Bare minimum for an LS swap?

[T/A Addict]

I haven't scored a replacement motor for the ill Chevy 350 that is currently in my '69 Firebird and haven't set my mind yet on type of replacement - another cheap used Chevy 350 - a Poncho 350,400,455 - or my first LS swap. My main objective is just to get it running this spring as cheap and as comfortably as possible to enjoy while I finish my other project.

With that being said if I can pick up a complete 5.3 with harness, ecm and accessories what are some of the items at a minimum that I would be looking at having to purchase to complete the process? I want to use the info to compare costs of either direction.

[mytmouz]

The ls swap I am doing now is by far, the most expensive swap I've done. I would say triple the amount you have in mind, then double it...

[1sikride]

Agreed.

I got smoked.
and u can’t really cheap out on the swap parts.
Do it right the first time.

[Paraman1]

SO far I am into mine about 4000 in necessary swap parts. fuel tank , headers , holley EFI controller , motor mounts , raised tunnel patch , oil pan and a few ancillary parts. I still have to fab a transmission bracket of some sort , come up with a alternator mount to move mine out of the steering boxes way and do an an exhaust as well as fuel line plumbing and I am guessing there is a host of little crap I am missing. My goal was 10 grand for the complete LS1 with T56 swap and even before I found out the motor was toast I wasn't going to make it by a couple grand.

You can pick up a crate SBC at Autozone for a heck of a lot less than that or cruise your local CL and find a replacement SBC that will tide you over for 500-1000 bucks.

[rickpaw]

You need to get oil pans, mounts, front accessories, engine/trans mounts, exhaust manifold, and fuel injection compatible tank at the minimum (Holley makes all the swap stuff for the 1st gen F-body cars). So at the minimum you're looking at roughly $3000 for the supporting stuff, not including engine/trans/ECU. You may be creative and make the truck accessories fit.

I had $6k into my swap, including the engine/trans; but I changed out a bunch of other parts too while I had the engine/trans out. Now, I figure I can do a junk yard LS swap for around $5000.

Keep in mind the numbers above are for parts only.

[T/A Addict]

Ok it is sounding like it is not a cheap easy swap as some other articles I have read suggest. Especially not if you want it done right as I expected.

The Chevy 350 would obviously be the quickest and cheapest.

[1985olds]

Dirty dingo slider mounts, I made my own crossmrmber, oil pan, I used the truck accessories i got with the engine, $150 reworked truck harness. Im in around a grand not counting the engine.

[BMR Sales]

define Cheap? Iron LS5.3s are cheap, but then there are alot of other things. Harness, Mounts, Radiator, etc, etc, etc.

I went LS3 and with accessories, I know I'm well above $10k. If I had bought a Crate 383 Stroker, I would have been less than 1/3 the cost and my car would have been on the road a year ago!

[andrewb70]

The Holley mounts are not that expensive and well engineered. At a minimum, I would do the Holley mounts and oil pan. From there, various options are optional and much depends on your skill level. I am pretty sure that stock 4th gen exhaust manifolds will work in a F-body, so that's cheap.

There are numerous sources that tell you how to modify a stock harness. For fuel system, I have seen DIY options to modify a stock tank to use an in-tank arrangement using the 5th gen Camaro fuel bucket. VaporWerks sells some inexpensive parts to make it for as a constant 58psi dead head pump.

As with anything, you can spend money on new parts or you can use some ingenuity and skill to substitute your labor for parts.

Andrew

[Rod]

engine mounts (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/trd-4592?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-trans-dapt-performance-products&gclid=CjwKCAjww6XXBRByEiwAM-ZUIFOqK0QzSJ7rtsBqko-5zDPf3mFQg5GqzxNHcht0BgmbsoTCzGBWMRoCxjAQAvD_BwE) 65 bucks
shorty LS headers (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevy-LS1-LS2-LS3-LS6-LS7-Stainless-Steel-LS-Swap-Headers-Chevelle-Camaro-C10-/163006247615) 158 bucks
Jegs LS swap pan (https://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/555/50228/10002/-1)159 bucks
Pick up for LS pan (https://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/555/50247/10002/-1) 39 bucks
remote filter bracket (https://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/969/1028/10002/-1) 23
LS intake (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-300-130) 271 dollars
LS ingnition box (https://www.speedwaymotors.com/MSD-6014-LS-Ignition-Control-Red,280130.html?sku=5476014&utm_medium=CSEGoogle&utm_source=CSE&utm_campaign=CSEGOOGLE&gclid=CjwKCAjww6XXBRByEiwAM-ZUILTx0YSO_yNgn93qkMfgjf9gdyQzc-HAP3lZ8Ux3397IZlQ_PzGSVhoCHoUQAvD_BwE) 386

reuse your carb and use the truck accessory drive that came with the motor, nothing fancy just quick and dirty for a better accessory drive I use the Holley on some uses corvette gear so parts are easy to get if needed Holley LS drive (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-20-143?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-holley&gclid=CjwKCAjww6XXBRByEiwAM-ZUIIeHGu0YrN-m_vcDVmdqddUBnHd2loPZskVbAsYPyLvYD4uPRNBb3RoCh7QQA vD_BwE) 829

us any standard electric pump (https://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/15914/10002/-1?CAWELAID=1710817915&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=44693592161&CATCI=aud-391543084240:pla-209994152231&CATARGETID=230006180039220935&cadevice=c&gclid=CjwKCAjww6XXBRByEiwAM-ZUIJhpOZfTe3Gj8NOLHFLoYTRCm5vxlKFNyydS0N6BX-xPDTzbEB1UCRoCu-AQAvD_BwE) 99 bucks if you had a mechanical one before

most automatics will bolt to the engine so reuse you old trans with this LS flywheel adapter (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-704000?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-summit-racing&gclid=CjwKCAjww6XXBRByEiwAM-ZUIGJoWEU1xYRrbXHjBAjNOZ2E-fMXbwGVYWQh6fsfa_wBstvKCs1MJRoCNmAQAvD_BwE) 59 bucks
with a manual trans you need this LS flywheel sachs NFW 1050 (https://www.rockauto.com/en/parts/sachs,NFW1050,flywheel,5348) and it uses Big block clutch just 65bucks

does it all work?

yes it does


152164

[T/A Addict]

Awesome...... Thanks for all the great info guys, positives and negatives, exactly what I was hoping to get. I do all the work on my cars myself so I wouldn't have to farm out anything other than tuning I believe.

Rod.... Thanks for all the links, that is Super helpful. I do have a brand new Holley DP I'm not using currently so that can be used, the car does have an electric fuel pump but I'd replace it with a new one regardless.
Definitely makes me think that getting a complete 5.3 or 6.0 from a truck would be well worth it especially considering that I would likely be willing to keep it for the final build.

I imagine that a lot needed items like the intake, ignition box, radiator etc. could be picked up used to save even more.
Don't get me wrong.... I would eventually tear the car apart and do it with tank, FI intake, all the correct and custom stuff etc. but I don't want to do that until my big project car is done. Just want to get her running reliably to enjoy until then.

[Rod]

Awesome...... Thanks for all the great info guys, positives and negatives, exactly what I was hoping to get. I do all the work on my cars myself so I wouldn't have to farm out anything other than tuning I believe.

Rod.... Thanks for all the links, that is Super helpful. I do have a brand new Holley DP I'm not using currently so that can be used, the car does have an electric fuel pump but I'd replace it with a new one regardless.
Definitely makes me think that getting a complete 5.3 or 6.0 from a truck would be well worth it especially considering that I would likely be willing to keep it for the final build.

I imagine that a lot needed items like the intake, ignition box, radiator etc. could be picked up used to save even more.
Don't get me wrong.... I would eventually tear the car apart and do it with tank, FI intake, all the correct and custom stuff etc. but I don't want to do that until my big project car is done. Just want to get her running reliably to enjoy until then.

I did the latest project "Flare Witch" with a Carb and I used the truck drive and it runs great and won the grand Turismo at SEMA

152167


152168

[T/A Addict]

That's Awesome.... thank you very much

Another question..... If I get a 5.3 with the trans 4l60 would there be anything else needed? Trans cross member,

[mytmouz]

If going with a 4L60 or another electronically controlled trans, you will need a trans controller, and some type of tps sensor for it to operate the trans...

[badazz81z28]

You can do an LS swap for not much money at all. The problem is people start out being cheap buying one piece at a time. That will nickel and dime you to death! If you buy a complete engine,there’s not much more that you need. You don’t have to buy a new radiator. You don’t need $800 headers...you don’t need $100 adapter brackets when you can get all these for far less money. You start buying parts with “Holley” stamped in it, you’re spending money. With my lessons learned, im pretty confident I could do a LS swap $2500-$3000 if not less.

[T/A Addict]

ok... so it's looking like the way to go is LS... I know how dependable they are and how well there respond to small improvements.
I've seen complete 5.3s with all accessories, pcm etc. For 800-1000...6.0 a little more
Even a complete 5.3 with a 4L60 for 1k or so
Sounds like another 1-2k or so to set it all up
I see running Poncho 400/455s going for about 1500

[mytmouz]

It's not the costs of the parts, it's the electronic magic. Once you have the harness, ecm, tac module, etc. You install it. Now, what about deleting the VATS? If you have someone with the software to do it, that's great. No one I know does it for free. It takes a really good scan tool to help with some issues, as I had no codes showing, but mine ran like crap. 3 GM techs from the local dealer, (all of whom got paid, said it was either this sensor or that, which also cost money) I bought a $1,400 scan tool and figured out it was a voltage issue to the ecm. Do you have the time and patience to rework the harness. If not, it is a few weeks wait, and some more cash. IF the engine sits up for long, with ethanol fuel in the rails, then it is most likely time for a new set of injectors.

Not trying to steer you away from an LS, I just don't want to see someone get swept up in the Cheap LS swap black hole. I will do another for me, as I have far more experience than I thought when I went in to the first one, and like the others who are posting it can be done cheaper, I have plenty of extras. In fact, a 1957 chevy convertible came to my buddies body shop, and we installed a 5.3 in it, and made the mounts and such our self, and the stock manifolds fit. The owner was going carb'ed, but is now leaning towards FI, since I got mine working. If he gets the harness and ECM, I will most likely do the install.

[piratebaseball]

I'm sure I missed it somewhere, but I think you have to answer the question what are your goals before you go ask what is the bare min price?

[T/A Addict]

mytmouz - Thank you....I have read many stories about the issues that arise with an ill running LS swap do to a sensor or something and do also understand the need to get the computer flashed. I totally understand how the entire build would add up quickly if going FI route but it seems that if you go carbed you won't have all the possible headaches and cost starting off. I would go back to EFI but at a later time.

As far as reworking the harness I do have the patience and my OCD (haha) will dictate that it is done above and beyond, even if it takes longer but time is the factor.... I have 2 young daughters and moving into spring and summer it gets very busy with all the outdoor activities, etc. But I try to have the mentality that it is not costing me anything sitting in the garage and I'll get it done as I can.


I'm sure I missed it somewhere, but I think you have to answer the question what are your goals before you go ask what is the bare min price?

My main objective is just to get it running this spring as cheap and as comfortably as possible to enjoy while I finish my other project.

Upon completing my 79 T/A which is getting a built LS2/ 6 speed, Global West arms and leafs, Viking coil overs etc.... I will restore/P-T the 69.... That being said if I go Pontiac or LS power right now it would likely be kept for the final build.

[Rod]

fun thread, I used the components I listed before, my car is a carbed 6.0, the MSD6ls box only requires 3 wires to run the car 12volt constant power, 12volt keyed power and ground,....no electrical magic, and I have run the car for years and hundreds of events, real events not something like "Uncle Bobs shellfish run" my 6.0 is bolted directly to a super T-10, using the correct offset motor plates I didn't do any thing to the trans cross-member or drive shaft

you can do a well done low cost swap without being fancy, don't think of it as a LS swap, think of it as a block upgrade, use your carb and trans, use the accessory drive that comes with the motor use the factory manifolds to get you started, up date and upgrade later

[chuckd71]

Given your time constraints, if the goal is just to get it running switching to LS now sounds like a terrible idea. Having never done it and not knowing what you are doing or will need isn't a recipe for a quick or easy process. You can have a crate 350 or whatever in and running in the time it takes a 6 pack to get cold; a first LS swap not so much. Any time and money spent going ls now would basically be time and money wasted if you are going to redo it again later anyway and go from carb to efi. Personally I just don't see any way that going LS makes sense in these circumstances if you want fast and cheap. Just a thought.

[T/A Addict]

6.0 and a super T-10 is a combo that I have not heard before. It obviously works extremely well!

Going the way of a 350 would be the biggest waste of time and money in my opinion because it would definitely be replaced later but undoubtedly the cheapest and quickest route to take. I am trying to find a balance for myself here with cheap/quick and what I want and would enjoy. My wishful timetable is not set in stone and it wouldn't surprise me if I didn't even get it done by Fall.

Lots of pros and cons posted and I've been soaking it in.

[jlcustomz]

Your personal skills at fabrication, swapping, & patience can make a huge cost difference. For example if you do as suggested & get a complete takeout setup, there are wiring diagrams you can follow to take a factory harness & make it into a stand alone, cheaper than a carb & carb controller. Stuff like this can be done ahead. I moved my own accessories around ahead of time.
Did my 99'ls1 swap in 2002' mostly the hard way. Didn't have the choices & info you got now. Cut & reboxed my g-body crossmember,made my motor mounts, harness. Had a lot of misc stuff to play with, was already plummed for my tpi engine. Used the twin fans that came with. The t-56 came with. Got ps lines modified locally by hydraulic line shop. aftermarket gauges were an investment.
My biggest regret at the time::: didn't know the seller had a 2002' ls6 for a thousand more. Here's the other thing;; 15 to 16 years later of part time use, a few sensors, alternator, starter, & very little else needed. Can mostly sit for months, then be driven reliably for hours. My big negative against carbs these days is the crappy gas isn't so kind to them.
Sooo, being affordable & done right depends on you. Not for everybody.

[HotWheelz]

If yer in Wisconsin, I've got a nice excellent '74 Monte Carlo 2-V 350 that runs excellent.

The L-92 6L80 4x4 swap into the 1985 CUCV set me back all told with cost of truck and everything; $15,000.

:drive:

[T/A Addict]

Thanks for the offer HotWheelz but I'm in Missouri.

Ok I'm about to pull the trigger on a 6.0 LQ4 long block, it has a mild Comp cam and ported 806 cathedral port heads, SLP oil pump, SLP double roller timing chain, ASP underdrive pulley, GM muscle car oil pan. I will need alternator and bracket, intake setup etc. Do all LS use the same exhaust manifolds? Trying to make a list of required items before I go with it. Still thinking that MSD controller and carb would be quickest and easiest.

I did see that FiTech has some nice products including tanks, and complete computer, harness, intake setups if I decide to go that direction. A T-56 or 6060 would be great too but then I'd have to add in all of the hydraulic clutch components. Maybe that would have to be a later add-on.

Any thoughts/suggestions on parts if I go with the 6.0 long block?

[andrewb70]

^Yes, all gen 3 and gen 4 exhaust manifolds are interchangeable.

Andrew

[Paraman1]

I would avoid the FITech if I were you. I did a lot of research before buying the Holley EFI controller and FITech's customer support is lacking to say the least. One of the guys in our car club bought one and had it professionally installed on his truck and had nothing but issues with it. Sent back the throttle body twice and still couldn't get the problems resolved so he sent it back for a refund and is still waiting on his money.

If you are not going to use the original EFI system and reprogram the ECU or go with an aftermarket ECU to control the system I would just go with a carburetor. Putting a TBI system on it is really spending money to travel backwards IMO.

[T/A Addict]

I do see a wide variety of reviews on Fitech while Holley is well "Holley" Still one of the best.

No intentions going TBI as I agree it would be a waste. I will either go carb or stay stock style MPI