Idea for Hydraulic parking brake

[jknight16]

I just wanted to throw out an idea that is in its infancy stage of contemplation in order to get some of you guys input on a parking brake idea.

I was recently driving an early 60's International Travel-All and I noticed one interesting component that I had never seen before. On the dashboard was a 3 inch long lever that operated a valve that had been plumbed into the brake line running to the rear brakes. To apply the parking brake you 1) push on the foot brake, 2) engage the parking brake lever, 3) release the foot brake. I assume this valve keeps the pressure that was created by the normal foot brake applied to the rear brakes, thus acting as a parking brake.

Through some internet browsing I found that many aircraft parking brakes operate using a similar concept. What do you guys think of the idea as it could be applied to our vehicles? Does anyone make a valve for this sort of application? Doesn't it seem like this could be easier than fabricating parking brake cables in some applications?

Lets hear what you all think!!

[shep]

On a suburban I helped build they used a line lock plumbed into the rear brakes, same idea just modern equipment. Heres a pick of the burb http://www.4wheeloffroad.com/eventcoverage/131_0504_2005_moab_easter_jeep_safari/photo_05.html

[PonchoJohn]

It's a nice thought, but let me give ya a fer-instance.
Let's say your car runs over the edge of (insert bad thing here) and it snags/rips your lowered car's hydraulic brake tube/lines/whatever.
Well, it's gonna be hard to apply hydraulic pressure w/o a transfer medium.
That's the whole point behind an "emergency brake." If not, it sure would be a LOT easier to install rear discs off a C5 on our cars.

[andrewb70]

What John said! The point is not a "parking" brake, but an "emergency" brake in case the hydraulics fail for some reason.

Andrew

[HsvToolFool]

Here's a good thread (https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20078) on e-brakes which gets into
the topic of fluid-locks (line-locks)...

I think as a backup e-brake, line-locks are inexpensive
and effective. But in an emergency, I want a
mechanical clamp.

There's a link in the above thread to a $30 gadget
from Jamar (http://jamarperformance.com/TheRealm/shop_detail.asp?product_catID=Brake+Accs%2E&product_id=147) that does the job and appears to have
an auto-release to protect against driving with the
brakes locked.

[jknight16]

Ok, I see what you guys mean about the "emergency" aspect of the idea. I suppose I hadn't thought of using a line-lock as something that does the same thing, but it does make sense.

I kinda like the product that HSV provided the link for. I mean, for someone with an automatic that is looking for an easy (albeit less effective in emergency situations) solution, that kind of thing would work well.

Either way, thanks for your input guys!!

[DarkoNova]

If you ran over the edge of something bad and cut your rear brake line(s), I think you'd notice before you even got a chance to park the car. :drive2:

Matt

[ProTouring442]

Random thoughts;

Anyone ever try to stop a car with that "emergency" brake? :eek:

In any case, a lot of large trucks, motor homes, tow trucks, etc. use the line lock style of parking brake.

On the other hand, I believe our Maryland State Inspection requires a mechanical parking brake.

Shiny Side Up!
Bill

[HsvToolFool]

Anyone ever try to stop a car with that "emergency" brake? :eek:

Twice.

My first car was a 66 Mustang coupe which still had
the original single-reservoir master. It failed before
I had gotten around to swapping it out. That e-brake
was scary slow, but it eventually did the job.

The other time I was the front seat passenger in
an awful wreck. A kid ran a stop light going over
60 mph and t-boned our driver's side door and front
fender. The driver was knocked unconcious by the
impact. I was out for a half-second. When I got my
bearings, I saw that our car was rolling towards a
ditch which had a steep 10-foot drop. When the driver
didn't respond to my yelling, I reached over and
yanked the console e-brake. It stopped us instantly
and prevented a nasty tumble into that ditch. We
all walked away from that accident with relatively
minor injuries.

I always preferred under-dash pedal e-brakes to
the console handles found in most Dern Furin' cars.
But ever since that accident, I've been a big fan of
them. When I rod my 66 Mustang vert, it will get
one too.

[MonzaRacer]

Well as for using it as a parking brake which they were designed for, to lock a car after parking because old trannys didnt have park and older low compression engines were never ment to hold a car.
Now can we use parking brakes for an emergency brake in the event of a hydralic failure,,,yes doe we ever do it not mostly.
But NAPA has sold mechanical /hydralic brake locks for years. I have even seen a fella use one and a spring/bungie strap to launch a drag car. He only had one arm.
Nothing wrong with incorporating one into your car, might even prove usefull for antitheft too.
Lee

[jp455]

Hi guys,

Going back to this old thread for a second...if a linelock were to be used and say the battery quit after being parked for a long time, would the linelock disengage?? Or is it a device that needs current just when its first applied?

Thanks!

[andrewb70]

Hi guys,

Going back to this old thread for a second...if a linelock were to be used and say the battery quit after being parked for a long time, would the linelock disengage?? Or is it a device that needs current just when its first applied?

Thanks!

Needs current to be active and hold pressure. It is just a spring loaded solinoid. Press the brakes. Activate solinoid. That hold the pressure on the front brakes. Once the button is release (or the battery dies) the solinoid will open and pressure is released.

Andrew

[70camaro406]

Anyone know how long a line-lock can be applied before it kills the battery? Or how much juice a solenoid draws? It'd be curious and informative to know. I have a line-lock on my car, which was a street/strip car...now it is all apart. But I'm keeping the line-lock installed, and it'd make a good parking brake with the 5-speed that's going in. Just curious as to how long it should/could be applied.

[GetMore]

I know we have a valve like that on one of our wreckers, and the boss says not to park it overnight with the hydraulic brakes active, because it'll push past the seals in the caliper.

[ks71z28]

don't use a line lock, i bought one off Ebay for $30. Apply brakes, push knob down... you are locked!

[John Wright]

I don't think you can pass annual inspection in Va with anything other than a mechanical ebrake.

[MarkM66]

don't use a line lock, i bought one off Ebay for $30. Apply brakes, push knob down... you are locked!

Then it would work fine as a "parking brake."

Would work if you needed the car stopped while running, any other time just leave it in gear.

Yeah, probably not the safest way to go. But niether is driving a 40 year old car, :-) .

[Chad-1stGen]

There are a lot of parking brakes on newer cars that would never work as an "emergency brake." I agree that a mechanical system is nice as a backup to hydrollc in the case of emergency. That said a lot of mechanical systems are not capable of locking the tires or stopping a car at speed.

[jknight16]

Is there any risk of damaging piston seals or anything like that in the calipers from sustained clamping (say overnight) if you were to use a hydraulic-style parking brake?

[osdmike]

Here is My version of a parking/emergency brake.
(Not finished on pics."Under construction")

I used an old Toyota Clutch Slave Cylinder , connected to the original parkingbrake pedal/wire. Correction :"MASTER cylinder"
It´s not very "High Tech" looking , but You get the idea.

Rear calipers are Wilwood Dynalites .
So as a parkingbrake ,it works really good.
When pushing the P-brake pedal while driving,there is no problem to stop the car. (even locks the tires)

I know that it could be a problem if the piston seals are leaking, when parked.
So i allways leave it in gear.

Before , I had Wilwoods single piston floating Mechanical Spot Calipers in the rear for P-brake. Didn´t work at all.

I talked to a guy at The Swedish Motor Vehicle Inspection Co.
He said that even some newer Mercedes´ and BMW´s barely passes the tests. Parking/Emerg.- brakes are to weak.


Anyone have experience with these new Wilwoods?
http://www.wilwood.com/Products/001-Calipers/033-cpb/index.asp

So,...continue post ideas about P-brake solutions.


----------------------------------------------------------

[David Pozzi]

Here is the Mico version that is used in trucks. Forestry trucks use them to lock all 4 (or more) wheels.
http://www.mico.com/products/displaysubinfo.php?id=37

[jasonsnova]

osdmike,
i luv your set up on the parking brake what year/model toyota clutch slave was that, also was the brcket from the truck too or did you fab that up?

[osdmike]

The Toyota (Starlet ?), I think was from -77 or so. Paid $25(junk yard.)
Also check other european cars from the 70´s or 80´s.
AUDI or Volvos got better looking , aluminum ones.

The bracket is homemade.

[jasonsnova]

mike another dum question...when you dont have the p/brake ingauged the fluid still properly flows through it for proper use of the rear brakes?

[Fesler built]

Instead of going with hydraulic why dont you do electric with a ram that you can turn off and on with the push of a button, so as long as you have battery power you have brakes. We do them all the time with power actuators they are very simple and I will post a few shots in a day or two. If you guys want the kits to do this we can make them up and sell them. They are very cool

This eliminates the parking brake pedal or handle so you can hide it. Very simple to install and works great, you can even use your alarm to kick it on and off for you.

[osdmike]

:pat: Sorry! I mixed it up. Not a dum question!
It should be Clutch Master cylinder! (on the firewall)

I used one with the fluid cup separated with a hose. It already has threads ,You can use for the brake line fittings.
(not the one with the fluid cup attached directly to the MC)

It´s important that fluid flows both ways ,when not engaged.

[jasonsnova]

well id be interested if you could post some pics... my car was a auto so last time i had the car all apart i never put the ebrake back in ....then i went and put in a six speed last ear so i need to do something, and i dont like the oem style wear the brake cabes run under the car and rub up against every thing, thats why i was interested in hyd set up. wouldnt the electric drain the battery if it was parked for a day or something?

[jasonsnova]

ike did you plumb it so you used the resivor inlet as the brake in and the take out the bleeder screw and use that as the out?

[willih6996]

Instead of going with hydraulic why dont you do electric with a ram that you can turn off and on with the push of a button, so as long as you have battery power you have brakes. We do them all the time with power actuators they are very simple and I will post a few shots in a day or two. If you guys want the kits to do this we can make them up and sell them. They are very cool

This eliminates the parking brake pedal or handle so you can hide it. Very simple to install and works great, you can even use your alarm to kick it on and off for you.
Please post pics and more info. Thanks

[osdmike]

Pic.#1: This is how My Clutch master cyl. looked like from the beginning.
All I had to do ,was to make the brake line fit,where the hose from the fluid reservoar is attached.

2.Important that fluid flows easily both ways , when push rod isn´t engaged.

3.Clutch master cylinder from a VOLVO.

The fluid in the Toyota MC flows better than the Volvo.
I think it´s because the hole You see at the pic. is bigger in the Toyota.
Drill a bigger hole and You are all set,I guess.

4. Some modifications made.

[osdmike]

Anyone have experience with these new Wilwoods?
http://www.wilwood.com/Products/001-...-cpb/index.asp (http://www.wilwood.com/Products/001-Calipers/033-cpb/index.asp)
:hmm: