Project P.o.s. Part 2

[70bird]

Thanks to all that responded to my 1st questions. You guys have been a great help in deciding how far to go on these repairs. Much appreciated!

Ok, I found a roof today at my local ecology self serve wrecking off a slightly newer 2nd gen. It’s in really good shape, inside and out for $120.00 + $100.00 for a guy to remove it. Sweet, that parts taken care of. I had him cut way below the A-pillars, actually taking a chunk of the dash with it as well as much of the upper sail/ ¼ panel.
Now, I’m wondering how much of it I will actually need to use.
Worse case, I will replace the entire roof with bracing and all, but really my roof skin is what is rusty. so I’m thinking I will cut out my existing skin so I can get a better look at the braces for rust etc; and will have access to previously hidden areas for blasting.
So, here’s my question: Should I plan to remove the entire skin at all the factory spot welds etc? Or can I just slice it and leave a “margin” all the way around, leaving window channel and door channels intact? If so, should I cut it at the edges of the channels on the 90deg. bends, or should I leave more of a margin than that. Would welding be easier at the edges, or on the flat areas?
I really don’t want to replace the entire roof section if I don’t need to as I am told that temporary bracing would be required so the car doesn’t twist out of shape. I do have welded in sub frame connectors and a 4 point roll bar mounted to rear floor and wheel wells, so I wonder if that would be enough or if I would need to brace it.

Here’s a link to my previous post for pics:

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38697

Thanks for looking, Mark

[70bird]

Well, I had today to get something done to my junk, so I decided to just go for it. I'm in it for real now!

I left a good margin to weld to, but I don't know, maybe this thing just needs the whole top as rust is everywhere. It's all surface rust and is now accessible for blasting except the insides of the A-pillars. Here there is surface rust on the insides, as far down as I can see with a flashlight. I suppose these areas could be chemically treated.

Here's a few pics:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
This shot is from the rear and shows A-pillar at the left
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Any suggestions to save the roof are welcome, Mark

[shep]

I would wire brush what I could get at and use rust a converter or encapsulater on it. For inside the a A pillar you could put a rag on a wire dip it in the encapsulater and run it through.

[mikey]

I would media blast or sand it the best I could or $$$ allow then rust mort etch prime and epoxy prime. 3M makes a nice wheel called strip and clean for die grinders the only problem is it's only 1/2 wide. It stripps away rust and paint with minimal thinning of metal works great for small areas. You might try that along with a wire wheel.

[bart007]

Wow, if the lkq part is in good condition, I would have cut the roof in the middle of the a-pillars and in the middle of the sail panels toward the smaller end. Then replaced the whole roof assy as a unit, not quite as much finish work would be needed w/this approach.

[mikey]

Wow, if the lkq part is in good condition, I would have cut the roof in the middle of the a-pillars and in the middle of the sail panels toward the smaller end. Then replaced the whole roof assy as a unit, not quite as much finish work would be needed w/this approach.
True but it means more work splicing in the pillars and potential fit problems if not done correctly. Skinning it would be alot faster and easier for a newbie to get it right.

[70bird]

True but it means more work splicing in the pillars and potential fit problems if not done correctly. Skinning it would be alot faster and easier for a newbie to get it right.

OK, I agree with just re-skinning. This brings up a new set of newbie Q's. (sorry)

How to get the skin off the roof I just bought without killing it? I am not concerned with the spot welded sections, but with the drip molding area that is wrapped around the roof frame. (much like a door skin) Also, the adhesive that is used between the skin and frame was real tough to get separated when I took my old skin off. I ended up using a long pry bar to get it off, and bent it quite a bit in the process. I obviously don't want to use this technique with the new one. So, how to do it?

How far down the A- pillars should I replace?

Thanks for your time, Mark

[mikey]

You should find a seam that runs roughly even with the side (bottom edge) of the skin on the top of the a pillar. As for the sealer a little heat from a small butane lighter helps quite a bit.Not the pencil type but the one the size of a travel deoderant can. Heat up the ribs from the bottom just toasty to the touch. All you are doing is making it easier to cut not burn it out.Then use a slightly flexible putty knife to score it a little each pass. It will take a bit so just take it easy use some wood shims to space it appart as you go to make it a liitle easier to work don't rush or for the issue you will end up bending the skin. As for the drip rail I will do some research I'm not exactly sure of the design on a 2nd gen. I hate to tell you wrong. Also clean out the lead on the sail panels you will find the factory seam under it should be the same way on the a pillar.

[redfire69]

It may be a little too late, but I saw this today... a new skin for $360 (if camaro is the same)...

Also, the seams (if leaded) can be cleaned out with a butane (plumbers) torch as described above. They should be evident at the A-pillar and sail panel. I would recommend a whole re-roof at this point as well.

Ron

http://www.ecklerscamaro.com/product.asp?pf%5Fid=731330&dept%5Fid=1439

roof skin at ecklers:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

getting the lead out:

[70bird]

Redfire, Thanks for the link!
I wonder if that is that is the same panel I found at The Paddock? I didn't even know about Ecklers before this, and will be checking them out for other parts as I have a used roof skin now.
BTW, Ecklers price is the same as Paddock, but was 100.00 less for shipping to CA. Go figure!

Thought I would post up some progress on my roof skin replacement. This has been quite a lot if work and has required about 20 hours to get the old skins off my car and the donor roof. I bought a spot weld cutter from Eastwood and that made things a lot easier.
I figure that there were about 200 spot welds cut out from both panels. Whew!! Now I know why the body shop wanted so much to do it!
I got the new skin sitting on the car to test fit and it is good. The most nerve racking part was cutting the skin at the A-pillars at the right place as there is no real straight edge to measure from. So, I cut a little long and trimmed to fit. So far, so good.

I didn’t close up the wrapped (like a door skin) section at the drip rail and A-pillar yet as I am removing it again for rust treatment of the roof panel, and a coat of rust encapsulater. I’m hoping this will close up a small gap (about 1/16” or less) on the driver’s side A-pillar seam.
Here are a couple of pics:

Driver's side:Should I add some metal tabs to close this gap?
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
Pass. side
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

What do you all recommend, POR-15 or DP90, or other?
Spot weld like factory, or seam weld window channels? What about the sail panel section?

Any advice or tips are appreciated,
Mark

[mikey]

On the sail panel I would spot weld it like factory then stitch weld the seam. On the apillar iwould just stitch weld it also the gap is thin enough to be able to come really close to metal finishing it. Stitch welding is basically welding a 1/2" skiping 3" or so and repeat until weld is solid. Pretty much go in circles until yor last weld runs into the first pass you made.