DSE 3" Drop spring rides like crap...

[Magntik]

Where did I go wrong?
Like the title says, installed the 3" drop leafs, poly shackle bushings and their mono to muliti conversion kit, and it rides terrible.
I had what Classic Industries called "heavy duty" 5 pack leafs in before with factory style shocks.
My Firebird had what I would call a "sport" suspension and my wife called stiff or harsh ride before, but this is worst. Going over rough road makes it sound like the car is going to shake it self a part.

Is this what everyone with DSE's drop leafs feel?
Do the shackle bushings make that big of a difference?
I am going to put the rubber ones back in before I call DSE and talk to their tech line, I just wanted to find out if this is normal from others who are running these.

Thanks guys

[eville]

I've heard it's shocks that effect ride quality more than anything.
What shocks are you running?

[parsonsj]

Do the shackle bushings make that big of a difference?They can if they are binding. I've had that happen before. Maybe take 'em apart and lube them well, look for burrs or similar problems?

jp

[chicane67]

Shackel bushings can make a difference...

Shock valving can make a world of difference...

[jannes_z-28]

When you mounted them did you tighten the shackles with the car on the ground and settled. If you don't you can get binding issues.

I would also look at the shock settings. The shocks have more influence on this than the springs.

I know one guy that had his shocks set to the hardest setting, the car litteraly vibrated appart.

Jan

[Magntik]

I've heard it's shocks that effect ride quality more than anything.
What shocks are you running?
I think they are just a stock replacement, can't go check b/c I painted them black a while ago.
but these are the ones I have been running.

[Magntik]

They can if they are binding. I've had that happen before. Maybe take 'em apart and lube them well, look for burrs or similar problems?

jp

Used all the lube that DSE included. Made sure to put some on the shackles themselves, didn't want any squeaks.

[Magntik]

When you mounted them did you tighten the shackles with the car on the ground and settled. If you don't you can get binding issues.

I would also look at the shock settings. The shocks have more influence on this than the springs.

I know one guy that had his shocks set to the hardest setting, the car litteraly vibrated appart.

Jan
I put the car on the ground, then tighten the shackles and the front spring perch bolts. The axle was the only thing "tight" before hitting the ground.

[Magntik]

What rear shocks are you guys running?

I don't race this car, or autocross. Mainly just beat on it around town.
And except for the drop springs the rear suspension is stock configuration.

[silver69camaro]

Shocks can make a car feel like a C5 Vette if they're good, or a '55 Chev if they're bad.

Good quality shocks (read: aluminum-bodied adjustables) cost way more, but are worth it. They are key when making a car ride well on the road.

[Magntik]

Shocks can make a car feel like a C5 Vette if they're good, or a '55 Chev if they're bad.

Good quality shocks (read: aluminum-bodied adjustables) cost way more, but are worth it. They are key when making a car ride well on the road.
Those aren't in the budget! LOL
What's the next best thing?

[eville]

Those aren't in the budget! LOL
What's the next best thing?

i have bilstein shocks revalved by hotchkis with my hotchkis springs. the car rides better than ever!

[Magntik]

i have bilstein shocks revalved by hotchkis with my hotchkis springs. the car rides better than ever!

I have read more and more about guys using or perfering the Hotchkis "version" what makes them so much better then say the one I saw on ATS's website?

[Apogee]

To the best of my knowledge, the Hotchkis shocks are just normal Bilstein's valved to Hotchkis' specifications so that they match their spring rates the way they want them to. That's what I'm running on my car...if my rear shocks ever come off of back order. Biltstein's are a good quality shock for the money and a huge improvement over the generic OE replacements.

[Magntik]

anyone know how Hotchkis spring rates compare to DSE's??

[silver69camaro]

All I know that Hotchkis is in the 160-180ish range, but remember they are all progressive.

[6'9"Witha69]

Even a little off, the Hotchkis Bilsteins will be much better than the stockers are now. Hell, even some 3 click adjustable Konis would be a lot better.

[Rick Dorion]

I thought I read somewhere that the Hotchkis Bilsteins are valved about 10% stiffer. I have the stock Bilsteins with Hotchkis leafs. It's firm.

[67rsssls]

If you are using the same length shocks with the 3" lowered springs as you were using with the stock springs they are probably too long. From past experience the ride can become pretty uncomfortable when your shocks are bottoming out. I am sure a quick call to DSE would result in a recommendation for the correct shocks to use.

[Magntik]

If you are using the same length shocks with the 3" lowered springs as you were using with the stock springs they are probably too long. From past experience the ride can become pretty uncomfortable when your shocks are bottoming out. I am sure a quick call to DSE would result in a recommendation for the correct shocks to use. When I first got the car it was sagging with monoleafs. I put multileafs on it and retained the stock lower "plate", by doing that I need to use shocks for monoleaf cars, which were too short to reach the body. So Mr. Gasket or somebody sells shock extenders to fix this issue.
So when I put these DSE leafs on shocks fit fine with out the extenders.
So go figure.
I talked to Mark at DSE, he agreed pretty much with everyone here.
His 2 points were:
1. The multileafs I took off were around 140 to 150 lbs/in spring rate, were DSE says 175 lbs/in rate. So a "firmer" ride for sure.
2. He recommended the red Koni stock replacement shocks they sell on their website.

But, I haven't had any one here say they are using or would recommend those.
So I have talked to Frank (GP Superstore) and looking at the deal he can get me on the Hotchkis Blisteins.
Since that seems to be the most used, other than adjustables.

[rockdogz]

Mine ride great - I have the DSE 3" leafs and their yellow Koni shocks that they sell. I have poly bushings in the rear and solid in the front.

[Rick Dorion]

With the stock bilsteins, if I hit a bump the car jumps a bit. I'd like to get the Alston vari-shocks some day and see if I can dial in a better ride. The roads aren't the greatest here.

[Magntik]

The roads aren't the greatest out here either.
And to add to my problems I cut a coil out of the front Hotchkis 2" drop spring and now the front sucks going down the road too!

But it looks great parked!!!:cool:

[Marcus SC&C]

You`re on the right track. I gotta agree with everyone so far. Remember when you increase spring rate you have to increase shocks dampening rates to coincide or you`ll be underdampened and the springs will be bouncy (soft springs) or really harsh (firm springs).
Consider this too. If your car had 7" of rear suspension travel (which is about stock shock travel),3.5" up and 3.5" down and you lowered it 3". That leaves you with .5" of bump travel,hope you shortened the rear bumpstops/pinion snubber or you`re riding on them much of the time! That`ll make it ride hard for sure.
Even if you have taken care of that and picked up say another 1" of travel you`ve still got less than half the travel in bump that you originally had. Stock rate shocks are valved to control movements with a soft spring over the full factory range of travel. You`ve more than cut that in half and added much firmer springs. The stock valved shocks don`t have any hope of properly controling the suspension now. The stock replacement type Bilsteins will help as their dampening rates are firmer and likely have a much better overall curve than the ones you have now but probably still not enough total rate. So basically you can compromise and put $200pr. shocks that`ll make it better but not quite right and have to either live with it or replace them again later or $350pr. adj. shocks that you can set to work perfectly and be done. Or you can swap the springs back to softer ones and take some drop out of the car and you get some more suspension travel back. You probably don`t want to do that now that you`ve gotten used to the lowered ride height though... :) Mark SC&C

[Boulder69]

I have the DSE 3" drop and their red Konis and my ride rides like crap as well. Really harsh. I just haven't had time to mess with the adjustments on the Konis yet. :fingersx:

Here is my thread on this topic:

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32522

[Rick Dorion]

Good info as usual , Mark. I put some chalk on the snubbers in the back and they don't hit so I think, in my case, it's some bumps I have to watch for. However, I also believe Vari-shocks would be more supple and tuneable. Saving the pennies!

[Magntik]

I just got out from under the car, it's obvious I have been hitting the snubbers!

Took my lucky hacksaw to them and cut a fat 1/2 or more off.
Used the kids' yellow sidewalk chalk to "color" the fresh cut, time to go driving.