View Full Version : Motor/trans angle?
jasonz28camaro
02-25-2019, 05:37 PM
I’m in the process of modifying my transmission crossmember on my 68 camaro for my swap. I’m using my stock front subframe and the car is currently empty except the motor/trans and rear suspension; no front sheet metal installed. With the car sitting up high with the lack of weight what would i use to help get a desired angle on the motor/trans? At this time I’m only worried about the motor/trans angle, not the entire/final driveline angle. Would i use the subframe as a zero degree reference? By the way the car is sitting on all four tires.
c4racer2
02-25-2019, 08:05 PM
I think you can only do it with the motor in the car.
jasonz28camaro
02-25-2019, 08:33 PM
Motor is in the car but no interior or front sheet metal. Also going from big block to GEN V LT aluminum so there’s that difference too.
Shawn0331
02-26-2019, 10:26 AM
Unless you're dropping the ride height by a lot Just match the trans to the Diff angle. weather or not the front is up higher than the rest or vise versa it dont matter because those angles are going to change depending on ride height. But if you are dropping your ride height drastically to the point where it is going to change your pinion angle then you need to get the vehicle level, jack the rear end up and all that jaz.
jasonz28camaro
02-26-2019, 01:54 PM
What’s a good starting angle on the trans? I still Need to set the pinion but i need To build the trans crossmember first. The rear will need to have the lowers trimmed down some and i plan on doing that later on.
c4racer2
02-26-2019, 04:52 PM
Carb motors like to be as close to zero as possible for best metering. Efi doesn’t matter as much. But I would still say zero is your target on the motor - not sure if trans angles at all. Seems like it doesn’t.
Craig510
02-26-2019, 06:22 PM
Take your rear springs out and mock it up at ride height. Otherwise it will just be a guess. I like to push the tans up as high as possible but headers and driveshaft clearance needs to be considered. 2-3 degrees down typically works but needs to be verified.
jasonz28camaro
02-26-2019, 07:58 PM
Rear is at rideheight, just need to adjust pinion angle more, it’s a Ridetech 4-link. I’ll shoot for 2 degrees and leave a little room for maybe 1-2 more dregrees worth of shimming or so. Thanks for the replies!
c4racer2
02-26-2019, 09:53 PM
What trans ?
I’m about ready to mock up a new T56 install myself.
Shawn0331
02-27-2019, 04:28 AM
Depending on what trans you are running getting it at zero degrees is probably going to require some tunnel fab. Just make sure the car is level now that you are doing this because you could think you need to cut trans tunnel to get at 0 degrees but really its just because the rear of the car is lower. Jack the trans up as far as you can go and see what angle it at then match your pinion to it.
I’m in the process of modifying my transmission crossmember on my 68 camaro for my swap. I’m using my stock front subframe and the car is currently empty except the motor/trans and rear suspension; no front sheet metal installed. With the car sitting up high with the lack of weight what would i use to help get a desired angle on the motor/trans? At this time I’m only worried about the motor/trans angle, not the entire/final driveline angle. Would i use the subframe as a zero degree reference? By the way the car is sitting on all four tires.
Here is the way I have found the simplest over the last 40 years...
1. Mock up the car so the rocker panels are level at whatever ride height is convenient to work on it/under it. Full weight, no weight, suspension under it or not, doesn't matter. Make the rocker panels level front to back. BTW...make sure the body mounts/subframe mounts are new or in perfect shape.
2. Install the engine/trans so it is 2 degrees tail down. Not 1 degree, not 3 degrees..certainly not 6 degrees. 2 degrees. If this means cutting out the trans hump/tunnel, go get the Sawzall.
3. Fabricate whatever engine/trans mounts necessary to mount those components.
4. Now when you install your suspension AND the suspension is mocked up at its intended ride height, set the pinion angle at 2 degrees UP.
5. You're done.
c4racer2
03-01-2019, 07:59 AM
related question - whats the best measuring device? I downloaded the Tremec Toolbox app which has an angle finder - is this acurate enough using an iPhone 7?
c4racer2
03-01-2019, 09:26 AM
Also - I'm working out my trans mount without the motor in the car with the car up on 18" wheel stands and a trans jack. At least to get the tunnel clearances cut out and initial mock up. Crank centerline is even with motor mounts - so that's easy to figure out where input needs to be. Trans face is 20" back from the motor mount - so that location is easy to figure out. I have the car sitting at 2deg neg, so I'll mock up trans in the 2-4deg range just to check for clearances and location of trans mount. I'm using a SpeedTech mount for a second gen Camaro. First thing is figuring out how much tunnel needs to come out. My motor mounts are lowered 1/2" and trans is the Magnum and so far doesn't look like too massive of a hole. But big enough that a tunnel replacement is going in - also using the speedtech part there.
related question - whats the best measuring device? I downloaded the Tremec Toolbox app which has an angle finder - is this acurate enough using an iPhone 7?
iPhone level should be fine. I use a digital level from Home Depot $35.
- - - Updated - - -
Also - I'm working out my trans mount without the motor in the car with the car up on 18" wheel stands and a trans jack. At least to get the tunnel clearances cut out and initial mock up. Crank centerline is even with motor mounts - so that's easy to figure out where input needs to be. Trans face is 20" back from the motor mount - so that location is easy to figure out. I have the car sitting at 2deg neg, so I'll mock up trans in the 2-4deg range just to check for clearances and location of trans mount. I'm using a SpeedTech mount for a second gen Camaro. First thing is figuring out how much tunnel needs to come out. My motor mounts are lowered 1/2" and trans is the Magnum and so far doesn't look like too massive of a hole. But big enough that a tunnel replacement is going in - also using the speedtech part there.
Be careful...lots of opportunities to mis-measure. Much better to use a dummy block and trans case.
jasonz28camaro
03-01-2019, 12:01 PM
I got it at 2 degrees and hacked up my stock crossmember to make it work. I have Plenty of room to go up and it down with the trans at this point. I will go back and possibly stiffen the corssmember up a bit and remove some extra material so it goes in easier. Has great ground clearance too.
It’s a 10speed for the guy asking.
The TREMEC app works decently. I could not find my level gauge that’s more style mechanical.
Heres a link to my build if you want to know more about the car. https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/1909325-68-camaro-build-gen-v-swap.html
Heres some pics with it mocked up and then installed minus the trans mount bolts.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/D9E8E89467A441C5BCAC62493E6F18F6_zpsmvxf-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/D9E8E894-67A4-41C5-BCAC-62493E6F18F6_zpsmvxfft1z.jpeg.html)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/C2BA2D1D0FA048AA8232907391A2C3FA_zpsncqi-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/C2BA2D1D-0FA0-48AA-8232-907391A2C3FA_zpsncqiwhfm.jpeg.html)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/CA66909F6B89446CA699BEC6E81AA7CF_zpsdpw6-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/CA66909F-6B89-446C-A699-BEC6E81AA7CF_zpsdpw6c6f1.jpeg.html)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/BC51EBF056E84EAC9678C2DC2F956691_zpskqbv-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/BC51EBF0-56E8-4EAC-9678-C2DC2F956691_zpskqbvehh1.jpeg.html)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/FCE8C16E43DE476298DF10E58356C34E_zpsg3lj-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/FCE8C16E-43DE-4762-98DF-10E58356C34E_zpsg3ljdnxl.jpeg.html)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/03/E0FF2575201A4E4494B2C55A9A4B42A4_zps5zh3-1.jpeg (http://s151.photobucket.com/user/jasonz28camaro95/media/E0FF2575-201A-4E44-94B2-C55A9A4B42A4_zps5zh3mhxz.jpeg.html)
c4racer2
03-01-2019, 12:31 PM
iPhone level should be fine. I use a digital level from Home Depot $35.
- - - Updated - - -
Be careful...lots of opportunities to mis-measure. Much better to use a dummy block and trans case.
I am only using this set-up to determine how much of the stock tunnel to remove. And I have removed more than is needed - so no issue there. I am not building a trans mount - I am using a SpeetTech mount. I will get that installed and see if the trans fits where I expect it to. And then I'll be ready to just do a final install with the motor. Just easier than dropping the motor in just for clearancing the tunnel. It's not exactly a precision job!
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