Att Larry, gas tank vent valve??

[Steve N 69 69 69]

Hey, I was wondering what ever happened to the gas tank vent/rollover valve thingie Larry had with him at SEMA a few years back. He said something about trying to import them to sell?
anyone know, or have any ideas on a vent for an EFI tank, that lets the pressure out, but keeps the gas/stink in?
Thanks,

[shanekennedy]

how about a vented cap?

[parsonsj]

Steve,

I'm pretty happy with my method: I made a simple liquid/vapor separator and hooked it to the liquid side of the tank. I made sure it was above the tank so that gravity will return the liquid to the tank. I hooked the vapor side of the separator to a K&N crankcase filter.

Result: tank venting works nicely, and no gas smell. I put the filter below the separator and upside down. I was easier to package that way, plus I can put activated charcoal inside the filter if need be. So far, no need.

jp

[EFI69Cam]

Hey, I was wondering what ever happened to the gas tank vent/rollover valve thingie Larry had with him at SEMA a few years back. He said something about trying to import them to sell?
anyone know, or have any ideas on a vent for an EFI tank, that lets the pressure out, but keeps the gas/stink in?
Thanks,

There is a thread over on lateral-g talking about this.

Seems like the charcoal cannister is the way to go. If you have a factory ecu, you can even implement the purge solenoid. If you car is LT1 powered, why not just copy the Evap system from a LT1 Impala or Camaro?

[TonyHuntimer]

Steve,

I'm pretty happy with my method: I made a simple liquid/vapor separator and hooked it to the liquid side of the tank. I made sure it was above the tank so that gravity will return the liquid to the tank. I hooked the vapor side of the separator to a K&N crankcase filter.

Result: tank venting works nicely, and no gas smell. I put the filter below the separator and upside down. I was easier to package that way, plus I can put activated charcoal inside the filter if need be. So far, no need.

jp

John,

Let's see a picture of this system...:postpics:

Tony Huntimer
RaceHome.com

[parsonsj]

Sure thing.

You can see two lines going to the tank. The one on the left is the return line from the pressure regulator, the one on the right is the vent. It goes to the liquid/vapor separator, and then the output of the separator goes down through the trunk floor to a K&N crankcase filter.

[Steve N 69 69 69]

wow John, that thing is all business, looks great too BTW. Do you have stock in A.N. fittings? Did you say you made the separator?

Shane, the rock valley tank has a little vent tube on the top left corner, so I wanted to put some sort of filter on there.

EFI, I ripped all that stuff out of the harness years ago, I was trying to simplify the installation as much as possible. I'll check out the lateral G site, thanks.

I found this on the net http://www.thinkauto.com/onewayvalves.htm , the units on top look like what Larry had with him at SEMA, but its a Euro site, Maybe thats why he was saying he should import them to sell here.
I'm trying to find something like this, on this side of the pond.

[parsonsj]

Do you have stock in A.N. fittings? Did you say you made the separator?Ha! I wish I had stock. I own a dozen Summit and Jegs hats from all the fittings I bought there over the past year.

Yes, I made the separator. Some tube, some scrap aluminum, and a pipe thread tap. I don't have any fab pictures of it, but I can provide a diagram if you're interested.

jp

[Larry Callahan]

Should you need I can get the valves pretty easy but, I also had luck with using a Wilwwod brakes residual pressure valve.

[BRIAN]

I had listed the GM part number for a vent pressure valve. It is like $12 and attatches to your vent line. It simply releases the pressure at a pre set air pressure. About 2 inches long and in diamater. I have also had zero fuel loss in a non baffled tank so it also may have a fuel tip built in. Hard to beat for the money. If interested I will look up and post part number but it is on Lateral G and most are on both sites.

[Steve68]

Post the number Brian, pls

[Steve N 69 69 69]

I though about the brake residual valve, but shouldn't the tank be able to take air in, to replace fuel being used, as well as let excess pressure out? Maybe 2 valves, one valve to let air out , one to let it in.

Larry, do the valves you can get work like these "tank breathers" http://www.thinkauto.com/onewayvalves.htm , if so, I think I need the last one "TRL7. For in line fitting into ¼” bore hose" sounds like the exact piece.

later,

[parsonsj]

Yes, the vent needs to work both ways: air out to allow easy gurgle free filling, and air in to keep the fuel pump from generating a vacuum in the fuel tank.

Two vents (one each direction) would seem overly complicated, and would still need to be filtered on the way in, and kept from sloshing (and smelling) on the way out.

jp

[preston]

Can you post a link to the fuel tank vent thread on lateral-g ?

I could not find it.

Thanks
Preston

[Steve Chryssos]

Here's a pic of my vnt tube. Simple aluminum fuel line with a loop. It passes thru a hole in the trunk floor. A small K&N breather hangs upside down on the end of the tube.

Inspired by the old Welches grape juice ads from the 70's. Or was it jelly? Whatever.

Keep in mind the biggest stinker can actually be braided hose. Through a condition known as permeation, the hose actually "sweats" just enough to smell, but not enough to feel wet to the touch. Russell braided line is the worst. I used to run braided line for the entire length of the vehicle--fuel cell to carburetor. What a waste of money! Run as much hard line as you can.

[preston]

In years of doing this I still haven't hit on the right solution - braided rubber line smells, but hard line is only practical up to 1/2". I current run -10 supply and return lines and would like to run hardline. Actually it can be done, but the tooling required is hundreds of dollars. Currently my solution is to run 4 1/2" hard lines, two supply and two return. People often mention braided teflon hose but the only kind I've seen in a -10 is Earl's top of the line hose which is $38 a foot !!

At 800-1000 hp I guess I could just squeak by with 1/2" lines if I was using fuel injection, but not for a carb.

Just wondering if anyone had come up with anything else, I hate to run 4 fuel lines just kind of a pain.

As far as evaporation has anyone adopted a charcoal canister from OEM ? I don't see why the purge solenoid would need computer control, it seems like a line to the air intake at all times would be okay, but I worry about it actually siphoning fuel from the tank. Not to mention, this is a 5th fuel line that would need to run to the front of the car. I'm not sure a few loops of hardline is enough to prevent siphoning down the vent line. I have a Stock Car rollover ball style valve on my vent line now, and when you fill the tank, the gas will bubble past this check ball and up into the vent line. Currently my vent line is just routed to be the highest point of the fuel system, but that is not easy to do either.

[68 SuperRam]

Has anyone every considered talking to DSE about venting the tank and or fabbing up the gas cap - to get their input - just a question.

[130fe]

I saw this post a while back http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=1261&highlight=10033125 . In the post reply #20 a GM valve from a third gen camaro #10033125 was recommended for it. Here is a price for it from an online gm parts house, but I am going to see how much the local dealership wants for it. I am also very interested in this because I have some venting problems on my current set up and Rock Valley (my tank) seems to think I am the ONLY one out there who can't figure out how to do this. While on the Power Tour I talked to Rick (owner of Rick's Tanks) at the bar one night and I wished RV customer service and product knowledge was as good as his. I will post more info when I get it.

[parsonsj]

Through a condition known as permeation, the hose actually "sweats" just enough to smell, but not enough to feel wet to the touch. Russell braided line is the worst.Perfect. Just perfect. My setup above is using Russell line. I don't notice a smell, but my car has been sitting cold, dark, and quiet for a couple of months. I considered hardlines (I've got the Ridgid benders, ss line, and fittings), but the impossible part is getting the first bend and flare done. I'll be sniffing the air carefully once this car gets running regularly.

jp

[DLinson]

I am getting the fuel smell from my car now and I was wanting to know if the above methods are working.

My car is plumbed with hard line the length of the car except for about 2 feet from the fuel filter to the fuel rail, (EFI) and 3 feet from the pump to the gas tank. I just have a -3an vent tube out of the tank fill tube through the floor. I don't have a check valve yet.

I was wanting to know if you guys had luck with the check valves, the fuel recovery tank, or if I will need to replace the Russel steel braided hose. If I need to replace the braided hose, which brand is best?

Thanks,
Dennis

[BonzoHansen]

Some guys at nastyz28.com found teflon lined hose worked well to eliminate the gasoline smell issue.

http://www.nastyz28.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77994&highlight=teflon+fuel+line

[TonyHuntimer]

Did anyone ever get one of the GM valves? Any pictures? Any opinions change about their fuel system check valves after running them for a while? Stevo, do you get a lot of vapor smell in the garage from your system?

Tony Huntimer
RaceHome.com

[got6spd?]

how big does the actual hole for venting need to be? The factory one is a tiny little pin hole isn't it?

[TonyHuntimer]

According to Aeromotive, in our high performance applications it should be at least 3/8" or #6 AN.

Tony Huntimer
RaceHome.com

[HILROD]

The GM part number is 10033125. It is around 1.5 diameter by 3 long. It is number 10 in the bad line drawing.

[BonzoHansen]

That's not just a one way valve letting air in? Those cars use charcoal cannisters for evap. Just wondering.

[killer69]

the Black Camaro stinks of fuel and uses Earls Black fabric braided hose, i talked to Ricks Tanks and he mentioned this and i figured he was drunk!!! no offense. but now it would appear the he was not drunk. so now what 5 cars all built with the black fabric braided hose???? Great!!

[parsonsj]

An update:

My venting has worked very nicely for smell and gurgle free filling of the tank. I can get within an inch or so of the tank breather, and no smell at all.

On the other hand, my Russell main supply fuel line failed. I'm using hard line except for the last 2 ft to the rails. And those two feet of Russell hose failed! An out and out failure, with a steady stream of gas right onto the ground at full pressure (42 psi). That's less than 2000 miles and 2 years on the car. I cut the hose apart and inspected the inside of the hose. It looks 20 years old! Multiple cracks, and hardening. Unacceptable!!!! If you are using standard ss braided line for fuel use, you need to replace it.

I've ripped the remaining Russell line out of the car and I'm gonna get even more hard line, and use teflon-lined stuff where hose is required. Watch the classifieds... I'll be selling a whole bunch of Russell hose and ends soon. Cheaply too.

jp

[got6spd?]

I found this on the net http://www.thinkauto.com/onewayvalves.htm , the units on top look like what Larry had with him at SEMA, but its a Euro site, Maybe thats why he was saying he should import them to sell here.
I'm trying to find something like this, on this side of the pond.

those tank breathers seem like they'll do the job.

I'm running the stock tank in my 68 and was thinking of cutting off the pickup tube in the tank all the way to the top and using that as the vent line. then running that original line to one of those inline vent valves

Opinions???

[preston]

Those "euro" valves or the equivalent are readily available from places like Hoerr racing. Also check out ATL's site and pdf catalog they have several choices.

Your inline valve idea is okay, but I have had problems with some of those valves - don't get anything that is spring loaded. Remember it has to allow air in and out of the tank. Definitely put a length of hose after the valve and loop it around 1-3 times so fuel doesn't slosh out.

My overal experience with those valves is they will slow down a fuel spill but not prevent fuel coming out entirely. And the ones that robustly stop any fuel from coming out will also "stick" closed and you'll wonder why the tank won't take any fuel.

[Glenn]

Did or Does anyone have this part number Brian was speaking of ? or even a substitute part number?






I had listed the GM part number for a vent pressure valve. It is like $12 and attatches to your vent line. It simply releases the pressure at a pre set air pressure. About 2 inches long and in diamater. I have also had zero fuel loss in a non baffled tank so it also may have a fuel tip built in. Hard to beat for the money. If interested I will look up and post part number but it is on Lateral G and most are on both sites.