anybody flipped the ats mounts???... lsx in 70 chevelle

[The WidowMaker]

ive searched for hours on this topic, and i still havent found the answers that i need. im looking for someone that used the ats/autokraft/s&p mounts (all exactally the same) and have made an lsx motor fit in their chevelle. ive found guys that have used the ats mounts, but placed a spacer underneath. nobody said whether they tried them while flipped.
heres what i have so far.....
stock crossmember painted bc/cc ... dont want to notch now
ats mounts
short and wide frame mount
autokraft pan to be ordered soon

whos used the above parts? what about headers? ive read some people in the initial mock up with the edelbrocks, but is anybody on the street with them? is anybody running the aftermarket accessory drives? does anyone make them minus the a/c?
so far i called ats and autokraft and they both said that the mounts SHOULD work when flipped. anybody have a definite answer?
thanks, Tim

[camcojb]

I flipped my ATS mounts initially on my 64, since they do not clear the frame towers otherwise. I called Tyler and he said he believed the engine would be slightly higher is all. I later trimmed my mounts to run them the way they were intended, and honestly I did not notice any difference in where the engine sat.

I'm running Tylers pan and it cleared fine with the mounts flipped, or later the normal way.

Jody

[The WidowMaker]

how did they not clear the frame tower? any pics of what youre talking about?

with the limited pictures i have seen, im not sure how flipping gains height either. it almost seems as though the mounting hole is in the middle of the mount. therefore flipping would do nothing. but i dont have one in my hands yet to tell.

im tempted to just buy the 307 mounts and modify them to work. i could just slice them down the middle and weld them back up 1/8 narrower. this will give me the extra 1/2" that i need. some say that raising the motor will ruin the center of gravity blah blah..... but i think the lowest part of the car will be the headers. raising the motor 1/2" will allow me to lower the car 1/2" more thus actually improving cog since the whole car will be lower.


thanks, Tim

[chicane67]

There is a plate that is sandwiched in the poly mold that has a sort-of lip on it that comes in contact with the frame stand. It works and clears on some applications and not so well on others... its is something beyond the individual components control.

The solution is to mill the lip off of the mount and install it in its normal configuration as per the ATS Engine Mount instructions... as Jody describes in his reply.

[camcojb]

There is a plate that is sandwiched in the poly mold that has a sort-of lip on it that comes in contact with the frame stand. It works and clears on some applications and not so well on others... its is something beyond the individual components control.

The solution is to mill the lip off of the mount and install it in its normal configuration as per the ATS Engine Mount instructions... as Jody describes in his reply.

yes, to be clear, it is not a fault of Tylers stuff. It's the individual frame mount on my Chevelle that's the problem. Simple solution though.

Jody

[tom_a]

Tim,

EDIT: Forgot to mention this is a 69 Chevelle frame
I don't have all your answers but I thought I would share my findings. The answer is YES the ATS mounts when flipped (Logo upside down) will fit an A-Body frame. This is the way Tyler had told me to do it. I don't listen very well sometimes (All the time according to my wife) and I did not catch that. I originally installed the ATS plates with the logo upright. It was close to working that way...but just could only get one bolt on one side. I called Tyler and he said that I am doing it wrong.....flip upside down. I went out to the garage and did that. They fell right into place perfect. I don't have good pictures of the first time (no spacers) but you will see the frame stands in stock position...not move back like every other A-Body I have seen. I am using the ATS pan and it cleared the cross member with no notch. It was very close almost touching and I would not have wanted to run it that way. I don't think it is possible to get an LSX pan with more clearance than the ATS pan..just no physical way to me. The second picture is after I installed 1/2" spacers and moved the engine back. One note is that when I installed the spacers I reversed the plates (Logo upright). They fell right into place. I suspect that the F-Body cars have motor stands that land higher up on the subframe..pure speculation on my behalf and really academic at this point. As you already know the spacers were installed to try and accommodate tie rod issues. The tie rod issue in my mind is not related to my style pan or plates. Rather it is just a problem with our front steer cars. I am still trying to resolve tie rod issue on my car. The plates will work.

As for the headers I have the Edelbrock and I see no issues. In fact for $600.00 for a 1 3/4" stepped to 1-7/8" in 409SS material is a great value. These just started arriving to people a little over a month ago so not many running yet. Andrew (AndrewB70) here is the only one I know of to actually be lit off. He has a build thread in project section going right now.

As for the aftermarket accessories with out A/C..I believe Sinister makes them that way. Scott Gulbranson's car has that system without A/C see g69camaro.com

Stock frame stands in factory location with plates upside down
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/Chevelleframe009700-1.jpg
1/2" spacers with frame stands moved back with plates upright ie; logo facing up
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/hd21000-1.jpg
Header's do not hang down that bad
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/fr7900-1.jpg
Edelbrock A-Body LSX Header's
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/hd31000-1.jpg

[tom_a]

Here is a shot of the ATS oil pan...a huge amount of room. Sure it is not the cheapest and the remote oil filter is not for everybody but I am very happy with the fit, form and quality of it.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/1000pan-1.jpg

[The WidowMaker]

thanks tom... a few questions though...

did you try it with the spacers and with the plates up side down? would this have gotten you a little more room?

you said you moved the motor back. did you actually put it closer to the firewall? if so, why, how much and is this going to cause header issues?

the only other issue i can think of is driveline angle. with the tremec, most guys have raised the rear of the tranny. doing this will cause the motor to pivot on the mounts and put the front of the pan closer to the tierods. not by much, but still something to consider.

i just bought the taller frame stands and im going to use the taller engine mounts with them. ill slice the stand and reweld it so the taller engine mount will fit over it. the stand and mount combo should buy me about 1/2"

tim

[tom_a]

Tim,

I did try the plates upside down with spacers...they would not fit that way....same issue just reversed. They fit fine with the spacers when I rotated (Logo upright). I moved the engine stands back because the stock location it moved the pan to close to cross member. If you notice the second picture above with spacers the stands are also reversed. When I get the body back on I will determine if there is a header problem. I feel there is plenty of room to play with. The whole spacer thing for tie rods may not even really help anyway. If you see this thread https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42716 you will see where they still hit on one side. I suspect once I figure out what I am doing wrong that they will hit on both sides anyway.

[tom_a]

Here is a better picture of the the frame stands located when I pulled the SBC out. It seems odd that these actually hang off the front however pan still clears even like this, but again I think your real concern should be tie rods regardless of whom ever pan/mounts you use. One thing I forgot to say is like Jody said above you could trim or hollow to make the mounts work either way...but I was not really concerned with where the logo is facing.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2008/04/1000SIEPAN-1.jpg

[The WidowMaker]

well i just ordered the autokraft pan and plates, and i also got the taller stands with the taller mounts. ill let you guys know how it goes.