Which front drive LS serpentine system

[cdoggy81]

Got it narrowed down to the March 20035 for $1850 or the Vintage Air front runner 174014 for $2600?

March:
looks pretty good for the price
heard their fitment is not that great

VA:
$800 more :[
I have read the alternator that comes with the VA has had some failure problems

Thoughts?

[65 drop top]

I'm happy with the VA front runner on my BBC, fit and finish is perfect. I'm building a LS3 now for a different car and am really liking the Drive Junky system. The Wegener unit would be my second choice.

[raustinss]

Without looking it up I know Mr Ron Sutton was chiming in on a system he liked due to the amount of belt contact on the power steering pump pulley.... could be drive junky not quite sure

[68EFIvert]

Without looking it up I know Mr Ron Sutton was chiming in on a system he liked due to the amount of belt contact on the power steering pump pulley.... could be drive junky not quite sure

I remember it being the Drive Junky setup as well. Maybe Ron will chime in. I have a Vintage Air setup on my car and if I were to do it again I would choose Drive Junky or Wegner which was already stated. The both have great contact on the pulleys.

[thumper877]

Without looking it up I know Mr Ron Sutton was chiming in on a system he liked due to the amount of belt contact on the power steering pump pulley.... could be drive junky not quite sure

I remember it being the Drive Junky setup as well. Maybe Ron will chime in. I have a Vintage Air setup on my car and if I were to do it again I would choose Drive Junky or Wegner which was already stated. The both have great contact on the pulleys. It is drive junky. I have there setup. Beautiful quality great directions and I also had them put a brushed finish on it to match my wheels and trim. The hand built and tig welded power steering reservoir is like art work so drive junky x2

[cdoggy81]

I'll look into the Drive Junky a little more. So far it looks pretty good & not toooooo much more than the VA setup.
http://drivejunky.com/product/high-ac-ls-drive-system/

[Simbad68]

I've been looking for a LSA system and ran across CVF Racing setups. I havn't found a whole lot of info on them, but might be worth taking a look.

[Schwartz Performance]

We use Wegner primarily on LS3's. They build high horsepower race engines, so it's thoroughly tested.
They're also relatively inexpensive, compared to BS and VA. I sell them for $2400 shipped, black anodized.

Drive Junky is also a good choice. I sell them too.

-Dale

[csouth]

I've been looking for a LSA system and ran across CVF Racing setups. I havn't found a whole lot of info on them, but might be worth taking a look.

I think Concept One sells an LSA system.

[dontlifttoshift]

I've dealt with the ConceptOne LSA system. It's fine if you don't actually want to make boost. I would have to say the same about the CVF setup as it looks like they are using one belt to run it all.

[krom]

how about one of the holley setups?

https://www.holley.com/products/accessories/drive_brackets/complete_kits/parts/20-138

[BMR Sales]

It is drive junky. I have there setup. Beautiful quality great directions and I also had them put a brushed finish on it to match my wheels and trim. The hand built and tig welded power steering reservoir is like art work so drive junky x2

It is Artwork - unfortunately my Power Steering Reservoir hit my Steering Pump so they are making me a Remote Reservoir.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif (https://postimages.org/)

[cdoggy81]

I went with the VA kit. Got a good deal & they threw in the DSE hardline :)

[badazz81z28]

I went with the VA kit. Got a good deal & they threw in the DSE hardline :)

What's the benefit of the drive systems? I have been using OEM for the last 3 swaps and no issues.

[cdoggy81]

No real benefits unless you have fitment issues or perhaps PS slippage. I just wanted something that looked better than the OEM stuff. We send all this $$$ on our cars to look & perform so just another piece in the puzzle :)

[Simbad68]

What's the benefit of the drive systems? I have been using OEM for the last 3 swaps and no issues.

Clearence issues for me. I'm running a AME subframe that has the motor lowered 3" and set back 3". The stock position of the alternator will not work due the rack.

[Billet-Specialties]

Coming soon a New Billet Specialties Sport Trac Drive System . Will keep you posted when it is ready to purchase

[gdphillipswagon]

I've got the Wegner drive system purchased from Schwartz Performance. Perfect fit. Give Dale a call!

Gordon

[Ron Sutton]

Our company is running 37 Holiday specials on everything from wheels, brakes & suspension to engines, clutches & LS Drive systems, including the Drive Junky, which is the very best, in my experience.

https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/126884-37-Holiday-Specials-in-1-Post-!-Suspension-Brakes-Engines-amp-More

[old66tiger]

I have the KWIK stuff on my car and am pretty happy with it

[cdoggy81]

Went with the Vintage Air front runner 174014 & got the DSE hardline included for $2400 :]

[ROCKETW19]

Wegner for sure. they build nascar motors they now quality

I had the vintage air on a LS3 I went to super charge it and found out you can not run any super charger with the vintage air system.
thats how I found Wegner and ended up buying a fully built motor I was so impressed.

[65 drop top]

Went with the Vintage Air front runner 174014 & got the DSE hardline included for $2400 :]
Nice! Please keep us updated and post a pic once you get it installed. I'm ready to buy a system now so would like some feed back on the VA.

[piratebaseball]

I used Wegner on my build. Casey is great to work with and they have more belt wrap than a lot of the other companies mentioned.

[dontlifttoshift]

#Immaleavethishere

146847

https://www.holley.com/products/accessories/drive_brackets/complete_kits/parts/20-180

[slimjim]

#Immaleavethishere

https://www.holley.com/products/accessories/drive_brackets/complete_kits/parts/20-180

That's impressive, I like the bracketless integrated water pump design, it looks really functional. I hope they bring out a dressed up pulley option.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/12/rB9YEmW-1.jpg

[130fe]

I am running the C5 stuff with the Holley AC bracket and like it but want something more compact. I am seriously thinking about that Holley setup, either the 180 (billet pulley covers and fluid dampener included) or the 185 (same basic system without the billet pulley and dampener). It looks like there are black powdercoat and polished options (read the PDF below). I called Holley today and the tech I talked to didn't seem to have much knowledge on it although he said he had one on his 5.3 truck). I realize it is a new system but some of the questions I had (such as the alternator), he asked me where I got the specs- I told him online from their site..... SMH. I think I will be pulling the trigger on it in the next day or so.

http://documents.holley.com/199r11335.pdf

Is having the fluid dampener that big of a deal from a street and autoX driving perspective?

[dontlifttoshift]

There is a lot of win in that setup.....some one at Holley has their head screwed on straight for sure. I wished they would have used an OEM alternator, though.

The sfi damper probably isn't required but I would want it for anything that was going to see a lot of rpm a lot of the time.

[130fe]

I agree with you Donny, the alternator pictured reminds me of one of those Mech Man alternators.

[dhutton]

That is a nice looking setup but it is not going to pass the Ron Sutton power steering pulley wrap test. I am sure it is fine for street use but the hardcore guys may not be happy.

Don

[qnitro]

Shouldn't you be working on your 69.. that thing is going to be awesome... the body mods you did need to be shared... :) I'm biased.. I know.. I just love that car you are doing..



That is a nice looking setup but it is not going to pass the Ron Sutton power steering pulley wrap test. I am sure it is fine for street use but the hardcore guys may not be happy.

Don

[dhutton]

LOL. Shouldn’t you be working on your cars instead of cyberstalking me?

Don

[Bwheeler287]

i went with the march pro track with raw accessories and black finished brackets. the whole deal from jegs ended up about $1500 shipped. i have read the same complaints about fit on the forums, but i did not experience and fitment problems. One thing i could see some having an issue with is that it is a lot of small pieces and brackets to make happen, but they are very nicely labeled with good instructions. It looked awesome when finished, nice and compact, and blends nicely like an upgraded factory look. To me, the savings was worth the extra time involved with the multiple parts.

had i known about that holley midmount when i was shopping around, i would have strongly considered it. some engineering and user friendliness definitely went into that setup for those who are not looking for a ton of bling.

[130fe]

Yeah, I went ahead and ordered the new Holley stuff.

[rallystyle]

I like the looks of the front drive setups but the question is when a parts goes bad down the line years later will you still be able to get the parts for it? if your on a road trip and the alt or a water pump goes out can you get a part for it. and that's all front drives. oe would be easiest to get parts for but are not the opium setup always.

[andrewb70]

That's impressive, I like the bracketless integrated water pump design, it looks really functional. I hope they bring out a dressed up pulley option.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/12/rB9YEmW-1.jpg

The new Holley set-up is really slick. There is an overview video on their YouTube channel and they said the alternator is actually smaller than a truck alternator but rated at 150amps max, and something like 100amps at idle. That seemed pretty impressive. The other cool part is that these are available for LS and gen 5 LT engines!

All they need to do now is come up with a gen 5 LT4 system...

Andrew

[Ron Sutton]

I like the looks of the front drive setups but the question is when a parts goes bad down the line years later will you still be able to get the parts for it? if your on a road trip and the alt or a water pump goes out can you get a part for it. and that's all front drives. oe would be easiest to get parts for but are not the opium setup always.

That's a good point. But I don't think it's a valid concern with most drive systems.

I'm speaking of the Drive Junky version we sell here:
* The Edelbrock LS water pump is a direct replacement for an OE Water pump. So you could swap in a GM pump In an emergency.
* The Powermaster Alternator utilizes standard size cases & bolt patterns. I don't think it's GM, so we'd need to figure out what vehicles came with that case, for emergencies.
* The Jones Racing power steering pump is a rebuilt, ported & blueprinted Delphi power steering pump. So again, in an emergency an OEM pump will bolt right in.
* The A/C compressor is Sanden, a super common brand available everywhere.

I think the same can be said for the Wegner. The Chinese made units are the ones that make me worry. And there are several brands with all ... or most ... of the parts made in China.

:cheers:

[130fe]

I just got the new Holley LS Mid Mount SERP kit in the mail on Wednesday. I remember in the Holley video that they said that their new alternator was their standard fit. I had an extra Holley bracket and just fit the new alternator with their normal (C5 style) bracket (one that utilizes a truck or F-body alt). Fits like a glove. Can’t wait to start putting this one on in a couple of weeks! In Holley case you could use a GM truck one to get you home (if you broke down on the road).

[badazz81z28]

I wanted to bring this thread back up. I looked mainly at price...but when I looked at brands like Holley a concern was on my mind how everything was hanging off the water pump. Is it good to have all those accessories hanging on the 6 small bolts originally designed to hold only a water pump? I looked at VA and it seems there is support bolts on the lower part of the block.

- - - Updated - - -


Went with the Vintage Air front runner 174014 & got the DSE hardline included for $2400 :]

VA gave you that deal? They told me as a manufacturer they had to sell only at MSRP and referred me to Summit or Jegs.

[andrewb70]

You can probably hang your while car by those six little bolts. I wouldn't be the least bit concerned.

Andrew

[Schwartz Performance]

I wanted to bring this thread back up. I looked mainly at price...but when I looked at brands like Holley a concern was on my mind how everything was hanging off the water pump. Is it good to have all those accessories hanging on the 6 small bolts originally designed to hold only a water pump? I looked at VA and it seems there is support bolts on the lower part of the block.

- - - Updated - - -



VA gave you that deal? They told me as a manufacturer they had to sell only at MSRP and referred me to Summit or Jegs.

$2400 is less than WD cost so must have been a while since he got that, or got some other special deal.
They do sell at MSRP, and dealers like ourselves are required to ADVERTISE at a certain price, not necessarily sell at a certain price.

We're a dealer for both, and more.

We've installed a couple Holley mid-mounts now, they seem very solid but I do understand your concern. However I wouldn't be concerned. :)

-Dale

[badazz81z28]

^^ which one would you put in your personal car? Holley or VA?

[2yellow69]

This is the "normal" Holley high mount a/c set up just for reference.158691

[rickpaw]

^^ which one would you put in your personal car? Holley or VA?

Holley.

It's my understanding is that the alt/water pump cartridge used in the mid mount Holley set up are based off C7 stuff; so you can get parts at part store in an emergency.

[badazz81z28]

Can you all post some pictures of the set-ups?

[BMR Sales]

It is drive junky. I have there setup. Beautiful quality great directions and I also had them put a brushed finish on it to match my wheels and trim. The hand built and tig welded power steering reservoir is like art work so drive junky x2

I will be selling my Drive Junky set-up in the Brushed finish. I sold the Car, then sold the LS3, but the Engine Buyer is not Buying the D-J Drive

https://i.hmjimg.com/images/2018/12/07/IMG_5383.jpg

https://i.hmjimg.com/images/2018/10/23/20170820_120458.jpg

[badazz81z28]

I will be selling my Drive Junky set-up in the Brushed finish. I sold the Car, then sold the LS3, but the Engine Buyer is not Buying the D-J Drive

https://i.hmjimg.com/images/2018/12/07/IMG_5383.jpg

https://i.hmjimg.com/images/2018/10/23/20170820_120458.jpg


How come the top pick doesn't have the PS wrap like the lower pic? Does Drive Junky have a LS7 kit? Looks like they don't sell anywhere but their own website....No wonder I haven't heard of them. How much you selling your kit for?

[badazz81z28]

Also....is belt wrap on the PS really that much of a concern on a large ribbed pulley?

[Z06vet]

Here is the holley mid mount. Here is what I experienced - I like the overall setup, I did have concern about the belt wrap as well. Time will tell. The hardware that comes with it looks/feels cheap. I had to chamfer the ends of the water pump housing bolts, the they were strait cut - and not clean. They got tight when I threaded them in. I also don't care for allen head bolt heads, and there is a mix & match of hex heads and allen heads. There was quite of bit of casting slag in the water pump housing in several areas, which I knocked clean with a chisel. The black coating on the water pump housing is thin and nearly worn thru in a few places. Nowhere near as nice as the finish as on the rest of the components. I had to drill out the bolt hole for the hing bolt on the compressor, as the bolt would not go thru, or slide in from the side as instructed. I also filed the opening after the hole was enlarged. The fit is good, spacing is good, the acc themselves seem high quality. The cover that goes over the tensioner has no access for ratched head or extension. So you have to remove the cover- which has 2 tiny allen head screws. I may end up leaving it off and ceramic painting the tensioner. I drive the car long distance often, and would be pissed off if I had to change a belt and either didnt have the tiny allen key, or worse, that the head strips. I used anti- seize on every bolt on the drive setup.

[BMR Sales]

How come the top pick doesn't have the PS wrap like the lower pic? Does Drive Junky have a LS7 kit? Looks like they don't sell anywhere but their own website....No wonder I haven't heard of them. How much you selling your kit for?

the 1st picture is off Drive Junky's Site. The Power Steering Pump does not fit a 2nd Gen correctly - it comes in contact with the Steering Box. I had them build me a Custom Pump & Reservoir.

Ron Sutton was selling them & I bought from him. Then I had the issues with the PS, so I dealt directly with Drive Junky on the solution. I wonder if they got paid from Mr Sauce!

[badazz81z28]

Here is the holley mid mount. Here is what I experienced - I like the overall setup, I did have concern about the belt wrap as well. Time will tell. The hardware that comes with it looks/feels cheap. I had to chamfer the ends of the water pump housing bolts, the they were strait cut - and not clean. They got tight when I threaded them in. I also don't care for allen head bolt heads, and there is a mix & match of hex heads and allen heads. There was quite of bit of casting slag in the water pump housing in several areas, which I knocked clean with a chisel. The black coating on the water pump housing is thin and nearly worn thru in a few places. Nowhere near as nice as the finish as on the rest of the components. I had to drill out the bolt hole for the hing bolt on the compressor, as the bolt would not go thru, or slide in from the side as instructed. I also filed the opening after the hole was enlarged. The fit is good, spacing is good, the acc themselves seem high quality. The cover that goes over the tensioner has no access for ratched head or extension. So you have to remove the cover- which has 2 tiny allen head screws. I may end up leaving it off and ceramic painting the tensioner. I drive the car long distance often, and would be pissed off if I had to change a belt and either didnt have the tiny allen key, or worse, that the head strips. I used anti- seize on every bolt on the drive setup.

I admit the Holley set-up does look pretty slick with the black alternator and AC compressor. I personally didn't like the whole system hanging solely on the water pump bolts (that's just me and I'm sure its fine). I see what your talking about with the mix Allen and Hex head bolts...I got the Holley's high mount AC bracket and I agree the bolts do seem different, but its well known that all this stuff is made in China. That probably explains the coating on the pump. Did you not opt for the ATI pulley??

I did end up buying the Vintage Air set-up because I got it pretty cheap comparatively to the MSRP price (and 18 months 0% financing). Drive Junky does look like a good set-up and if they advertised an LS7 set-up and could be had from Summit, probably would have looked a little harder at it.

BMR, what are you selling your set-up for?

[BMR Sales]

I admit the Holley set-up does look pretty slick with the black alternator and AC compressor. I personally didn't like the whole system hanging solely on the water pump bolts (that's just me and I'm sure its fine). I see what your talking about with the mix Allen and Hex head bolts...I got the Holley's high mount AC bracket and I agree the bolts do seem different, but its well known that all this stuff is made in China. That probably explains the coating on the pump. Did you not opt for the ATI pulley??

I did end up buying the Vintage Air set-up because I got it pretty cheap comparatively to the MSRP price (and 18 months 0% financing). Drive Junky does look like a good set-up and if they advertised an LS7 set-up and could be had from Summit, probably would have looked a little harder at it.

BMR, what are you selling your set-up for?

Sending you a PM

[badazz81z28]

Not a lot out there for the DJ kits....Who else has one??

[badazz81z28]

So contacted Detroit Speed and they exclusively use the Vintage Air kit and some of the newer builds use the Holley kit....why? Seems odd there’s lots of discussion on PS wrap yet one of the biggest names in the PT scene don’t use a system with such feature. This has wasted my brain bytes all weekend.

[nickburns]

Has anyone used the GM original front drive set up on a LSX motor with a Detroit Speed subframe? Is there clearance issues ?

Thanks

[CSG]

Has anyone used the GM original front drive set up on a LSX motor with a Detroit Speed subframe? Is there clearance issues ?

Thanks
I know in the instructions from DSE for my first gen it states that factory f-body drive will fit. I am curious as well...

[badazz81z28]

I used C5/C6, I don’t think the factory low mount Ac will not fit with C5 nor F-body

[MCB Matt]

I know this is an old thread but figured I would post as many of you here are customers of ours anyways.

Here is the current list of Kits we sell:

Drive Junky
Wegner
Holley
Concept One
CVF Racing
Vintage Air Front Runner
Billet Specialties
EMS
March (Only when the customer insists or they are the only ones with the application as fitment IS sketch).

That being said, let me know if anyone needs info or pricing on any of these brands. Please send desired finish and any other details we may need.

Thanks,
MCB

[65 drop top]

Does the VA front runner come in all black? Compressor, alternator, brackets, etc.

[MCB Matt]

Does the VA front runner come in all black? Compressor, alternator, brackets, etc.

No, it does not. What engine is it for?

For most LS/SB/BB all Black is available in:

Wegner (LS)
CVF
EMS
Holley
Concept One

Let me know on the application and I can get you over pics and tax time sale prices.

Thanks,
Matt

[65 drop top]

LS3. Too bad VA doesn’t offer a black out option. I guess Wegner or Drive Junky will get the nod when I’m ready.

[badazz81z28]

I thought MCB wasn’t selling drive Junky ???

[65 drop top]

I thought MCB wasn’t selling drive Junky ???
They didn’t list them. I just like them though, seems very similiar to the Wegner. When I’m ready I’ll just get whichever has a better deal going.

[badazz81z28]

No I specifically asked.


They didn’t list them. I just like them though, seems very similiar to the Wegner. When I’m ready I’ll just get whichever has a better deal going.

[MCB Matt]

I thought MCB wasn’t selling drive Junky ???

They contacted me a few weeks ago about selling their kits. We have some numbers to work out and I need to call him back to set it up. However, we CAN sell them now..

Thanks,
Matt

[Schwartz Performance]

I still prefer the Wegner over anything.. Quality parts, and they're an engine builder so their stuff gets tested ALL the time.

Here's an LS3 we did one on. Wegner offers the AC & alternators in black now, but please note we painted this water pump black, and the engine block.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/02/33201403078_f53d9a90b9_b-1.jpg

We've also done many Drive Junky installs & sales, here's one on an LT4 we put in one of our C10 chassis.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2019/02/43716952502_fd28828365_c-1.jpg

Happy to work up a quote for you guys.

[old66tiger]

I have the KWIK stuff. Looks good, seems to work fine and at a fraction of the cost. Actually, don't mind the high mount alternator and AC stuff. PS pump was modified to run -10 feed and I have a remote reservoir.

[MJB]

I went with sinister.

Looks nice

161968

[badazz81z28]

Good lord! That sinister kit is $3k!!!


The PS belt wrap is what sold me. I’m surprised many brands don’t have that. Looking at kits, you do get what you pay for, not that cheaper kits “don’t work”