You guys can have California

[ProdigyCustoms]

This is a freakin joke, LOL! If they did that here, every freakin Honda and Eclipse in Florida would be removed from the streets. Wait, I am thinking about this a bit more...........

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NCyMkB0uMeg

Here, if you are a adult, and I mean a 25+ year old adult, not a 18 year old adult, and your driving a 69 Camaro or the likes, you can pretty much get away with anything on Saturday night. Loud exhaust, blowers over the roof blocking vision, Wheelie bars, slicks, etc. As long as you are not acting like a idiot you are OK. but if they want to bust your ass, a connected nitorus bottle will be a pretty major offense.

Now, if you leave a stoplight, on the NOS, with a cop at your bumper, leaving him in a black cloud,....... he will try to write you a ticket for driving with your front tires off the ground! Amoung other things. Don't ask me how I know. Hey, it was 3:00AM, Ihow the hell was I to know he was there? You just know your f__ked when he rolls the little wheel on the wheelie bar with his foot as he appoaches the car door, LOL!

[Steve68]

In my best Officer Shmedly voice " this is illegal, this is illegal", open the hood ya right!!! What a bunch of crap!! paint everything black!!

[ilovefirstgens]

Its bs like that which is why i dont own a new car!

I love that theyre saying its all to cut down on street racing, wonder if they would let you go with a scca liscence...

[Samckitt]

I agree that is Fcuked up. How come there are so many aftermarket automotive companies in CA when they have such strict laws like this? I don't get it. Because the weather I guess....
Scot

[Bigblue73]

Thats what the guy desires for driving a Honda....The cop clues are the lowered suspension, wheels and "Large" exhaust tip. I thought Barney lived in the south.

That Honda was anywhere from new...How far does California go back for inspections?

[camcojb]

Thats what the guy desires for driving a Honda....The cop clues are the lowered suspension, wheels and "Large" exhaust tip. I thought Barney lived in the south.

That Honda was anywhere from new...How far does California go back for inspections?


They go back to 75; earlier doesn't get inspected. However, it is still illegal to remove any smog equipment from the earlier cars. So that scenario could play out with your 73 Challenger or a 69 Camaro also. For now they are targeting the import guys, but they have the right to do it to others. It's bringing in a lot of revenue and apparently has curbed street racing some according to their figures, so look for it to be adapted in other states. Many follow California's lead, especially if there's money to be made.

Jody

[evo69]

Isn't that profiling! I didn't think that was politically correct!:confused:

[EFI69Cam]

They go back to 75; earlier doesn't get inspected. However, it is still illegal to remove any smog equipment from the earlier cars. So that scenario could play out with your 73 Challenger or a 69 Camaro also. For now they are targeting the import guys, but they have the right to do it to others. It's bringing in a lot of revenue and apparently has curbed street racing some according to their figures, so look for it to be adapted in other states. Many follow California's lead, especially if there's money to be made.

Jody


Does Cali go by the year of the engine for engine swaps? If you install an LS1 in an early car, do you have to have all the equipment like cats?
In Colorado its the year of the car.
This is counter productive as even a catless efi LS1 would run cleaner than any 60s or 70s engine emissions equipped or not.

[camcojb]

Does Cali go by the year of the engine for engine swaps? If you install an LS1 in an early car, do you have to have all the equipment like cats?
In Colorado its the year of the car.
This is counter productive as even a catless efi LS1 would run cleaner than any 60s or 70s engine emissions equipped or not.

California is year of the engine, and the engine cannot be older than the car. So it would need full smog equipment to do an LS1 swap into a muscle car.

Jody

[rockdogz]

What if you plan (like I do) on running a new crate motor? What emissions equipment would need to be used with it?

[Steve68]

Jody's right revenue!!!!! is big for EVERY state, and remember trends start west and move east, Damn didn't everybody start east and move west, somethings wrong here!!

If the parts you install have a CARB number then there legal right?

I know here in O-town they formed a task force to curb street racing, but like Frank said diving a older/classic/muscle car they really don't bother you unless your acting like a SPAZZZ doing wheelies on the street, know what I mean?? :hammer:

[camcojb]

What if you plan (like I do) on running a new crate motor? What emissions equipment would need to be used with it?

It would depend on the engine I guess. If it's a new Gen 1 small block to be legal it would need all the factory smog for the 69 installed like the smog pump (if equipped), hot air tube to air cleaner, etc. I am not sure how they would handle a Gen 2 or 3 crate motor install, probably send you through the referee. I have also seen some of the standard crate motors listed as "not legal for sale or use in California on a pollution-controlled vehicle".

And any aftermarket parts need a carb EO# to be legal, like an intake, headers, etc. Otherwise they are considered illegal on a pollution-controlled motor vehicle, which the 69 Camaro was.

Jody

[EFI69Cam]

California is year of the engine, and the engine cannot be older than the car. So it would need full smog equipment to do an LS1 swap into a muscle car.

Jody


I hope CO does not go that way. In researching a 99 Vortec 454 swap into my 91 Blazer, I was told to make sure the truck had all its 91 vintage equipment installed. That means I don't need the 99's AIR pump.

69 model year stuff is smogged once to old standards, after that you get your collectors tags and never see a smog station again.

[camcojb]

I hope CO does not go that way. In researching a 99 Vortec 454 swap into my 91 Blazer, I was told to make sure the truck had all its 91 vintage equipment installed. That means I don't need the 99's AIR pump.

69 model year stuff is smogged once to old standards, after that you get your collectors tags and never see a smog station again.

69's here aren't smogged at all; but to remain "legal" they have to retain all the correct smog equipment. With the new law allowing them to open your hood this may be a concern. I have not heard of anyone in a muscle car having an issue yet, seems they are targeting the imports at this time.

Jody

[rob07002]

Maybe CA politicains and the like should be more concerned with illegal aliens killing cops and then running back across the border.

Freakin Sad!

[KrisHorton]

Man, that video pissed me off...

I can see how the *concept* of this law is good...but the *concept* of Communism didn't sound bad on paper either...

I've been lucky so far, I live in Southern CA and have pulled up next to many cops in my Mustang, blower whining, exhaust rumbling, and they just glance at it and carry on with their day. I know I might just be lucky, but that's my experience so far. The only two things on my car that might not be technically legal are the lack of a front plate and my springs. The car is lowered 1.5 inches and I can't fit a plate onto the custom front fascia very easily. I just wonder what else they'd try to nail me for. I've got a ProCharger, but there is a CARB number stamped right on the blower, so I think I'm in the clear there. I do tend to drive pretty conservatively in town, but I have a tendency to show off and rip from light to light, but I never go out to the street races or anything, so I'm probably not as much of a target as the younger kids in piece of crap Hondas and Acuras with cut springs and clear taillights.

Kris

[Steve1968LS2]

In a logical world all that would matter would be the sniffer test.. if you pass the sniffer then they shouldn't give a crap what's under your hood...

Then again, who ever said we live in a logical world.. lol

[jeffandre]

In a logical world all that would matter would be the sniffer test.. if you pass the sniffer then they shouldn't give a crap what's under your hood...

Then again, who ever said we live in a logical world.. lol

Exactly what I have said since the 70's. If you live in a state where pollution can damage a valley area (where it would hang for days, increasing the toxins in the air, and decreasing the natural ability for the area to recover), expect to see the environmental restrictions continue to increase!

[Gonzostyle]

It is unfortunate that the police feel this is the best solution. This doesn't solve any problems. The kids are still going to race. So they get a ticket for modified parts. I am sure most of them are keeping the stock parts around now, so it is just a quick swap, get an inspection, then put the modified parts back on.
Personally I think a legal venue that promoted racing in a controlled enviornment would be a much better solution. I know it did a lot for me growing up. I also think for the muscle car people this will not be too much of an issue, there are far fewer kids with muscle cars than there are with modified Hondas.

-Jeremie

[RaceMan]

thats total BULL S*$#! what if changing the timing helped the polution control would that still be illegal or if you wanted better fuel econemy , I hope that S*#$! doesn't get out here on the east coast , I can't believe that :barf:

[rocketman]

it makes wonder how many of the rod builders out there actually correctlly title there cars?most states when going for a special const title you dont have to meet the smog laws.

[6'9"Witha69]

Been there, done that! It is usually for imports though. I have been pulled over for Speeding, failure to signal, and unsafe turning movement and only been issued a ticket for not having my proof of insurance and tinted front windows. I have never been asked to open my hood. I know import guysd who have had to open up!

In CA the only time a car like my Camaro is smogged is during transfer of ownership. And since that was almost 9 years ago I don't that that applies anymore. Jody is right, the engine must be newer than the chassis. I have never heard that the engine is what gets smogged. Everything is dictated by the chassis. The smog sticker is on the car. My buddy pulled his 5.3 and put in an 8.1. He dialed it down for smog and passed. They just looked under hood to see everything was connected properly. If you don't tell them it is different most won't be able to tell.

[landyacht67]

In a logical world all that would matter would be the sniffer test.. if you pass the sniffer then they shouldn't give a crap what's under your hood...

Then again, who ever said we live in a logical world.. lol

I never thought I'd be happy about AirCare (our emmision test), but thats how it is here. If you pass, you pass. If you fail, you fail. They never even look under the hood. You can't pull a cat if the vehicle is newer than 10 years though. As far as other modifications go, as long as you have suspension travel, and nothing hangs lower than the rim you're usually alright.

Some cops are diks though. my friend got pulled over once because - "your wheels are too shiny". and he got a vehicle inspection. That was the last time he ever drove his Honda, then he went back to Mustangs.


Julian

[chicane67]

My best friend is an LEO in San Diego. He gives me updates to this kinda crap all the time. Their major reasoning in San Diego is really to cut down on the little bit*hes that have fu*ked it up for the rest of us.

Back in the middle 80's, we even had cops at the big end that would use their turn-signal to signify which lane won....... and this would eventually go until 4-5 in the morning. There were even LEO's that would bring their own cars out and run with the big kids...

****The following might not be PC (I am not prejudice, I hate everyone equally)****

Then came the import scene. The Asian influence (especially in San Diego) and their cool guy gangland attitude. Always pack-in their 9, beating each other into their cool guy gangs (which made national television) and their lack of respect to anyone that wasn't Asian or drove an import for any reason. We even had a few people shot at the scene because the little bit*h lost a heads up race...... and didn't like it.

There for awhile, the cops wouldn't even look at the American muscle, old or late model. This was due to the fact that we were looked at as being considerate, tactful and for the most part, more intelligent drivers. For example, we didn't send a three to four wide pack to race down a street and then send our buddy with a turbo'd car to do a run down/catch up just to prove the a NA four cylinder was S L O W...... or actually race back to the little end while others were staging. Even the "fast" import guys hung out with the V8 big boys....... not just because they were actually fast, but displayed intelligence and had showed respect for their fellow brothers with wrenches.

In the end, California is just fed up with the "Generation Looser" mentality that these kids are displaying. These kids......... all drive imports. So how to kill the problem (and to rake in the moo-la as a revenue generator) is to crack down on the real problem.

Gonzo is correct...... even if we have a legal venue (which we do in San Diego and in Pomona) there is still going to be street racing.

But dont think this is just related to California alone. (It is a fact that cops in Florida are just plain STOOOOOPID.....as are most of the drivers there..... stooooopid tailgating *tard*s. And in the rain no less.)

But the word is, if its works in California.... it will work in the other states as well. Which if you read into this, means dont drive an import.

[KrisHorton]

Which if you read into this, means dont drive an import.

Man, if only more stories had that kind of moral... :bananna2:

There's a lot of truth in what Tom just said. It all comes down to the mentality of the drivers. I'm sure even the police see that any kid can go to Pep Boys and buy a chrome "intake" and a giant muffler, go home, screw them on, and they think "Voila, instant racecar!" I see sooooo many around here (Pomona, Industry, Chino, West Covina, Azusa, etc.) that are beat to hell and have body kits dangling off of their cars (recently saw one with a front fascia taped on and about to fall off...) with cut springs riding so hard the car looks like it's about to rattle itself apart.

When a cop sees a well-kept muscle car (or even a clean late-model) he won't think "Ooh he must street race and drive like a jacka$$" no matter how beastly it sounds or low it sits. They'll think that the car has a lot of work and effort into it, done by someone who probably knows what they're doing.

Kris

[EFI69Cam]

But the word is, if its works in California.... it will work in the other states as well. Which if you read into this, means dont drive an import.


Preach on. :worship:

[Blown353]

100% correct on the profiling thing, and Chicane hit it right on the money as to why they're doing it. It's the attitudes and driving "style" which the majority of the owners of "that kind of car" seem to have.

Case in point:

A few months ago, I *accidentally* did a rolling 50mph burnout in the Chevelle past a Highway Patrol. He looked and heard, but didn't seem to care!

However last week I got pulled over in my Subaru STI. I wasn't speeding, wasn't doing anything stupid, I got pulled over for having no front license plate. How lame is that? The officer was most likely profiling and pulled over "the car with the big wing." Didn't have to pop my hood or anything, but I know why he pulled me over.

Mind you, I've never had front plates on any of my other daily drivers for the last 10 years (the Chevelle and my '87 Vette) and nothing was ever mentioned about not having the front plates even if I was pulled over.

As Tom said, it's just not the fact they're "ricers" it's the fact that most have the "ricer mentality" and drive like it too.

The cop that pulled me over in the STI was a very nice guy and I could tell by the look on his face when he finally got up to the window and looked in I wasn't the kind of driver he was expecting.

I still wonder if he would have asked me to pop the hood had I not painted my new Borla exhaust black. Big shiny mufflers on the back of an import are cop-callers. Flat black ones not so much. :smoke:

Troy

[camcojb]

thats total BULL S*$#! what if changing the timing helped the polution control would that still be illegal or if you wanted better fuel econemy , I hope that S*#$! doesn't get out here on the east coast , I can't believe that :barf:


In the old days when we still had to smog the earlier cars they used to have a nox kit that had to be installed, in my case on a 65 Chevelle. It basically was a sticker for the underhood area and a plug for the vacuum advance; cost was $20-$25. So even though it killed the performance and mileage it made it smog legal. Of course right after smog everyone took them off. I was reminded of that by looking under the hood of my new 67 Chevelle project and seeing the sticker.

Jody

[CRCRFT78]

I think that its BS. There are alot more important things to take care of as LEOs. But hey, they've got to make their money somehow. Everyone has good points though. It seems no matter what you do to a musclecar they just don't call the attention imports do. Unless your acting stupid in it. Imports definatley do just about everything they can to cause the attention. Stickers, dirt bike exhuast, bouncing all over the road, wings bigger the a 727. Haven't they ever heard of a "sleeper". About the engine swaps. I definately need to look into that. My Malibu (78) passed smog without any of the LT1 (96) smog equipment on it from the donor car and it wasn't an issue. Where can I get the information regarding the engine swaps and the criteria you have to meet?

[ilovefirstgens]

Mind you, I've never had front plates on any of my other daily drivers for the last 10 years (the Chevelle and my '87 Vette) and nothing was ever mentioned about not having the front plates even if I was pulled over.


WTF!

in the less than 2 months that i drove my car without a front plate i got pulled over 4 times!!! never got a ticket for it, oh and the car didnt have seatbelts in it either....

I think they were just bored though

[6'9"Witha69]

in the less than 2 months that i drove my car without a front plate i got pulled over 4 times!!! never got a ticket for it, oh and the car didnt have seatbelts in it either.... Did you tell em the bracket was on back order? That's what I have done. Of course I only ever get snagged for it going thru old town Pasadena.

[CarlC]

Did you tell em the bracket was on back order? That's what I have done. Of course I only ever get snagged for it going thru old town Pasadena.

Doing a burnout in front of The Cheesecake Factory on Saturday night? That place is crazy busy on the weekends.

Age makes a differance, both for cars and people.

[ilovefirstgens]

Did you tell em the bracket was on back order? That's what I have done. Of course I only ever get snagged for it going thru old town Pasadena.

Haha yep 3 times it was already ordered and hadnt come yet, and one time i had to do more fitting to get it to work (i showed him the big chunks of body filler you could see from where i was trying to put those plastic retainer dealeys in.

Also what would my situation be with my ls1 being in a 68.... i was under the impression that we were more or less above the law when it came to this kind of stuff, maybe its just a good excuse to do some crazy stuff to the ls1 to make it look old or just too cool for them to write me up on haha.

Also as far as LEOs, the car does get their attention but I give em a smile and a wave, figure theyl remember that when they catch me doin somethin stupid haha

[67RScamaroVette]

Its bs like that which is why i dont own a new car! ...

exactly. :bsjerk:

[67RScamaroVette]

Camco- You're right. Ahem..

"
The basic intent of the California engine change laws is that when you do an engine swap, the new engine/transmission cannot pollute more than the original engine/transmission. This means the newly installed engine must be the same year (or newer) as the vehicle, and all emissions controls on the newly installed engine must be installed and functional. Also, you can't put a heavy-duty truck engine (over 6000 lb GVW) into an S-10 Truck because heavy-duty truck engines have less stringent emissions limits than light duty trucks."

that's such a load of BS.. I know of a few people who havent had their engine compartments looked at twice, so I figured as long as it was cleaner than before, it would be fine. Hope they dont notice my lack of EGR, AIR, Cats, race headers, intake, breathers, "race" mufflers, lowered suspension, ported Tb, and God forbid I paint my intake. :here!: Damn gestapo government.

[aonghus]

When my car was running, I ran it with open headers for about 4 months.

I got thumbs up from the local police.

Friend who has a honda, gets pulled over just about anywhere he goes.

Just don't drive like an idiot, and you'll be fine. I've had cops ask me to rev it, but I don't burnout through the stoplights.... lol