So I look at a pro built car, and get discouraged but...

[Rileys68Camaro]

I have a 1968 Camaro, I've never been in serious debt for it, only had one bad shop incident.

It's not costing me any money to have it, I've had it 10 years, and though it doesn't run, I've only worked on it for about 6 months total if I added up the hours, plus the shop screw ups. Most of it is new, gas tank, exhaust, motor, guages, stock suspension, wheels, tires, lights, wiring, glass, it did get a subframe blast and spray and an okay paint job.

I've probably got about $15-20K into it, labor and all. Added it up once, probably never again...:) Most of that was the 'need' for the best, and fancy stuff. Like the high end Auto Meter stuff, Vintage Air that I didn't need on a non running/driveable car. But then I didn't buy the real needed stuff, like seats, seat belts, steering stuff etc.

Now that I've learned a lot, I should have it on the road next summer.

It will be on 15" wheels, with a SSBC front disc, and a $3000 or less brand new motor, a used but functioning 700r4 and Vintage air.

I probably won't have much interior, but it's will be glassed and weatherstripped and driven hard.

I will have a few nice things on this car by then, Vintage Air, most likely a March Serpentine kit and Corbeu seats.

But you know what? It's a freaking 68 Camaro that I wanted since I saw Better Off Dead(that was a 67, but hey) and I'm lucky to have it so I'm going to enjoy it.

So yes, I would love a C5 subframe, LS6 motor, Boze wheels etc. But if I was to wait and buy those, I'd never drive my car, or be in major debt and I won't do that.

Just thought I'd share, as I've stared at my car for hours, just being frustrated and discouraged.

Driving it on 15"s will be much more fun that looking at it sitting in the garage with 17"s.

[Chad-1stGen]

Amen!

I really enjoy this site but it gets you thinking about all the cool things you want for you car that it doesn't have. While the builds that are planned out well in advance look great, if you can't afford all the high dollar stuff or don't want to spend it just get the car on the road!

I find myself thinking of a lot of things I want but when it comes down to it I sure like being able to drive my car right now when I want instead of working on a non moving vehicle.

[bbcc]

+1

Very true, some folks loose sight of the overall goal which is to beat the living snot out of the cars we build.

I would much rather cruise or race than look at fancy billet.

[Smock67]

i have loads of plans for mine... but as soon as its done being painted im rockin the hell out of the 15's hell they might even be 14's i dont even care if my interior is completed i'll find a seat to bolt in and drive it.

Heres to those that just wanna DRIVE HARD

[Rileys68Camaro]

Yep, you can do a lot while driving it. Heck, even if you have to take a weekend or two you can do a lot.

With some effort, one weekend can be a mini tub or simple roll bar or hook up some guages etc and be driving again on Monday.

If I ever do another, that's how it will be.

[protour_chevelle]

Amen! Thats why I try and do as much work as possible over the winter months, but not too much to cause me to not be able to drive it for the following summer.

Then at the car shows its a new car every year!

[strangler]

I raise a glass for the cars that really should be alive, held back by the pipe-dreams of thier selfish owners.

I know I'm doing all I can!!!!!!

(great thread!!)

[NOT A TA]

I try to keep from getting in too deep again. I made a nice car unusable for the last 20 years and STILL haven't put it back together. The other ones I keep running and doing small upgrades in driving weather and bigger jobs in the off months. I'd rather drive them on the street and tracks than have them idle with expensive dreams. Someone will always have a faster or nicer car but I enjoy my time behind the wheel.

[68Formula]

Keeping it driveable is my motto too. I just don't have the time or money, so I keep the improvements small and systematic.

Sure it would be nice to drop in a LSX engine/trans combo but that would mean too much downtime. Instead I'll work on installing an overdrive trans probably this winter. Later on (maybe next year) new modern cylinderheads and then someday adding injection to the engine I have.

[High Plains Mopars]

I see it this way, either you have the means to purchase all the parts and goodies and pay to have them installed, or you acquire the skills and talent to build the parts and perform the work yourself. So if you don't have the $$, then you need to learn to fabricate.

Since I've had one of each, a multi-decade project and a shabby driver, I've also decided that it is much more fun to drive a roach than to sit and look at a partially complete beauty queen. If I can perform a mod over a few months worth of weekends in the winter, then it is put on the to-do list for some unspecified time in the future.

[twosaturns]

I feel your pain...
I remember back in the day, I sold my nova for a deal I couldn't pass up (a friend got the nova, I got $3K, a running driver 78 3 speed stick malibu, and I kept my engine and wheels and gta seats!)
I had all these plans for the malibu (tpi 350, T-5, GN rear, etc- hey, it WAS the early 90s!) but I got discouraged by how much it would run, and how much down time it would take. I should have kept my running, just painted nova, but I got all the 'big plans' and it killed my enthusiasm. I learned that a good solid driver is more important than a high dollar rolling tribute to the summit catalog. one day maybe I'll build another car, but kids take priority, and restoring our old victorian home is a busy, satisfying thing too.

[yellowrallys]

Drive that 68 and be proud! AS IS!

[backtobasics]

AMEN!
I am going to be proud as hell to roll my Challenger again (its been 10 years) and its going to be primer, 15 steel wheels, and I am going to love every minute of it. the goal is power tour 2008!

[TA219]

I hear ya 100% on getting a little depressed when looking at professional cars, I just dont have the kind of money that a car like that requires. But i do usually have plenty of time so i fab up my own parts and do my own work after doing plenty of reading, and so far most things have turned out ok :)

My car does have alot of compromise, I am running a 5.3 iron block lsx out of a truck rather than an alum LS1 , I didnt mini-tub it or put a 4-link in it yet, no high $$ subframe, it has no A/C, etc.... but it is rust free (now), and does have some cool pro-touring stuff on it. According to my spread sheet i have 15k in it and last month the engine roared to life for the 1st time. :)

I expect to have it painted and driving by the end of next summer and should come in around $20k total if things go well

[indyjps]

Ive got a 69 that was parked as a running/driving/ 12 sec street/strip car in 1998. I pulled the engine so my siblings would not get the urge to go for a drive while I was in the military.
there it sits, complete less engine waiting for a tear down and paint, truck pan and the door have started to pinhole in the front corners, thats it. I have a near stock 350 and a 12-1 comp 383 and a built 406 short block sitting next to it.
I taken the last few years and purchased all the suspension and brake parts Ill use.
Ive moved 3 times in the past year so that has killed any time to get started but Im thinking about just dropping in the 383 put on the new front brakes and drive it on the 15" weld big and littles with ratty white paint for a summer.
the vintage air and 6 speed can wait a few more years, and I personally dont want an ls1, I have an unassembled 434 gen 1 short block that will get injection.

[nbecker]

When your driving your muscle car with 15 inch wheels and a first gen small block theres alot of people that will say to there self i sure wouldnt mind crusin that around, And if they dont they can keep there green peace hybrid POS!

[trapin]

Riley...I'm pickin' up what you're throwin' down, bro. After Pigeon Forge in September I finally decided I was done waiting and set a goal to have my car done by next year. To get there, I had to scratch a lot of stuff off the build list that I "wanted" but didn't "need". Some of the items that went bye-bye were; Paddle Shifter, 18" wheels, Hydroboost, DS&E control arms (I'm using the ATS/AFX spindels so I kept my stock arms and fortified them with billet cross shafts and del-a-lum bushings). Plus there were a lot of other little things that got axed too.

I figure I'll just add that other stuff later. Once I'm done paying off all the debt. LOL!!!!

[Dookie]

Well this is my first post , so what better way to introduce myself,

This story hits home too hard , I have been chasing second gens for five years , ever since i saw one on the cover of Hot Rod magazine all done up , i had to have one . Now after owning 5 second gens i have finally ended up with a nice car . The first one i bought was a driver , but i wanted a big block for it , so i ripped the driveline out and sold it , the car sat for over a year dormant before i decided i would rather have a R/S car , i found one , sold my first one , and pulled the R/S to the back lot of my shop , i lingered around latreral g for a while dreaming , planning thinking i am going to build a nice car one day , to make a long story short, i did this with the next three cars , all of which needed total resto's , all the time doing nothing but dreaming , about what kind of beast i would someday build . Somehow going through a Divorce , Starting a new company , raising my child on my own, remarriying , and the normal ups and downs of life got in my way ... I cannot tell you how many countless hours i spent late at night looking and dreaming and never being able to move forward ....
But let me get onto my point , about a month and a half ago , one night when i couldnt sleep at around 3 in the morning i was on the computer and stumbled across , what in my opinion was a deal of a lifetime . . . I finalized the deal and ended up with a real nice running driving car that i am extremely happy with , it is not the style i am going to keep but i have put nearly 800 miles on it in the last few weekends of owning it , and can tell you that every second of every mile it has put a smile on my face ...
My recommendation is , if you have a decent base , build it for nothing else but the pure pleasure of driving it ... you can change stuff in phases , sure it may never make it to show car quality , but at least you will get some satisfaction out of owning it .. i could have made almost any of my other cars decent drivers , but i too wanted to make a full blown P/T car , and wanted to settle for nothing less ....
my Present car has a nicely built 350 with a saginaw 4spd , old school chrome Cragars that look like the older dish centerlines , nice but all stock interior , almost completely stock suspension , and i can still say it drives like a dream. And i cannot begin to tell you how many people have stopped me and oooohhed and awwwed about it . Sorry for the long post but i felt compelled to let my story flow , and i am not good at summarizing ...:pat:

[Dookie]

Ive got a 69 that was parked as a running/driving/ 12 sec street/strip car in 1998. I pulled the engine so my siblings would not get the urge to go for a drive while I was in the military.
there it sits, complete less engine waiting for a tear down and paint, truck pan and the door have started to pinhole in the front corners, thats it. I have a near stock 350 and a 12-1 comp 383 and a built 406 short block sitting next to it.
I taken the last few years and purchased all the suspension and brake parts Ill use.
Ive moved 3 times in the past year so that has killed any time to get started but Im thinking about just dropping in the 383 put on the new front brakes and drive it on the 15" weld big and littles with ratty white paint for a summer.
the vintage air and 6 speed can wait a few more years, and I personally dont want an ls1, I have an unassembled 434 gen 1 short block that will get injection.


dont let the 5.3 motor get you down , i have one that i have gotten on trade , granted it has afr heads and a procharger , but it made 530 at the rear wheels with pump gas and through a 4L60e tranny . stock injectors ,no headers .

[73z-6sp]

Amen!



Thats exactly what I was thinking I would post, before I even got to your post. Well said!

[Moose]

My recommendation is , if you have a decent base , build it for nothing else but the pure pleasure of driving it ... you can change stuff in phases , sure it may never make it to show car quality , but at least you will get some satisfaction out of owning it .. i could have made almost any of my other cars decent drivers , but i too wanted to make a full blown P/T car , and wanted to settle for nothing less ....


I bought a good driver and have been working on my car in stages. I first did wheels, then I did the interior and a 6 speed. Now i'm upgrading to a ls1 over the winter.

I have just been enjoying driving mine and backed away from a full tear down dream car build. I know its not going to happen without a lot of hard work and cash. I have no problem with the work, its the cash that always gets me.:hand:

Being a one income family with two kids under 3, family comes first, car second.. I budget everything and try to do it as best and reasonable as I can.

Good luck, driving and enjoying the car is the most important part. Working on it is one of my favorite parts. If it was finished, I'd have to start on something else..:razz:

[Dookie]

Yeah i am involved in running / managing a Machine and fabrication shop (industrial) so doing a lot of stripping cleaning myself is easy , but time , and of course money is always a constraint..... single income ? uggghh my wife is quitting work in Feb. and going to fininsh Nursing school , we have a newborn.... she took 12 weeks off for that with no +maternity pay ... it dwindles the back pocket account very quickly.....

[steemin]

I believe that you have the right perspective in regards to your car.
Do not ever let envy enter into the equation and force you into putting more money into a car than you are comfortable with.
Or more importantly embarass you into not finishing a car because you don't think it will be up to snuff.
One thing I want to share with you is that imho the real joy of owning these cars is the pleasure of driving them. Not parking them somewhere and having people drool on them. Hell most people will pick it apart anyway even if it is a high end build..
Git R runnin and enjoy:cool:

Scott

[trapin]

My car does have alot of compromise, I am running a 5.3 iron block lsx out of a truck....
Cool. I'm interested to hear how that goes. I have a 5.3 iron block in my 2002 Silverado and I think it's an amazing engine. Hands down the best performing mill I've had in a daily driver. It's got 113,000 miles on it and the other day I pulled away from a brand new Dodge Hemi on the freeway while I was trying to merge over. He thought he was going to be cute and cut me off but my truck out accelerated him. The look on his face was priceless. I plan to hand this truck down to my son Jake when he's ready and when I do I'm going to do a complete rebuild on the motor, have a stage I done on the heads and stick in the stock camshaft that came out of my LS1.

[Martin71RS]

My Camaro is my only (real) car and it is undrivable for the 2nd time...I've owned it for 9 years now and driven it 2 maybe 2.5 years max.

If I ever do a project like this again I will make sure I have one driving muscle car.......(or keep it as a driving project)

Martin

[Dookie]

I believe that you have the right perspective in regards to your car.
Do not ever let envy enter into the equation and force you into putting more money into a car than you are comfortable with.
Or more importantly embarass you into not finishing a car because you don't think it will be up to snuff.
One thing I want to share with you is that imho the real joy of owning these cars is the pleasure of driving them. Not parking them somewhere and having people drool on them. Hell most people will pick it apart anyway even if it is a high end build..
Git R runnin and enjoy:cool:

Scott

Scott
YOur car looks like a pretty high end build.......Beutiful!

[SHANE 73Z]

My 73 and I celebrated our 10th anniversary this year..........(my name is Shane and I have a problem)

My car has never been down for more than a few weeks at a time. I bought the car as a decent driver and it does sit in the garage through the winter (big enough to park in but no work can be done).

I see the pro built stuff for what it is, but wouldnt have my car any other way. I can drive it where & when I want without concern. It will be getting its 4th engine in the spring. It doesnt have the best of everything, but I have it to a level of performance that can scare me. I am in the process of working out little bugs that have kept me from any driving events but they should be resolved this year.

Then it will be time to work on the slow kid behind the wheel!!!! DRIVE IT LIKE YOU STOLE IT

Shane

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3333928)

[Rileys68Camaro]

I got lucky, that even though I had some issues with the shop, and it's primered where they wrecked it, it's now straight and rust free. Coated on the bottom and inside.

So for beauty, it just needs a front clip pulled and repaint of the firewall, dash and primered section.

But putting the fenders on and off half dozen times for the "I'm going to just wait and paint it. No, no, I want to drive it" I'm confident I can tear it down and re assemble after paint fairly easilly and quickly.

If you can, take your car apart and put it together a time or two just cause. Then, when you do it for the final real time, it will be so much easier and you won't be waiting on that part that you need but didn't know it.

[Bill Howell]

+1

Very true, most folks loose sight of the overall goal which is to beat the living snot out of the cars we build.

I would much rather cruise or race than look at fancy billet.

There, I fixed your post. Same thing I have been saying for years. I think some are truely scared to finish their cars, for fear they will actually have to drive them.

Anyone can be a keyboard warrior and they don't impress anyone, however, show me some tire smoke and I am in!

[BonzoHansen]

Rock on! Time & money kills my dreams too! Not!

I finally got my 77 back on the road this summer and I am so happy. I easily put over 2000 miles on it this summer.

I couldn't afford big wheels & tires or rear disc or more motor. But some low buck upgrades (12" rotors, SPC arms, some del-a-lum, etc, porterfield pads & shoes, 4th gen seats, yada yada yada) and it is pretty fun to drive. I'll make some upgrades here & there over time, but keeping it driveable. T56 is next so I can drive it even more!

Rock it man!

[OHCbird]

I feel ya, man- I had to put the brakes on a few items & focus on getting what I have done. I shouldn't even be doing this right now- I've been so damn busy since 9/11 (I'm a Navy pilot, in the service for 19+yrs)... trying to actually be around for my project has been a big, fat punch in the balls. I have kids fast approaching college as well- not the best time to be dropping 40K on a project (other than a nice pool- already done).

It's all about where you are in life & what you're ready for. Unless you have the cubic-dollars (or hook-ups) to go all out, I guarantee you'll have 500% more fun DRIVING your car around while I chase more and more parts made from 'unobtanium'. As soon as I saw Tony's plan, I made similar plans to make the next RTH... then Uncle Sam changed things again (I'll stop whining). Oh well- maybe Power Tour 2010, or RTH XX?

Eithe way- congrats on putting your foot down!

[Moose]

There, I fixed your post. Same thing I have been saying for years. I think some are truely scared to finish their cars, for fear they will actually have to drive them.

Anyone can be a keyboard warrior and they don't impress anyone, however, show me some tire smoke and I am in!

You and a few others on here have built some increbile cars. I love that that you guys drive and beat (enjoy) them.

My biggest concern is just the paint.. everything else I can fix myself.. But, its just a car, and I have no plans on having a garage trophy that just sits there.. I build my cars to drive and enjoy.. It just takes me twice as long as most..:hammer:

[Bill Howell]

You and a few others on here have built some increbile cars. I love that that you guys drive and beat (enjoy) them.

My biggest concern is just the paint.. everything else I can fix myself.. But, its just a car, and I have no plans on having a garage trophy that just sits there.. I build my cars to drive and enjoy.. It just takes me twice as long as most..:hammer:

Thanks, the goat was just the first car I built protouring style, but I have always been more into building cars that I beat on. Hey, I can remember in 1994 building a 70 Chevelle SS clone (basically stock) for about $3000 and thinking that was all the money in the world. Times were very hard back then, trust me, those that know my background know that. Who knows what else I will build in the years to come, but be assured, whatever it is will be a driver, damn spit shines.....

OHCbird.....we are only on RTH3, surely you can get here before we are in double digits....hehe
You are right though, money spent on projects should be based on where you are in life, family, children, etc. That is why I hate seeing cars torn to the ground then sit forever. It is easy to disassemble but hard to get them back on the road. I love having events though, it incourages people to get back on their projects.

[Moose]

bill

Before the goat, didn't you have a real nice camaro? I may have that wrong, but I thought when I read the article in the mag about your car it said something about that..

I hope to make the RTH next year.. its only 8-9 hours for me.. I like going to get new ideas.

[BonzoHansen]

You are right though, money spent on projects should be based on where you are in life, family, children, etc. That is why I hate seeing cars torn to the ground then sit forever. It is easy to disassemble but hard to get them back on the road. I love having events though, it incourages people to get back on their projects.Quoted for truth.

[Bill Howell]

Hey thanks. Yes, it was a 69 396/four speed numbers matching car. I really loved it, but it was completely stock except for the wheels and a few bolton parts. I sold it to Mark West, who now comes to all the RTH events. I have asked about buying it back a couple times but he won't even talk about it.

[Rileys68Camaro]

I wouldn't sell that 69 back either... :)

I've thought often about selllng my 68, and though I doubt I'd ever get farther than thinking about it, but have been threatened with bodily harm by both my wife and mother if I ever do...

[Rileys68Camaro]

Power Tour has always been a dream, and I admit, I was a little worried my car would be shabby compared to the rest.

But, as long as it doesn't break down, then it won't matter.

Oh, and I've seen some of those cars, they're not all perfect.

So now it's a goal, hopefully in '09.

[OHCbird]

"I've seen those cars, and they're not perfect..."

EXACTLY! There are few cars that I've seen that transfer well magazine-to-street (detail-wise). Even with that reality I still sit here (another issue in itself) trying for perfection, with 'that'll do for gov't work' funds. Hrrruuummpphhh. I'm trying to skinny-up my honey-do (they pile up quite nicely while your overseas) and personal project list.

Focus

Focus

Focus!

OK- thread hi-jack over. While I'd love to jump on the 'RTH3 or bust plan', I think the realities of my profession will prevent it. RTH4?

[nytal]

This post makes me feel soooo much better. I look at my car and see what it could be. Lurk around here for ideas and drool over the builds.Try to compromise between what i see, what I "really" need and "bling" that I can't BUILD without. Mine doesn't seem to go anywhere. I've got issues before it's a driver again. I purchased it 15 years ago drove for nearly two and parked due to gas consumption, unsafe suspension/drum brakes, and Flintstone floor/toe boards. Money always seems to be "better" spent somwhere else. $500 for a part or pay Best Buy or Nebraska Furniture Mart off. I'm slowly amassing parts.
My plans are huge even with the tought of trying to do most work myself parts are still expensive. SHE is a '68 firebird with a oil burning '70 something 350 (thats if it's not locked up) backed by a muncie. A number of parts were taken before I could move from old to new house what a pita!
Anyway I have a ls1, a t-56, wayne due irs kit w/85 dana36 ,painless wiring, entire stainless bolt kit and used replacements for stolen parts. I need floor pan, trunk pan, tail panel, pass. 1/4, afx, t-56 kit, u/l a arms, varishocks, harness ecu program,drive shaft, fuel lines (filter/pump) and on... and on...
I started pulling the front end, but had to stop because parts were taking too much garage for annual halloween party. Now I'm on hold to see if my neighbor can score a rotisserie. Anyways Thanks for the inspirations even if some price tags are disheartening. Hopefully I'll have my own post WITH pics soon.