TLC show 'Wrecks to Riches'

[Neil B]

I caught an episode of 'Wrecks to Riches' last night. Barry's Speed Shop built a pro-touring style '71 Satellite with a Hemi. What was different about this show was that it documented the parts cost and labor hours to build. They had $55K and 460 hours in the car and it sold at auction for $75K. If you give about $5K to the auction house and to pay for transport and lodging, that leaves about $15K for the 460 hours of labor. That works out to around $32 an hour for labor. $32 doesn't go very far when you factor in California labor and rent/overhead. Why was Barry so happy? Was it for TV effect or is there something I'm missing in the financials?

[BranZ]

I just assumed that the 55K covered labor also. I really did not think he was going to come out on top. Did the car have an overdrive? I saw all the push button stuff. BranZ

[colt zantop]

he doubled his money last week with a chevelle. I didnt think he would make it ($$) with the satellite but he did....

[Steve68]

Just great, I'm looking for a 72-74 RR or Satellite, now somebodys going to drive the price through the roof, I was going to watch last night but it was getting late,

[dropit69]

im sure hes smiling because the tv station prolly paid him tons to do all the filming and stuff at his shop im sure he didnt do that for free...im glad they told them all the money they had in it thats very cool..unlike boyds crazy deadlines..lol..he has an 8 week deadline on that 56..oh no..wonder if hell make it?????????

[mopork]

it was a 71-72 satellite and a 71-72 roadrunner clearly the builder is quite ignorant of mopars with the 9" Ford rear and all, cut up 2 to make one fake GTX. :rotfl:

[mone]

My uncle has a 70 Satellite..its shaped like a Charger or a 69 Camaro..

[Jims78elky]

The show is great,though some of it just gets old,like the engine.
The guy who was selling it say's "well i know its got a little crack"
should have been stomped for the $2000.00 he wanted for a junk
block...c'mon,...you know he knew about it being not good.Barry
could have just did a new crate engine,or a old school 340-440
with EFI or turbo's..maybe could have got a little more profit?

Sure that used block with some history on it,but it ain't gonna do
any good sittin in the shop floor.I hope the seller made it right
with barry on it.Also did you guys see the shifter? I just loved
the billit steering wheel with the shift buttons on it,way cool!
and really makes a clean different look,though the buttons are
small,could make for big thumb dudes nightmare lol..I think
the shrifter paddle's are more user friendly.

After all the work was done,it was a awesome car,the color was
just amazing,and a different aproach to a body style that's not
always is chosen for a high end build,again if they could drop
the "hurry" it up last moment thing it would be more fun to
watch the show,it was like they waited until the last day or
so to order the wheels,they come,but barry hates them LOL
so they go back with "tension" all in the shop,doesent have
to be that way.

I guess it makes the show though,so iam looking forward
to more shows..:smoke:

Whew...lol

[andrewb70]

What's TV?

Andrew

[MuscleRodz]

I saw it as $55K part and materials plus labor. I am sure a good chunk of the $55K worth of parts was donated by the people who didn't have their names blurred out on the back wall. If it all came out of his pocket, 460 hours x $50 per hour is $23K, plus $55K for parts that they mentioned, comes to $77K. Car sold for $75K less roughly 8% commission, is $69K. That's $8K in the hole. I wouldn't be smiling on TV. I will bet his buddy that has bid on both cars is protecting Barry.

The bigger problem with the show as a car guy, it doesn't really show a whole lot. Just a story line.

Mike

[Neil B]

I saw it as $55K part and materials plus labor. I am sure a good chunk of the $55K worth of parts was donated by the people who didn't have their names blurred out on the back wall. If it all came out of his pocket, 460 hours x $50 per hour is $23K, plus $55K for parts that they mentioned, comes to $77K. Car sold for $75K less roughly 8% commission, is $69K. That's $8K in the hole. I wouldn't be smiling on TV.

Mike

Exactly. That's the way I saw it too. You bring up a good point about many of the $55K in parts being donated. But if it's your nickel buying the parts and labor, building these types of cars on speculation to immediately resell seems like a risky game.

[FJB2069]

I was adding it up as I watched the show and apparently coming up with the same result as a lot of you.

I was thinking of calling this guy the next day and see if he'd finish my camaro for $55k!!!!!!!!!!!! What a deal!

[CRUSTY69]

76k for a clone....he made out good..25k profit..

[I_work_for_Barry]

I'm glad to see people talking about the show. It seems for the most part everyone likes it. I work for Barry and I can tell you one thing, we don't get to work on the TV cars all day. We have over 30 cars in the shop that need to be repaired or built and thats what pays the bills. Doing the TV show thing is a gamble. Every sponsor, every company, Beyond productions, and TLC have invested so much time and money in this and they have no idea if it will pay off. We all love what we do at the shop and to have a TV show is just a big bonus. Please remember, this is the first season, the shows keep getting better and things go smoother but it all takes time. Keep watching and we hope you all enjoy what we build.
Another thing I forgot to mention is the man hours. In both shows you see how much each car sells for, how much has been spent, and how much is made. The thing that people forget to figure in is our normal shop rate per hour and how many hours we put into each car. On the GTX show everyone got to see how many man hours went into the build. If you take the 460 hours and multiple that by the shop rate you come up with around $36,000.00 give or take a few. Now ad the $55,000.00 that Barry spent minus the $75,000.00 that the car sold for. Profit what profit. Barry is doing this because he loves building cool cars. Weather or not the show is a hit, we are doing what we love. The coolest thing about all of this is that at the end of the day, we get to build some real cool cars. Keep watching.

[I_work_for_Barry]

Andrew, if you watch tomorrows show I think you will like it.

[MrQuick]

Don't forget all the free advertisment and exposure.

[CRUSTY69]

"i wonder if they make that piece?" barry white, side cowl skin..

[CRUSTY69]

can you get me on the team?...im moving to fontana.

[andrewb70]

Andrew, if you watch tomorrows show I think you will like it.

I don't have TLC....

Andrew

[CRUSTY69]

I don't have TLC....

Andrew
they are doing a 70 Le Mans

[hotrodgal]

My least favorite episode, by the way. Or should I say, least favorite car...but then I'm spoiling the surprise. Anyway, guys, watch it and remember it's just TV. And I may get my butt kicked for this, but for all of you who are trying to figure out the cost angle - we did try to get as much product donated as possible - TLC did NOT give us any money to work with, this was all out of our pocket (mine and Barry's, not even the business); but on some of the cars there just wasn't anyone who wanted to play ball, so we took a hard hit (especially on the Camaro). And the numbers are just approximate - we had to keep a list of vendors who gave us product and assign a value to that product, that's where they get the $$ from. And about the wheels - when Chris does the rendering for how the car is going to look (and that's usually right after we've found the car) he sends the design for the wheels over to the company that makes our wheels, so therefore they have minimum 4-5 weeks to produce the wheel - and they always came down to the very last minute - do you guys really think that we waited until the end before ordering a set of custom wheels? Puh-leeze!! If there are any more questions on how we pulled this fiasco off, please let me know - I'll try to answer them as best I can.

[CRUSTY69]

your giving out secrets, your sooo gonna get busted...lol..

[hotrodgal]

Shhh, don't tell anyone :ssst:

[CRUSTY69]

well im glad to see you guys held on to the pontiac...selling at cost would have been a watse of time..

[hotrodgal]

Yeah, there were NO buyers at that venue...the car was actually high bid for the auction! There was no way we were going to let it go for that price...so we brought it home. So other than that, what did you all think of tonight's show?

[JCAM68]

Hotrodgal, Where Do You Guys Get The Wheels From??

[JCAM68]

I thought the car looked great! I liked the Camaro the best though.

[colt zantop]

nice episode.....the chevelle and camaro were my fav's though......

[hotrodgal]

We design the wheels ourselves, and they are available for sale. Thanks for watching!!

[hotrodgal]

The Camaro episode has been my favorite too so far...but my favorite car is yet to come...but that's all I'm going to say for now!!

[Larry Callahan]

I'm Tivo'ing tonights episode. I missed the first one.

Has the entire season already been shot?

[I_work_for_Barry]

Yes, the entire season is in the bag. Larry, if you come down to the shop we have some of the cars that two of our local customers bought in the shop.

[protour_chevelle]

I feel so special with all of this underground info being given out. hehehehe.

-Matt

[hotrodgal]

You're quick, Adam. Beat me to the draw on that one :) We finished filming in January...and we are waiting to see if the ratings are good enough to do a 2nd season. Thanks again to everyone who's watching! Let TLC know what you think of it...and us too.

[Orngcrush69]

Good luck! I hope to make it down there to the shop for some tips

[zbugger]

I liked this episode. The car, well, the rear could have sat a touch lower, but oh well. Oh, and when they showed the car after it was finally finished and they did the burnout shot, what were the sparks under the car coming from? It looked like a lightning storm. Or was that just me seeing that?

[Steve68]

I think the front sat to low and the rear to high, would have brought one up, and one down, but other than that it's a good show, except when they get the older guy to start bashing the UTI kids, reminds me ot the idiot Boyd and his retards,

[kamaroman68]

It almost looked like a water leak to me and not sparks. However I could be wrong. Chris

[southernfriedcj]

Hotrodgal,
I enjoyed the show last night. Can you clear one thing up for me please? Does the cost of the build include materials and labor?

Thanks,
Jim

[stryfe101]

I saw the sparks too...was wondering what it might be. I've like all of the cars so far but the Lemans and the Satellite are my 2 favs.

Gray

[Jagarang]

fell asleep before I saw the numbers the Lemans drew on the block.
What was the final number?


I think the front sat to low and the rear to high, would have brought one up, and one down

I couldn't agree more, although the preauction gawkers seemed to like the way it sat.

[hotrodgal]

Hi Everyone,
Thanks for your opinions on last night's episode...to be honest, it wasn't my favorite and I was worried that it would tank. But I guess it was OK. The sparks you all saw were the end of the starter hitting the flywheel...but we fixed that right away. And again, the "spendometer" shows retail value on parts that we used and does include the "man hours" that they mention. The producers thought it would be of interest to show something like that, and it seems to be the biggest point of conversation so far. And I don't know how many of you joined Jagarang in sleepyland before the show ended, but the GTO ended up coming back home with us.
Becky

[tracar91]

My wife and I liked the show last night, but she made two comments I thought I'd share:

She thought (and I agree) that the rear sat too high because of the wheels (what diameter were they?)

And she asked whether these cars were represented as clones? I'm sure they are, but nothing is mentioned during the show.

I also noticed at least once when the narrator got the years mixed up. He either called it a 70 lemans early or a 71 GTO late.

Personally, I am of the opinion that the more car build shows on TV, the better exposure our hobby gets. And that is a good thing. They are the only "Reality" shows I can watch.

[Northern Goat]

First of all awesome build on the Lemans. IMO, the 40K offer seemed fair for a Lemans. I know a 65 GTO with very similar mods (except Butler power) went for 50K a while back. So 40K for a Lemans seems fair. You may have put a lot of cash in it but it is still a Lemans.

I assume that TV land makes you refer to these clones as GTX/GTO..., but some of us may find it insulting these clones are referred to as GTX/GTO. I know a lot of my Mopar buddies felt the same way about the Satellite. I think that by referring to the clones as the real deal and auctioning them off as such, you are giving the crooks and uneducated the wrong idea. A clone is not the real deal and is usually worth sigificantly less.

Overall, great show. I enjoy watching it a lot. Not as over the top with the conflicts as Boyd.

[Bob Johnson]

I agree with Barry..it's worth 50K. If you took him a car and told him to duplicate that build, it'd be 90K or so. It will bring the 50, probably from somebody watrching the show and wants one..

[hotrodgal]

Thanks everyone, you all have some valid questions/points. We filmed this last year, I had forgotten we had two cars to work with on that episode. One was the white one, which we used - the other blue one (which all you eagle eyes spotted at the end of the show) was the parts car. The reason it was used in the "track around" is because the white one was already blown apart and being worked on. And as for the stance on the car, we had put Hotchkis springs on the rear and didn't have time to lower it before we had to be at the auction. But have no fear, it was the first thing we did when it came back home!

[Jagarang]

Hi Everyone,
Thanks for your opinions on last night's episode...to be honest, it wasn't my favorite and I was worried that it would tank. But I guess it was OK. The sparks you all saw were the end of the starter hitting the flywheel...but we fixed that right away. And again, the "spendometer" shows retail value on parts that we used and does include the "man hours" that they mention. The producers thought it would be of interest to show something like that, and it seems to be the biggest point of conversation so far. And I don't know how many of you joined Jagarang in sleepyland before the show ended, but the GTO ended up coming back home with us.
Becky

I know you kept it, but was curious what the high bid was?

[hotrodgal]

If I remember right, it was $47K - which wasn't a bad price. They didn't show it, but I tried to get him to let it go for that....

[Northern Goat]

No comment on the cloning issue?

[bobbaganoosh]

Did anyone else notice the sparks under the car during the burnout shot? What was going on there? The car looked good, if it were mine I'd have to drop the back a little more, that's just my opinion.

[Bob Johnson]

No comment on the cloning issue?
If you try to clone a car to an original, I think it hurts it much more than if you make a pro-tour/street machine out of it. You're changing the motor, trans, rear, brakes, suspension etc. The bodies aren't different, just the trim and the driveline. If you're changing that already to modify the car what's the difference. I guess the PHS documentation could tell on you if you said it was a GTO when it wasn't, but in the Chevelle world, after 67 they were all 136 cars with the SS option. If I were building a pro-tour 69 ot 70 Chevelle, I'd use a Malibu. No need wasting a SS..

[hotrodgal]

Bobbaganoosh, go back up a few posts and you'll see where I explained all...by the way, thanks for watching!

And as for the "clone" issue, we tried to stress the fact that these cars were clones, we weren't trying to pass them off as the "real deal". We had no control over how the show was edited so I know there was a lot of stuff that got cut - so that was probably something that was, for whatever reason. And we did "clones" simply because we thought they would be better received than just a plain jane car. Technically, our version "Super Muscle Car" is supposed to be the old styling with all new technology, so they're really not clones in the true sense of the word.
Becky

[SickSpeedMonte]

I watched a few. The Camaro was absolutely sick!!

Being a Newb and all here... I had no idea there were all these "celeb's" on this site :lol:

[Bob Johnson]

If I remember right, it was $47K - which wasn't a bad price. They didn't show it, but I tried to get him to let it go for that....
If someone brought you a decent car like that, what would Barry charge to duplicate that car? 50K wouldn't do it I'll bet.

[hotrodgal]

Actually no, Bob it would take anywhere from $80 to $100K to do it - but that's at full retail prices plus labor. And it would take 12 -18 months to get it done.

[Northern Goat]

If you try to clone a car to an original, I think it hurts it much more than if you make a pro-tour/street machine out of it. You're changing the motor, trans, rear, brakes, suspension etc. The bodies aren't different, just the trim and the driveline. If you're changing that already to modify the car what's the difference. ..

If you are trying to sell a pro touring modfied machine why not refer to it specifically as a GTX/GTO clone. I agree with you on not wasting a good original to PT, I just have a problem with people viewing the show and thinking cloning is OK because a "big shot" like Barry does it.

I'm probably going to put a Judge "package" on my 70 GTO, but I will call it a GTO, not a Judge and if I were to sell it, it would be advertised as a clone.

From Hotrodgal's comments it appears that the editors are responsible for this. The same editors that didn't catch the narrator calling it a 71 GTO.

[Bob Johnson]

My least favorite episode, by the way. Or should I say, least favorite car...but then I'm spoiling the surprise. Anyway, guys, watch it and remember it's just TV. And I may get my butt kicked for this, but for all of you who are trying to figure out the cost angle - we did try to get as much product donated as possible - TLC did NOT give us any money to work with, this was all out of our pocket (mine and Barry's, not even the business); but on some of the cars there just wasn't anyone who wanted to play ball, so we took a hard hit (especially on the Camaro). And the numbers are just approximate - we had to keep a list of vendors who gave us product and assign a value to that product, that's where they get the $$ from. And about the wheels - when Chris does the rendering for how the car is going to look (and that's usually right after we've found the car) he sends the design for the wheels over to the company that makes our wheels, so therefore they have minimum 4-5 weeks to produce the wheel - and they always came down to the very last minute - do you guys really think that we waited until the end before ordering a set of custom wheels? Puh-leeze!! If there are any more questions on how we pulled this fiasco off, please let me know - I'll try to answer them as best I can.
a set of one offs for that kind of car and the buyer that buys it at auction is a waste of money in my opinion. Set of Salt Flats or some of the big inch RalleyII repops would work fine..Then all you gotta do is the the offset and get them made.

[Bob Johnson]

Actually no, Bob it would take anywhere from $80 to $100K to do it - but that's at full retail prices plus labor. And it would take 12 -18 months to get it done.
that's what I figured..plus what the car cost. If you liked that car and you wanted one like it, it is a buy at 50K..You didn't answer me on the guy and his wife that tried to buy the Goat. I saw him at Sun Valley when I was there. I think it was him that had a Hemi Coronet Convt. ..represented as the real deal..very suspicious.. a guy there was bragging about his dad stealing it across the block..I told him I doubted he would be bragging once he saw it and the way the serial plate and data plate looked..I noticed that it was bounced back and Silver had it at a later auction..damn thing still brought they money with disclaimers on it..I've seen him on all the Silver auction shows..only problem with buying a car in Portland, it cost me $2500 minimum to get it home..

[hotrodgal]

Hi Bob - I'm sorry, I didn't see where you had asked about Mike and Sandy...they are really nice people, but they always ended up getting outbid by someone. They bring nice cars to the auctions, some sell and some don't, but hey, that's the auction life. And let me say one more time, we did the cars we did the way we did them because of the time frames we had to work with. We tried our best not to compromise on anything, because that's not the way we do things. I apologize again if we offended anyone by doing what we did with some of the cars.
Becky

[bobbaganoosh]

Bobbaganoosh, go back up a few posts and you'll see where I explained all...by the way, thanks for watching!


Sorry...I never learned to read.:fart:

[Bob Johnson]

Hi Bob - I'm sorry, I didn't see where you had asked about Mike and Sandy...they are really nice people, but they always ended up getting outbid by someone. They bring nice cars to the auctions, some sell and some don't, but hey, that's the auction life. And let me say one more time, we did the cars we did the way we did them because of the time frames we had to work with. We tried our best not to compromise on anything, because that's not the way we do things. I apologize again if we offended anyone by doing what we did with some of the cars.
Becky
no need to apologize..you can't make everybody happy..Barry's taste is right up there at the top..most of the criticizers don't have squat anyhow..ask for their credentials the next time one of them whine. Guarantee they haven't won AMBR or Ridler or been in the finals for Goodguys car of the year, on the cover of a decent magazine, etc.

[hotrodgal]

No problem...I miss s***t all the time

[CRUSTY69]

would the le mans really qualify as a "clone"..looked like it was 99% original metal..just the rubber nose...i didnt notice any badges..
and about the show, the editors skip to many things...seems like every episode, they show everybody, pounding the body with chissles, then a minute of sanding, then its off the paint...i know its not really like that, the editors just seem to skip ALOT of the build..

[hotrodgal]

I can't tell you how much gets left out - but the film crew shot an average of 40 - 50 tapes at 40 minutes each for each car. I think our director was pissed at Chris for something and that's why he got so much air time last night...instead of the build. And we would really rather classify our cars as "Super Muscle Cars" - as opposed to clones, 'cause they really aren't in the true sense of the word.
Becky

[Bob Johnson]

I know exactly what you're talking about. When I was captain of the Atlanta team on The Barrett Jackson Car Search, I barely recognized what they were showing..it was twisted around so much..They had an agenda..didn't want Atlanta to win the competition. Tried everything including hooking up with the L/A team and fixing the ending. I told them the rumor of Georgia boys being stupid and living in trailers was greatly exagerated. They found out the hard way..lost their show over it too.

[hotrodgal]

Hey Bob
This might sound weird, but were you at the drag races in Pomona a couple of years ago? Barry and I were there in the Top Eliminator stands and I don't know if it was you or not...but we were talking to a guy who was involved with that show. How weird would that be?

[Bob Johnson]

Hey Bob
This might sound weird, but were you at the drag races in Pomona a couple of years ago? Barry and I were there in the Top Eliminator stands and I don't know if it was you or not...but we were talking to a guy who was involved with that show. How weird would that be?
no it wasn't me..must have been one of the California guys..I met Barry when I was in California and delivered 2 old cars to Eric Giesert
might have seen him @ Pleasanton when my 48 Woodie was in the running for Goodguys Americas Most Beautiful Street Rod in 2002 or 03.

[Clean Cut Creations]

Actually no, Bob it would take anywhere from $80 to $100K to do it - but that's at full retail prices plus labor. And it would take 12 -18 months to get it done.


Then why is it represented that you can make money at an auction selling cars that cost more to build than they sell for? Isn't that the premise of the show? All this does is make somewhat informed couch potatos less informed about our hobby and what cash it takes to build a car like on your show. I now have customers coming into my shop thinking they can build cars and sell them for profit. I now seem like the bad guy when I tell them what it REALLY costs!

[zbugger]

When garage builders are building their cars, they don't usually count labor hours. They only count parts cost. It's a different story when they have a professional shop build the car.

[Clean Cut Creations]

When garage builders are building their cars, they don't usually count labor hours. They only count parts cost. It's a different story when they have a professional shop build the car.

I understand what you are saying but... let me get this straight........The regular average joe can get sponsors to give them parts for free, have a team of "FREE" labor build the car, take it to the auction to sell and do all of this in 4 weeks?
Last time I checked....SRRC was a shop with alot of specialty tools and resources that the regular joe doesn't have.

If a garage builder doesn't count their time into the value of their car that is their loss. I want to buy a new GM, FORD,or DODGE vehicle for the cost of the parts it takes to build one....but that aint gonna happen because they don't want to take a bath in every vehicle they sell. A smart at-home custom builder will count time (to an extent) or they are only cheating themselves in the long run.

I don't buy into the hype and I'm sorry that a slanted veiw of vehicle building is being fed to the show veiwers. They tend to believe EXACTLY what they hear/see. It discredits our hobby and its businesses.

[GIDRDUN]

WOW. Becareful not to give to much away.

The show and the cars were fun to work on. There was many a late nite with Barry and I. Usually until 12:00 or 1:00 in the morning. Then back up and do it again.

I can say it is true that TLC did not give much to start with. But you do have to remember it is TV. SMOKE and MIRRORS.

We did not want to take a true SS Chevelle or Camaro, GTO, GTX , GT Torino, Mach 1 etc and modify it. The true car guys would hate that. So, we did our on thing. Which seem to be working.

I am only sorry that things did not work out with the White's and hope someday to correct what went wrong. We had alot of FUN and built a great friendship so we thought. Someday maybe.

Tim (the go to guy)

[Bob Johnson]

WOW. Becareful not to give to much away.

The show and the cars were fun to work on. There was many a late nite with Barry and I. Usually until 12:00 or 1:00 in the morning. Then back up and do it again.

I can say it is true that TLC did not give much to start with. But you do have to remember it is TV. SMOKE and MIRRORS.

We did not want to take a true SS Chevelle or Camaro, GTO, GTX , GT Torino, Mach 1 etc and modify it. The true car guys would hate that. So, we did our on thing. Which seem to be working.

I am only sorry that things did not work out with the White's and hope someday to correct what went wrong. We had alot of FUN and built a great friendship so we thought. Someday maybe.

Tim (the go to guy)
what are you saying? Your deal didn't work out with the Whites, or TLC won't be doing the show next season? What went wrong that you refer to?

[vanzuuk1]

Thanks Bob, I was just trying to figure out what he meant , I was lost.

[GIDRDUN]

To clear things up. I was the shop foreman and from a buisness stand point things did not work out with Barry. I will just leave it at that. I guess we will just call it BURNOUT due to 90+ hours a week. Stress level was very high as one could imagine. It had nothing to do with TLC. The film crew was GREAT.

I wish them all the best with their show and buisness. They do build "some" of the best cars in the buisness.

[Rick Dorion]

I think everyone did a great job. Last night I watched the episode on the Parnelli Jone's car. Very enjoyable.

[Bertram65]

Did anyone see the show last night with the two Mustangs? be interesting to see how the red one turns out.
The new yellow Mustang was decent but it seemed like all just bolt on stuff that anyone could have done, why did they think they would win an award from Ford at SEMA for that? The other Mustangs they were up against appeared to be really modified.

[Bob Johnson]

To clear things up. I was the shop foreman and from a buisness stand point things did not work out with Barry. I will just leave it at that. I guess we will just call it BURNOUT due to 90+ hours a week. Stress level was very high as one could imagine. It had nothing to do with TLC. The film crew was GREAT.

I wish them all the best with their show and buisness. They do build "some" of the best cars in the buisness.
Nothing unusual there..Alan and crew experienced burnout on the Cuda project. Working toward a unrealistic deadline strains everyone's relationships..If you want to move east and have a lower cost of living, Alan is always looking for good help..He'd love to have a good foreman. I can't imagine working toward a deadline every month.

[wickedridz]

As someone who has had great opportunities to work with as well as for some of the best builders in the industry today it never seems to stop amazing me how when for whatever reason freindships and or partnerships desolve, one of the people involved typically takes the high road and the other well lets just say takes a path less traveled by most. as the saying goes there are always two sides to every story, airing "dirty" laundry in a forum that nobody knows about nor needs to know about is not only unprofesional but also just plain rediculas. people in glass houses should not throw stones. its good advice if you can understand the meaning. this is a site about the show the shop the cars and the parts, i hope that the sour grapes can be left in the trash where they belong and not here where it adds no content or insite into the topics of discussion.

[Elitemusclecars]

That show is all well and cool but has anyone noticed that the same people are bidding on his cars no matter where the aution is?

[MarkM66]

That show is all well and cool but has anyone noticed that the same people are bidding on his cars no matter where the aution is?

It's been addressed.

[Damn True]

I love the way the designer guy says "we're gonna add modern touches" as if he invented the idea of doing so.

[Damn True]

......most of the criticizers don't have squat anyhow..ask for their credentials the next time one of them whine. Guarantee they haven't won AMBR or Ridler or been in the finals for Goodguys car of the year, on the cover of a decent magazine, etc.

All of the above counts for exactly nuthin Bob. A matter of taste is just that. If you dislike carnitas who am I to say you are wrong for having that opinion. One need not graduate from cordon-bleu to decide what they do or do not like to eat. Similarly, one need not win a riddler to decide if they like a car or not. Buying an expensive car makes one no more qualified to comment than a guy who has yet to finish building his own.

[Bob Johnson]

All of the above counts for exactly nuthin Bob. A matter of taste is just that. If you dislike carnitas who am I to say you are wrong for having that opinion. One need not graduate from cordon-bleu to decide what they do or do not like to eat. Similarly, one need not win a riddler to decide if they like a car or not. Buying an expensive car makes one no more qualified to comment than a guy who has yet to finish building his own.
opinions are like as* holes..everyone has one..and 99% of them stink. If I look for an opinion on something I'm doing, believe me I will not go to some jack leg schmuck who hasn't ever had or built anything of note. I will go to someone who has been there and done that. I would presume you would go to someone knowledgeable in your business if you want advice or an opinion. I do think Barry's knowledge of muscle is not as great as his knowledge of hot rods. That's the way Alan Johnson is. But both see the attraction to muscle and are learning fast. It's ridiculous for someone who hasn't ever had anything criticize a quality builders work. Any whiner should have to post all of his past heaps and let the person they're criticizing voice an opinion on their cars.

[Bob Johnson]

That show is all well and cool but has anyone noticed that the same people are bidding on his cars no matter where the aution is?
some of those smaller Silver auctions do not have a great number of bidders. I would have thought the Reno August Auction would have had more players. But it did sell to a new guy. Good money for a 71 Roadrunner/GTX..not a car I would choose to build..but worth what was paid..should have picked a 69 or 70..pay more on the front end and get a whole lot more on the back end. can't scrimp on your starting car..

[19topless69]

Great show, hope it makes another season. I like the blown 69 camaro
the best.

[paul67]

running for just over a week here in the uk on the discovery home and leasure channel better than boyds less bitch more build.

[paul67]

just watched the mustang fastback episode ,was it me or when it was lowered it suffered bumpsteer , if so was it cured before it hit the road or if not how did it handle. As i have about the same amount but not driven my 67 camaro on the road yet.

[dplenzig]

Last Friday I was driving through a small town by my house here in CO and the SMC Roadrunner was sitting on a classic car lot for sale. I stopped and checked it out. Not my favorite body style, But it is a pretty nice car. Kind of weird watching the show and then seeing it a mile from the house on a small car lot.

Daren

[bnickel]

just watched the mustang fastback episode ,was it me or when it was lowered it suffered bumpsteer , if so was it cured before it hit the road or if not how did it handle. As i have about the same amount but not driven my 67 camaro on the road yet.

i think most of that was due to the worthless flaming river rack and pinion rather than the lowering of the car, although i'm sure that added to it as well. the problem with the FR rack is the that tie-rods end up being too short for the mustang chassis because of the end take-off design.

[bnickel]

opinions are like as* holes..everyone has one..and 99% of them stink. If I look for an opinion on something I'm doing, believe me I will not go to some jack leg schmuck who hasn't ever had or built anything of note. I will go to someone who has been there and done that. I would presume you would go to someone knowledgeable in your business if you want advice or an opinion. I do think Barry's knowledge of muscle is not as great as his knowledge of hot rods. That's the way Alan Johnson is. But both see the attraction to muscle and are learning fast. It's ridiculous for someone who hasn't ever had anything criticize a quality builders work. Any whiner should have to post all of his past heaps and let the person they're criticizing voice an opinion on their cars.

Bob, i don't want to start a flame war here but i have yet to see one these super muscle cars that i would describe a super in any way, i mean anyone can build a car with bolt on parts and hire someone to do a snazzy paint job. i also don't want to put down Barry as he does build some of the best customs and hot rods but as far as muscle cars goes i'm not really impressed. if i had the money to buy all those bolt on parts i could do the same thing, but i don't so i have to get creative. i would call your car a super muscle car or practically anything stielow has built and many others out there as well. I do think the show is enertaining though.

[Hartz]

Last Friday I was driving through a small town by my house here in CO and the SMC Roadrunner was sitting on a classic car lot for sale. I stopped and checked it out. Not my favorite body style, But it is a pretty nice car. Kind of weird watching the show and then seeing it a mile from the house on a small car lot.

Daren

So how much were they asking???

[Neil B]

Just a little constructive criticism after watching a few episodes:

1) Reality or not, having the same buyer at all the auctions really detracts from the show.

2) Using the same or similar 'one off' wheel design on every car ruins the individuality of the car. That '69 fastback really needed T/A-inspired wheels.

3) Using novice guest builders, hacked up wiring harnesses, chipped paint, fab work after painting, etc. are all sending the wrong messages (perhaps only to the enthusiast audience)

With that said, I still look forward to each new episode.

[romar 02 SS]

You have to realize they only have 4 weeks to complete these cars. There is no time to be innovative, change body lines, recess bumpers, etc.The best they can do is install someone elses innovative product that has the bugs already worked out.The show really is just about a muscle car build, the only difference is it's in a pro shop and not a garage. Given more time I think the cars would be that much cooler. All in all I like the show. Just my opinion. Larry

[hotrodgal]

Just a little constructive criticism after watching a few episodes:

1) Reality or not, having the same buyer at all the auctions really detracts from the show.

2) Using the same or similar 'one off' wheel design on every car ruins the individuality of the car. That '69 fastback really needed T/A-inspired wheels.

3) Using novice guest builders, hacked up wiring harnesses, chipped paint, fab work after painting, etc. are all sending the wrong messages (perhaps only to the enthusiast audience)

With that said, I still look forward to each new episode.

Neil, 1)we really don't have control over who goes to what auction...just so happens that there are a few guys who have the money and the means to travel the auction circuit...Ardell being one of them...and he happens to like our cars (and also his 15 minutes of fame being on TV, if you ask me). The production company actually asked us to discourage him from buying any more of the cars after he bought the Camaro...they didn't want people to think exactly what you're thinking. Hopefully, there will be more people to bid at future auctions so you won't see the same guys buying.
2)OK, I'm looking at our catalog with the wheels we used on the cars...they're all different. And the gold centers were supposed to be "trans am" oh well
3)wish we could get professional volunteers who could hammer these cars out...but who really can take 4 weeks off work? And I knew the bit with the wire harness would merit a comment or two...we actually only used one piece of that...not the whole thing. As for the chipped paint, and fab work after painting...that's what happens when you're forced to cram a 12 month build into 4 weeks...

And thanks for continuing to watch!!!

[restomodbird69]

everyone is an arm chair quarterback but yall got the show so just keep on keepin on.

[Madspeed]

Why dont they let you really show your tallants and build somthing awsome and inspiring? Do a more long term build, Lets see some twin turbo'd awd manual trans handcrafted masterpiece =)

What part of that harness was used? I thought I had seen the Instrument cluster piece used and tail lamp sockets.


Out of curiosity why are all the cars automatics?

Bahh I still enjoy the show annyways In the words of Mike Tyson, "I take my hand off to you"

[ubervic]

Neil, 1)we really don't have control over who goes to what auction...just so happens that there are a few guys who have the money and the means to travel the auction circuit...Ardell being one of them...and he happens to like our cars (and also his 15 minutes of fame being on TV, if you ask me). The production company actually asked us to discourage him from buying any more of the cars after he bought the Camaro...they didn't want people to think exactly what you're thinking. Hopefully, there will be more people to bid at future auctions so you won't see the same guys buying.
2)OK, I'm looking at our catalog with the wheels we used on the cars...they're all different. And the gold centers were supposed to be "trans am" oh well
3)wish we could get professional volunteers who could hammer these cars out...but who really can take 4 weeks off work? And I knew the bit with the wire harness would merit a comment or two...we actually only used one piece of that...not the whole thing. As for the chipped paint, and fab work after painting...that's what happens when you're forced to cram a 12 month build into 4 weeks...

And thanks for continuing to watch!!!

1) I kind of figured as much - the heavy fellow and the other couple, fans of the cars as well as liking the fact they're on tv.

2) IMHO, the wheels on the Mustang were fine. My gf, who's watched all the shows with me, and isn't much into cars commented "Now that's one car I'd drive." My favorite where the wheels on the "GTO."

3) You're not pre-selling these cars for lots of $$$ (like certain other shows). If the build quality on these cars isn't that great, then I guess nobody will bid much for them at auction.

4) (Okay, so there wasn't a #4, but I decided to add a few more cents) People complaining and bitching about other people on tv, I don't care to watch - it's been done before. I'm more interested in seeing the development of the design, the actual building of the car, and the business of building them. If the episodes were edited to show builds overlapping, just how much stuff was going on at one time, all of that stress, I think that would give you enough "conflict."

Overall, it's a good show. I tivo and watch all of them.

[Neil B]

OK, I'm looking at our catalog with the wheels we used on the cars...they're all different. And the gold centers were supposed to be "trans am" oh well


Yes, they are different, but they all look basically the same.

Camaro wheel...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2006/05/camarowheel-1.jpg

GTO wheel...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2006/05/gtowheel-1.jpg

'05 and '69 Mustang wheel...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2006/05/05mustangwheel-1.jpg

And the GTX wheel was very similar.

I love the show and I just want to be able to look forward to a 'fresh' new design on each car. Keep up the good work and thanks for responding - it's rare to get feedback from the entertainment industry.

[kennyd]

As someone who has had great opportunities to work with as well as for some of the best builders in the industry today it never seems to stop amazing me how when for whatever reason freindships and or partnerships desolve, one of the people involved typically takes the high road and the other well lets just say takes a path less traveled by most. as the saying goes there are always two sides to every story, airing "dirty" laundry in a forum that nobody knows about nor needs to know about is not only unprofesional but also just plain rediculas. people in glass houses should not throw stones. its good advice if you can understand the meaning. this is a site about the show the shop the cars and the parts, i hope that the sour grapes can be left in the trash where they belong and not here where it adds no content or insite into the topics of discussion.

i assume this is barry , good point to make .
and if it is barry ... great job , some of us less noticed builders look up to shops like yours .
stay around and talk .

[Bob Johnson]

It's impossible to do a one off custom car and not expect to lose your as*..You will have lot of guys and big companys building street machines and rods with nothing but bolt on stuff, and they think they are on par with handbuilt one off custom piece cars...stranger yet, Jon Q. public just doesn't see past a slick paint job. The idea is to build a car and make money on it at auction. If you put Barry's labor rate into the build cost, it ain't happening and it isn't going to happen consistently with him or anyone else.

[Travis B]

wow....have I missed out on this thread, I dont have a whole lot add other than I think it is absolutly hilarious that people that have no car building experience start trash talking builders.....most people on here are just armchair quaterbacks anyway...just a bunch of talk and most will never actually finish there car!

[provintage]

I waunder how the sponsors feel. They give them parts and they say they pay for them? Also, What happened to the money that was going to charity? Maybe the "White Charity" ? When is the Nova going to air?

[wickedridz]

to kennyd: wickedridz is not "barry" wickedridz is just lucky enough to work for barry. the statement that i posted was a responce to what a now "banned" person was saying/ attempting to take credit for. just a small suttle way to set the record straight on my part.

[toxicz28]

to kennyd: wickedridz is not "barry" wickedridz is just lucky enough to work for barry. the statement that i posted was a responce to what a now "banned" person was saying/ attempting to take credit for. just a small suttle way to set the record straight on my part.

What exactly was this co-called "banned" person saying? I've read his posts, and they seem proffesional and courteous. As well as a bit remorseful that it didn't work out. He seemed to not foster any ill will towards the White's, in fact he wished them luck with both the business and show. He then went a step further and complimented the quality of work that is performed there. In case you missed that post, I quoted it below for you.
One more question. Why do you refer to yourself in the third person? It's cute when you're two years old, but from an adult......


To clear things up. I was the shop foreman and from a buisness stand point things did not work out with Barry. I will just leave it at that. I guess we will just call it BURNOUT due to 90+ hours a week. Stress level was very high as one could imagine. It had nothing to do with TLC. The film crew was GREAT.

I wish them all the best with their show and buisness. They do build "some" of the best cars in the buisness.

[Radlark]

"Can't we all just get along!"

I swear if I am need of a good laugh this website never let's down!! Thanks guys!

[GIDRDUN]

Wickedridz works for Barry? Be an adult. The so called "banned" person is ME. I wish the Whites nothing but good will. You only know what you here from them and then you take it and run with it. Childish in my book. But just my opinion. They do build some nice cars but so does everyone else. Time for something new.

[GIDRDUN]

Toxicz28, Thanks for the comments. I have been in this field for 27 years and am building 14 cars as we speak and you never know who you might have to deal with again so I try like h--l not to bad mouth anyone. It was truly a great experience to work on the show and with a person like Barry. There was much learned and tought as well. Maybe time will heal all. Until then I do wish them all the best. As the old saying goes, It takes a real man to face the issues, not turn away.

[provintage]

I agree Radlark, But GIDRDUN is a professional with many years of experience. I feel it is his way to possibly vent. He never said anything bad toward them. The people that work for him are young and can become childish with their remarks. For Gods sake say what you mean and don't hide behind words. Maybe Barry ( not his wife ) should respond to his post.

[Bob Johnson]

I agree Radlark, But GIDRDUN is a professional with many years of experience. I feel it is his way to possibly vent. He never said anything bad toward them. The people that work for him are young and can become childish with their remarks. For Gods sake say what you mean and don't hide behind words. Maybe Barry ( not his wife ) should respond to his post.
from what I've read, it needs no response. No one or nothing was badmouthed. You work 90 hours a week with deadlines and people get tense and it strains relationships. This circumstance is not unusual and doesn't need airing here or anywhere. Both the Whites and Gidrdun seen like hard working professional people. Gossip will not mend the strain. Let a sleeping dog lie..All this is only reopening a wound that's trying to heal

[GIDRDUN]

Thank you Bob. I agree.

[provintage]

Just noticed on supermusclecar.com that they have it setup for people to make donations. I can't believe this. To me this is stooping pretty low.

[TonyL]

Just noticed on supermusclecar.com that they have it setup for people to make donations.

You mean at the top of their message board?

Thats standard EZboard. Every EZboard has that. Even this one used to. (we used to use EZboard before Vbulletin) They simply didn't want to drop coin on a board this major is all.

[Matt]

I'll have to Tivo this... been really busy sadly.

I gotta say for this being the PT.com equivalent of a sh*t fest, it's still the most civil message board I've ever seen.

[moparguy]

Well I have watched the show and it always cool to see old muscle cars being built and put back on the road no matter who is on the show it could be puppets for all I care, but for me it seems the shop owner seems alot like Boyd in his attitude about employees and how things get done. Just my observation. But its a cool show because of the cars not the people as there is not really any ground breaking technical stuff going on or innovation. Cool show.

[hotrodgal]

I waunder how the sponsors feel. They give them parts and they say they pay for them? Also, What happened to the money that was going to charity? Maybe the "White Charity" ? When is the Nova going to air?

Hi Provintage...the sponsors know exactly what is going on with the show..the gals at the production company are in contact with them constantly. And where did you get info about the proceeds going to charity? I will admit it was a thought at the beginning, but nothing was ever confirmed and as it turned out, all of the "profits" went back into the next car on the list. If you'd like to talk to our accountant about how much we actually got to keep, I'd be glad to give you his number. And check your TLC listing for show airdates.

[BRIAN]

Way too much reading here for me. Honestly the show's concept is not the greatest as those smaller auctions ust do not always bring the money and I think most are interested in the build not the sale. Sort of like the whole trick with Overhaulin. Would love to see more build footage. Nobody is too smart to learn something or pick up a trick or two.

The same bidder also bothered me but he is probably the smartest of all as from what I understand you guys can't sell at B Jackson. Guarantee they will show up there and sell for a whole lot more.

Guys have to understand money dictates build quality plain and simple. I agree I wouldn't like to see some of the practices done on the big buck stuff but being where Barry is I am sure he has that all worked out. You guys build some nice stuff when the money is there.

Better than watching ER or something with the wife. Drop the auction and keep them coming.

[MrQuick]

We're watchin tonigh show as I tpe. That 3rd gen shop car is BOSS!! Y'all gotta get a picture of him driving by. good times

[Tom K]

Hmm, so that's what my Fairlane/Torino would like like if I ever finished it. Same body style and color.