AMC Rebel suspension project

[buster51]

Hi All,
New to the form as a member, but have been hanging around for a while. I'm especially interested in the suspension threads. I apologize ahead of time if this post is too long for a new guy.

I have a project that i'm in the planning stages of and looking for some opinions. We have a 70 AMC Rebel Machine that I originally did a quick restro to 30 years ago for our son's first car. It was pretty rough then and I had bought it for the drivetrain for my SC/Rambler. But he fell in love with it so I wound up making it safe and a decent driver. About five years later he hit something and ripped the upper control arm out of the (rusty) shock tower. So that was it and it moved from one storage place to another.

The car is completely original down to the ram air seal, 390, 4-speed and is black on black. I had somebody recently try to buy it mainly for the VIN and door tag because they were supposedly only 5 black on black left. The car is probably to bad to save, but I guess I don't know any better.

My thoughts have ranged from buying a clean four door or wagon to get a solid floor, frame rails, rockers and front clip, to a GM G-Body chassis or an Art Morrison frame. The first is pretty hard to do because there are almost no hardtops left and a sedan or wagon that is solid enough to use wouldn't be cheap and too nice to cut up. I got away from the G-body chassis because they look pretty flimsy and probably ruin the value of the car.

I like the Art Morrison, Chassis Engineering or Schwartz frames but am leaning to a CE rear clip and front IFS with Auto Weld custom bent frame rails. I also like the Scott's Hot Rod and Heidt IFS front ends. Progressive Automotive has a nice C4 system, but I'd rather run a traditional wheel style. The other option would be replicating the stock mounting points and using the Control Freaks AMC IFS like the excellent eddiebarret AMX build here.

My concerns are wheel travel and the ability to withstand a northeast pothole at 70mph. The car weighs 3500-3600 lbs. Most of the systems, if they mention it, only have 4" of wheel travel. The potholes are deeper than that. I also worry about the rear lower control arm mounts on Mustang II systems hanging out and the lateral load they have to withstand hitting a hole. A friend's Must II system failed when the upper control arm cross shaft T-bolts pulled through.

So, I'm asking for people's opinion on how any of these systems operate in the "real" world. I have searched here and read about ride quality, wheel travel and the amazing "Front Suspension & Steering Geometry" sticky, but am also concerned with handling bad pavement. It won't be a daily driver or a track car, but he will drive it to work and he isn't real good dodging road hazards. Any suggestions and thoughts would be appreciated. The car will be lowered 1-2 inches and use 16-17" tires, nothing extreme. It will use the stock style triangulated four link rear suspension.

Here's a early rendering. It will probably be more original looking now.

[mike343sharpstick]

First off, what a cool car. Black on Black Machine would be killer! Thanks for saving it.
Sad that the front is messed up, but stuff happens.
I am an AMC guy and have a 69 javelin that I set up to handle pretty good, but based on the fact that you have a car with torn up front suspension I can understand why you would consider a complete front suspension upgrade, and I don't think it's a bad idea at all. Even if you were to restore the car you would need to replace much of the front sheet metal anyway.
I've taken my current Javelin 'nearly' as far as I want to with suspension modifications, but have been throwing around other suspension ideas for a future/next javelin build.

I like the Detroit speed X-Gen setup, and if I do another Javelin I'll very likely use this or something very similar. This is listed as having 6" of travel. http://www.detroitspeed.com/X-Gen-Products/032041-X-gen-535.html

For rear suspension I like the Torque Arm Suspensions available. I like that they can be installed without a ton of floor/trunk modification and It seems function great. 1982 to 2002 Camaros use that design, and those work amazingly well for AutoX and road action.

Fabricate some subframe connectors and make sure there isn't rust inside the existing frame rails and have at it :)

[buster51]

mike, glad you like the project. I keep flip flopping on how to accomplish it, but am leaning to the AutoWeld bent-to-specs 2x4 tubing and maybe their universal front end too. One other thing that makes their stuff look attractive is we could drive to PA to pick it up. Shipping from AM or Chassisworks would be prohibitive and they each have features I'd want different. Originally I had considered a G-Body frame welded in because of the number of 50s cars and trucks that use them, but after more research, it looks like finding a good one will be an issue around here and the track is only 58". The Rebel track is 60" and it could be a little wider. Another possibility would be a new G-Body stock car front clip and even keeping the steering box instead of rack.

Rear is easy enough with just duplicating the original frame and four link set up or using somebodies complete 4 bar clip with Ford Housing.

I have printed out most of Ron Sutton's great articles which has given me the idea to just correct some of the AMC geometry which isn't bad to start and use a more modern spindle/brakes.

Thanks for the interest

[mike343sharpstick]

If you considering G-Body stuff, which is not a bad idea, have you looked into the Ford Crown-Vic 2003 and later option. It might be too wide, but it looks like an interesting design.