Gas prices. WTF?

[Samckitt]

The price of gas is f'ing bullsh!t. Yesterday going home from work it was $3.30 in the town I work, $3.39 near home, this morning going to work it was $3.49 & going home tonight it was $3.59. Bullsh!t I tell ya.

[TonyL]

and the price of a barrel of oil? It went *DOWN* to 65 bucks a barrel today.

[6'9"Witha69]

It is all manufacturing costs right now. A lot of refineries have been working at full capacity, and in order to make more capacity, have to shut down for a while to do so. Thereby creating less supply and upping the price.

But yeah, the price of gas sucks. Imagine this, I drive 40 miles one way in LA county traffic everyday to work. 400 miles a week in commuting in a Silverado is a real butt kicker.

I need an HHR.

[TonyL]

Didn't Hotrod just do an editorial on the whole "how gas prices affect the hobby" thing?

I bet it eventually will. More EFI'd V8s, (especially since the advent of the mechanical fuel injection pump.) and possibly some different powerplant choices. Turbo V6s or even some straight 6s would be cool too.

/is glad my vair gets 28 MPG.

[toxicz28]

It is all manufacturing costs right now. A lot of refineries have been working at full capacity, and in order to make more capacity, have to shut down for a while to do so. Thereby creating less supply and upping the price.

No offence, but that's BS. The refineries are at the same capacity they were right after Katrina. But, the gas was cheaper then than it is now. It's the oil companies hosing the consumer.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for businesses making money, but they are earning record profits in the neighborhood of tens of billions of dollars. Try telling the world they are not gouging.

[Joey_H]

The oil companies are robbing us blind! Yes I've read about plant shutdowns for maintenance and whatnot, but what about record profits the oil companies are reporting? If the price of a movie gets too high I can cut down on the amount of movies I see, and watch tv at home or do something else. If gasoline doubles in cost what can one do? There aren't any viable substitutes, we're at the mercy of the oil companies. Public transportation in L.A. isn't the greatest, I have no desire to spend ninety minutes fooling around with buses to get to work when it takes me forty minutes to get to work in my car. I can cut down on my driving but there's a certain amount of driving I have to do no matter what. I can understand the oil companies exist to generate a profit, but at what point does that profit become too high? Utilities are regulated by the governnment, they can't raise the price of gas, electricity, and water whenever they damn please. I'm not saying oil companies should be regulated, but something needs to happen to reel them in. Dubya is in bed with the oil men so he's not looking to help the common man. Here in L.A. prices at the pump can change several times a day. They never lower them several times a day, they only raise them.

[67SSDan]

Awh man, don't even get me started. This is so freaking rediculous it drives me crazy! You hardly hear about it in the news any more... which also drives me crazy. It's almost as if everyone is just used to paying the prices and given over to the fact that they are going to keep going up. Damn apathy!

But... what can you do. Move to Saudi?

[Ralph LoGrasso]

Anyone want to buy a '96 Tahoe?

[John McIntire]

This is the only reason I drive a Honda Civic. I tell everyone that it was the first car I ever bought that I didnt want. I got it for the MPG when I was originally commuting 73 miles oneway to work. Now I am "only" commuting 32 miles one way. I'd love to get a nice truck or Tahoe, but the damn gas is insane. I average 36mpg or better with the Civic.
Oh, another thing to look out for now. At my local place I get gas, which happens to be a Valero, they are now charging 2 different prices, one for Cash, and the other for Credit. Keep your eyes peeled! The price out on the board on the main road is cheaper because its the cash price, but when you pull up to the pump, there are two prices for every grade, and yup! You guessed it! It's 6cents MORE a gallon for using your credit card!
I have just noticed this in the past week, and have checked a few other stations, and they seem to be the only one.................so far.

[lowboy]

I too agree that gas prices are rediculous and have a hard time swallowing the profits Chevron, etc., are making. But, why don't I ever hear anyone take environmentalism too task and the fact that, because of radical environmentalism, there has not been a refinery built in the last 30 yrs., and the cost, because of regulations, of building one exceeds something like 10 BILLION dollars. A certain political party keeps saying we need an energy policy that "makes sense", yet they won't even let us drill in a frozen freakin tundra in Alaska. There is so much freakin oil in U.S. territory. Last year I read about a "pool" of oil found in Louisiana(spelling) that was 300 miles wide. I guess it doesn't matter how much oil a country has if it can't get it out of the ground.

[lowboy]

And furthermore, it's my understanding that oil companies make about 5 cents a gallon profit. Out here in California, something like 18 cents per gallon goes to taxes.

[Bow Tie 67]

Yeah it sucks!! Last year I found myself driving like a little old man when it hit $3.00, which gave me another 1 - 1.5 mpg in my maxima. I average 21 - 22 mpg driving normal and its a V6. ( I like my car and its paid off ) I can drive my ls1 and get 26 - 28 mpg, although it takes premium and I don't want to rack up the mileage. Here in the Chicago suburbs prices are at $3.59, I have seen it jump .30 in one day. Correct me if I'm wrong but as little as 3 months ago gas was just above $2.00, you cant tell me that a 75% increase is warranted. WTF

@$^%$%^&%@&%$@^@%^&%&@%^@&%@&@%^$^@$#%$%!$
^%&^*^&#%^

[GBodyGMachine]

Yea, gas prices suck. But here is what I think

I drive 20 some miles one way to work everyday. This is something I have to do. So I pay for gas. Nothing I can do about it so I dont B!tch to much.
My hot rod on the other hand sits around alot more now that gas prices are high, but I still enjoy my hobby. Gas prices WILL NOT stop me from driving. What can I do to lower them anyway?

Jeff

[bigvegan]

Man, the gas prices are bad enough, but what really gets me is that a large segment of the foreign oil producers are some of the most evil people in the world.

Gas at 3.50+ a gallon. Great, nothing like knowing that a chunk of $ for each tankful is going to a group of tyrannical fundamentalist regimes in the middle east, and that chunk gets bigger as the price of oil goes up.

"Make a $5-10+ donation to Al Qaeda, Hamas, or Hezbollah with every fill up! Don't worry, you just pump the gas, we'll get them the money."

Thanks, but until we liberate a certain region of the world's oil fields, or come up with V-8s that run on seawater, I'm going to be driving my Corolla and saving my pennies.

[vintageracer]

Bitch all you want about the price of gas but I have yet to hear ONE OF YOU say you have parked you car and started to ride a bike!

The fact of the matter is that each of us will pay WHATEVER the cost for gasoline/diesel since our lives/activites revolve around our personal transportation and in our society that's the AUTOMOBILE!

[camcojb]

our price has dropped 18 cents in the last week. But that's still $3.29 per gallon.

Jody

[Jims78elky]

Man..What I would give to be able to go back to 1975 with my
dad,when he owned a Union 76 station..around .77 cents a gal
I believe back then.All I know if you had it on your hands it burned!

And that was the "good stuff" Super! All those 12:5.1 comp cars
came and loved that stuff! People complained about the price then.
And now its almost $4.00 a gallon! Geeesh! Iam Old!!!!

Anyone have a decent Schwinn they want to donate to a old dude?


lol..:lmao:



-Jim

[camcojb]

Anyone have a decent Schwinn they want to donate to a old dude?


lol..:lmao:



-Jim

here 'ya go!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2007/05/schwinn20002-1.jpg

[paul67]

Here in the UK $2.00 and litre.

[99 BUCKET]

I would have no problem walking to work or riding a bicycle. If only my job was a mile or two a way. unfortunatly, for most of america that is not the case. I too have parked the 22-26 mpg v8 of mine and have been riding the busa. Even with that I am staying out of the throttle and getting 42-46 mpg. Sucks to know there is not a whole lot being done about the issue.

[WS6]

everyone go back and search about one year ago when this topic was at the top of the page and read everything that was said then. It still applies today.

I will only say a couple things. Do not bitch about a company making money. Period. This is a capitallist economy and that's the best damn one there is. If you don't like that don't give them any of your money.

Learn what profit margin means and stop looking at gross profit. If you would do that you would be more angry at banks and pharmacutical companies that make a much higher profit margin than oil companies. The short version of that is this; drug companies make huge profit on everything little bit they sale. Oil companies make small prifts on everything they sell. They just happen to sell a hell of a lot more.

Evironmentalists are more to blame for gas prices than the oil companies. Botique fuels are a joke. Make one or two top quality blends and be done with it, not the 10+ or whatever is out there. Most of which have been proven to offer no positive effects.

Change your habits and your fuel consumption or quit bitching.

[JJSmitches]

And furthermore, it's my understanding that oil companies make about 5 cents a gallon profit. Out here in California, something like 18 cents per gallon goes to taxes.

I think you mean the gas stations make 5 cents per gallon?

At least thats the way I have heard it explained. Then you take the % the credit card company keeps and its no wonder that some gas stations have a "cash price" which is probably lower than if you swipe your card to pay.

When I lived in Downtown Sacramento I rode the bus to school and walked to work. It was really the greatest living situation (for local travel) I have ever experienced. Unfortunately, taking the bus from where I live now to work is a 122 minute trip that would cost $2.25 each way according to the online travel planner.

[sik68]

To save money, the best thing I have done is change my driving habits. On the freeway, I'm always in the slow lane with my cruise control on at a little less that 65mph. Cruise control is key! While city driving, I'm never in a rush to speed to the next red light, and always roll into the throttle as much as possible. I save about 3mpg in my subaru wrx, which comes to about 7 bucks per tank.

I hardly ever drive my Camaro, so I couldn't care less about MPG when I'm driving it. :)

[Jims78elky]

here 'ya go!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2007/05/schwinn20002-1.jpg


Jody,

You are the man!


:worship: "Cotton Picker"

If you had a Scwhinn..You know what that picture is all about!



Now Iam really old.. I'll now head back to the tar pit and wait my turn..lol.

:razz:

-Jim

[Steve68]

Cool Bike! I had a green Stingray, I loved that whitewall Slick,

CC and keeping the RPMS under 3K for me,

[CHROMAHOLIC]

This is my solution to the gas prices.......my custom built 9' long 1/2" off the ground pedal scrapin chopper

[CliffS]

Your gas prices are high, I know my first time in the states back in the late '80 it was around $2-2.10. But consider yourselves lucky we pay around $7.40 for 93.

[MarkM66]

From the looks of traffic on the weekend and evenings, it sure doesn't look like people are cutting back on driving. So F it, let the prices keep going up I guess.

I'm trying to work at home as much as I can, and only drive when need be. Some people are trying....

[trapin]

I learned a long time ago that it's not worth the effort and distress to worry about something you have no control over. And gas prices are something we have absolutely no control over. When they go up I just re-adjust our monthy budget to comply. I don't like it, but there's not a damn thing I can do about it. No politician has any power to do anything about it, so voting isn't the answer. Parking my car is not the answer, I have to drive to work. Riding a bike is not the answer, I work 23 miles from my home. So why piss and moan...this is the reality of life. Get used to it.

[vintageracer]

Paul67

How much is a "litre" in real volume?

In the redneck south US a "litre" is what a female cat has when giving birth!

I guess I better check the spelling.

Ha Ha

Have a great day!

[vintageracer]

I just purchased an 84 Mercedes 300D Turbo Diesel Monday. It's Vegatable Oil Time in Tennessee.

I am going to do something REALLY STUPID and join the "Green" crowd, after all, Al Gore is my neighbor.

They say these old Mercedes are great Vegatable Oil cars so I am going to have some fun and experiment with a single tank "veggie" kit for the car.

If it works like it is supposed to work I can't complain about FREE FUEL!

[CHROMAHOLIC]

Gas here in Ontario, Canada is $109.00 a litre and there is 4.55 liters in a gallon which makes our gas roughly $4.95 a gallon depending on what time of day it is. The price goes up and down here like a pair of new brides pajamas :)

[teamplex65]

Wow paul thats $7.57 a gallon. Why the difference? Is your cost of living that much higher than America? When I went to London a few years ago it seemed most didnt own cars.

Is there an explination why yours is that much higher?

[Takid455]

[quote=99 BUCKET]... been riding the busa. Even with that I am staying out of the throttle and getting 42-46 mpg. quote]

I ride my zx9 weather permitting. granted a portion of my commute is stop light traffic, I only get 33-35 mpg. how can 400 more cc's get better gas mileage?? possibly that I have carbs compared to your EFI would be the answer? :hmm: however I still get the same milage when I fly through the country side . maybe my tune is off.

[jknight16]

I haven't put diesel in my truck in over a month now because I'm riding my CBR929 every day to work and back, despite the 100+ degree weather we're already having. That's the only way I can try to cast my vote for lower prices, by decreasing my level of demand.

My CBR is EFI as well and gets between 36 and 42 mpg, but that's also with me weighing it down with another 230 pounds.

[Joey_H]

The furriners that are chiming in with their high gas prices compared to the US have to blame their own goverments. Their extremely high gasoline taxes are the reasons they pay so much.

[Dave's 67]

The gas companies continue to make record profits and charge us more at the pump. Take a look at Yahoo Finance for exxon, chevron and valero income statements. It is sickening.

[ProTouring442]

Dubya is in bed with the oil men so he's not looking to help the common man.

No offense, but it wasn't Dubya that allowed the two largest pieces of Standard Oil to get back together. If there were real compitition out there, the prices might look a little different.

Once you add the greed of the oil companies, the greed of the local, state, and federal governments, the greed of the enviromentalists, and the actual price of the oil together, you get the prices we pay.

The real question is, how many of us, with a hard to get part, wouldn't sell it for as much as we could get?

Shiny Side Up!
Bill

[harshman]

Gas is still a world commodity no matter how you look at it. The President, Congress and the rest have little to do with current pricing with the exception of taxes. They do however have the power to allow drilling on our native soil encourage new refineries and further expand OUR economy. The issue is that too many special interests want to save their interpretation of the planet and wildlife. They despise black energy and somehow determine that it is the cause of all evil.

[Ralph LoGrasso]

I learned a long time ago that it's not worth the effort and distress to worry about something you have no control over. And gas prices are something we have absolutely no control over. .

I agree; stoicism prevail.

[99 BUCKET]

fuel injection!!!! and I have a cool little average mpg gauge. but I used to not ride it if there was a hint of rain. black bike, water spots, bad mojo. In leu of the gas prices I have been riding it in everything except the down pours. sad really

[Damn True]

The gas companies continue to make record profits and charge us more at the pump. Take a look at Yahoo Finance for exxon, chevron and valero income statements. It is sickening.

C'mon pal. Look deeper than what some talking head on Network TV tells you.

First, learn the difference between profit margin and gross profit.

Then consider this:

The top 5 oil companies in the world are:
1. Saudi Aramco
2. National Iranian Oil Company
3. PeMEX (mexico)
4. Citgo (Venezuela)
5. Exxon/Mobil (United States)

There is only one US company even in the top 5. Exxon/Mobil produces about 90% LESS oil than Saudi Aramco and holds only a 3% GLOBAL market share.

The reason your gas prices are high and getting higher is that there are over 3000 more cars on US roads every day and there are over 500 times more vehicles on the road in China that there was just 3 years ago. The demand is up, the supply is largely stagnant. You want to be pissed at someone and I understand that. But don't be pissed at the oil companies, be pissed at those who prevent US oil companies from exploring and producing oil on our shores.

There has not been a refinery or Nuke plant built in the US in over 30 years. More nukes would mean less oil used to create electricity and more available for motor-fuel. More refineries would lower the oil companies costs and allow them to increase production and therefore supply.

[MarkM66]

I just purchased an 84 Mercedes 300D Turbo Diesel Monday. It's Vegatable Oil Time in Tennessee.

I am going to do something REALLY STUPID and join the "Green" crowd, after all, Al Gore is my neighbor.

They say these old Mercedes are great Vegatable Oil cars so I am going to have some fun and experiment with a single tank "veggie" kit for the car.

If it works like it is supposed to work I can't complain about FREE FUEL!

"Going Green?" Next you'll be telling us you're "Off the grid." LOL

[vintageracer]

"Going Green?" Next you'll be telling us you're "Off the grid." LOL

Big Al (Al Gore) just got his solar panels approved for his house here in Nashville just as long as they cannot be seen from the street OR by his neighbors. Maybe I can sneak an extension cord over to his house and get "Off the Grid"!

[steemin]

here 'ya go!



https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2007/05/schwinn20002-1.jpg

Ahh yes the Cotton Picker brother to the orange crate and the Apple Peeler(?)
I love those old bikes.
But that 5 speed shifter is scary looking:eek:
Scott

[camcojb]

Ahh yes the Cotton Picker brother to the orange crate and the Apple Peeler(?)
I love those old bikes.
But that 5 speed shifter is scary looking:eek:
Scott

yes, there's a reason they discontinued them around 1972! :)

Jody

[WS6]

Oh nuts!



Anyway, the HOR passed their antiprice gouging bill either today or yesterday. I am sure many people here that are upset with gas prices agree with this bill. Just ask yourself one question though. Where in the bill does it give a number, a figure, a percentage, or anything that even comes close to definitively saying what constitutes or qualifies as gouging? I'll save you the trouble, it doesn't. It's complete BS because it leaves it up to congress to decide for themselves what constitutes gouging. This is the same congress that has investigated oil companies multiple times on the past for price gouging and every single time have said "Oh well we find nothing wrong afterall". Yet they still pass this rediculous bill. Talk about pandering to the ignorant.

Again, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a company making huge profits in a legal manner. If you don't like it, don't give them any of your money.

You should be congratulating Exxon/Mobil for bringing in such huge numbers while still giving us some of the cheapest fuel in the world. Especially considering the majority of their profit comes from overseas, not US sales. This is other countries money that Exxon gets to use here in this country. But, no, instead so many people cuss them and talk about taking their legally earned money away. Preach on socialist brothers, preach on.

[Damn True]

Trey, I want to buy you a beer.

[bookends]

[quote=6'9"Witha69]It is all manufacturing costs right now. A lot of refineries have been working at full capacity, and in order to make more capacity, have to shut down for a while to do so. Thereby creating less supply and upping the price. quote]

true but it's damned ironic that it happens right at the beginning of summer when everyone goes on vacation.

[jsconiers]

I have a dump truck that drives for a refinery. They are at a much lower capacity and can't keep the trucks they have subcontracted working 32 hours a week, but am told it will ramp up mid to late june. When it ramps up trucks are sub contracted and run 24 hours a day. While I would tend to think it is on purpose refineries are at a lower capacity. The oil companies as well as most other major business industries, not to mention politicians, the iraq war, illegal aliens, out sourcing, etc, are hosing the consumer. Until we scream "enough is enough" or start changing our habits they will continue to screw us.....


No offence, but that's BS. The refineries are at the same capacity they were right after Katrina. But, the gas was cheaper then than it is now. It's the oil companies hosing the consumer.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for businesses making money, but they are earning record profits in the neighborhood of tens of billions of dollars. Try telling the world they are not gouging.

[jsconiers]

That statement is not true......the refinery I'm near to hasn't done this...


[quote=6'9"Witha69]It is all manufacturing costs right now. A lot of refineries have been working at full capacity, and in order to make more capacity, have to shut down for a while to do so. Thereby creating less supply and upping the price. quote]

true but it's damned ironic that it happens right at the beginning of summer when everyone goes on vacation.

[Steve68]

C'mon pal. Look deeper than what some talking head on Network TV tells you.

First, learn the difference between profit margin and gross profit.

Then consider this:

The top 5 oil companies in the world are:
1. Saudi Aramco
2. National Iranian Oil Company
3. PeMEX (mexico)
4. Citgo (Venezuela)
5. Exxon/Mobil (United States)

There is only one US company even in the top 5. Exxon/Mobil produces about 90% LESS oil than Saudi Aramco and holds only a 3% GLOBAL market share.

The reason your gas prices are high and getting higher is that there are over 3000 more cars on US roads every day and there are over 500 times more vehicles on the road in China that there was just 3 years ago. The demand is up, the supply is largely stagnant. You want to be pissed at someone and I understand that. But don't be pissed at the oil companies, be pissed at those who prevent US oil companies from exploring and producing oil on our shores.

There has not been a refinery or Nuke plant built in the US in over 30 years. More nukes would mean less oil used to create electricity and more available for motor-fuel. More refineries would lower the oil companies costs and allow them to increase production and therefore supply.


We can only explore 15% of our areas for oil,

At the end of last year Cuba gave the rights to explore the ocean area to numerous countrys, which is right off the FL coast, an oil rich area that we have known for years,

[Steve68]

Oh Yea, I want off the grid too!

[WS6]

[quote=6'9"Witha69]It is all manufacturing costs right now. A lot of refineries have been working at full capacity, and in order to make more capacity, have to shut down for a while to do so. Thereby creating less supply and upping the price. quote]

true but it's damned ironic that it happens right at the beginning of summer when everyone goes on vacation.

Environmentalists have gotten laws passed that dictate a different botique fuel during the summer times in so many of the major cities. Summer time typically starts right around Memorial day due to schools getting out for the summer. Vacation time starts once the kiddies are allowed to leave.

Maybe the refineries could start producing this botique fuel sooner in anticipation of the rush. However, I am betting there would be storage/shelf life issues maybe even production issues with trying to make too many different fuels at one time. I do not know the ends and outs to that extent to really be able to say though.

True, you make your way over here to the better coast and I'll go have a beer with you anytime.

[WS6]

We can only explore 15% of our areas for oil,

At the end of last year Cuba gave the rights to explore the ocean area to numerous countrys, which is right off the FL coast, an oil rich area that we have known for years,

This is the biggest slap in the face to all those people who scream of the horrors that could occur to the precious vacation industry in FL if we allowed drilling off the coast. Yet five miles further off the coast than we want to drill a country that doesn't like us has allowed people to drill. As if five miles makes a difference when you're what 50 off the coast already? Instead of these wonderful people going "oh hell no your not taking that money from us" they decide to sit there and scream of how badly the beaches would be damaged if something happened to the offshore oil rig that's drilling for natural gas. People are dumb and I am convinced the dumbest are responsible for creating our laws and screaming the loudest.

[TonyHuntimer]

All the excuses about why the gas prices are a bunch of BS. The oil companies know that they can raise the price as much as $1 per year and people will still pay.

There are a hand full of guys at the "top" making a ton of money off these rate hikes. If you could find out their salaries you would have a heart attack.

Tony Huntimer
Goodies-SpeedShop.com

[rob07002]

All the excuses about why the gas prices are a bunch of BS. The oil companies know that they can raise the price as much as $1 per year and people will still pay.

There are a hand full of guys at the "top" making a ton of money off these rate hikes. If you could find out their salaries you would have a heart attack.

Tony Huntimer
Goodies-SpeedShop.com

KEY EXECUTIVES PayExercisedMr. Rex W. Tillerson , 54
Chairman, Chief Exec. Officer, Pres, Chairman of Fin. Committee and Chairman of Exec. Committee$ 4.30M$ 2.08MMr. Donald D. Humphreys , 59
Principal Financial Officer, Sr. VP, Treasurer and Member of Management Committee$ 2.50M$ 2.46MMr. H. R. Cramer , 56
VP and Pres of ExxonMobil Fuels Marketing Company$ 2.36M$ 6.35MMr. J. Stephen Simon , 63
Sr. VP$ 3.09M$ 4.58MDr. S. R. McGill , 64
Sr. VP$ 3.09M$ 4.17M

Couldn't find bonuses though

[6'9"Witha69]

KEY EXECUTIVES PayExercisedMr. Rex W. Tillerson , 54
Chairman, Chief Exec. Officer, Pres, Chairman of Fin. Committee and Chairman of Exec. Committee$ 4.30M$ 2.08MMr. Donald D. Humphreys , 59
Principal Financial Officer, Sr. VP, Treasurer and Member of Management Committee$ 2.50M$ 2.46MMr. H. R. Cramer , 56
VP and Pres of ExxonMobil Fuels Marketing Company$ 2.36M$ 6.35MMr. J. Stephen Simon , 63
Sr. VP$ 3.09M$ 4.58MDr. S. R. McGill , 64
Sr. VP$ 3.09M$ 4.17M

Couldn't find bonuses thoughThe stock prices are up in these times of so called windfall profits. The bonusses probably have some sort of EPS wrap which greatly increases bonusses based on stock performance. You can be sure bonusses are through the roof.

[lowboy]

I know, lets have the government take over the oil industry. Then everything will be just awesome! Damn these oil company's and they're exorbitant profits..

[Ralph LoGrasso]

Laissez-faire...

[bigvegan]

Well, maybe if we used the billions we're giving to OPEC every day to fund an operation to secure OPEC's oil fields for the democratic nations of the world, gas might be a little cheaper.

Besides, what are they gonna do? Fund terrorists? Hate us? Blow stuff up? I mean, what are they going to do that they're not doing already?

And most of the oil deposits are in minimally populated regions, so we wouldn't have to do any nation building, they'd get to have whatever government they wanted, they'd just have to stay away from the pipelines.

Man, does OPEC bug anybody else?