

Salt Racer
02-11-2005, 07:31 AM
Common interest is a good thing, especially on hobbies that are expensive and involved. Congrats to you two!

SV will let you run non-registered cars, as long as you tow it to the track. There were several not-so-street-legal cars running at SOWS.

Steve1968LS2
02-11-2005, 08:01 AM
Anybody up for a Buttonwillow event? Carl? JonB? Spanky?

http://www.speedventures.net/2005_Schedule.asp

Both Mean69 and I are plannning to do one of these two events. Don't know which one yet. We'll let you guys know as soon as we decide.

I got the official blessing to run in white group from John Wurth, so I'll be in either white or yellow. I'd like to be in different group than Mark's so I can ride shotgun with him and help sort out his car.

My Riv will have extra 30~40 hp, sticker tires, and less severe understeer.

If anyone new wants to try, don't be shy! All you really need is a basically safe, street-legal car with 3pt. or more seat belts (unless you have a convertible) and a helmet. You don't need 500hp motor or trick suspension, though I do recommend having decent brake system. Here's the link to tech form http://www.speedventures.net/tech.htm

Registration is open for March event.

I wonder if my car will be done by then?? So its basicly an open track event, right?

Mean 69
02-11-2005, 08:38 AM
I wonder if my car will be done by then too!!!!! Yikes, tons of stupid little demons.

The Speedventures guys seem to be really happy with the way their events run. I went to the Decmber event at Cal Speedway, which was coincident with the Japan GT cars. The open track event was pretty messed up as a result of the JGT guys, etc, most of the guys were not happy at all. In general, they run really well I guess. I met some nice guys, seemed like a good bunch, and they put on a LOT of events.

To give you an idea of what you might expect to need to run in the red (advanced) group, well, there were a bunch or Radical's out there which have a unreal power to weight ratio, two Porsche GT3 Cup cars, in fact one of them ran at Daytona 24 Hour last weekend, and some other very, very fast cars. You can learn a whole bunch from these guys. Alot of them are cc.com'ers.

Mark

Salt Racer
02-11-2005, 09:04 AM
...So its basicly an open track event, right?

Yup.


...I wonder if my car will be done by then too!!!!!

Me three!! Should we shoot for April 15th event? It's up to you guys.

SV event at Streets of Willow ran really well. LOTS of track time for guys in upper three groups (Five 25-min sessions!! for each group). That was the first time SV tried school thing so I only got two 15-min solo sessions but it still was fun. Now school group (aka, yellow) has three or four 15-min sessions.

A bunch of good guys, too.

Steve1968LS2
02-11-2005, 09:42 AM
April 15th sounds doable..

I used to run my 2000 SS at buttonwillow whenever I could and I did pretty good.. the 69 will be a whole new deal..

I like Buttonwillow because there is really nothing to hit.. mostly.. ;)

PAI Racing
02-11-2005, 02:19 PM
I'll go as Mean69s Crew. I am hoping to have my hot-rod sold by then so I can buy a GT1 car.

Salt Racer
02-11-2005, 03:57 PM
GT1 car!? :jawdrop: Wow, you're getting serious!

April 15th started to look better for me. Aluminum rod ends I ordered for rear stabar got delayed, and the starter just died (another reason to hate automatic tranny). I might as well spend a little more and get a mini starter to save few pounds from driver side.

See you guys at the track!

Mean 69
02-11-2005, 04:27 PM
Katz, if you spank my car with yours, my ego will take a huge blow to say the least! Not a knock whatsoever on your car, but the new motor has at least an extra 100 HP, the car weighs less, and I have far bigger tires (and brakes too, if I can ever get the darned things to work!!!). The results could be just devastating!

All in good humor, but truthfully I'll just be happy to make it there and not have anything go terribly wrong.

If Sean scores the car he wants, well, all bets are off. Forever. Words cannot describe how vicious it is.

Hey! This is getting motivating! I might try to make both events if things turn for the better this weekend with the silly brakes. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Yeah baby!
Mark

Q ship
02-11-2005, 06:20 PM
Well my car will NOT be ready, but I wanna get over there anyways, just to socialize with you guys. I'll be at whatever date y'all decide on!

Salt Racer
02-12-2005, 07:04 PM
Katz, if you spank my car with yours....

If I did, you owe me a frosty beer.

Nah, that ain't gonna happen once you get the hang of your car so don't worry about it. Either way, I vote for the idea of after-event beer & pizza get together.

My prediction (or actually my optimistic personal goal)...
My best lap time will be within four seconds of Mark's.


I wish I can make it to the March event. I still want to go to that tire seminar too. I should be able to get my car ready in time IF all parts arrive in timely manner. We'll see...

CarlC
02-14-2005, 12:45 AM
I'll pencil in April 15.

dennis68
02-14-2005, 06:36 AM
I think I can be ready for the April event (I hope, I hope, I hope). I'll reserve a spot anyway.

Salt Racer
02-14-2005, 06:41 AM
Well damn, then I too will shoot for April 15th.

I guess I'll miss the tire seminar, but I can work on my car at more leisurely pace.

This is really exciting!! It'll be a big turn out from PT.com!!

MarkM66
02-14-2005, 06:51 AM
Mark (mean69), have you ever posted pics and specs of your car? If so, I missed it. I'd like to see, :icon996: .

Mean 69
02-21-2005, 11:09 AM
Given recent issues with my wonderful brakes (going to a manual setup), it looks like I am likely not going to be ready in March. I'll pencil in April also.

I apologize for the lack of shots. The car is basically together, but I am re-doing the exhaust, brakes, etc, besides the fact that San Diego is washing away. Haven't gotten any really "presentable" pictures. I also need to do a rear firewall to seperate the driver's area from the new fuel cell, and put it in a roll bar. Gee, that shouldn't be too hard!??! Aaack! back to the garage.

M

Salt Racer
02-21-2005, 01:31 PM
Holy Crap!! You got a lot of things to do! It reminds me of the mad thrash I did last fall. Most of the mods you saw (and some you didn't see) in Vegas were done in month of October. I was still driving around with 4-wheel drum brakes, 17:1 one-finger steering and dead rear shocks when I decided to try SOWS in late September. Thankfully I don't have that much stuff to do this time.

I started taking my motor apart. Nailhead is goofy-looking from outside, and it's even goofier inside. I got a custom cam from Compcam, but they ground lobe separation wrong. It pee's me off! I like their Xtreme energy cam lobes (quick valve acceleration), but I've never had a good luck with the company itself.

Meanwhile, I got a set of new rubber donuts - BFG KDW2s. I was going to get GY GS-D3, but found out they have very soft sidewall at the last minute and KDW2s were cheaper... My already-pimpy-looking yellow Riv has reached a new level with bling tread pattern. I should grow big afro and get some gold jewelries to match https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

dennis68
02-21-2005, 02:26 PM
Now accepting donations for track tires..... :nopity:

Mean 69
02-21-2005, 03:12 PM
My already-pimpy-looking yellow Riv has reached a new level with bling tread pattern. I should grow big afro and get some gold jewelries to match

Oh man, that was classic! Mr. "T" Katz! Just don't get a mohawk...

Rant time. Aye aye aye, custom stuff is such a pain at times. I have been sizing up the new calipers (don't have 'em yet, but they are on the way, using a drawing), and the new rotor hats... It NEVER ends! Thankfully. I love it, although sometimes it'd be nice for it not to be so challenging.

Hey!!! I can see a sliver of blue sky! Maybe Buttonwillow won't float away afterall!!!

M

Salt Racer
02-21-2005, 04:57 PM
Mohawk, eh? That should lower the CG height over big afro... :rotfl:

I hear ya on custom parts. It's frustrating, but there's no better feeling than when something you designed/engineered finally works out well.



Now accepting donations for track tires..... :nopity:

I'll donate a set of 235/75R15 white wall tires off my Riv. That should even out your 700ish-lb weight advantage over me.


Mr. "T" (my last name actually start with T)

CarlC
02-21-2005, 08:53 PM
Mohawk, eh? That should lower the CG height over big afro... :rotfl:



Better aerodynamics too!

Salt Racer
02-22-2005, 06:34 AM
LOL! I'll have a custom mohawk wig made for my helmet if I start racing an open-c0ckpit car. It'll be like a vertical stabilizer and help keep my head straight!

dennis68
02-22-2005, 07:06 AM
I'll donate a set of 235/75R15 white wall tires off my Riv. That should even out your 700ish-lb weight advantage over me.

"R" compound??? Maybe I can make some spacers so the 15's will clear the 13" brakes.....that might throw scrub off a little don't ya think?

Wide whites or the regular Walmart kind...gotta make sure they bling a little don't ya know.

alcino
02-22-2005, 07:41 AM
I'm getting excited for this event. Seems there may be a great turn out of old detroit muscle.

Mean69- Are you from San diego? I live in Lakeside and maybe we can cruise up to ButtonW together.

Alcino

PAI Racing
02-22-2005, 08:18 AM
Any of you guys ever been to BuRP after it rains? I would suggest a set of Super Swampers... Holy cow is that mud nasty. There is a photo somewhere on the CalClub site of a Spec Racer Ford stuck nose first into the mud, straight up in the air like a crashed air plane.

Orngcrush69
02-22-2005, 09:31 AM
I'm in, I'm actually running at Buttonwillow this weekend for the first time.

Salt Racer
02-22-2005, 04:43 PM
Cool, another guy who ain't afraid of using his car!! Good luck and have fun this weekend, and see you in April.


"R" compound??? Maybe I can make some spacers so the 15's will clear the 13" brakes.....that might throw scrub off a little don't ya think?

Wide whites or the regular Walmart kind...gotta make sure they bling a little don't ya know.

Heck yeah, they are real deal, and they are DOT-R with minimal tread!
R happens to stand for "Rock hard", BTW. Very predictable (no grip all the time), and they'll give you plenty of embarrassingly loud warning even when you take a highway onramp at almost-warp speed 25mph! Overall diameter is 29", so that will help reduce scrub radius too.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif



Any of you guys ever been to BuRP after it rains? I would suggest a set of Super Swampers...

I'll bring a set of 34 x 10.50 swampers off my Jeep for spare.


:hammer:

Mean 69
02-22-2005, 07:13 PM
Yeah, I am in the San Diego area, so long as it doesn't float away here in the next few days. I am very most likely going to tow the car, it is fresh, and I am getting too old to deal with breaking down somewhere in the middle of uh, er, you know. I bought a cool tow vehicle, and am going to get a trailer here in a while. Anyone here can call me any name they want for trailering the car, it really won't bother me. And if you do have an "off" and end up in the slop, well, if you're nice, I can pull you out. It has a turbo, and four wheel drive.

Den, you might be able to use my take-off wheels, honestly. I am trying to settle on the offset for the front wheels such that I can order the matching ones for the new rears, if it all comes together you can borrow the Toyo T1S's. 235/265's, something to keep in mind.

BuRP could be very interesting this weekend.....We are on a record pace for rain this year.. Friggin tornados in So Cal?!? We voted against mosquitos, hurricanes and all kinds of other "crap" on the last election ballot, I knew they forgot something!

Mark

dennis68
02-22-2005, 08:13 PM
I'll keep that in mind, thank you Mark. Pssst, 17's right? :fingersx:

PAI Racing
02-23-2005, 11:00 AM
If anything "bad" happens at BuRP, stop by 7's Only. They are really helpful and thier primary fab guy/wrench is a muscle car guy (despite all the rotaries). His name is Eric.

Salt Racer
02-23-2005, 03:33 PM
Dang, everyone will be running on good tires. Mark got KDs, Carl has Nitto RIIs, and now Dennis will have T1-S.

I still can't get over the blingy tread pattern of KDW2s. They better live up to the hype!

BTW Mark, what kind of tow rig did you get? Build some rock sliders and stout bumpers, and we can go rock crawling when I move down there!

You're trailering your car to the track for some lapping, not to a car show so I won't make fun of you.

Mean 69
02-23-2005, 04:44 PM
Dodge. Ram. Diesel, 3/4 ton. 4x4. Bitchin. Coolest truck I have ever driven. And NO rock crawling. At least not yet!

Hey! It stopped raining! For now at least. This is the third wetest season in So. Cal history, but we could easily eclipse #2, and possibly #1 in the next six weeks of the season. I know, stop whining, wussy boy. Point taken. I did grow up in snow though, so take it somewhat easy on me?!

Rotors and M/C's showed up today, two days early (I love Coleman!!!).

M

Salt Racer
02-24-2005, 07:28 AM
Oooh, sweet rig! Keep it nice. You can always get a beat-up Jeep for less than $3K and turn it into a rock crawler. I think I have less than $2500 on my Comanche, not counting the time I spent making parts and general maintenance cost. Not the best trail rig by any means, but it's been through several 3.5~4-rated rock trails in Arizona when it had 31" tires (plus some prerunner-style running on desert wash). Hard to beat in terms of fun factor-per-dollar.

Being a resident of Seattle area for five years, I feel the pain you CA dudes are going through now. It better not rain much when I get down there - I've already had enough miserable weather that a human should have to deal with in his life time. Time to make it up with plenty of sunshine, blue sky, and 100* weather!!

CarlC
02-26-2005, 09:33 PM
No trailer whining from me. I might trailer mine up if I can find one cheap/free for a few days. It does not take much to strand a car 150 miles from home, and track days bring out every weakness in a car.

Salt Racer
02-26-2005, 10:42 PM
Yup, very true. I will get really screwed if my car breaks down 1200 miles from home, but I like living on the edge LOL.

Dare devil Katz
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Actually my friend in Kerman has a trailer so I'll bribe him in case of a trouble.

dennis68
03-01-2005, 08:50 PM
Just got back from Anaheim and kinda paid attention from Buttonwillow back home.....lots of nothing. Crossing my fingers all goes well.

MrQuick
03-01-2005, 09:54 PM
Hey did you see the bunnies that hang out on the side of hwy 5? creepy!

dennis68
03-01-2005, 10:53 PM
Nope, but CHP is real good at hiding in plain sight sitting sideways in the tall grass of the median. Take it easy on the way down boys, I've never had a problem before but they scooped up a few guys that I saw. They came out of nowhere and all of the sudden the mirror was red&blue.

Salt Racer
03-04-2005, 11:37 AM
Ladies and gentle dudes, the registration for April 15th event is open. Start signing up!

https://www.speedventures.net/event_select.asp

Be sure to cough up extra $20 to rent a transponder, unless you have your own AMB transponder or a Hot Lap timer.

alcino
03-21-2005, 06:14 PM
I just signed up. Hope there is still interest in this event.

Alcino

Salt Racer
03-23-2005, 06:52 AM
I registered when I posted the link above. Just need to get my car running in time :fingersx: I got carried away and am doing more stuff than I should have.

JonB69FB
03-23-2005, 09:01 AM
I may be able to make the April 15th event. I'll let you know when I get back from the Pontiac Heaven Drags & More on the 3rd/4th of April.

Salt Racer
03-23-2005, 09:19 AM
My goodness! JonB is alive!!

Staying busy, huh?

JonB69FB
03-23-2005, 11:58 AM
Yeah, I've been super busy. We had a software release that ended up going a couple months beyond schedule so I was putting in 12-14 hour days trying to catch up. Didn't you see my thread in the Project Updates area?

I just FINALLY got the Firebird put back together last week. April 11th is my last day at my current job so by the 15th I should be plenty bored and looking for stuff to do. :rotfl:

So you're moving to SoCal?

Salt Racer
03-23-2005, 03:03 PM
Guess I missed that thread. Your new toy looks like it'll be a fun race car.

Yup, I'm moving to SoCal this summer. The job will be in San Diego area, but I'll try to find a place a little further inland. I can finally kiss good bye to NW weather!

JonB69FB
03-23-2005, 03:58 PM
Heh. We could be neighbors! I'm in Ramona, which is northeast of San Diego (where I work).

It's been pretty wet down here this year though. Had about 3 sunny weekends ALL year. At least things are turning green again after the fire.

Mean 69
03-24-2005, 07:52 AM
Jon! Dude! We are neighbors! I live in Carlsbad, I used to work over in RB. Small world. I am working my tail off to get the car set, all I have to do is to make a custom mounting bracket for the new Alcon calipers, align the car front and rear, design, bend, and install roll cage, install rear firewall (fuel cell in trunk now), finish tuning the motor. Heck, no sweat, right? Sheesh!

Mark

JonB69FB
03-24-2005, 05:36 PM
Hey, if you ever want some help, or someone to offer moral support, let me know. Hanging around other people's projects is always way less stressful than beating my head against my own.

As for my project: one word: ARGH! Last night I attempted to dial in the brake bias but there's something REALLY wrong as the rear brakes are locking up way too easily (I suspect a bad master cylinder or adjustable proportioning valve). Of course, while installing my brake pressure gauge in one of the front calipers I screwed up the bleeder adapter, so I spent a couple hours today trying to find a replacement. I also ordered a replacement MC and PV. All of this stuff should be here tomorrow, after which I can install it and HOPEFULLY I'll be able to stop without killing myself (locking the rears at high speed is, uh, scary). Otherwise I'll probably have to swap out the rear calipers for ones with smaller pistons, which is just MORE time and MORE money and MORE frustration. grrr.

Mean 69
03-24-2005, 05:58 PM
Oh, gee, another guy with brake issues! What are the piston areas front/rear, what M/C are you running, and do you have a booster? having been down the "what the heck is going on with my brakes and why don't they work like I want them to?" boogie. There is a pretty straightforward front to rear piston area ratio (got the goodies from an old Tilton article). Drop me a line if you want some more info. Or better yet, bring the car over to my new shop, and we can sit and stare at the darned cars together! Maybe we can make one good car with the two of them?

Mark

JonB69FB
03-24-2005, 08:05 PM
Piston diameter is 1.75" front AND rear. Both are four piston Wilwood units (oldish Superlite IIs front, Dynalites rear).

I'm using a GM style (cast iron) 1 1/8" bore master cylinder, with a Hydratech hydroboost unit.

No stock distribution valve, Wilwood knob type adjustable proportioning valve on the rears.

The smallest piston size available in a Dynalite caliper is 1.38" (they also offer a 1.62" piston). I have to kind of wonder what Wilwood was thinking putting a piston that big in a rear brake kit. I originally misread the rotor width (0.81") as the piston diameter, but now that I've realized the front and rear are same size it's pretty obvious I'm going to have to swap calipers.

I keep telling myself that if this was easy everyone would do it. One day I might believe myself ;)

Mean 69
03-25-2005, 08:49 AM
The Tilton guideline I have basically says go with about half the rear effective piston diameter as you have in the front, as a start. With the piston sizes you have, the prop valve will never pull down enough pressure to balance things out, you will pretty much always have a rear brake tendancy. You could swap the fronts out? Probably easiest to find a good twin piston (or single piston floating) rear caliper. For reference, the Alcon's I have net a piston area of 4.67 in2, and the rear floating PBR single pots are 1.94 in2. The guys at Hoerr also stated that almost all cars have too much rear brake. Not what you wanted to hear, I suspect...

Mark

Salt Racer
03-25-2005, 10:11 AM
Jon,

Call up Wilwood if you got 1.75" calipers in their rear brake kit and have them swap the calipers. Rear kits with 0.810" rotors are supposed to come with 1.38" Dynalites.

I have new style 1.75" SuperLite up front, 1.38" Dynalite rear, and the same adjustable PV. Rotors are 13" and 12". Even with 57% weight on nose, there's enough adjustment in PV to balance out the system.

Steve1968LS2
03-25-2005, 10:40 AM
Yup, very true. I will get really screwed if my car breaks down 1200 miles from home, but I like living on the edge LOL.

Dare devil Katz
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.
.
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Actually my friend in Kerman has a trailer so I'll bribe him in case of a trouble.

I have AAA super gold filled platinum account.. they will tow my sorry ass up to 150 miles for free.. on a flatbed :)

I might be able to make the April 15th event with the 68.. would be a good place to learn the cars capabilities..

Anyone make R compound tires in a 335 width???

Steve1968LS2
03-25-2005, 10:43 AM
Guess I missed that thread. Your new toy looks like it'll be a fun race car.

Yup, I'm moving to SoCal this summer. The job will be in San Diego area, but I'll try to find a place a little further inland. I can finally kiss good bye to NW weather!

Good, then you will closer to me and I can bribe you with beer and pizza to help me work the bugs out of the new 68.. I'm not up to date on tweaking a Mustang II suspension :)

Salt Racer
03-25-2005, 10:47 AM
Given that I do 2000+mile road trips in my Riv at least a couple of times a year, I probably should join AAA.


As for tires, search and you shall find...

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/types/comp.jsp


We can tweak MII IFS. But if you can wait, you'll be able to get a race-ready subframe in a year or so.

Steve1968LS2
03-25-2005, 10:54 AM
Given that I do 2000+mile road trips in my Riv at least a couple of times a year, I probably should join AAA.


As for tires, search and you shall find...

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/types/comp.jsp

We can tweak MII IFS. But if you can wait, you'll be able to get a race-ready subframe in a year or so.

I think the car can hold me over for a year.. give me time to work with the induction system and slap a regular cowl hood on the car :)

Thanks for the tire link..

JonB69FB
03-25-2005, 11:08 AM
The Tilton guideline I have basically says go with about half the rear effective piston diameter as you have in the front, as a start. With the piston sizes you have, the prop valve will never pull down enough pressure to balance things out, you will pretty much always have a rear brake tendancy.

I found a similar guideline (Baer) that said 40-50% more front piston area. The 1.38 rear/1.75 front combination seems to fall into that general area, so hopefully I'll share Katz's experience and I'll be able to dial enough rear brake out with the prop. valve.


Call up Wilwood if you got 1.75" calipers in their rear brake kit and have them swap the calipers. Rear kits with 0.810" rotors are supposed to come with 1.38" Dynalites.


According to the instructions that came with the kit I have the correct calipers, and they are indeed supposed to be 1.75" bore. :hmm: My kit is a "Dynalite Pro Series Rear Axle Kit Vented Rotor Type (2.36 Offset) Big Bearing Ford" part number 140-2115-B.

Either way I've got a set of 1.38" calipers that should be here tomorrow, and I'll get all this junk installed and hope the weather is dry enough to go flat spot some tires. I'm running out of time to **** around with this car--events are calling me.

Mean 69
03-30-2005, 07:44 AM
Anyone make R compound tires in a 335 width???

Ooooohhhhh. That's not fair! Everyone else will be on "street" tires!!! Well, maybe this will force me to buy track tires sooner rather than later.... BTW, I have a brand new cowl hood (Goodmark) that I doubt I will use, it's just taking up space in my shop.

Mark

Salt Racer
03-30-2005, 08:54 AM
Damn right, not fair. But with race tires and 700hp on tap, he better be at least few seconds faster than the next fastest guy!

Good thing I have plenty of excuses to be slow (Nailhead, 117" WB, 4300 lbs, narrow street tires on 8" rims, etc, etc...)



...According to the instructions that came with the kit I have the correct calipers, and they are indeed supposed to be 1.75" bore. :hmm: My kit is a "Dynalite Pro Series Rear Axle Kit Vented Rotor Type (2.36 Offset) Big Bearing Ford" part number 140-2115-B..

Maybe the kit was assembled for pro street cars with monster 31x18.50 rear tires and skinny front tires?

JonB69FB
03-30-2005, 03:53 PM
Maybe the kit was assembled for pro street cars with monster 31x18.50 rear tires and skinny front tires?

Entirely possible. Either way the situation is WAY better with the 1.38" bore calipers (which I swapped in this weekend). Pedal feel is perfect, and I managed to get the bias set up correctly, even though it required backing the prop valve out nearly all the way.

I'm going to look into upgrading to a Wilwood 4-piston staggered bore front caliper that will give me a little bit more piston area up front (1.88/1.75), but it's not going to happen soon--I've been spending WAY too much money on the car lately and I just bought a fresh set of (expensive) front pads that wouldn't work with the staggered bore calipers.

It's looking good for me to make this event. Unless I break something at the dragstrip this weekend (possible, but unlikely due to lack of traction), I'm planning on being there.

Salt Racer
03-31-2005, 07:42 AM
Good to hear you got it working. My prop valve isn't cranked all way down. Perhaps taller rear tires (27.2" vs. 28.5" nominal) were helping me out. I got new tires so I'll probably readjust mine once it gets running again.

Try those new front pads and see if it helps any. That's just might do the trick. BTW, what kind of pads did you get? I ran Polymatrix E pads front and back at SOWS, and I bought a set of PFC 01 pads a couple of months ago. Boy, they are expensive!! (to me anyway). Haven't had a chance to test them yet, though.


BTW Steve (and everybody)...
I didn't mean to put any pressure on you or anything. Just a friendly rivalry, not that I can come close to your car.

Everyone who shows up and thrash his car gets a hell of a respect from me, regardless of type of cars or lap time. I'll be one of the slower ones for sure, but I respect myself for having guts to take a 4300-lb land yacht out on a road course and have fun doing it. You guys know how I am - I just wanna see PT cars get used like they're meant to be.


So how's everyone doing? Can everyone still make it?

JonB69FB
03-31-2005, 09:34 AM
Try those new front pads and see if it helps any. That's just might do the trick. BTW, what kind of pads did you get? I ran Polymatrix E pads front and back at SOWS, and I bought a set of PFC 01 pads a couple of months ago. Boy, they are expensive!! (to me anyway). Haven't had a chance to test them yet, though.


I use PFC '01 pads in front and Porterfield R4 in the rear. You'll like the PFCs, especially once they get warmed up. If I swap pads it'll probably be to go with a slightly less aggressive one in the rear, but I just bought the R4's that are back there, so they have to wear out first.

At this point I'm just hoping I can stretch my tires through this event and Lone Pine (Lone Pine being their planned final demise). After they're gone I'm considering buying a set of 17" track only wheels and running some honest-to-goodness slicks, but that's even more money (wheels mainly, slicks seem to be fairly cheap).

Steve1968LS2
03-31-2005, 09:53 AM
Damn right, not fair. But with race tires and 700hp on tap, he better be at least few seconds faster than the next fastest guy!

Good thing I have plenty of excuses to be slow (Nailhead, 117" WB, 4300 lbs, narrow street tires on 8" rims, etc, etc...)


Maybe the kit was assembled for pro street cars with monster 31x18.50 rear tires and skinny front tires?

It's funny.. I can't find 335/35/18 tires anywhere.. even at Michilin..

Maybe they stopped making them in that exact size.. the car right now is running them in Pilot Sports. Would be fun to get some stickier ones though..

The shifter in the 68 should be fun on a road track.. yea right.. 1st on list is a built up T-56 :D

<-- looking forward to the event..

Mean 69
03-31-2005, 12:30 PM
You may have a more difficult time finding race rubber in an 18" size, unless you go with "real" race rubber. I traded a set of wheels and tires (I got them) for a differential, and some other parts to a good buddy. They will be the basis for the 65 Mustang. Tires are Hoosier's, rears are the size you are looking for (fronts are 305's). You might be really well off to run the street tires first though, it will be easier to learn the car's behavior, surprises will be less dramatic if they indeed happen.

Well, I just found out that my new wheels (Kinesis), that are necessary for the new Alcon brakes, which were supposed to be done last week, aren't going to be done until "next" week. I can work around this for the most part, but it is making me nervous. I am going to the event one way or the other, even if the darned car isn't ready! Roll cage tubing, also supposed to be here last week, arrived today. I mounted the tubing bender in the new shop last night, and the Bridgeport showed up today as well, so overall I am still looking good.

By the way, presuming I have the new brakes installed, I will have two sets of brake pads that fit the earlier style PBR calipers, if someone wants to try them. One set is a perf friction "Z" pad, the others, which show some real promise, are Carbotech Panther Plus. I will buy the latter type for the new calipers too.

Man, this is coming up quick!!!!
Mark

PAI Racing
03-31-2005, 12:57 PM
I think that Toyo and Hoosier both make a 335/35/18. It is standard issue on the back of the Speed GT cars. Tirerack should have the Hoosiers. You can also try Ron at AIM tire up in Sonoma or Vilvin Tire. I don't have contacts, but an internet search should get you where you want to go.

Salt Racer
03-31-2005, 01:25 PM
Here's another source of race tires...
http://www.rogerkrausracing.com

But, like Mark said, it's probably wise to stick with street tires for the first time out in a new car, or DOT-R tires with similar breakaway characteristics to street tires. I think I read Yokohamas, Nittos, Falkens, etc have street tire-ish feel on CC.com but I could be totally off.


It really is coming up quickly! My new heads got shipped out yesterday, so I should receive them early next week. Then I still have to wire fuel pump and electric fan, modify exhaust pipes to adapt headers, make rear stabar, and tune new carburetor. I hope I'll get everything done in time, if not, I'll still show up in my Jeep.

Q ship
03-31-2005, 02:50 PM
I'll still show up in my Jeep.
HA! Then my moto-x helmet will be perfect! :bananna2:

CarlC
03-31-2005, 03:19 PM
Let's hear it:

Steve
Jon
Mark
Katz
Alcino

I have not taken the plunge yet, but if you guys are signed up and going, I'm in.

Anyone have a portable tire inflator?

We ought to start looking into hotel availability. Motel 6 in Buttonwillow is the best bet. Tech is a 7:00 am so driving up that morning would be tough.

Carl

Orngcrush69
03-31-2005, 07:46 PM
I lost the motor one day before a photo shoot with PHR, but I should have her back together and ready for Buttonwillow! And Salt Racer, I'll race you for last place.

dennis68
03-31-2005, 08:10 PM
I may be bailing on you guys...I feel terrible. Just too much to do before the event, no time and no money. I WILL be at Vinces party in June and may even try and make another event this summer. If I make, I'll make it but it's not looking good. I don't even have belts in yet. PHB is in peices on the floor at the shop, coolant overflow is under my toolbox somewhere, there is a hole 22"X12" in the middle of my floor and the exhaust dumps into the cab (my commute is only 10 minutes).

MrQuick
03-31-2005, 10:44 PM
What, how the hell did you get that big [email protected]$ hole? Ok Fred Flintstone....sorry to hear you could not make the race. The party is in July, lets not confuse the troops please? Let me know if you need help...I'll send Allen over! Now get back to work damit

dennis68
04-01-2005, 05:55 AM
Started playing with pinion angle and things got out of hand...gotta learn to leave that cutoff wheel alone. https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Mean 69
04-01-2005, 07:56 AM
I recognize that trans! Too darn tall to fit most tunnels, my Mustang shares your pain. Don't give up Dennis, let us know if there is some way we can help you out. Just make certain the car is safe.

Carl, good point on the hotel, I didn't even think that far ahead. But heck, you mean there's no Hilton, or Four Seasons in the area?!

M

CarlC
04-01-2005, 08:44 AM
Mark,

Yeah, there's Four Seasons. Fall, winter, spring, and summer!

The Motel 6 is as good as it gets. They even have a pool!

I'm on the fence right now. I just got called to do another one of those big jobs that I sent you a picture on. Starts Wednesday morning in Kentucky. Might get back Thursday night.

F$((#E((%(#)($%(*^%))#@_)@**%)(^)^)!!#($(%)@__!)(* %(@

and every other word that I can't say here!

Steve1968LS2
04-01-2005, 08:46 AM
Carl, good point on the hotel, I didn't even think that far ahead. But heck, you mean there's no Hilton, or Four Seasons in the area?!

M

I HATE the idea of parking the 68 outside overnight.. not because of weather and such but because of thiefs and vandals..

The stories of guys cars getting stolen or messed up while they slept in a motel still haunt me.. :scared:

Salt Racer
04-01-2005, 09:28 AM
What!? There are four seasons in SoCal!? I only want spring and summer! LOL.

Motel 6's rate works for me ($32 for one person in a 2-bed room), so I'll book a room today. If anyone wants to share room, I'm sure I can add your name when I check in.


...And Salt Racer, I'll race you for last place.

Bet is on. Faster guy gets free beer!


Den's pic reminds me of my Nova when I swapped in Richmond 6sp while I was in college. I had a rubber floor mat covering the hole for a couple of months.

David Pozzi
04-01-2005, 09:36 AM
FYI,
The SCCA publication "The Wheel" has an ad from a member who lost his whole tow rig and race car at the Motel 6 in Buttonwillow!
It hasn't shown up yet.
I'd pool money for an all-night security guard, or camp at the track.

Carl, let me know if you will be there, I'm planning on driving down unless something comes up.

Steve1968LS2
04-01-2005, 10:37 AM
FYI,
The SCCA publication "The Wheel" has an ad from a member who lost his whole tow rig and race car at the Motel 6 in Buttonwillow!
It hasn't shown up yet.
I'd pool money for an all-night security guard, or camp at the track.
.

Hence my post :)

I would be willing to chip in on that.. to be honest I usually just drive up to Buttonwillow early and drive home that night.. it is not THAT far for me..

Besides.. it's sorta fun to drive to an event.. run the car and then drive the same car home.. Makes you careful about breaking things as well.

PAI Racing
04-01-2005, 11:24 AM
There are also a couple of hotels north of BuRP at the Lost Hills exit. It is about the same distance from the track as the Buttonwillow exit (in the opposite direction), but doesn't have the awesome barbecue at Willow Ranch.

As a suggestion, you might want to leave your car at the track. Les keeps a pretty good eye on the place at night. You could then ride to your hotel in someone's tow vehicle.

MrQuick
04-01-2005, 12:09 PM
you guys give me a box of twinkies, 6 pack of red bulls and I'll sit in Steves car with Mrs. Mossberg and her little rock salt shells...oh yeah, has to have a radio :camaro:

CarlC
04-01-2005, 12:13 PM
I really, really, really want to go!!

David, I'll keep you in the loop.

Steve, I've done the same thing, but usually tech is at 8:00, so a 5:30 departure is no biggie. But for you it would be a really early drive. For me, the drive home is coffee and sunflower seeds.

Katz, we do have four seasons. Ask Farmer David!

Salt Racer
04-04-2005, 05:53 AM
Well, I got new heads on Friday. Ports and valve job look good. I was getting ready to paint them (cast iron) yesterday afternoon, and I realized retainers are awfully close to seals. Took one spring off to check it, and sure enuf, there was only 0.470". New cam has well over 0.500" lift. It sucks, but good thing I caught it before I put them on.

One thing after another... 12 days to go, million things left to do...

alcino
04-04-2005, 09:28 AM
I hear ya about little last second problems saltracer. I went auto crossing this weekend and still had fuel delivery problems even though I had a new carb and upgraded fuel pump. I noticed that during the auto crossing my fuel pressure was 0-1 psi. If I let the car cool down the psi goes back up to 8psi. Would you say this is a vapor lock (fuel boiling) problem? The fuel line does get within an inch of the exhaust header before reaching the electric pump. I will just wrap it in foil and insulation and hope it helps for the race track. What do you guys think?

Salt Racer
04-04-2005, 10:00 AM
...The fuel line does get within an inch of the exhaust header before reaching the electric pump...

So you have an electric pump on the front end of the car? If so, that probably is compounding the problem. Or did you mean pressure regulator perhaps?

I'd definetely wrap the fuel line with high-temp insulation thing.

alcino
04-04-2005, 10:28 AM
I have a self regulated pump at the front. I guess I will look in to mounting it just out side the tank in the back. Now I understand why new cars have them in the tank.

Mean 69
04-07-2005, 12:02 PM
Well guys, things are not looking too good at this point for me after all. Two things seems to be killing me, the wheels, and now, I just found out, brake pads!!! I am none too happy, the pads for the new calipers are "custom," meaning they are a "make from" a stock pad. I think I can do the mod myself, but if this, AND the wheels are not here by tomorrow, I am not going to be able to run the car in over the weekend, which would leave three days to sort out an entirely new brake setup before (gulp) getting on the track. I am not throwing in the towel by any means, just wanted to give a heads up.

Mark

alcino
04-07-2005, 01:21 PM
Thats sad to hear.

I just reserved my hotel room for the night before at the motel 6 of Buttonwillow. Was only $40 and it has a second bed.

Q ship
04-07-2005, 08:14 PM
Friday! Friday! Friday! at smokin' Buttonwillow raceway! Come see Mean 69's Dodge Ram MMmmonster truck take on Salt Racer's INNnnsane Jeep!!

Seriously, sorry to hear about the trouble Mark, the brakes sure have been a pain for you. I haven't seen Katz here for a couple of days either, hopefully his thrash is going well. Maybe the last minute thrashes on the TV "reality" shows aren't too far off the mark after all, eh? Sure hope you can make it, I'm looking forward to seeing your car!

Salt Racer
04-11-2005, 11:07 AM
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

This is where I'm at. You may think I'm into bright color stuff (yellow paint job and this engine), but that's not really the case. This blueish green is the original engine color Buick used in '65, and I hate the yellow paint on my car.

Anyway, I still need to assemble the new carb (750 main body/850 base plate hybrid), match the bore size of carb spacer (cheapie 4-hole variety turned into like HVH SuperSucker), finish wiring fuel pump and electric fan, plumb fuel line, and make rear stabar endlink brackets.

I should be able to fire up the motor by this time tomorrow. I'll show up in pimpy yellow Riv unless the engine blows up upon startup.

dennis68
04-11-2005, 11:10 AM
Hey, that P/S pump looks an awful lot like a late model Jeep pump....got lots of those lying around.

Mean 69
04-11-2005, 12:09 PM
Welp. It's official. I'm out for this week, I can't pull it together. Kinesis is late, and I found out this morning that I screwed up a dimension on the brake brackets I am making, and will need to make them over again. Not a big deal in and of itself, but with everything else, I am not going to make it. I solved the brake pad issue, with one simple phone call to Porterfield in Costa Mesa CA. Got the pads the very next day.

Tail between legs big time, I am super bummed.
Mark

Edit: BTW, Katz, the work looks superb. Good luck on getting it running.

Q ship
04-11-2005, 01:22 PM
Crap! Sorry to hear it Mark. Beginning to wonder if we'll ever meet!

Katz, the engine looks great! The parts/food runner has been reserved!

Denny, any hope of making it?

dennis68
04-11-2005, 02:10 PM
Nope, I'm out. Going to July for sure and may make a June event as well. I'm close but not close enough, I still need the harness' and i have developed a major fuel starvation concern above 120MPH. At about 5100RPM it starts popping at slowing down. I suspect fuel pump but haven't time to check.

MrQuick
04-11-2005, 09:51 PM
you didn't pinch the fuel line on your panhard bar mount did you??? jk
Sorry to hear you guys can't make this session. Hope July works out better for everyone.

dennis68
04-11-2005, 10:09 PM
You know if my work was just more understanding and let me do important stuff from 7-3 like getting the Elco ready I wouldn't be having these issues...damn employers.

PHB isn't in yet....I'm a slacker. :slap:

MrQuick
04-11-2005, 10:16 PM
Like I said Den, If you need any help at all, let me know...I'll send Allen and Cody over!

JonB69FB
04-13-2005, 12:32 PM
I'm not going to make it either--just too many other things going on right now.

Q ship
04-13-2005, 02:37 PM
Sorry to hear that Jon, I was looking forward to seeing that beast. Jeez, is anyone gonna be able to make it? Steve, Carl, David?

David Pozzi
04-13-2005, 06:52 PM
I've been sick all week, stayed home over the weekend trying to get better.
It's about 50/50 for me right now. I won't have a car to drive on the track, just wanted to come down and hang out. Every time I've helped Carl, we have learned something new.

CarlC
04-14-2005, 01:00 PM
I'm SOL. 8 hours of sleep in the past 4 days does not work well.

David Pozzi
04-14-2005, 05:31 PM
Carl,
Thanks for letting me know. I'm going to stay home, I still have a cough and headache.

I just found out I missed the deadline for the Monterey Historics Aug race! I sent it in late and they will try to find a spot for me.

Q ship
04-15-2005, 09:12 PM
Just got home.

YYYYYYyyyyyyeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhaaaaaaawwwwwwwwhahahah ahahahahahahahaha!





And I was just riding, not driving. Thanks Katz!!!!


I'm officially hooked. And beat. Pics tomorrow.

David Pozzi
04-16-2005, 12:01 PM
Glad to hear Katz got there!
I had a ride in that car at Bonneville but just crusin' around...

Q ship
04-16-2005, 12:42 PM
Yeah, Katz was there, and Alcino, and Orngcrush69(sorry I didn't get your names guys!). It was great to put a face to the names here. The weather was perfect, and there was a nice turn out of the Speed Ventures folks. The event seemed very well run and organized, there ended up being 5 sessions so everyone got a lot of track time.

I'll post pics tonight, but let me just say that anyone that is hesitant to bring their car out for fear of wear needs to take a look at Orngcrush69's car and re-evaluate. It's immaculate, what I would call a show car, and he had it out there! Alcino's Mustang gave an excellent showing, and had to be one of the best sounding cars out there. I really liked how he cleaned up the front and rear ends.

Katz, well what can I say. The man is a monster! How many people would thrash a car together, drive it 1000 miles, and hang it out on a track?(knowing that it had to make the trip home too!) He generously let me ride with him on 2 sessions, and I had an ear-to-ear grin the whole time! I want more, I wanna drive!! I now realize that there is no way to really evaluate your cars limits without taking it on track. Period. Thank you again Katz!!!

It rocked, guys. Those of you that have been out there know what I mean, and those that haven't-I hope you get out there and give it a try. I'm the newest convert!!

alcino
04-16-2005, 01:04 PM
Kats made it there but did he make it back??? On our last run his engine starved for oil and spun a bearing. I think he said oil was leaking from the breather in the turns. I gave him all my spare oil and left for San Diego. He seemed ok driving it home slapping away. Hope no rods decided to let go. Also its only seeing in person do you realize how big a Buick Riviera is. That thing must have weighed 1000 punds more than anything else out there and was able hang with the competition in white group.

Other than Katz ordeal and the little carb issue I had, it was an awesome time. At the end of the day I was staying up with M3's as long as I didn't make a mistake. Gotta love R compound tires.

As always I wish there was a bigger turn out of Muscle cars. Thanks for coming out Katz, Brian, Dave and Dan. JonB I still would like a ride in your green machine

alcino

Q ship
04-16-2005, 01:28 PM
Aww crap! I had to leave before you guys got finished with that last session. Hope he gets back OK.

Davezz28
04-16-2005, 06:11 PM
Friday was a great day at the track, and nice meeting Katz, Al, and Brian. I wish we had more muscle cars to play with and I can see I am going to need to speed up the build on my car. It sucks to ride around the track as a passenger!!! :help!:

I hope Katz and his car will make it back to WA, we left before the last run and did not know he had problems.

Hope more can make the next track day!!!

Here are a couple pics I took.

Q ship
04-16-2005, 07:55 PM
A couple pics from me.

All that I took are at this link. (http://members18.clubphoto.com/brian812566/2814832/guest.phtml) Alcino, I can't believe I took 3 shots of your car and they were all at the same point in the curve! Sorry dude!

David Pozzi
04-16-2005, 08:25 PM
Did they run the track counter-clockwise?

Q ship
04-16-2005, 08:29 PM
Yeah David, CCW.

David Pozzi
04-16-2005, 08:42 PM
I thought so when I saw that photo of Katz. ;)

MrQuick
04-16-2005, 09:02 PM
thanks for the pictures Brian, looks like you had lotsa fun. Hey Katz your car looks flatter than the last race. Hows the extra HP sit with you?
Can't wait for July!

Orngcrush69
04-16-2005, 11:29 PM
Here are some more pics of Katz and Al on the track.

Mean 69
04-17-2005, 01:07 PM
Those pic's both make me smile, and break my heart. I am so depressed I couldn't make the event, but it looks like you guys had a great time, and the photos are just awesome. Most open track events are really light on the early muscle, and as a result, the folks are usually really surprised to see the cars, especially when they are getting spanked by them! Great for you guys, and man, I really hope I am not on the sidelines next time. Or, in my case, back at the garage.

Mark

Q ship
04-17-2005, 01:27 PM
Mark, have you heard from Katz? Just wondering if he got back OK. We missed you, that's for sure. Next time!! I'm so fricken' hooked now.......

David Pozzi
04-17-2005, 08:32 PM
Man, I'm worried about Katz! Knowing him, he's parked under a tree changing bearings!

MrQuick
04-17-2005, 09:41 PM
anyone have his cell number?? he'd be near to me if he had problems... ***** usually happens near SF. I'll put up the Katz signal

dennis68
04-18-2005, 04:50 AM
I've got an open stall at work and an extra bed at home (if you don't mind bunking with a 7 year old-he's been waiting for somebody to use that extra bed.)....hey Katz, where the hell are you?

MrQuick
04-18-2005, 10:03 AM
Did you call him? Which way was he going...back home or down to San Diego?

Salt Racer
04-18-2005, 10:35 AM
I just got back to WA, but w/o my car. Turns out there was more than a spun bearing. Combustion pressure was escaping into water system (perhaps cracked block). I didn't make it too far, and my good friend Rick Dekneef in Kerman bailed me out. The car will be sitting in his shop until I can locate a good block and crank.

It sucks, but it's part of racing and I had a great time out there. Hopefully I can fix it by Vince's bachelor party.

Guys who made it out there, thanks for coming out and it was great meeting you all. I hope to see you guys and guys who couldn't make it this time at the next event.

Course configuration was #13 CCW. My best laptime was 2:25-something. Not bad for a boat on street rubbers, but I was hoping 2:20-ish which I'm sure is possible with more driving practice. Alcino was a tenth or so faster.

I gotta get back to work now. Be back here with more report later.

David Pozzi
04-18-2005, 12:40 PM
Katz,
Glad you made it back, I wish I had some nailhead parts to send your way. Back in High School auto shop, I worked on one that was runing on an engine stand. We used it to practice for the Plymouth Trouble Shooting contest.

Q ship
04-18-2005, 01:00 PM
Glad you're OK, pm'd you.

Salt Racer
04-18-2005, 03:08 PM
...Katz, well what can I say. The man is a monster! How many people would thrash a car together, drive it 1000 miles, and hang it out on a track?(knowing that it had to make the trip home too!)...

Let's just say I'm missing a coupla wires from my brain. The way I see it, life's too short to worry about small things. It's not the end of the world even if your car breaks down 1000 miles from home. Yes, it sucked but it's just a small dent within this whole priceless experience. I have strong attachment to my car, but it still is just a car. It can be fixed.

BTW, David makes an interesting observation about me. I'd have pulled the oil pan in the pit if I had parts and tools LOL.


My personal report.....

BuRP was much more difficult than SOWS (remember I'm a novice driver). I guess the new-found hp made it more difficult for me. The car was as quick as Alcino's MII, which has run high 13s in 1/4 mile. Not bad for a Nailhead.

Took me a while to get used to the first turn (Sunset). It's a very sharp 90-deg turn at the end of long straight. I normally try to manually downshift the TH400, giving a throttle blip right before the gear engages. It doesn't work as good as heel-toe on stick shift. While Q-ship was riding shotgun, the shift knob slipped into the 1st and that caused me to spin out. I also span out when I was trying to give point-by at Riverside (novice mistake).

With new suspension mods (-2* front camber and rear stabar), the car was joy to drive through big sweepers. My bar rate calculation was close enough that the car was very close to neutral. Throttle-steering a 4300-lb car was some experience. Blingy BFG KDW2s stuck pretty well, but they got greasy under afternoon heat. 245/255s are just too narrow for the weight of my car, I suppose. The car remained very predictable and controllable, but I really need wider tires.

PFC '01 pads are terrific!! Ask Q-ship how my car braked before Grapevine and Sunset. Pads were expensive, but the money very well spent. The only concern was pad knockback. I had to tap the pedal after pretty much every corner. I know wheel bearings were tight. Perhaps I should look into piston springs.

I was way off the pace during first three sessions, but I got the hang of the course by the 4th session. Trying to follow faster cars definetely helped. I started out like 2:29s, and I managed to get it down to 2:25s. I was still coasting through some sections, so I should be able to knock off a couple of seconds next time out.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

David Pozzi
04-18-2005, 06:58 PM
Katz,
What calipers do you have on your car?
You might try some low pressure (2lb) residual pressure valves.

MrQuick
04-18-2005, 11:52 PM
Hey Katz,
glad your ok, sorry to hear about the car...I know a guy that has a complete 70 455 engine sitting in his body shop...i'll see if he still has it tomorrow. hope you can make it out in July.:fingersx:

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 05:46 AM
David,
I have Wilwood forged SL4 front and Dynalite rear. Rear axle is an old Buick semi-floater (non C clip), which has some slop but not more than a typical 9". I didn't have as much knock back problem at SOWS, but the car didn't corner as hard as it did this time either. I'll try 2 lb valve and see if it would help.

Vince,
I'm debating whether I should fix the Nailhead or swap in a SBC. I would really rather have SBC and stick shift, but the problem is initial cost and time. SBC will be cheaper in the long run, but rebuilding a Nailhead is much cheaper for now.

I don't want to let my car sit in Rick's garage for too long. He runs a repair shop and he always needs extra space. Mark offered me to store my car in his shop too, but for the same reason, I don't want my car taking up his valuable space too long. So more than likely I'll fix the Nailhead. 425 is tough to come by, but I don't mind running a 401.

I can probably run my car at your event. If for some reason I end up swapping in a SBC, I'll still show up as Mark's crew or something.

Davezz28
04-19-2005, 05:52 AM
Sorry to here about your problems Katz. I am the other Dave with the 69 Chevelle (not the owner) and live in Fresno which is 30 min from Kerman. I have a good friend in Kerman and I visit him quite a bit, so if you need any help let me know. I will keep an eye out for a block.

In fact there is a wrecking yard here in town that has every kind of car you could think of, I could give them a call to see if they have what you need. I'm guessing it is a 1965 425cid? Let me know the details and I will make a call.

Dave

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 07:01 AM
Dave, I remember you. Didn't know you were from Fresno area.

It would be great if you can find a motor nearby Kerman. That would save me a ton on shipping. You're correct it's a '65 425ci Buick. But anything from '63~'66 motor would work. 425 prefered, but 401 would be OK too. I need a good block, and a crank. I'll try to see if I can fit 4340 rods from some other application. I owe you a ride-around at the next event.

Also, if you go to Kerman frequently, try visiting Rick's automotive repair. It's on Madera Ave. (290 S. or something). There's a '46 Hudson truck destined for Bonneville and Open road racing sitting in the shop now.

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 10:44 AM
Well guys, my friend in Porterville found a complete 425 for $600. Thanks for the offer to look around a motor.

I'll just bore out the block slightly and adapt good rods, custom pistons, improve oiling system and call it good. That should get me by for a year or two. Then I'd go with LSx or SBC .

David Pozzi
04-19-2005, 12:01 PM
Katz,
Maybe you should throw an accusump on it?
When running clockwise the turn marked "sweeper" usually gave people oil pressure loss problems.

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 12:52 PM
Yup, that's exactly where I span the bearing and I limped back to the pit area.

I'll modify the stock pan and add wings and buffles. Accusump will be on the shopping list too.

Steve1968LS2
04-19-2005, 01:18 PM
Yup, that's exactly where I span the bearing and I limped back to the pit area.

I'll modify the stock pan and add wings and buffles. Accusump will be on the shopping list too.

My new 68 has an accusump system.. I have to admit I am unfamiliar with it..

I thought it just helped pre-oil the engine before start up.. does it help when the car is running as well?

Steve1968LS2
04-19-2005, 01:19 PM
Katz,
Maybe you should throw an accusump on it?
When running clockwise the turn marked "sweeper" usually gave people oil pressure loss problems.

Thats the big sweeping right hander at the back/right of the track.. right? (marked as Riverside on the map)..

nevermind.. just saw the one marked "sweeper" :hand:

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 01:19 PM
I thought it just helped pre-oil the engine before start up.. does it help when the car is running as well?

Yup.

We were all wondering where the hell you were. See you in July.

Steve1968LS2
04-19-2005, 01:47 PM
Yup.

We were all wondering where the hell you were. See you in July.

Ha!.. gotta have a car if I wanna go to the track..

Going to get the car this weekend and then all will be good with the world ..


Question.. if an accusump is just a pre-oiler then how will that help at the track??

alcino
04-19-2005, 02:56 PM
Its not just a pre-oiler unless its the base model version. If not that one, it detects pressure drop while the engine is running and unloads its reserve to the system to restore pressure.

At the California speedway open track I spun three bearing with stock oil pan. This time I had baffels, windage tray and crank scrapper. My car came out fine with out accusump. But I do like insurance instead of pulling an engine after every event.

alcino

Steve1968LS2
04-19-2005, 03:35 PM
Its not just a pre-oiler unless its the base model version. If not that one, it detects pressure drop while the engine is running and unloads its reserve to the system to restore pressure.

At the California speedway open track I spun three bearing with stock oil pan. This time I had baffels, windage tray and crank scrapper. My car came out fine with out accusump. But I do like insurance instead of pulling an engine after every event.

alcino

Gotcha.. I will what type the car has when it gets here..

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 04:49 PM
Accusump is a pressurized oil reservoir tapped into oiling system. It traps pressurized oil when an engine is getting healthy oil pressure, and when the pressure from pump drops down to a predetermined level, the valve opens and the trapped oil flows out to aid lubrication. It's the next best thing to going dry sump.

Al,
Thanks again for oil. Here's the link to HRP's brake section. PFC 01 pads for DL cost $60. A bit more than I told you at the track but still not bad, and trust me, you'll be amazed at the difference.

http://www.hrpworld.com/index.cfm?form_prod_id=264,162,49,363_1562&action=product


Can you believe there's almost 150 posts in this thread? Nice to see a lot of participations (valid ones, that is) in racing section!

alcino
04-19-2005, 05:16 PM
This thread is getting out of hand. Many tangents, but all good. Makes me excited for future events with all the people who might show up.

Katz:
Thanks for the link and no problem about the oil. Seriously any time. New tangent, Congrats on another publication in PHR. I was flipping through the pages and thought why does this guy and the wheels he is in front of look familiar. Haha it's Katz! Just warning you that I may ask you some more questions on suspension next time I see you.

Alcino

Salt Racer
04-19-2005, 05:35 PM
Yeah, that pics are kinda embarrassing.

Nah, it was cool. I was involved in the write up and tech aspect of that article, but didn't know my portrait would be in it. I'm a minor celebrity now LOL.

Won't be too long until I go down to SoCal next time. Ask your questions away!

Davezz28
04-19-2005, 06:12 PM
Glad you found a motor that fast, it is not like there are 425 Buicks laying around like Small Blocks.

I painted Dave's Chevelle in a old cotton gin in Kerman that my friend converted to his shop. The next time I am in town I will stop by and check you the Hudson.

If you need any help just let me know. Hope to see you and the others at Button Willow or Willow Springs again. Can't wait to get my car together so I don't have to ride around the track as a passenger.

Salt Racer
04-20-2005, 08:26 AM
Yeah, I really lucked out. To be honest, I don't really know if it's a 425. Very well could be a 401 considering the motor is coming out of another '65 Riv (all '64s have 425, '63 & '65 came with either 401 or 425). But, the motor is only 100 miles or so away from Kerman and time is tight so I'd call it good.

Rick, being a pretty damn good engine builder/developer, has already laid out some plans. He'll turn down the rod journals to BBC size and stuff some 6.70" BBC rods and custom Ross pistons. He also wants to check the heads on his flow bench and see if there's any more to be gained. It'll be one stout Nailhead when all is said and done. Honestly I don't need any more hp with my current driving skills and tires I got, but it'll be nice regardless.

I talked to Mark (Mean 69) last night, and I'll make a trip down to SoCal in May when Mark takes his car out to BuRP or Cal Speedway. Maybe I'll see you guys then.

Here's a pic of the Hudson I was talking about. It was from a couple of months ago. It looks unbelievable in person. Chassis is by Morrison with C5 IFS and 4-link. Initially it will be powered by a Rodeck aluminum 410ci backed by a Jerico 4sp. and 9" stuffed with 2.2 ish gear.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2005/04/Hudson-1.jpg

Davezz28
04-20-2005, 04:16 PM
I think I saw the Hudson one day when I was across the street at the Bank. That is the same shop that I always see the yellow 67 or 68 drag camaro parked in the shop.

Sounds like a solid bottom end. Not sure what the stroke is on a 425, but with a 6.7" rod you will have a great rod/stroke ratio and a very light piston. Should make for a real responsive and torquey (sp) motor and it will probably be easer to drive due to more part throttle torque. More horsepower only makes a car harder to drive when you are WFO.

Salt Racer
04-21-2005, 03:11 PM
Yup, that's the shop. Yellow Camaro (it's been stored somewhere else now) belongs to another friend of mine in San Diego. He's also the owner of the truck. There's also a circle-track-looking late '70s Firebird setup for track duties. They'll bring it out to next SV events that I'd attend.

Rod/stroke ratio will end up like 1.84:1 or something. I'm guessing quicker piston acceleration off the TDC would help induction a little bit, along with slight increase in cam overlap. Nailhead is rather bad in that area (1.84" intake valves, etc). Exhaust is even worse (45-deg valve angle, 1.5" valves), so we'll have to figure out something. Most Nailhead guys are old school types, so I don't think stuff like this has been done before too many times. It'll be interesting.

Mean 69
04-21-2005, 03:30 PM
I'd just caution a bit in terms of investing in a motor that you will likely take out of the car in the near future. A custom set of pistons is about $700, rods pretty close, cam, gaskets, timing set, etc. It all adds up. Might be a good exercise to see how much it will truly cost to put it all right, and then compare to the cost of doing what you'd really prefer in the car. Dunno, I am just the type of guy that does virtually every project twice, I always spend more in the end.
M

Salt Racer
04-21-2005, 03:37 PM
I agree. I'll try not to get carried away too much. If I did, I'd probably be redesigning combustion chamber shape, etc LOL.

Rick told me his cost on the 4340 rods are about $400 (don't know what brand). Not sure on pistons. I already have all upper end pieces, so I'm estimating the whole thing to cost a little over $2K. And if it pulls a good number on dyno, I can sell the complete motor for a decent price when I'm ready to swap in something else.

Did you try bleeding the brake again? I hope that would solve the problem.

Mean 69
04-21-2005, 04:54 PM
I will try again, either later today, or tomorrow morning, with a helper this time! A pressure bleeder is looking really good at this point. Great, another tool purchase. Naw, I'll do it the old fashioned way.

I agree though, someone will take it off of your hands after you are done with it, but still a good exercise to think through! Course' with a solid bottom end, and forged pistons, well, maybe we could put a turbo on it later on!!!! How nuts would that be!?!

Vroooooom.

Davezz28
04-21-2005, 07:39 PM
Wow, 1.84 and 1.5" valves on a 425 inch motor, you will have to work some majic to get those heads to work.

How is the valve spacing on those heads? Can you open up the seat area and install larger valves? I think those 425s had around a 4.30" bore, so the cylinder shrouding should not be a problem as long as you could open up the cc around the larger valve.

If you want to get wild, there is a set of Isky roller lifter on ebay for sale. With enough lift you may make those small valve work. :headbang:

Salt Racer
04-22-2005, 07:06 AM
Mark,
Not that I can do much over the phone, let me know if you need any help.

Hmmmm, twin turbo Nailhead....Never heard of that one.

Not sure if I'd do the turbo thing, but supposedly there's a company in Oregon working on aluminum heads for those ancient Buick motors. If that really happens, I just might keep it.

Dave,
Supposedly the heads I got flow 240cfm/185cfm at around 0.550" lift with those tiny valves. I kinda doubt those numbers, but they did make good power considering I was able to keep up with Al's MII in straight.

Valve spacing is, well, very small. Those tiny valves are almost touching with each other. 1.94"/1.55" valves are as big as you can go, so I was told. Pushrods aren't in line with valves like on SBC, and go around the side of valves, and water jackets are really close to the existing valve seats that you can't even install hardened seats so it's practically impossible to increase valve spacing w/o investing in new casting.

Yes, bore is like 4.313". BUT, because of 45-deg valve angle, intake valves get really close to cylinder wall when lift goes beyond 0.550" or so.

It's a goofy engine, and damn near impossible to make power equivalent of other engines of same displacement (at least with my budget). But all I need for now is about 450hp, good torque, and reliability. All of which are possible (I think...) with a 425.


Just a side note for those who are stuck with carburetors like I am...
I couldn't afford a brand-new Holley HP series DP, so I built my own hybrid carb for this project.

Parts consist of Proform 750cfm main body, Proform 850cfm base plate, Proform metering blocks, Holley quick kit, and fuel bowls from my old carb. Not counting the cost of bowls, I spent less than $400. It can be duplicated w/o billet metering blocks (which are 0.5 lb each lighter than pot metal), and that will reduce the cost by another $120.

I bored out the bottom side of mainbody with hand die grinder to match 850 bores, and plug & re-drill idle fuel circuit using 850 mainbody gasket as a template. The rest is just typical Holley assembly. Profom sells 850 main body for $100 more. It requires no modification, but the venturi throat is rather big. I used 750 main body to save $100 and to increase booster signal. It worked awesome. Good top end power and killer throttle response! It's a good alternative to a swap meet Holley DP for cheap guys like me.

Salt Racer
04-25-2005, 05:38 AM
The results are finally up on SV website. Looks like Al was solid 3.1 sec. faster than I was. Congrats dude!

Z06 guys are unbelievably fast! John W. did 2:01:xxx with near stock Z06 (except for open pipes and T1 suspension). Unreal.

That Gurney Eagle only managed 2:05:xxx. Should have been below 2 min.

I need to practice driving. I want to catch that Cadillac CTS-V and M3 at next SV event.

http://www.speedventures.net/event_results_db.asp?event=4/15/2005+-+BW+13+CCW&results=OA&s=lt

PAI Racing
04-25-2005, 11:20 AM
Did you say Eagle? What type?

Salt Racer
04-25-2005, 12:09 PM
This type. I don't know a whole lot about these vintage racers.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Q ship
04-25-2005, 12:12 PM
Hey Katz, I saw a little of that guy going around the track-he was taking it real easy on the curves. It was fun to watch him open it up a little on the front straight.

PAI Racing
04-25-2005, 03:17 PM
1970/71 Eagle Indy car. I looked at that car when Trenery had it for sale up in Emeryville. It is a sister to my buddy's car. Originally a turbo offy and 4 cam Ford car that now has a 2 bbl 305 chevy for parades... Unless they have changed the motor over the last year. Wow, so the guy was actually driving it huh?

Salt Racer
04-26-2005, 09:07 AM
Yup, he was actually driving it. Big thumbs up for him, though faster S2000 guys are kinda bitching about him being slow and not giving point-bys.

If I had money to afford an authentic vintage racer like that, I'd beat the crap out of it. Nothing mechanical cannot be fixed with time and money. Or I'd restore it, and build a clone and beat the crap out of it. But that's just me.

I'm started thinking about getting a set of 18x10/11 CCW wheels. CCWs don't look as good as Kinesis, but I get the same result for half the price....

PAI Racing
04-26-2005, 11:47 AM
Katz do you mean Honda S2000 or Sports 2000s (y'know Lolas etc)? That car should be quick even with a soft motor. The tub is a tank by modern open wheel standards, but is still well under 2,000lbs.

I was really impressed with the quality of the CCWs I had.

Salt Racer
04-26-2005, 12:02 PM
I meant Honda S2000. There are bunch of those running at SV events, and some are running par with prep'ed Z06s, which to me is very impressive.

That Eagle (or any racecar for that matter) must be a blast to drive. One of these days, I want to build a small track car something along the line of Radical. Maybe I should talk Mark into doing one of those after his Camaro ;-)

I think I'll be getting CCWs after the motor is done.

BTW, any update on your GT1 car deal?

Mean 69
04-26-2005, 05:20 PM
Maybe I should talk Mark into doing one of those after his Camaro ;-)

Er, I think that is going to be plural very shortly. I have an itch to build a second gen, and am looking for a donor car now. Two candidates in the area. Beyond that, well, heck yes!!!! I'd love to do a small dedicated track unit.

So that brings up a point, I am at a crossroads. I am doing the cage in my 69, the main hoop is tacked in, the back down bars are cut and will be tacked in tomorrow morning. The question is, do I leave it a dual duty street car, with the possibility for a rear seat, or "finish" the cage with pure track intentions? I wanted to put a rear seat in it so folks could see that it is do-able with the three link for a street driven car, but, well, the car isn't "pretty" enough for a show car, but too nice to be a race car at the same time.

Wheels? Well, Sean kindly traded me his CCW's for some parts to help his Faux-COPO project, so these are essentially the basis for the second gen build (gotta do something with them, right!?!). I can only say that the new car will greatly resemble a steam roller. They are very nice, maybe not as pretty as the Kinesis, BUT!!!! Having just been burned by Kinesis on the delivery of my wheels, nearly a month delay, well, I am not too thrilled with them right now. Keep in mind, they are ten minutes from my house, I know them personally, also knowing they are going through some transitions, and are terrific folks beyond building an incredible product, but.... For the cash, delivery, purpose, etc, I think it might be hard to beat CCW based upon feedback I have gotten. 'specially for track wheels. Get 'em in black!

M

PAI Racing
04-27-2005, 09:03 AM
Katz, I had thought about doing a tube chassis A sports racer of some sort as well. I figured it might be trick to just pirate the geometry and suspension bits off an old ChampCar (mid '90s Reynards seem to be everywhere for around $20K). And then do a small block chevy powered sports racer... An interesting tidbit that I just stumbled upon recently; the Riley and Scott Mk III WSC car was actually a tube chassis car.

The GT1 car is never far from my mind, but the confluescence of cash and the right car hasn't happened yet. If I were to move the '67 my decision would be much easier... I actually had an evil plan to keep the Camaro and get a GT1 car, but then my wife started meeting with a landscaper... Oh mama!

Salt Racer
04-27-2005, 11:35 AM
...but then my wife started meeting with a landscaper... Oh mama!

Ouch! It'll be sad to see your '67 go, but I hope you'll find a good car at a good price.


You're right about R&S Mk III. I've always thought all of those LMP cars are monocoque (sp?). Your comment prompted me to do some looking around and I stumbled across this site. You've probably seen it. It's pretty cool.

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/index.htm

It's interesting that many LMP cars have parallel or even anti-Ackermann steering. I've seen those on open-wheel cars and assumed they've done it for aero reasons, which obviously isn't a concern on LMP cars. I guess it has to do with tire construction and straight line stability? R&S car even has rear-steer configuration, and what appears to be VERY short FVSAL. Riley rocker is intriguing. It seems to have different motion ratio for spring and shock. Very, very interesting stuff.


Mark,
I'd vote for keeping the back seats, or at least configure the cage so they can be installed later. I like the idea of a company R&D car that you can take prospective customer(s) for a ride around. We can do a racecar with 2nd gen.

Then we can build light weight track cars.

Whatever the finish I get on my rims, they'll be carbon black after 300 miles of driving LOL. But I really wish CCW does anodizing the whole rim in dark gunmetal like on JP's car. I suppose I can get brushed finish and paint them.

PAI Racing
04-28-2005, 08:05 AM
Mulsanne Corner is actually where I saw the write up about the R&S MkIII being a tube car! I was busy spanking... er I mean, reviewing the photos of the Eagle GTP car.

Salt Racer
04-28-2005, 12:25 PM
"The Toyota Eagle MkIII generated over 10,000 pounds of downforce at 200 MPH!..."

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2005/04/eek-2.gif

Steve1968LS2
04-28-2005, 03:06 PM
I want to go so you guys can give me tips on how to improve the suspension on the 68.. and a replacement for the rear bar on the four link.. it is a little too loud (in a clunky way) for driving around :)

PAI Racing
04-28-2005, 04:11 PM
I know the guy who was the team manager for Gurney when they were running that car. (Watched the Indy 500 at his girlfriend's house last year with he and a bunch of AAR guys.) The thing that amazed me most about that car was the fact that they took the "bus stop" chicane at Daytona flat, no brake, no lift no nothing... Compare pole time from '91 or so at Daytona to last year. That is interesting info.

I guess the car ran at an HSR or VARA event at Cal Speedway this year. Damn sorry I missed it. I love IMSA cars!

Mean 69
04-28-2005, 05:53 PM
You mean this Toyota? Say, who's that guy in the tan shirt with the fake SCCA credentials in the background anyway? Must be one of those guys that got to watch the practice race from the last hairpin turn at L.B., FIVE FEET from the darned cars!

Well, never mind on the photo, it is too large to attach. But it was a great shot!!! I wish I had a (computer) brain.

On the car front, the basic four point structure is now in place, just finished welding it in about an hour ago. Not a great pic, but I am super happy with the fit so far, really tight to the interior, and overall pretty tidy. Tonight will be a good night deciding whether I am going to weld in the cross bar for the shoulder harnesses, or make it a removable piece. I can say already that a four point does basically nothing to help torsional rigidity, even fully welded in I can muscle the bar to flex a bit side to side. At this point, there is no triangulation, so I am not surprised. That will be fixed.

You can also see where there used to be a seat back structure, but not anymore. 22 gallons of gas in the trunk means rear firewall. Yippee, sheet metal work! I just got a bead roller the other day, so this will help out a lot in making things a bit more rigid. Obviously, the box on top of the firewall is the torque box for the upper link. No sweat fitting in a two piece seat bottom and full seat back with this setup, it fits cleanly inside the stock rear seat back support too.

More to follow.
Mark

Salt Racer
04-29-2005, 04:38 PM
...The thing that amazed me most about that car was the fact that they took the "bus stop" chicane at Daytona flat, no brake, no lift no nothing... Compare pole time from '91 or so at Daytona to last year. That is interesting info....

Wow, that is amazing! It takes some big balls too.
It's really cool that you know all sorts of people in racing business. I think I'll be hanging around with you a lot when I move there ;-)


Mark,
Looks good. Is that 4130 or DOM? I think rear firewall is a good idea whether you have stock tank or not. Make it fit tight around the tunnel, wheel tubs, etc and maybe even tie into the rear bars somehow. That should help increase torsional rigidity.


Well, I hijacked my own thread and we haven't talked about SV event for a while so I'll get it back on track (for a short while - I'll probably hijack it back again myself).

One of the owners of SV John Wurth (really nice guy) captured a short video clip of me spinning at River side. Enjoy!

http://www.wurthwines.com/wms/videos/BW_4-2005_buick_spin2.wmv

alcino
04-29-2005, 09:51 PM
that video was awesome! What luck. And if you look to the left after they go over the hill you can see my car sitting on the side of the road after I had spun out.

MrQuick
04-29-2005, 10:47 PM
That was cool..." holy four corner flat spots Katzman "!! nice recovery too. I can't wait for July.

Orngcrush69
04-29-2005, 11:59 PM
Nice recorvery Katz! I almost did the same thing @ the beginning, but started to hit riverside @ a lower entry line and let the car slide up.

Mean 69
04-30-2005, 08:18 AM
Oh, very cool bud! I think there is a future for you in F1 testing, you kept it on the pavement! :drive1:

The bar is .120" DOM steel, I went with this for a couple reasons. One, it is a lot easier to deal with in terms of fabricating than the alloy, including welding. Two, if the car ever goes to full race mode, the cage will meet the requirements for NASA without having to be reconstructed. I certainly didn't do it for the cost, the thicker wall stuff is over $6 per foot. Thank you China for grabbing all of the steel in the world to build your country!!!

I made a seat back brace yesterday and integrated it into the cage, it came out really nice and made a big difference in the integrity of the cage so far. I'll snap a shot and drop it in here this weekend. I decided to go with a removable back bar (oh, the humility!), that will go in today, and then the "cage" will be basically good enough to hit the track. I'll do the forward bars, etc, later. With some luck, I may sneak out to BuRP on Friday for the Speedventure event to begin shaking the car out.

Mark

Salt Racer
04-30-2005, 01:20 PM
Yes, I really lucked out. I'd like to take a little credit for keeping my car on the pavement. But if John wasn't as good a driver as he is, there would have been some sheetmetal and fiberglass carnages.

I am obviously on the wrong line in the video. Proper line (or at least that's what I think) is to take the mid-later part of Riverside and Truck stop as one corner, taking relatively early apex at entrance Riverside. I was actually trying to give point-by b/c I saw the Corvette coming at pretty damn fast pace (as you can see), hence I was on the outside of the corner. I think I lost the traction due to marbles.

Moral of the story - wait for straight or very easy section until you pass or point-by somebody.


So Mark, when do you want me to fly out there? Should we shoot for the NASA event at Cal Speedway you were talking about? Good call on DOM. I personally don't like doing 4130 cage just b/c I suck at making nice tight-fitting fish mouths, which you need for TIG.

PAI Racing
05-02-2005, 08:45 AM
That was worth a good laugh! It looks like you were having a good time Katz! I am really impessed with all the smoke!

Salt Racer
05-02-2005, 11:23 AM
Heck yes!! It's about the most fun thing you can do behind the wheel of a car! I'll do it again in a heartbeat (not spin out but track event).

Hopefully I'll be a decent driver in a couple of years and I can laugh at my mistakes from the past.

PAI Racing
05-03-2005, 11:56 AM
Katz, it is all a learning experience and seat time is the key. The first time I drove a race car on the track, I backed an RX7 up on top of the flag stand between the "esses" and Star Mazda (going CCW). I have also spun and hit the pit wall after blowing my exit from Sunrise (also CCW in an RX7)... I don't like CCW at BuRP.

Salt Racer
05-03-2005, 02:28 PM
Wow, you had a fair share of mistakes yourself huh? That made me feel better.

Yeah, seat time. Should be able to get plenty of that once I relocate!

Thanks for sending me those lap times. That is really interesting. Those are some fast times. I too was surprised that ALMS cars are going faster than T/A cars. I thought Daytona Prototypes would be faster, but maybe I was thinking of some other series. I was comparing those to lap times @ Lagna Seca on SV website. Radicals are running pretty well at 1:32 to 1:36:xxx. The fastest production-based car (for that particular event I was looking at) is a 575hp Viper on slicks at 1:40:xxx.

You got pictures from Mark, right? Man, I love that car!

PAI Racing
05-04-2005, 08:35 AM
Katz,

I've destroyed a car at Willow too, but that wasn't my fault...

Mark's car looks so freaking bitchen! I really dig it. It looks like a mondern TransAm car hiding under a street car, but not as overtly as some of the more popular cars (Bob Owen's or Big Red).

The DSR lap that I included in that list was a 1:28ish as I recall. So, the Radicals at SV (I'm assuming they are the DSR Radicals and not the faster models) are about 4-8 seconds off a race Cheetah (which are really cool aluminum tub cars). That Viper at SV sounds like it was doing a decent job!

All in all those lap times were a real eye opener. I can't believe how fast the ALMS P2 cars are! They look so dang slow when you see them on TV and they are still over 5 seconds a lap faster than a DP at Laguna!

Salt Racer
05-05-2005, 05:33 AM
Katz,

I've destroyed a car at Willow too, but that wasn't my fault...

That's one thing I worry about, not my own car but destroying somebody else's car due to my mistake.


...Mark's car looks so freaking bitchen! I really dig it. It looks like a mondern TransAm car hiding under a street car, but not as overtly as some of the more popular cars (Bob Owen's or Big Red)....

Hell yes!! It definetely has "form follows function" look, and that's what a well-executed PT car should look like! I really like the rear shot, with fuel cell and bell crank peeking a little bit. If anything, I'd lower the ride height a touch more. Maybe I'll talk him into that when we do subframe. There should be enough adjustment in 3-link to compensate for height adjustment.


...The DSR lap that I included in that list was a 1:28ish as I recall. So, the Radicals at SV (I'm assuming they are the DSR Radicals and not the faster models) are about 4-8 seconds off a race Cheetah (which are really cool aluminum tub cars). That Viper at SV sounds like it was doing a decent job!

All in all those lap times were a real eye opener. I can't believe how fast the ALMS P2 cars are! They look so dang slow when you see them on TV and they are still over 5 seconds a lap faster than a DP at Laguna!

I think that particular Radical is a regular SR3 (it just says SR3 turbo).

I really need to get cable TV...The only time I can watch road racing on TV is when CBS covers F1 or ALMS, which doens't happen very often. Watching NASCAR bores me after a while.

PAI Racing
05-05-2005, 08:34 AM
Its funny, I grew up around road racing, but worked on stock cars from a fairly early age. I still enjoy stock car racing, but I can't take the "cult of personality" and "Entertainment" aspects of NASCRAP (as Paul Tracy once called it).

I was racing at Willow when I lost my first RX7. Stuff like that can happen. I think it is a lot less likely to kill someone else's car at an open track event.

I think the SR3's are supposed to be hotter than the DSR Radicals. Is that the one with that pretty little V8 that Radical builds?

Mean 69
05-05-2005, 09:50 AM
Thanks for the compliments on the car, guys. The front wheel offset is what makes it look a lot different than typical car's, but I have a very strong feeling that this look will become very popular in the near future when parts/subframes with a wider track become available in the marketplace. I dropped a pic of the rear under the "Safety" section, in the Fuel Safe thread the other day. Here is a shot of the car from the front. My current limitation to making the car lower is the exhaust, specifically the stepped headers. They fit really well, but the collectors point down at a pretty good angle, so in order to mate the x-pipe up to them, well, didn't leave too much to work with. It sounds so vicious that I am not going to touch it for now though. I need some aero pretty soon too, so it'll all come together at that point.

Mark

Q ship
05-05-2005, 10:13 AM
Thanks for the compliments on the car, guys. The front wheel offset is what makes it look a lot different than typical car's,
Ohhhh geeez-I have many many questions for you Mark! Very nice looking car, I like the ones that have a lot going on "under the skin".

Salt Racer
05-05-2005, 11:39 AM
Thanks for the compliments on the car, guys....

You deserve it! Dig the license plate too.

Salt Racer
05-05-2005, 11:43 AM
I think the SR3's are supposed to be hotter than the DSR Radicals. Is that the one with that pretty little V8 that Radical builds?

Hmmm, not sure. But based on HP number (320hp), I'd say yes. It's gotta be tough to squeeze that kind of power out of a 4-cycle 1300-cc 4 cylinder, even turbo charged. But I could be wrong...

Salt Racer
05-09-2005, 07:32 AM
Fastest lap of the day.

http://www.wurthwines.com/wms/videos/BW_13_CCW-4-15-2005_Fast_Lap.wmv

MrQuick
05-09-2005, 09:29 AM
John is a monster on the track, can't wait.
Mark your car is looking good. Are those true 3 piece rims?

jeffandre
05-09-2005, 10:37 AM
Thanks for the compliments on the car, guys. The front wheel offset is what makes it look a lot different than typical car's, but I have a very strong feeling that this look will become very popular in the near future when parts/subframes with a wider track become available in the marketplace. I dropped a pic of the rear under the "Safety" section, in the Fuel Safe thread the other day. Here is a shot of the car from the front. My current limitation to making the car lower is the exhaust, specifically the stepped headers. They fit really well, but the collectors point down at a pretty good angle, so in order to mate the x-pipe up to them, well, didn't leave too much to work with. It sounds so vicious that I am not going to touch it for now though. I need some aero pretty soon too, so it'll all come together at that point.

Mark

Nice wheels Mark! I like the high offset look, have a set on order from CCW right now. What size and b.s. numbers did you use? Any rubbing up front?

Mean 69
05-10-2005, 02:40 PM
The wheels are from Kinesis, they are true three piece-rs, really light and very tough (not that I have tested the latter). They can provide darned near any offset you like, Alan is the main sales guy and a super cool person to boot.

I am running 9.5" on the front, with a 7" backspacing. This is an oddball setup, as I am running some wheel adapters in the front knowing that the "new" front suspension will have a wider track, I am hoping that I won't have to buy the front's again. I am running 275 KD's, and yes, you bet, I get rubbing. It looks like the first rub point is on the inner wheelwell, passenger side, in the back area. I pounded it in a bit, and it helped, but there still is a little rubbing. I thought about heating it up and then whacking it, but there is this stuff called paint, sealant, etc on the other side that might not like orange hot metal! I have been pretty careful about tight radius turns beyond that, but the next spot on my car seems to be the sway bar. I run the GW uppers, I think that gives a lot more clearance than the stock style. Overall, I am really not too worried about rubbing so far. I have driven the car maybe 100 miles with these, and aside from turning into the garage, etc, it is not that bad at all. No U turns though!

Mark

Salt Racer
05-10-2005, 02:49 PM
www.speedventures.net

Keep clicking on Refresh button, and you'll eventually see it on upper right corner.

alcino
05-10-2005, 05:20 PM
I'm jealous

jeffandre
05-11-2005, 05:23 AM
The wheels are from Kinesis, they are true three piece-rs, really light and very tough (not that I have tested the latter). They can provide darned near any offset you like, Alan is the main sales guy and a super cool person to boot.

I am running 9.5" on the front, with a 7" backspacing. This is an oddball setup, as I am running some wheel adapters in the front knowing that the "new" front suspension will have a wider track, I am hoping that I won't have to buy the front's again. I am running 275 KD's, and yes, you bet, I get rubbing. It looks like the first rub point is on the inner wheelwell, passenger side, in the back area. I pounded it in a bit, and it helped, but there still is a little rubbing. I thought about heating it up and then whacking it, but there is this stuff called paint, sealant, etc on the other side that might not like orange hot metal! I have been pretty careful about tight radius turns beyond that, but the next spot on my car seems to be the sway bar. I run the GW uppers, I think that gives a lot more clearance than the stock style. Overall, I am really not too worried about rubbing so far. I have driven the car maybe 100 miles with these, and aside from turning into the garage, etc, it is not that bad at all. No U turns though!

Mark

I also had rubbing at the same two areas. I removed the inner fender bracket that bolts to the firewall area and shortened it an inch or so, pulling the inner fender in towards the firewall some, which stopped that rubbing. The sway bar is a different story, and since I have 7.5" bs on my 19x10's I will also utilize a thin spacer if needed (need my front rotor hats first before I get into the spacer thing). I have Vette Brakes UCA's and LCA's and they do not get in the way like the stock arms did, otherwise I would be removing aluminum from the wheel on tight turns (the sway bar provides a nice steering stop before I contact the LCA's...). I may get the steering box 'adjusted' at some point if the rubbing poses any problems.

PAI Racing
05-13-2005, 02:04 PM
Katz,

Awesome! I clicked through the refersh button and saw a photo of both the spec Miata and the Datsun 510 that I drove a couple of years ago... Rent-a-racer flashiback!

dennis68
05-13-2005, 06:19 PM
Hey Katz, I checked the results from that event...that is a pretty impressive list of cars you whooped on. The 02 Vette and 99 Mustang owners must feel like junk getting their tails dusted by a 35 year old 2 ton barge. Smacking down a few Evo's and 300Z's doesn't hurt either.

Congratulations on either tremendous driving skills or more impressive chassis tuning skills getting that thing around the track.

Salt Racer
05-16-2005, 06:16 AM
Actually, I wasn't happy with my lap time at all. Most of those slow people were in yellow group (first timers). I think there are only 3~4 cars in white that were slower than me.

I need more seat time, and I really need wider tires. 4300 lbs are lots of weight for a set of 245/255s. Those hard compound (tread wear rating of 300) street tires got quite greasy after few hard laps.

The fact is, I'll probably never be satisfied with my own lap times. If I managed to pull 2:10:xxx someday, then I'd want to go 2:05:xxx. I'll probably quit driving if I ever get satisfied.

EDIT Looks like there are about 6~7 white group cars behind me, and one blue group car. Not bad, but I know I can do better than that next time.