1978 Malibu - "Deja-Bu" Project

[Deja-Bu]

Hey Everyone, new here, but very familiar with this forum and a handful of the projects on here. My name is Chad, I'm an Applications Engineer at Mastercam, and this is my hot rod!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/IMAG2519_zpsm3qzhakk-1.jpg~original

So here's a quick recap. My dad and I built this car while I was in high school / college. It's always been an evolving project, but most of those evolutions were directed toward drag racing. And car shows. Or a mix of them both really. As of its last trip to the drag strip, this is a 10.59 second car. But there's a problem with that. The closest drag strip is 3 hours away, and its been 2 or 3 years since this car has made it to the track. In that span of time, I bought a Focus ST and became very addicted to autocross and track days. The Focus is so much fun and it's fast enough now to hang with a whole new class of cars. (Having a new ZL1 wave you by in a Focus is a cool feeling!)
But regardless of how fast it is, it's still ... a Focus. And even worse, its front wheel drive. So that brings me to my new project. I've been seeing some former drag cars take the G-machine route, so I finally broke down and purchased a RideTech Level 3 Coilover System! This thread will track my progress on this project. So far I've made the big purchase, and I've done a good bit of research. Goodies should start coming in soon!

Some quick numbers on the car as it sits now:
Big Block 496
TH400 transmission with a manual valve body and a high stall converter
Notched framerails
Narrowed Ford 9", 31 spline axles, mini-spool, 4.11 gears
275/60-15 ET Street Pro Drag Radials, weld wheels
6 point roll cage
3" rear drop springs, 2" drop spindles, V6 front springs

And finally, a very very quick build summary in picture form below:
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[twosaturns]

wow that's clean for a drag car! I like the blue too. I was thrown off a bit when you said it was a '78, those aren't '78 taillights. but I see from the early pics you changed them along the way.

I had a '78 for a little while in the late '80's; slow as can be, but it was a stick car! didn't have the money at the time to get it right.

[JKELCH]

Nice car to start with, Im looking forward to this build.

[oldtinsmith]

Chad, I'll be studying your project just as intently here as I will on the other site(s)!

Doug

[Deja-Bu]

Tonight was the first night of any progress since the parts came in, glad I finally had a chance to get out to the garage.

The components are very well organized when you unpack the shipping boxes. Each coilover assembly kit comes in its own bag. I took the easy task first and assembled all four coilovers:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/20160128_192841_zpsa5x7ctyg-1.jpg~original

Following the trend of 'easy stuff first' I decided to attack the rear of the car. Pretty simple, remove the old shocks and springs, attach new upper and lower mount brackets, and connect the dots with the coilover.

Last picture of the Malibu with its drag car pants on:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/20160128_194853_zpsabk7ldcz-1.jpg~original

Old shocks and springs (not shown) removed, and will also be in my eventual for sale thread. QA1 Single Adjustable rear shocks and Hotchkis 2" lowering springs.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/20160128_202413_zpsszyxafcu-1.jpg~original

Upper bracket bolts right into the old upper shock mount:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/20160128_203729_zpsvjpgneq1-1.jpg~original

Lower brackets are a little harder in my case. This kit is designed for the stock GM rear end geometry, and I have a narrowed Ford 9" with "GM bracket geometry" and LCA relocation brackets ... so even with my QA1 shocks, I needed a custom shock mount bracket:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

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This was my stopping point today. Need to customize the provided lower bracket to fit my rear end geometry.

Looks like the upper hole on the Ridetech bracket is going to line up with the lower hole on my rear end bracket:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/Screenshot_20160128212919_zpsgybt8vjh-1.png~original

My stock location LCA bolt is 5/8" and the Ridetech bracket is slotted to fit a 1/2", so I need to mill the slot opening larger. I also need to add a hole for the (rusty) LCA relocator bolt.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/Screenshot_20160128212937_zpsgnhyutvn-1.png~original

Need to grind the weld on my LCA relocator more flush to the rear end bracket:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/20160128_212436_zpszpwmwtvc-1.jpg~original

Hopefully more progress soon!

[SSLance]

Very nice car Chad, believe I've seen it before over on the Monte board. Weren't you guys building a red Monte Carlo for your brother also?

I also had to re-engineer my rear lower brackets as my quick performance axle housing shock brackets were at a different angle than the GM brackets. I chose to just completely start from scratch with mine.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/01/IMG_20131010_194603_448-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/10/DSC03797JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/10/DSC03799JPG-1.jpg

If you run into any questions, just ask away. Can't wait to see how you progress with your changes to an already beautiful car.

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks Lance! And yep the Twin Turbo Monte is nearing completion. (I could post pics or just direct you to the car's facebook page here: https://www.facebook.com/83montebuildprogress)

Not sure if this is gonna work but...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

And I'm highly considering going from scratch with these brackets. I just machined out the slots in the Ridetech brackets so that they'd fit the LCA bolt, we'll see how close that gets me.

But thanks for the offer! I'm sure I'll have all sorts of questions once i get up to the front! Haha

[Gil]

Déja-bu in French means "already drunk" !
Nice car !
Gil

[mc84_zz4]

Chad, I'm looking forward to seeing the 2.0 version of your project.
And as always, the more pictures, the better.
:cheers:

[Deja-Bu]

Long overdue update here. Seems like the lower bracket is determined to give me a hard time. When I last posted I was hoping to modify the bracket. Here's how that part went:

Needed to slot out the hole for my 5/8" LCA bolt. (Ridetech slot is for a 1/2" bolt.)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160129_090026_zpsfeitnl4i-1.jpg~original

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https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160129_090759_zpsch9mttgk-1.jpg~original

And it seems like it paid off! Bracket bolted right up!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160131_170224_001_zps4hba2e9f-1.jpg~original

........or not
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160131_170148_zps1ytg3ig9-1.jpg~original

So it was time to pull out the empty cereal box and start making templates
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Unfortunately the machines at work are all occupied, so I wasn't able to CNC machine these brackets. I had to go at it the 'old fashioned' way - hand drill and an angle grinder. (So ignore how rough these look, I still have some cleaning up to do.)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160203_191433_zps4sbllasc-1.jpg~original

Welded on some captive washers to fill the step between the rear end bracket and my LCA relocator.
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Going to need some longer bolts now that the stackup thickness is longer
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160203_205237_zpsocu6gimj-1.jpg~original

The left and right side main sections of the brackets are done as of tonight. The only thing I want to add to them is a 90 degree tab that will bolt up to the holes that the RideTech part didn't align to. (And again, this isn't any fault of RideTech, this is because I have an aftermarket Ford 9" rear.) Can't wait to get the rear done so I can start the fun part up front!

[Streetbu]

Looking good as always!

[CruizinKev]

love it :twothumbs

[SSLance]

That's the way, figure out a way and make it work. Looks good.

[MOREHORSEPOWER]

Looks like you notch the frame ? Nice car !!

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks guys! And yep the framerails are notched. Outer C-channel cut off and filled in.

Got the rear back on the ground! Couple more loose ends to tie up. Still want to clean it up back here as well, including that nice rusty U-bolt for my anti-roll bar. And all of the rubber particles from this past year

Mocked up a test fit before painting ... getting excited!
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Seems as though the hardware I received was different than what the instructions called for. Unless I mixed things up when opening all the boxes. Either way, I ran out and grabbed some better suited hardware.
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Painted the brackets with Rustoleum Hammertone Silver, tried to match the silver vein powdercoated rear end.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160205_231043_zpsl3lzhafi-1.jpg~original

Both coilovers mounted, brackets painted, now just need to find a spot for the reservoirs.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160206_104023_zps2snjpwov-1.jpg~original

That should work! Coilover is at max travel, so I should have enough slack in the lines.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160206_113949_zps3xlpfdgu-1.jpg~original

This is officially my favorite picture so far. I love seeing the lines for the remote reservoirs.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/02/20160206_125741_zpsghxpoyki-1.jpg~original

I'd say the car gained an inch, maybe two, of rear ride height. Which is fine, plenty of adjustability. Can't wait to get these tires and wheels sold.
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Not shown in pics, tonight I cleaned up my ZQ8 S10 Blazer spindles and got them in primer. Starting to look at C5/C6 brakes. Still need to find a Monte SS steering box as well, then all of the upgrades will be accounted for.

[Deja-Bu]

Finally have some progress worth sharing! Been very busy with work and projects around the house, but this warm weather we've had recently has gotten me back in high gear.

I haven't been totally stagnant on this project between my last post and now, I've done a lot of cleaning under the car, as well as cleaning and selling old parts. Going to have to fund the tire and wheel purchase somehow! (Still not sure on what I'm going to be buying, I love the 3-piece CCW wheels, but they're at the very tip-top of my budget unfortunately.)

So nice to finally work with the garage door open again!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160221_151043_zpsbhxqbwwa-1.jpg~original

Okay so back to the progress... SO much cleaner now.
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Small sample of the rubber that came off. The rest of it is forever embedded in the clothes I was wearing while cleaning.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160310_211917_zpsxq1zuplq-1.jpg~original

You may also have noticed that the rear end was stripped out in the previous picture. That's because it was set up with a mini-spool for drag racing. I pulled it all out and am having my brother set up a Detroit Tru-Track instead. And at the same time, I'm doing a rear disk brake swap.

So this is the pile of parts that had to come out first... Glad the exhaust is ceramic coated. I have a lot of polishing to do before any of this can go back in.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160229_201945_zpsoanrmwzo-1.jpg~original

My 31-spline axles, and old brakes, as well as the pumpkin with the mini-spool
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160307_205541_zpsepu0urnr-1.jpg~original

Tru-track
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160312_114203_zpsi8jtzuc8-1.jpg~original

Right-Stuff rear disk brake swap for small-bearing ford 9"... these calipers are identical to the stock Malibu fronts, with the addition of a mechanical emergency brake.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160312_114630_zpsme1mxsux-1.jpg~original

That's about where the rear sits currently. Once the Tru-track is in, I can get the pumpkin back in, bolt on the rear brakes, and call it a job done. (Pending some testing, I'll probably need a proportioning valve from what I've researched.

Onto the front - I picked up a pair of ZQ8 Blazer spindles from a local junkyard. Cleaned them up and painted them, and installed a pair of Raybestos bearing assemblies.
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That about takes me to the installation process of the Ridetech front suspension. Not a whole lot that I can add to what's already been mentioned all over the internet about this kit. Amazing quality parts, clear instructions, lots of fun to see it come together. The one thing that I had to do outside of bolting everything in was to cut off four or so of the outermost front spring locating fingers inside of the frame. The coilover couldn't even pivot far enough to line up with it's mount hole in the LCA. Once these fingers came out, the coilover had more range of motion than it would ever need.
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Control arms, coil and spindle installed!
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Then the bearing, the torque wrench had a good workout tonight!
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And BAM, brakes! (Also, I spent a lot of time deciding which way to point the reservoir hose for the coilover. I decided to point it inbound because there are less moving parts and more places for me to mount brackets to accurately route the hose.
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I don't think I can get tired of looking at this. C6 Z51 caliper and rotor from Kore3. All I need to do is machine an adapter bracket so the abutment bracket will bolt to my S10 spindles.
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But that's about all for progress!
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Over the next few nights I'll get the tie rods in, as well as the big front sway bar. Looks like I'm well on the way to re-assembly, finally!

[SSLance]

Looking good... If I can offer a hint, I'd swap the rear shocks around so the rebound adjuster is at the bottom. That will make getting to it a ton easier and that is likely to be the knob you will use the most. Here is a picture of my rear shocks and my front shocks so you can see how I ran my lines to my reservoirs up front.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/DSC03799_zpshuxj85ax-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC03799_zpshuxj85ax.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/DSC03798_zpssn9bc1bx-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC03798_zpssn9bc1bx.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/0216161555a_zps915mtgml-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/0216161555a_zps915mtgml.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/0216161555_zpsjzuvy4ek-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/0216161555_zpsjzuvy4ek.jpg.html)

I cut 3" holes in my trunk floor above the axle and put my rear reservoirs inside the trunk, my front reservoirs are mounted on my inner fender wells.

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks for the tip Lance! That's a good idea, I'll definitely do that. And yeah it's looking like the front reservoirs are going on the fenderwell, that should be one of my next few projects.

Little update (with a side of learning!) on the front brakes. So as mentioned, I was doing the S-10 front spindle upgrade, that accepts C6 Corvette brake components. I used this thread (http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/1245369-g-body-c5-vette-frt-brakes-w-blazer-zq8-spindles-w-drawing.html) as an extremely helpful guide. The OP includes instructions, requirements, and a blueprint to machine the required adapter bracket. So in no time at all, I had brackets done and ready to go!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160323_211211_zpsuz3eoyse-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160323_211156_zpspxpxii0s-1.jpg~original

So these brackets have the correct bolt pattern to accept the C6 abutment bracket and S-10 spindle, with the correct offset to locate the calipers at the correct radius on the rotor...

... on the Base Model C6 Rotor

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160316_203008_zpszkvqtole-1.jpg~original

Of course I went and bought Z51 rotors, which are 0.6" bigger diameter, so the abutment bracket bottomed out on the diameter of the rotor before the holes could line up. So I made a second set of brackets, with a 0.3" offset to the abutment bracket holes. Aside from the offset holes, these brackets are dimensionally identical to the ones in the other thread. (You'll also note that I got a bit more fancy with relieving the area where the adapter bracket interferes with the S-10 spindle this time around.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160317_172953_zpsqlwo8ioc-1.jpg~original

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And just like that, the brakes fit perfectly.

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Something else that this offset allowed me to do, is run flange bolts into the abutment bracket instead of the socket head cap screws that everyone has to run on the base brakes. They need to run cap screws because they're all that will clear the spindle without tons of grinding. But as the picture below shows, that 0.300" offset paid off!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160317_184708_zpsetk439fm-1.jpg~original

And my final lesson for any G-body guys doing this swap, the stock brake hoses will fit just fine. (I know, I should upgrade to super nice brake lines, and I will. But just to get this project back onto four wheels, I'm leaving well enough alone.) However, the stock banjo bolts will not. My stock brakes used M10x1.5 banjo bolts, the corvette calipers use M10x1.0

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160323_201215_zpsuojyabrh-1.jpg~original

Also, to anyone who is interested in doing the base C6 brake upgrade, I can sell you my unused adapter brackets, just PM me.

In terms of other progress, I painted up my rear calipers to match the fronts:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160323_205926_zpspwohhuwc-1.jpg~original

And I just got my rear end third member back from the Tru-Track upgrade. Well... I got my Tru-Track anyway, but in a different housing. Turns out the 10.59 quarter mile was a bit too much for my existing housing...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/03/20160324_122823_zps1awdrcf3-1.jpg~original

[SSLance]

Great work on the adapters, that's a nice swap. Curious if you ever compared the S10 ZQ8 spindle directly to the stock G-body spindle? I wonder if the pin, ball joints, and steering arm are all in the same places as the G-body stock unit?

I'd consider this brake swap as long as I don't have to redo all of my suspension geometry.

[Streetbu]

Yes, they are all in the same locations Lance.

[SSLance]

Thanks...

[CRCRFT78]

Looking good.

[Deja-Bu]

Just finished the disk rear swap! Of course it couldn't be easy, just like the rear lower control arms. Caused again by my narrowed Ford 9" rear. The Right-Stuff disk conversion comes with a deep offset rotor and some equally offset caliper brackets. This offset caused some major interference with my LCA mounts in 3 of the four possible mounting orientations. The fourth orientation cleared suspension parts just fine, but...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160330_210313_zpsilhtylmm-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160330_210338_001_zpsr3dielt7-1.jpg~original

... not a lot of room for suspension travel there. So I decided to go custom again. I went to Napa and spent some time looking through their brake rotor catalog for similar diameter and thickness rotors, but without the big offset. I came up with these rotors from a mid-90's Buick Century/Regal.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160401_171845_zpsbh7lkdke-1.jpg~original

These rotors pulled the caliper mounting surface out about 1.25 inches. The only dimension that wasn't listed in the catalog was the axle flange clearance diameter, so of course that interfered as seen below. Nothing the Haas lathe at work couldn't take care of.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160401_215445_zpsaqiaik7y-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160402_110502_zpssiywpd4b-1.jpg~original

Once I turned about 0.150" off the OD of my axle flange, the rotor fit right over.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160402_142420_zpszfroqyln-1.jpg~original

Unfortunately, this offset caused the outer brake pad to have a little bit more tension on the rotor than I'd like. So I machined the mounting brackets a bit so that there would be a little clearance. (It's worth noting that these brackets are spaced apart with 1.250" bushings from out of the box. So I'm not really worried about 'weakening' the brackets any with this thickness modification. I'm pretty sure this is more rigid than it was before, by means of deleting the bushings.)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160404_140725_zps5hai25ak-1.jpg~original

And with that little bit of machining, the pads fit with a nice amount of wiggle room on each side.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160404_215105_zpse9emxygo-1.jpg~original

And we have brakes! Of course... I still need to find a way to extend my current emergency brake cable by 2" to reach the e-brake bracket on these calipers. And of course the brake hose isn't long enough either. So, almost there anyway.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160404_215528_zpsav81jpal-1.jpg~original

Also got the new third member painted up and reinstalled over the past few days. I was putting that install off until I knew that the axles would be staying in permanently.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160328_222215_zpsixxy1jjj-1.jpg~original

So this brings me to my next challenge. I've spent hours and hours researching the tire and wheel dimensions that all the g-body guys up here use. For me, the back tires are easy. My old tires were 275/60R15s, so 275/40R19s would fit in the same exact footprint. And I have a pretty good idea of where to start with offsets. (Also worth noting that I plan to have the car sitting pretty low, with the tires tucked into the fenderwell like they were before.)

When it comes to my old front tires ... they were 26" tall drag skinnies, so I'm shooting in the dark. The vast majority of g-bodies up here are Montes and Grand Nationals, which have much larger wheel openings than Malibus do. Not to mention, I have this chin spoiler that needs to be cleared, which eliminates most of the Malibus that I can find information on.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160402_153333_zpsshszkual-1.jpg~original

There is ONE Malibu that I can find, that has the same Ridetech parts as me, and the same chin spoiler, and it even sits like I want my car to sit. Link - http://www.lsxtv.com/news/hooked-on-handling-ls-swapped-78-malibu-from-ls-fest/
I know that there is a thread on here for this car, but unfortunately it hasn't been active in quite some time, and there is no detail on the tire size and wheel offset. I just know his front wheels are 19x9 ... would anyone happen to know this information?

Also worth noting, I had the impression that 245/40R18s would be perfect, if not too big. It just so happens that my Focus ST race rubber is that size. Obviously the wheel offset is way off. But I can't help but think that this tire looks a little lost in the wheelwell.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/20160405_211906_zpsfe4jn9fk-1.jpg~original

As far as wheel selection goes, I would LOVE to go with a set of CCW Classic 3-pieces, but they don't come in 19's. And I also don't want to bet a $3000 set of wheels that everything I'm doing this offseason will work / fit / perform perfectly this year. So I think I'm going to have to keep my eyes open for a used set of wheels, and machine some spacers / adapters to get everything to fit right. Once I get all of that stuff proven out, then I'll get myself a nice set of custom wheels.

[SSLance]

Something to think about is tire selection once you get rims, sometimes UHP tires can be hard to find in 19" rim sizes. Personally I like a square setup, same size tire and rim all the way around. It makes tire rotation possible to even out wear.

I bet you can fit a 275/40/18 up front with a 5.0" backspace. It might rub on the frame and sway bar at full lock but it that bothers you a quick steering stop would fix that.

Not sure what ride height you want to run but in order for the suspension to work properly you'll need around 2" of shock travel under compression from ride height. That should be at a minimum 25.5" at the fender which should clear most tires choices. ALso remember your steering geometry is going to be much different which will affect tire clearance (for the good). With more caster dialed in you might clear the chin spoiler better than you think and the camber gain will tilt the tire in at the top under compression which will move it away from the fender.

Wish I was closer, we'd slap my wheels on and check it out.

[SSLance]

Wish I has a picture from the side like this... My fender sits at 26.5" directly over the spindle and my 275/40/17s on 17x9.5s fit perfectly.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/DSC_6767_edited_zpsssittkbn-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC_6767_edited_zpsssittkbn.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/DSC_6784_edited_zpsw7un4au7-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC_6784_edited_zpsw7un4au7.jpg.html)

[linkstar69]

Cool transformation

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks! And thanks for the numbers Lance! I was way off on my first impression haha. I guess that's because I was trying to keep any rubbing from happening, ever. I want to unhook my right front sway bar and coilover just so I can send the suspension through its full range of motion with my little wheel/tire gauge. I'll take any muscle bar rubs with a grain of salt!

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Just for info's sake I run 275 40 17s like Lance all around, also on a 9.5" wheel with 5.5" bs. I had to run a 10mm spacer to clear the flat faced back of the wheels from hitting the '02 Camaro calipers. The car is dropped about 2"+ and the bottom of the frame just behind the front wheel is about 6" off the ground. I have read that between 6 and 7" at the frame is just about right for a G body for ride height to avoid issues with bumpsteer, and that has worked great for my car. The 275s are about 25.5" tall. I originally had 255 40s up front which were just about 25" tall and they looked a little small unless the car was slammed. 315 35 17s are also about 25.5" tall, as are 275-35-18 and 315-30-18. Up front I removed the inner fenders because before I understood Pro Touring handling I had the car lowered 4" and the 245-50-16s rubbed enough to eventually crack the plastic. Since the inners are gone I rolled up the outer lip for extra clearance just in case. The only rubbing I experience is slightly on the control arms at full lock, just enough to remove the paint and polish the arm. I drive it pretty aggressively on and off the track and have zero rubbing issues besides full lock. I think Lance may still have inner fenderwells in there?

As lance said if you are serious about sticking to the track while racing the main 3 tires of choice come in limited sizes. 275s are the "small" common size while 315s are what it seems more folks are trying to squeeze on there... and by squeeze it means some mods to make it work on a G body. On a 315 you want a 10.5" + rim but to avoid sucked in sidewalls and squishier handling you'll really want 11"+. 275s are good for 9-10" +, 9.5 + is a little better.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Here's a pic, sorry I don't have anything more up close. I like running the same size all around because I can rotate them and get a tire that gets heavily abused to last a little longer.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/SCCA2011202015201_zpsst62ynvy-1.jpg

[SSLance]

You made me go back and look Ben, I always forget if my wheels are 5.0" or 5.5" backspace. Mine are 5.0" BS on a 9.5" rim and I still have to run a 1/8" spacer on the rear to keep the tires off the frame. Did you do a frame notch?

Chad will need to figure that out on his own...sounds like he has a plan in place.

Chad, something else about a square setup you will like. When you have more tire contact patch in back than in front, you'll fight a push even more. You need more tire up front...not in the rear...to get your car to turn.

[rchaskin]

....I like running the same size all around because I can rotate them and get a tire that gets heavily abused to last a little longer....

X2. Really makes the tires last longer.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

You made me go back and look Ben, I always forget if my wheels are 5.0" or 5.5" backspace. Mine are 5.0" BS on a 9.5" rim and I still have to run a 1/8" spacer on the rear to keep the tires off the frame. Did you do a frame notch?

Chad, something else about a square setup you will like. When you have more tire contact patch in back than in front, you'll fight a push even more. You need more tire up front...not in the rear...to get your car to turn.

X2 on the fat rear tire. Maybe it's just obvious to me, like how you realize how much you bump your toe after you smash it on something, but it seems the G body platform likes us to fight for a good balance. Sort of like there isn't much gray area of somewhat balanced but a lot of under or oversteer area and a small little spot where the car sticks well on both ends. Mine has been this way anyways, but it's pretty sorted out now. Maybe all cars are like that, I dunno.

I do have about a 1" frame notch and minitub. If I run a 1" spacer out back to make 4.5" BS I have to have the fender lips rolled and it'll rub slightly up on the outer side of the inner wheel wells if the rear gets compressed enough, like when you load the back of the car full and tow your Nova 2500 miles across the country, polished rubber gets pretty shiny lol!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/04/trip009_zpsa6e08721-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/trip003_zps7bf97236-1.jpg

Hope this info helps in some way DejaBu.

[Deja-Bu]

I appreciate all of the feedback guys! Measuring for the wheels and tires was definitely tough. I totally understand what you all mean by keeping the setup square from front to rear. I didn't end up going that route, for a couple of reasons. First off, I'm too attached to the big and little look. I'm so used to seeing huge fat tires in the rear and nothing up front haha, so this is already a huge change for me. I also want to be able to tuck the tires into the fenders like i did before. As far as understeer goes, having any steer at all is a big change. Not to mention, 100% of my track experience was in a pushy front wheel drive car!

So after a long wait, onto the updates! Because of leadtime quotes (and a painful experience with Summit/Weld Racing), I ended up killing my plans for custom wheels and just going with the quick and inexpensive XXR wheels for now. I figured that if I measured the wrong size I wouldn't be super heartbroken, since they aren't exactly a big investment. And I don't think they don't look so bad for a temporary set. The XXR's obviously don't come in an offset anywhere close to fitting my setup, so I had to make a set of spacers/adapters at work.

Final details on my tires and wheels:
Front Tire - Continental ExtremeContact 255/40R18
Front Wheel - XXR 531 18x8.5, backspacing (including spacer) 4.85"
Rear Tire - Continental ExtremeContact 275/40R19
Rear Wheel - XXR 531 19x10, backspacing (including spacer) 4.3"

Haven't gone for a test drive yet, still have a couple of things to tidy up. Also need to give it a quick eyeball alignment. It was definitely nice to be able to turn around in my driveway though... the spool made maneuverability pretty much impossible.

Spacers:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160502_184339_zpsahu8daiw-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160510_081358_zpsygwrvnxp-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160512_171537_zpswguhwn0g-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160513_082455_zpsmkrew35x-1.jpg~original

Cleaned up under the hood and all parts back installed:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160423_143307_zpsloxzkvl7-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160423_142931_zpsmaywgw5o-1.jpg~original

Fronts Mounted:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_140459_zpsbtpihamm-1.jpg~original

Rears Mounted - This isn't the final height, after this picture was taken I moved the lower shock mount to the 1" lowered set of holes.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_124936_zps9vhdpdst-1.jpg~original

Looks so weird with wide front tires now!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_163724_zpsukjgs0x7-1.jpg~original

Final (maybe) ride height. Still sits a little high for my liking, we'll see how much lower I can get away with.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_163533_zpsxmbicvfx-1.jpg~original

Drove it outside for some pics:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_162235_zpsvngwoym9-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_162103_zpskmcdmv8r-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_162035_zpsmshz7agb-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_162015_zpspjvsabsc-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_162006_zpssbxhggzu-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160514_161828_zps1o4ku5td-1.jpg~original

[rchaskin]

Looks Awesome!!!

[SSLance]

Looking good! I know it is a departure from what you are used to, but I think it looks great. I'd drive it a bit like that and see where things hit if at all.

I suppose you'll find that now that it will turn, you'll be more and more aggressive making it turn which will work the suspension more than you have been used to in the past. Remember, a suspension can't work as designed if it's riding on the bump stops all the time... ;)

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks! And totally understand. I actually have left the shocks at the length that ridetech recommends in the instructions, which is why I'm hesitant to do anything at all up front. It's easy enough to move the mounting points in the rear though.

[Deja-Bu]

Test drive success!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160520_204822_zpsyavqysgi-1.jpg~original

Still chasing a couple of little leaks, but aside from that, everything seems great! Talk about a very different driving experience, I can already tell it's going to be a lot of fun.

What are you guys running for initial setups on the ridetech coils? Right now everything on mine is full soft, and I can definitely tell, because the ride is a bit springy. I'm sure I can tinker with it and get it closer, but I'm just wondering if there is a good ballpark starting place.

Oh, and as a result of my test drive, I bought a Z28 Camaro steering box. Manual steering isn't going to cut it.

[SSLance]

I can't remember, do you have single adjustables or triples? And yes, power steering is a must, especially when you start adding copious amounts of caster. Congrats on successful test drive...

[Deja-Bu]

I have the triples. Now that I think about it, I feel like there were some initial settings in the instructions... I'll have to breeze through them. (Or maybe I read them in someone else's thread up here.)

[JKELCH]

Been following the build and I really like it so far. Congrats on the test drive btw. Also when looking at your pic of the car at the pump, the grille is reflecting dark. Just a thought, but it looks pretty cool and would be kind of cool if you painted your grille the same color as the centers on your wheels. Just my opinion...

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Well looks like you pretty much nailed it on tires and wheels. I agree with the grille, and the rest of the polished trim too. ;)

Looks fantastic Chad!!

[SSLance]

I have the triples. Now that I think about it, I feel like there were some initial settings in the instructions... I'll have to breeze through them. (Or maybe I read them in someone else's thread up here.)

Try these for initial comfort but firm street settings. Remember we start adjusting with the knobs all the way in clockwise (full stiff) and count the clicks out counter clockwise.

Front
Rebound -8 clicks, High Speed Compression (big knob on reservoir) -24 clicks, Low Speed Compression (small knob on reservoir) -15 clicks

Rear
Rebound -16 clicks, High Speed Compression (big knob on reservoir) -24 clicks, Low Speed Compression (small knob on reservoir) -15 clicks

That should get you in the ballpark, or at least started

[Deja-Bu]

Thanks for the compliments! And hmm I didn't even notice that thing about the grille... I do like it though!

And awesome, thanks Lance, can't wait to try those settings out.

[SSLance]

If the rear still has a bit of a jolt at the top, loosen up the rear rebound some more. Rear rebound will affect the ride quality more than anything else. I typically just soften my rear rebound all the way out before leaving a racetrack and leave it like that until I race it again. Not a whole lot of difference between -16 and -24, but it's there if you need it.

[Deja-Bu]

Well thanks for the tip again Lance! Turns out that I left my rear rebound on full stiff from when I removed the knob to assemble the shocks, totally forgot to turn it back down. All of the other settings were pretty close, as I had just left them in their factory locations. High speed knob on the reservoirs sure have some tight clicks, and the low speed I need total silence to hear/feel any hint of a click. Took it for a test drive again, and it rode perfect.

Took some more pics:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160525_182209_zpsw9fk4me7-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160525_185359_zpseqtqhmfp-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160525_182315_zpsin7wpydc-1.jpg~original

Old picture for comparison...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/322401_10150440246538005_388823772_o_zps-1.jpg~original

After the pics, I was left with this empty parking lot... Made me very glad UConn is on summer break! This car is 100x more fun than it has ever been. Power steering pump, pulleys, and brackets arrive today. Hopefully I can get all of that stuff in the car over the next week or two, and then it's off to my first big block autocross!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/05/20160525_181948_zpsgjc7fegt-1.jpg~original

[SSLance]

Man, I wish we had a parking lot like that around here to "practice" on... **drool**

I know what these cars ride like with rear rebound full stiff, I BET you are happier with it backed off. lol...

New version looks tons better than the old, keep on enjoying it...

[Deja-Bu]

Power steering! Test drive success, which pretty much sums up the swap. Only thing remaining would be an alignment at this point. And again, Ridetech provides some values, but I'm just wondering how real they are / what everyone else runs. I want to lean a little more toward the aggressive autocross numbers.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/06/20160606_211316_zpstfukzt0j-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/06/20160601_203459_zpsvxg3e2xr-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/06/20160526_171421_zpsmqz5ajzz-1.jpg~original

[SSLance]

Man you are getting closer and closer to having a daily driver on your hands every day! :D You'll be surprised how much you drive it I bet once you get it all dialed in. VIntage Air setup next?

[Deja-Bu]

Haha I'll just roll my windows down and enjoy it for now!

But if I ever get bored, I think a 6-speed would be next...

[Deja-Bu]

So you were right Lance, I've been driving this thing constantly. Even took it to work at one point last week! But mostly just going for after-work cruises. Still haven't been able to hit an autocross. The club around here only does them every other week and it always seems like I'm busy on those Sundays.

However, the more I drive the car, the more I think I need to do something different as far as setup. I have very little (like zero) feel through the steering wheel, and the wheel has very little desire to return to center. From what I understand, this could be a caster issue. Is anyone running the offset ridetech caster slugs? The kit comes with centered slugs, and they say they sell offset ones to increase caster...

I still haven't gotten a 'proper' alignment. I just gave it a tape measure alignment so far. So I'm sure that's not helping me either.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/06/20160621_220047_zpshlnfep8x-1.jpg~original
(Thought it was a cool picture. And it looks like I'm going fast, even though I wasn't haha.)

[SSLance]

I knew that you would enjoy driving it, you'll enjoy it even more once you get a proper alignment done on it. You should do whatever you need to do to get as much caster as you can out of it. I think spec is 3-4* on these cars and I run almost 10* of caster. There is no downside (if you have power steering that is) only upside here. The offset slugs will help as will longer bolts that hold the upper cross shaft to the frame.

Find out what shop around you will do a performance alignment (not just put it back to spec) and plan on spending a couple hours letting them dial everything in. Rear thrust angle, pinion angle and then the front geometry. It'll make a huge difference in how the car feels to drive.

[Deja-Bu]

Update! Got myself that alignment. My brother works at the local Chevy dealer so I had him align it with their fancy machine. Turns out I wasn't that far off with my eyeball measurement of toe. Caster and camber had to move a good bit, and I can really feel the difference especially on corner entry.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160709_122053_zps0yjbhsgd-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160709_170630_zpsnqvd8zv8-1.jpg~original

Except all of that extra handling ability led to a few problems...

G-forces mean sloshing of fluids, both in my breather tank (it accumulates oil mist and condensation after awhile) and in my coolant overflow tank. And all of that sloshing made one heck of a mess under the hood, so I'm updating both tanks now. For you fellow G-body guys, I went and bought the Canton racing bolt-in expansion tank. The mounting holes lined up very nicely, installation was a breeze, but I'm not exactly a fan of where it sits. Or how crooked it sits. So I'll be modifying the mounting tabs quite a bit.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160803_212143_zpsvyqqq11z-1.jpg~original

Also, had some major issues with the Ridetech front sway bar. First of all, I can't believe that people get away with self-tapping screws to hold the bar in. If you read up, you'll see that I stripped those screws out immediately during the install. So I improved on it with some big 1/2-13 screws and with some hand-tapping into the frame and bolster plate together. As you can see from this picture, even that didn't work for long. Found it starting to back out on me.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160731_201906_zpstozpirz6-1.jpg~original

Also, the three bolts that hold the endlinks to the center of the sway bar turned out to have issues too. I stacked the washers and tightened the bolts 100% per the instructions. Guess I waited too long to double check their tightness though, because I had all three bolts on the right side of the bar back out, and the whole endlink become disconnected. Luckily the tie rod caught the endlink and held it up off the ground. Check out the side that didn't become disconnected. Two of these are visibly loose.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160731_202738_zps2kl4bqgx-1.jpg~original

So I hit two birds with one stone and fixed everything. Drilled through the frame, bolted through with 1/2-13 bolt into a nylon lock nut. Also drilled through and bolted the endlinks together with lock nuts. Also replaced everything with stainless hardware, because it was depressing how fast all that old hardware surface rusted.

GM put the body mount hole in the perfect spot for me to squeeze a wrench in there!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160802_200443_zpsmjlweauv-1.jpg~original

Finished product

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2016/08/20160803_213134_zpsujbifwac-1.jpg~original

[SSLance]

Congrats on the alignment, that should help a bunch. As you get more aggressive, more caster and less camber will really make the setup shine. All in due time though. ;)

I have been lucky with my Musclebar I guess as the only frame bolt that has stripped on me I was able to get a nut on the back side, the rest have held solid for over two years of beating on it. I hear ya completely on the end link bolts, I have marks on mine and carry a tool in my console specifically for tightening them back up on a regular basis (like in between runs when at the track). I do not have room for locknuts like you did because of the tires I run...someday I'll figure something better out though. I'm not sure why they won't stay tight...even with locktite on them.

[Deja-Bu]

Finally took it to an autocross! It was so much fun, and I was so sloppy because I was too excited to be in control. (And most of the time, people were riding along anyway, so I was driving like an angry teenager.) The car performed great though! It was a one-hour ride to the facility, I got ten runs in, and a one-hour ride home. Worst thing that happened was an engine oil dipstick ejection, oiling down one side of the engine bay.

As far as handling goes, the car was mostly there. I was a wimp and left my rear anti-roll bar hooked up because I was afraid of rubbing on my first time out. That had some pretty bad effects on handling obviously. I'd frequently lift the inside rear tire off the ground (which can be seen in video below) and either hop around the corner, or unload the diff and spin the lifted tire. The times that the tire stayed down, the rear of the car wanted to pass the front. So next time the rear bar is coming out.

Part of me is wondering if I should go stiffer in the front as well. I don't recall now, but I think my front springs are in the neighborhood of 900 pound springs. There's lots of iron sitting on top of them though.

I took 3rd place in X-Prepared, to a couple of C6 Z06s. But I was firmly in the top half of the time sheet, which was awesome. Because as you can see, this wasn't exactly a "power car" autocross.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/05/malibu_high_res_zps3yxipakz-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/05/malibu_high_res2_zpsckr4xepa-1.jpg~original

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/05/malibu_high_res3_zpsfzumjzug-1.jpg~original

This is what happens when you know a camera is on you...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZS2wEizx8k

A bit more of a controlled run

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpi0btld074

And the in-car of every run I did. It starts off extremely sloppy and tames down juuust a tad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gNpPfB6oTk

Can't wait to go again!

[beater65]

Awesome.

I like the first "launch".... smoke um if ya got um lol

[JohnJ@RideTech]

I like your choice of suspension!

[Deja-Bu]

Time to bring the thread back from the dead! It's been a long fun summer with the Malibu. Total of three autocross days under its belt, each of them an hour or so from home. (Which is a big deal for a car that used to ride in a trailer.) And there was only minimal carnage.

On the last run of the last event, I broke one of my rocker arm adjusting nuts (solid roller cam) causing the valve to remain closed and the car to make awful noises. By some miracle, the broken bit didn't fall down into the engine, it was hanging on literally by a thread. I have since replaced this and taken the car out for a few test rides.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/vUk6ezj-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/1LRIz1q-1.jpg

A few autocross highlights from the year:

I got married this summer, and had an autocross day as part of my bachelor party:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/j767MmL-1.jpg

The mercedes may or may not be a rental car...
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/WOQAMxK-1.jpg

Took my fiancee out for a run, and was told to "take it easy" ... so naturally I overcooked a corner, spun out, and smoked the place up!
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/fw4YbsQ-1.png


https://youtu.be/7nQI9EneAPk

Okay and here is the ACTUAL good run:

https://youtu.be/JDvuwpfys70

After discovering that my Ridetech suspension is so totally awesome, I took out this big chunk of unsprung weight and sold it. This is a rear anti roll bar that works killer for drag racing, but it causes your inside rear tire to come off the ground at autocross. The car is sooo much better without it. (And it was unhooked in both above videos.) If you look at my previous post, you can see the inside rear tire coming off the ground though.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/OzXwllS-1.jpg


Onto the off season!

I want to pull my dash mounted tach off and integrate it. I machined the dash faceplate below for my brother's monte, and I have wanted one of my own ever since.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/PoLpfYd-1.jpg

My current status:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/EzZ2jni-1.jpg

And my Solidworks model, soon to be machined. I'm planning on using the yellow LEDs as a shift light, and will feed power from my signal lights to the green LEDs. (Something that my dad and brother did on the monte)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2017/11/SarX89a-1.jpg


Couple of other winter plans:

I'm keeping an eye out for a new frame. I'd like to start from a clean slate and brace up a stock frame a bit better than the one I currently have. Along with that, add a bit of clearance where I need more clearance. Now that I have the car pretty sorted out, I think it's time to remove some of the 'adapters for adapters that allow me to fit this bit' and actually integrate some of the necessary geometry.

I'd really like to get some decent tires for next year too. These Continental DW tires are like driving on ice. I'm in a class of cars where most everyone is running slicks, so I need to make a change to be a bit more relevant, as you can see below. Also - the fluid spilling everywhere is indeed gasoline. I had no idea this was happening until I took this video. Turns out the rollover valve in my fuel cell flows too well... this shall be addressed this winter as well. Guess I shouldn't fill the tank prior to autocross!

https://youtu.be/Lm9y3tTGU98

[Streetbu]

Great to hear Chad and congrats on your marriage! Scary seeing the gas dump out like that, but once fixed you mileage will go up LOL

[SSLance]

I love that you are now taking this thing out and beating on it on a regular basis! Fun isn't it!!

Do you not have CAM classes up there? A good set of sticky 200 TW tires will make a HUGE difference in your grip. I suggest Bridgestone Re71s but Rivals are good as well.

[2ABodies1FBody]

I'd be interested I. That factory Monte gauge cluster when you get your custom setup up and running. Let me know.

CLINT