ATS Spindle tie rod problems??

[ITLBTU]

I'm installing the Tall ATS Spindle on my '69 Camaro. I also bought some Baer Tracker tie rods. The tie rod hits my wheel and the bolt is so close to the tire I know it would rip it open if I were driving it. I have '00 SS Camaro wheels on it 17"x 9" with a 2" Skulte wheel spacer. Has anyone else had problems like this?:sick:

[eville]

Can you post a picture?

[silver69camaro]

Did you call ATS?

[ITLBTU]

I can post a pic tonight. I spoke to Tyler, and he said that I might need a shorter steering arm. How do I find one of those?

[James OLC]

You might get lucky on eBay and they occasionally pop up in the classifieds over on Team Camaro. David Pozzi's website has the complete breakdown of casting numbers.

[eville]

I can post a pic tonight. I spoke to Tyler, and he said that I might need a shorter steering are. How do I find one of those?

I wonder if ATS will start making these someday?

[ITLBTU]

You might get lucky on eBay and they occasionally pop up in the classifieds over on Team Camaro. David Pozzi's website has the complete breakdown of casting numbers.

I remember seeing something about that there too. I guess I will just put a stock tie rod end on if I can't find one.

[67bird]

There are three different lengths. The short ones are usually listed as z-28 or such. I lucked out and bought a set of short ones that someone ground the numbers off of them. Everyone was leary about bidding on them. I got them for $50. Expect a set with # to bring at least $100 or more. You may have long ones now and could use the medium length, which are cheaper if anyone has them. You usually see short and long. I Pm'd ATS about the demand for these, but they informed me that they weren't going to make them. ATS makes arms for G-bodies to use their spindles, but that was only to allow use of the spindle on the car. One email I read stated that ATS only made something like $2 a set for these.

[ITLBTU]

Yikes! I just looked on ebay... There was a pair and it was up to $410.00!:barf:

[eville]

If you're bidding on these,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/67-68-1969-CAMARO-QUICK-RATIO-STEERING-ARMS-GM-Z-28_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ34200QQitemZ23010385 7314QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
They are not short. You can read the casting #s in the pictures. I compared them to the ones on David Pozzi's site and they look to be LONG.

[ITLBTU]

I saw that one too. I was watching it, because I thought it looked shorter than the ones I have on my car now.

[72SSAbody]

One email I read stated that ATS only made something like $2 a set for these.

If someone can send me a set or get me the dimensions we can make them.

Joe

[MrQuick]

Ultimately its a rim choice problem...incorrect back spacing. i had the same problem with my SS rims. Anything over 5 3/4" on a 17" will pose a problem with rim interference.



Hey Joe,
I can get a set to you. But I also have a billet long style too, enough material to redrill the hole but bump steer would have to be calculated. ...maybe some one could do a cad for the (near) perfect arm.

[72SSAbody]

Vince, if you want to do a billet short arm, just let me know.

Joe

[ITLBTU]

I know I would be interested. I was able to shorten the bolt on the Baer tracker, but it is so so close. Pics at links below...
www.itlbtu.com/pics/camaro2.jpg (http://www.itlbtu.com/pics/camaro2.jpg)
www.itlbtu.com/pics/camaro3.jpg (http://www.itlbtu.com/pics/camaro3.jpg)

[eville]

What is the # on your steering arms? I'm about 6 weeks behind you. Gotta get my wheels ordered. I'm going 18s, but it looks like it could still be bad. I had 3902520 & 2902519 arms on my 68.

[jeffandre]

I know I know, my 19's may not be the best for performance, but the steering arm and ball joint clearances necessary for big backspacing necessitated them. I had 17x9.5's from a late-80's Vette with 2" spacers and things were pretty tight. 18's would not have worked for my needs either...

[DarkoNova]

So what steering arms are needed exactly? Drum brake? Disc brake? This just threw a monkey wrench into my plans. I keep having to make changes just to get the ATS spindles to work.

Getting kind of annoyed now. :banghead:

Matt

[baz67]

So what steering arms are needed exactly? Drum brake? Disc brake? This just threw a monkey wrench into my plans. I keep having to make changes just to get the ATS spindles to work.

Getting kind of annoyed now. :banghead:

Matt

It depends on your wheel size, but the short arms are your best bet.

[Marcus SC&C]

Mr. Quick is right. There is no issue with the AFX spindles or the steering arms or the tie rod ends. The issue here is that the wheels have too much backspacing. Change the wheels or go to a slightly thicker adapter and the problem goes away. Changing tie rod height and the length of the arms alters the bumpsteer curves and ackerman angles as well as the steering ratio. A great deal of engineering went into making those aspects the very best they can be with the AFX spindles so there`s a pretty good chance of screwing it all up.
Just space the steering arms inboard 1/4" or so with some spacers or washers and longer bolts and you`re good to go. Mark SC&C

[ITLBTU]

Eville, I think that the 18" wheels will be fine. I also think that if I went with an 8"x 17 wheel I whould be ok as well. If I had a shorter steering arm I think it would work with no worries as well. I don't know what the casting # is. I can look after work. The car was a factory drum brake car.

[ITLBTU]

Mr. Quick is right. There is no issue with the AFX spindles or the steering arms or the tie rod ends. The issue here is that the wheels have too much backspacing. Change the wheels or go to a slightly thicker adapter and the problem goes away. Changing tie rod height and the length of the arms alters the bumpsteer curves and ackerman angles as well as the steering ratio. A great deal of engineering went into making those aspects the very best they can be with the AFX spindles so there`s a pretty good chance of screwing it all up.
Just space the steering arms inboard 1/4" or so with some spacers or washers and longer bolts and you`re good to go. Mark SC&C

I already have a 2" spacer on the wheels. I feel pretty dumb... I never even thought of spacing the steering arm inward..:screwy:

[DarkoNova]

It depends on your wheel size, but the short arms are your best bet.

I'm hoping I have the short ones, then. How much backspacing is too much? I'm going to get some Corvette wheels. 17x9.5 with 54-56mm of backspacing, I'm not sure exactly what it is. I hope it clears, otherwise I probably won't be getting the spindles.

Matt

[MrQuick]

50mm is approx. 1" That would be 54-56mm positive or negative from centerline. 9.5 is about 5 1/4". Im guessing you'd have a 6 1/2" back space...give or take an inch. j/k

No matter what spindles you have they will still hit the arm.

[MarkM66]

I don't see why some are blaming it on to much backspacing. Yeah, this is causing the problem, but if you want the widest possible tire/wheel, and for it not to hit the fender, you need as much bs a possible.

Give Flaming river a call. Awhile back someone said they offered short steering arms with the r&p conversion. See if they are in fact short, and if they'll sell you a set.

[derekf]

50mm is approx. 1"

I'm thinking 25.4mm is more like 1" and 50 is slightly shy of 2".

[baz67]

I'm thinking 25.4mm is more like 1" and 50 is slightly shy of 2".

Ya D that is how Vince impresses the girls with his supersly metric conversion skills.

[zbugger]

Derek, you are correct. 54mm = 2 1/8" and 56mm = 2 3/16". Or it's damn close to that. And from what I remember, most Vette wheels run in the 6 3/4"-7 1/4" range. Somewhere in there. It's not exact. Measure for yourself, dammit....

[MrQuick]

LOL, and thats where the humor lies....easy Buggie, its not rocket science. LOL

[Taylor1969]

If someone can send me a set or get me the dimensions we can make them.

Joe

I would be interested in a set if you made them.

[DarkoNova]

Derek, you are correct. 54mm = 2 1/8" and 56mm = 2 3/16". Or it's damn close to that. And from what I remember, most Vette wheels run in the 6 3/4"-7 1/4" range. Somewhere in there. It's not exact. Measure for yourself, dammit....

lol, well I don't have the wheels yet. I'm debating on whether or not to get them now if I'll have clearance issues with the spindles.

I guess a 2" spacer would work, I just want to be damn sure before I buy all new wheels and tires so I can use the ATS spindles.

Matt

[ITLBTU]

Well, I put a bandaid on the problem for now. Maybe for good. I found some hardend machine washers at work that are 3/16"thick. I put them, one one on each side of the steering arm, and it spaced the Baer tracker far enough out that I was able to add all but the two smallest shims. I would have been able to put all on had I not cut the bolt as short. I might be able to post some pics tomorrow, if there is any interest. Thanks for the advice Marcus. Such a simple fix. I can't believe I couldn't think of that.

[eville]

I'd like to see pictures please.

[ITLBTU]

I'd like to see pictures please.

I posted some pics here..

http://www.itlbtu.com/restoration/

[Marcus SC&C]

No problem,glad to help. :) Mark SC&C