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72NovaSS
06-23-2006, 12:40 PM
I'm looking for the best fuel injection system for my engine. My intake has an oil leak and since i have to pull the intake off to replace the gaskets, i thought i might as well go with fuel injection. so heres the run down of my engine...any help would be much appreciated.




ENGINE BLOCK: Motown 9.025” deck height 4-bolt main



CRANKSHAFT: Eagle 4340 forged steel 4.00” stroke



CONNECTING RODS: Eagle 6.00”



PISTONS: JE/SRP forged 4.125” bore



COMPRESSION RATIO: 10.0 to 1



PISTON RINGS: Speed-Pro



BEARINGS: Clevite H series



CAMSHAFT: Hydraulic Duration @ .050 is 244 intake & 252 exhaust. Lift .515 intake & .525 exhaust. Centerline is 112



CYLINDER HEADS: Motown Aluminum 220



VALVES: 2.08” x 1.600” Manley valves: Severe Duty intake & exhaust



ROCKER ARMS: 1.5:1 ratio roller rockers (Aluminum heads utilize a .150 offset intake rocker)

INTAKE MANIFOLD: Motown 4150


CARBURETOR: Hardcore 870 cfm. Hi flow 4150 style carburetor



IGNITION: Hardcore HEI distributor, Taylor Motown 8mm ignition wire, Accel spark plugs gapped @ .035


-brad

cykotic
06-23-2006, 12:53 PM
Are you looking to use the same intake manifold and just find a system to tap into it, or are you looking for a system that uses a different manifold like a hogans or what not?

72NovaSS
06-23-2006, 01:03 PM
thats a good question...i really like the fabbed look of hogans, how much do they run for on average? also, how much work is it to re-use the existing intake?

1Fine69
12-02-2006, 03:21 PM
novass this is not gooood. thank god i looked up hogans and foudn your post. im going to fuel injection too haha! hopefulyl minitubs as well. ill pm you with any info. i like the fabbed look as well

Doug F
12-03-2006, 04:37 AM
Hey guys, some of you know me. Thought I'd play over here sometimes as much as I enjoy EFI.


How much do you want to spend on the whole EFI setup?

andrewb70
12-03-2006, 09:09 AM
Look what the cat dragged in.

Welcome to our little slice of paradise Doug.

Andrew

parsonsj
12-03-2006, 09:16 AM
Hi Doug,

Welcome to the PT world!

jp

72NovaSS
12-03-2006, 04:01 PM
2500 max im just wondering whos gunna tune my system if i do get it...idk who will do a good job or not.

i guess when the time comes ill figure it all out

c.schulz
12-03-2006, 04:03 PM
Hi Doug,

Welcome to the PT world!

jp

pssst.....who is Doug?? Sound like someone of interest.Any way welcome Doug F


Chris

64duece
12-03-2006, 04:26 PM
Who's Doug F????????

You can usually find him in the backwoods of Kentucky in his old F100 w/ the shotgun mounted above the rear window! I heard he just finished upgrading to a sliding rear window for those, hard to get shots LOL!!!

HaHa.

Doug's a great engineer who's been working with EFI and other engine devolopment for a long time. He's unbiased and always willing to help. Welcome aboard.

To help answer your question.

A Commander 950 Stealthram kit will hit the nail on the head with your application. It's intake design will support your rpm and power needs and the price is right. There's plenty of web and shop based support on the net too. I always recommend running a WBO2 with any EFI application. HTH

camcojb
12-03-2006, 04:31 PM
thats a good question...i really like the fabbed look of hogans, how much do they run for on average? also, how much work is it to re-use the existing intake?

Hogans blow your budget, they're $2850 on average with rails.

Jody

andrewb70
12-03-2006, 04:57 PM
2500 max im just wondering whos gunna tune my system if i do get it...idk who will do a good job or not.

i guess when the time comes ill figure it all out

If you are not willing to learn to tune an EFI system then I suggest you stick to a carb. People use the term "tuning" very loosely these days. I can tune WOT in about 15 minutes for max power. What takes a lot of time, and I mean A LOT of time, is tuning all the part throttle and transient points on the map. If your expecting drivability like a new car, then count on at least 50 hours in-car tuning time. The OEMs spend thousands of hours just on idle.

Andrew

1Fine69
12-03-2006, 09:34 PM
ive got a lot...maybe to much, to learn

Fuelie Fan
12-04-2006, 08:33 AM
Don't scare him off! Fuel injection is fun! Of course, sometimes its hammer-to-the-skull type fun, but getting a car dialed in is rewarding. I don't recommend jumping in alone, its good to enlist the help of someone whos done it a few times to avoid typical pitfalls. NovaSS, where in SoCal are you?

Doug F
12-04-2006, 09:51 AM
Dennis, LOL, C10, I'm a Chevy guy!

Andrew,
I'll politely say that a good tuner can get a 90% tune in a couple of hours, other than some cold start tuning which you really only have one shot at a time with. If you disagree, we'll argue at lunch about it Wed. :). Some people who really love to do their own tuning, can mess with it for hours, but you don't really need to.

A wideband 02 really helps make tuning much easier. Whatever kit you get, make sure it has wideband. A good system will pretty much "tell" you what you need to do. If you just take it slow you can do it yourself.

Your $2500 cost pretty much will dicate your system choices as a Holley, Accel GenVII (with wideband will be closer to 3k), or the Edelbrock which I wouldn't consider for your engine. As mentioned a Hogans starts around $2500 with just the intake and rails.

72NovaSS
12-04-2006, 10:21 AM
Looks like i'll have to scrounge up a few more pennies! Wideband is a must so i know i have to get it.


Don't scare him off! Fuel injection is fun! Of course, sometimes its hammer-to-the-skull type fun, but getting a car dialed in is rewarding. I don't recommend jumping in alone, its good to enlist the help of someone whos done it a few times to avoid typical pitfalls. NovaSS, where in SoCal are you?

Thanks for the advice Fuelie Fan! I'm located 2 minutes away from Pomona.

andrewb70
12-04-2006, 10:27 AM
Dennis, LOL, C10, I'm a Chevy guy!

Andrew,
I'll politely say that a good tuner can get a 90% tune in a couple of hours, other than some cold start tuning which you really only have one shot at a time with.

I agree with you Doug. The key word being "good tuner."

Andrew

72NovaSS
12-04-2006, 10:30 AM
Thanks for all the help Andrew.

andrewb70
12-04-2006, 10:50 AM
Thanks for all the help Andrew.

Your welcome. Please don't think that I am trying to scare you off. EFI tuning is a blast. It's just best to know what your getting yourself into. This way the whole experience can be more productive and less frustrating. There is nothing worse than spending a bunch of money on parts and not making them work to their full potential. The Commander 950 is actually a nice low cost system and will meet your requirements. Its not like you need staged injection, boost control, coil on plug ignition, 3 rev limiters and a bunch of other stuff.

Andrew

Fuelie Fan
12-04-2006, 12:11 PM
I live in corona and work in tustin, if you need help let me know

72NovaSS
12-04-2006, 03:27 PM
Your welcome. Please don't think that I am trying to scare you off. EFI tuning is a blast. It's just best to know what your getting yourself into. This way the whole experience can be more productive and less frustrating. There is nothing worse than spending a bunch of money on parts and not making them work to their full potential. The Commander 950 is actually a nice low cost system and will meet your requirements. Its not like you need staged injection, boost control, coil on plug ignition, 3 rev limiters and a bunch of other stuff.

Andrew


Thanks for the suggestion. Im sure once i get the ball rolling and have the system i need it'll be alot better.



I live in corona and work in tustin, if you need help let me know

Thanks bud! Once i get the system i'll know who to contact!

1Fine69
12-04-2006, 08:46 PM
nova if you get the holley system let me know how it works out. i might have to go that way too looking at the prices of the hogans. i just went to check out the hilborn stuff.....are you kidding me? ill buy another engine instead thanks! can anyone guess at how much a hogans efi intake for a small block chevy with everything u need to run it would be? i know theres lots of factors but just a ballpark?

camcojb
12-04-2006, 08:58 PM
nova if you get the holley system let me know how it works out. i might have to go that way too looking at the prices of the hogans. i just went to check out the hilborn stuff.....are you kidding me? ill buy another engine instead thanks! can anyone guess at how much a hogans efi intake for a small block chevy with everything u need to run it would be? i know theres lots of factors but just a ballpark?

About $6K with injectors, pump, regulator, and FAST or similar computer.

Jody

Blown353
12-05-2006, 12:35 PM
About $6K with injectors, pump, regulator, and FAST or similar computer.

Jody

Bingo... and maybe leave a little more in the budget for a good baffled fuel tank/cell if he doesn't already have one.

If you're worried about price watch ebay and message boards, lots of "previous generation" boxes (that are still good but lacking some features of the latest and greatest) are on the market right now. I've seen some complete FAST bank to bank setups with manifold/TB/injectors/ECU on ebay over the last couple months that all sold for bargain prices (<$2700 for the whole setup.)

64duece
12-05-2006, 08:44 PM
I would still give a major :twothumbs for the Holley Cmdr950. Alot of people think it's lower cost makes it "limited" in it's capability. I know Doug F has strived to keep it affordable and simple so more people could make the switch to EFI.

I've owned and tuned these systems since they released them many years ago. I've installed and tuned a few dozen systms on everything from 275hp 305 w/ TBI to my own 380" Turbocharged Outlaw 10.5 car that ran 7.70's @ 180mph. I never hurt a part from the tune-up. I've heard a many people say "you need to upgrade to a abc or xyz box". Guess what, we turned my old car down (chassis rules) for the local 8.50 class. Car runs 8.48 to 8.52 everytime down the track. Now that's a product that works consistently!

1Fine69
12-06-2006, 05:05 PM
so what would the holley system cost in total around?

Doug F
12-06-2006, 06:33 PM
SBC Multiport systems are around $2400 mailorder and the wideband Bosch LSU4 is around $350 from Jegs and others.

Added items would be AN lines if you want them and any upgrades to the basic Holley filters.

If you get a stealthram you'll need TPI style throttle/trans cables and a bracket for them (can use stock stuff or Lokar).

Other than any fuel tank mods, this should be pretty much what you need.

1Fine69
12-07-2006, 03:42 PM
in other words.....blah blah blah holley filters blah blah bracket for them. gotcha haha.