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View Full Version : 86 Monte Carlo SS super project



redss86
08-17-2006, 12:14 PM
Alright guys, I have been a member here for sometime now, but haven't actually posted any pics of my car yet. I have posted a few pics of the rear suspension in the rolling chassis section. The parts guy where I work took some of my pics and put them on his website. For anybody to look at. Here (http://corvettecruising.com/detail.asp?id=333) is a link directly to the page for my car.

Here is a list of what I have done to it so far:

Body:
mini-tubbed 3"
spare tire well delete
rear floor board mod to clear suspension
stripped car to bare steel and epoxy primed
cut tunnel for t56 shifter clearance

Frame:
2x4 rect tubing from firewall to rear horns
truck arm rear suspension
screw jack rear spring perches
custom fabbed full floating 9in
truck arm x-member bracing
adjustable phb

Additional Plans:
SC&C AFX stage 2 kit
Bonspeed Delta wheels (18x9f, 18x10r)
315 rear 275 front tires
Approx. 550hp 383sbc or 600hp 434sbc
Viper t56 (already have)
Glass cowl hood (already have)
Complete original pattern leather interior w/ modified front seat foam (bigger bolsters)

I know this is a big list but I am doing ALL the work myself so it is taking quite a while. Here (http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b221/badaSSMonte85/redSSchop.jpg) is a link to a photochop I had Bernie (SickSpeedMonte) do on his car to give me a more visual picture of what my car will look like, rather than a mental image.

Sorry for the long post, but let me know what you guys think,
Joe

vintageracer
08-17-2006, 06:06 PM
Now THAT'S GOING TO BE ONE COOL G BODY!!!!

scogin918
08-18-2006, 09:36 AM
Do you have any more pics of the finished floor pan(rear footwells). I'm interested to see how you made room for the travel of the truck-arms. I don't like the way my own floorpan was cut, so I might be inclined to change it if I can find another way. Car looks good. Keep it up.

redss86
08-21-2006, 03:56 AM
Do you have any more pics of the finished floor pan(rear footwells). I'm interested to see how you made room for the travel of the truck-arms. I don't like the way my own floorpan was cut, so I might be inclined to change it if I can find another way. Car looks good. Keep it up.

Thanks for the complements. I will have to look through my pics when I get home tonight. If I have any good pics of the floor pan I will post them. Actually I will takes some more pics of the floor pan regardless if I already have some. I will try to post them tonight, but I may not get time.

Thanks again,
Joe

TPI Monte SS
08-21-2006, 05:32 AM
Looks evil, I like it!

redss86
08-22-2006, 07:58 PM
Here are some pics of the rear floor board. I have a minimum of 1/4 clearance from the floor to any suspension part w/ the suspension completely bottom out against the frame. I know this isn't much clearance but unless one of the arms break or a grade 8 bolt breaks I shouldn't have any problems. I don't remember if I did the floor mods w/ the body bushings installed or not. If not then that will give my even more clearance. I am pretty sure I had them install, and they are brand new urethane ones from Energy Suspension. I figured if I could get clearance w/ the suspension bottomed out against the frame, then once I installed some sort of bump stops I shouldn't have any problems.

Here are the pics, as you can tell they are still in bare metal and need primed. The welds also havn't been finished on the bottom.

Protournova
08-30-2006, 10:04 AM
Killer setup...

I am currently building a '71 Nova, with a truck arm system. It looks like you are running "off the shelf" parts.... ?????

GBodyGMachine
08-30-2006, 04:03 PM
Wow man thats awsome. Now my car doesnt seem so radical. Hope you get her done soon.
Jeff

Protournova
08-30-2006, 05:00 PM
Answered my own question with a little more research..:hand:

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16932&highlight=truck+arm

https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7840

Nice thread keep it going to ed-u-macate the rest of us.

My big question right now is coilover spring rate. They will be mounted in front of the ford 9 at a nominal angle. What is a good rate to start at... final weight isn't known yet... ????

'71 Nova
BB 408
700r4
Ford 9
Custom Truckarm

DeltaT
08-30-2006, 06:53 PM
Some GNX flares could easily be adapted for the Monte, and would look great. Cool project!

Jim

redss86
08-31-2006, 04:25 AM
Some GNX flares could easily be adapted for the Monte, and would look great. Cool project!

Jim

I didn't even really think about using flares. I have already done a 1.5" tub to both sides, so I should hopefully be able to run 315's w/o using flares. I think all I should have to do is trim the 1/4 lip a little. I am trying to keep it looking stock on the outside w/ the exception of hood, wheels and paint. Thanks for the idea though.


It looks like you are running "off the shelf" parts.... ?????

Correct. I bought the truck arms, phb brackets, and crossmember from Stock Car Products.


My big question right now is coilover spring rate. They will be mounted in front of the ford 9 at a nominal angle. What is a good rate to start at... final weight isn't known yet... ????

I am planning of running around a #250 rear spring, non coilover. My springs are still in the same general location as stock. I don't know my exact spring rates yet. Once I have the car fully assembled I will scale it and then probably ask on here and other boards as to what spring rate to use.


Wow man thats awsome. Now my car doesnt seem so radical. Hope you get her done soon.
Jeff

Yeah, it's a huge project, and I hope I get it done soon also. Funds are extremely tight right now. I sign papers on my new house tomorrow and am getting married in a month:scared: , so funds go elsewhere first.

Thanks for all the complements. Protournova, if you have anymore ?'s just ask. I sent you a pm.
Joe

Protournova
09-02-2006, 05:13 AM
Quote:
Yeah, it's a huge project, and I hope I get it done soon also. Funds are extremely tight right now. I sign papers on my new house tomorrow and am getting married in a month:scared: , so funds go elsewhere first.


Congrat’s on both accounts... add two kids to the equation… money is always tight. ;-)

Future state I plan on adding either light weight I-beam or tube arms. Current state is factory arms. One idea I had was to light them was by drilling 1” holes down the length of the center. Does anyone have an opinion on this????

Protournova
09-02-2006, 05:20 AM
Yeah, it's a huge project, and I hope I get it done soon also. Funds are extremely tight right now. I sign papers on my new house tomorrow and am getting married in a month:scared: , so funds go elsewhere first.

Congrat’s on both accounts... add two kids to the equation… money is always tight. ;-)

Future state I plan on adding either light weight I-beam or tube arms. Current state is factory arms. One idea I had was to light them was by drilling 1” holes down the length of the center. Does anyone have an opinion on this????

redss86
09-03-2006, 10:33 AM
Future state I plan on adding either light weight I-beam or tube arms. Current state is factory arms. One idea I had was to light them was by drilling 1” holes down the length of the center. Does anyone have an opinion on this????

I don't know how well the i beam or tubr arms would work. The truckarms are built the way they are because they have to flex. I think if you use an I-beam or tube setup, it would cause some serious binding issues. I have seen somebody (think it was on this website) that used a set of tubular arms. Though the way they had them built, I don't think it necessarily saved much weight. From the research I have done, you can't run a truck-arm setup w/ arms that are torsionally rigid. Here is a link to a very good discussion on a tubular truck arm setup. There is a ton of info in this post. http://https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8556&highlight=tubular+truck+arms

As far as drillin holes to lighten the arms, you might be able to do that. I would just me concerned about the strength afterwards.

Just my thoughts,
Joe

SicMonte
09-04-2006, 05:33 AM
all I have to say is wow........just wow. What a project!!! I have a 88 monte carlo SS....that just got a frame notch and soe other stuff....and you have really inspired me just now. What an awesome car.

Are you on the montecarloss.com board? I know Bernie really well..and I hang out with him all the time. His car is really nice. Good luck with your car and let me know if you need anything!!

Protournova
09-04-2006, 07:00 PM
I don't know how well the i beam or tubr arms would work. The truckarms are built the way they are because they have to flex. I think if you use an I-beam or tube setup, it would cause some serious binding issues. I have seen somebody (think it was on this website) that used a set of tubular arms. Though the way they had them built, I don't think it necessarily saved much weight. From the research I have done, you can't run a truck-arm setup w/ arms that are torsionally rigid. Here is a link to a very good discussion on a tubular truck arm setup. There is a ton of info in this post. http://https://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8556&highlight=tubular+truck+arms

As far as drillin holes to lighten the arms, you might be able to do that. I would just me concerned about the strength afterwards.

Just my thoughts,
Joe

Thanks for the link.. and yur right, lots of good stuff. I have also talked to MetalWorks on the phone and they where very willing and helpful to talk with. It would be really nice to see a group of the hotest suspension builders get together and run a heads up competition.

redss86
09-05-2006, 04:07 AM
all I have to say is wow........just wow. What a project!!! I have a 88 monte carlo SS....that just got a frame notch and soe other stuff....and you have really inspired me just now. What an awesome car.

Are you on the montecarloss.com board? I know Bernie really well..and I hang out with him all the time. His car is really nice. Good luck with your car and let me know if you need anything!!

Yeah, I am a member on montecarloss.com. My screen name on there is redss86. I wish I could change my id on here to the same, but I can't do that w/o creating a completely new profile. Oh well.

I will try and keep updates posted.

Joe

redss86
08-04-2016, 08:36 PM
Well 10 years later, and unfortunately not a whole lot of progress. But since the website that I had linked in my first post isn't there anymore, I figured I could actually add some pics to this thread and update it while I was at it.

Why 10 years and not much progress? "LIFE" happened!!!! As I had posted, I bought a house, got married, was unemployed for 5 months, then had to save money to build a shed to be able to work on it. That took almost 4 years to complete because I did not pay somebody to build it for me. I built it myself with the help of some family and friends. So then in that time frame we ended up having two kids ( thanks for the tip "Protournova") 19 months apart. Now that they are a little older, I am trying to get out and actually work on this. So when you throw two kids, a wife, home ownership, and doing some side work at home, you don't have much time to work on what you really want to.

Now I have over 250 pictures I could share, but that is entirely too many to post all of them. Plus a lot are basically the same pic, just a little different angle. So if you have any questions for some different angles it is no problem. This will take several posts and probably several days to fully update, and the posts will probably be pretty long. So be patient on my update progress.

Tear Down, these were taken February '05

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I even got the "girlfriend" (wife now) to help!

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Did a mini-tub on it. I cut the entire panel between the wheel wells out, and cut a 3" section out of the center. I did this because I wanted to keep the body bushing support there. It isn't actually a "body mount", but there is a bushing there. So I drilled out the spot welds as needed and cut around the center package tray brace. I cut the section out and welded the two pieces back together, then trim the floor as needed around the wheel wells for now narrower piece. Once it was all spot welded back in place, I cut filler pieces to fill in the gap in the wheel wells. Looking back on it now, I almost wish I would have went a little bit more, but I will fit as wide of a tire as I can in there now.

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I also did some rust patch work on the trunk weatherstrip flange, and remove the spare tire well.

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Then, it was off to work, where I put it on the rotisserie and sand blasted and epoxied the entire body (inside and out).

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While I had the body at work, I started on the frame. I had to build some sort of "flat surface" to build the frame on. I didn't have access to a frame bench, and hadn't really thought about building one at the time. So I had my Uncle bring his laser level over and we shimmed up some 4x4's, and screwed down some plywood. Seriously kind of redneck engineering, but it was all I had.

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Then the "fun" began!!!
I started by re-welding the factory seams on the frame.

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Had to build jigs to hold the rear frame horns in place.

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Then it was time to start cutting it apart.

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I put the "old lady" to work cutting out backing plates with the plasma torch for the new frame rails. I wish I actually owned a plasma torch, it sure was nice to be able to bring the one home from work at the time.

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New frame rails. I did "butt with backing" welds on all joints between the axles. As you can tell, I also plug welded the backing plates on either side of the joint.

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Used more 1/8" plate to make the transition joint between the new rails, and the original ones. I think they turned out really good. Also put a sleeve in the outer rail for the #3 body mount under the door opening.

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I will have to get some pictures of the actual finished transitions.

Then to locate the truck arm cross-member. I had to reinstall the body to make sure I got the rear end positioned correctly. I had to cut the rear floor board out for clearance for the arms.

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My help "hard at work" :ssst: :sleeping:

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She's going to "LOVE" me for posting that. Oh, well. I will continue to post as I can. The newest picture in this post is from December '05 so I still have a loooooonnng ways to go. I am actually curious what the "LIFE" gap will be on it.

Yukon Cornelius
08-05-2016, 06:22 AM
Nice work. Keep the updates coming.

cbpldc
08-05-2016, 08:07 AM
Man, that was genius cutting out the center to make your mini-tubs. Good work. Can't wait to see more.

Chris

rchaskin
08-05-2016, 10:55 AM
10 Year update....lol.

Good for you.
Time, it sure flys right by.

redss86
08-06-2016, 08:08 PM
This is a short post today. Hopefully be able to post a lot more tomorrow.

After I had the rails done and the cross member welded in, I mocked it all up close to the ride height I was thinking. It was only then that I realized that I had less than 2" of compression room for the rear end. So I decided to cut out the three pieces going over the axle and replace the top piece with a 2x3x.125 tube rather than the 2x4x.125 that the rest is built out of. I am still nervous about only having approximately 3" of compression before the axle hits the frame. I am going to have to install some sort of bump stop to prevent direct axle to frame contact.

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Used some 2x2x.125 tube for diagonal bracing coming off the truck arm cross member, and built a trans mission cross member and brackets.13035713035813035913036013036113036213036 3130364

I cut the factory rear spring purchases off the removed section of frame and welded screw jack plates on top. I reused the factory perch because I wanted to retain the factory body bushing mount. Also welded another piece of 2x2x.125 across the back of the perches for support and a upper shock mount, plus used some dom I had to support the front inner perches.

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redss86
08-07-2016, 09:21 PM
Welded in the adjustable panhard mounts, and fabricated the upper and lower shock mounts. Adjustable phb mounts were from Stockcar Products (SCP). Built the phb out of 1x0.560 wall dom with left hand threaded heim joint on one end, and right hand on the other. This way it is adjustable without removing it. I did install extra bracing on the frame side phb mount. I don't have any real clear pics of it, but I plated both sides of the mount with some 1/4" plate.

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Here are some pics of the frame bracing that I installed.

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Ordered some axle tubes to build a full floating rear end using SCP Grand National hubs. I had my machinist brother build me a narrowing setup for the axle. Then made some lower spring perches on the axle and welded the truck arm perches on. I do have more bracing on the perches, but don't have any current pictures of it. I will add some soon.

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Here are some mocked ride height pictures of when I stopped working on it. Date on these is April, '07

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And now we jump to May, '14, that makes it a 7 year "Life" gap. Of course when you have toddlers and sidewalk chalk around, they "help" work on the car (helping put some color on it). The rear wheel is of a rear wheel and tire off a Z06 with a 295 tire. The front is off my wife's TA, and has a 285 on an 18" wheel. I know it will not work on the front, but it is for wheel size/ tire dimensions.

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I am almost second guessing the last ride height setup. I feel I need to see saw it a little.... raise the front a touch, and lower the rear. I will have to actually put the front and rear bumpers on and reconsider the ride heights.

redss86
08-19-2016, 07:30 PM
After I mocked up the ride height, I put it up on stands to take a look underneath. I got to looking at the potential driveshaft clearance, and was a little concerned. So I found a piece of 3" conduit that I had laying around from building the shed. It just so happened to be the correct length to fit between the trans, and rear end to mimic a driveshaft. What I found was that at ride height I only had about 3/8" or less of clearance. So in turn I decided to raise the tunnel 1". So here is that process.

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In turn, I also had to raise the floor bracing.

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Welded up the firewall- floorpan seam, and cut off the pinch welds on the outside. Hopefully to serve to clean up the firewall, provide more bell housing clearance, and possibly some strength.

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redss86
08-19-2016, 07:36 PM
Trimmed the rear wheel opening flanges, and rolled them over.

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redss86
08-19-2016, 08:26 PM
Part of the reason I had to raise the floor, was because I decided to change my transmission cross-member. This raised the trans up, therefore I felt better raising the floor.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC034792020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03479%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)

Since I am setting this up so low, and with the truck-arms, I am forced to have the exhaust exit in front of the rear wheels. I plan on using something like the borla xr1 or similar mufflers, and I have some "Nascar boom tubes" that I am using for "tips". So with all the extra bracing running through the center of the frame, I decided to put some exhaust pass throughs in the bracing. I intend to add some bracing on the tops and bottoms of the pass-throughs. I also have to put them in the front "diagonal" braces, but I have the body on the frame currently so that will wait. I will be using some oval exhaust tubing. The pass-throughs are made from some 4.25x0.250 dom tube that I heated and smashed into an oval.

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I had started doing the body work on the doors a looonnnggggg time ago. Needless to say they had some surface rust on them. So for Valantine's day this year, the wife's present to me, was working on my car!!!!. So I put her to work stripping the doors back to bare metal so I could get them back in epoxy. I did the same with the fenders.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC036472020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03647%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC036512020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03651%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)

While the body is still on the frame, I decided to go ahead and see if I can get all the panels "fit". Needless to say, that is going to take some WORK!!! Gaps are not horrible, but where they are off, it's pretty bad (to me anyways).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037172020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03717%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037182020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03718%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037192020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03719%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037202020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03720%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)

redss86
08-19-2016, 08:30 PM
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037262020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03726%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037272020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03727%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037282020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03728%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037292020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03729%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)

This now gets up to date!!!

The only place I have changed direction from my "original" plan is the engine. Originally planned on a ~600hp sbc, but have change to a late model LS6 block and the intent on a pair of "hair driers". I don't actually have them yet, but I am still collecting parts as I find deals. The hope now is for ~650-700 whp. This will also retain a/c.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037322020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03732%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037332020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03733%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/DSC037122020Copy-1.jpg (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/jmarti81/media/Monte/Monte%20Forum%20Pics/DSC03712%20-%20Copy.jpg.html)

Update's will slow now, as I have to actually work on it to have an update.