1980 Malibu P/T build/daily

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

This is my 1980 Malibu. Had a 305 that was going to need a rebuild soon, when I came across a good running 454. So I swapped that in and lost all my "f-41" handling somehow.... So it's been my goal to make this car handle better than it did with the small block. So far I've triangulated my jounce bars, braced the frame rails at the back, installed belltech sway bars, 1 3/8" solid up front, 1" solid rear, and replaced all the tie rods, center link and idler arm. Obviously there's still lots to do to achieve my goal. Hopefully I can get some ideas from everyone here!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/04/2014071520211157_zpsyvqkgj0h-1.jpg (http://s6.photobucket.com/user/Escaped_psyco/media/Mali2/2014-07-15%2021.11.57_zpsyvqkgj0h.jpg.html)

[Justin@EntropyRad]

Looks sleeper, until you realize it's a G-Body

[Streetbu]

Nice! Might want some aluminum heads on that BBC to lose some front end weight. Next I would look into front a-arms and spindles to correct the horrible g body geometry. Keep us updated!

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

What would you recommend for spindles?

[Streetbu]

Depends on your budget. The afx spindles are very nice but by the time you add in brakes you'll have quit a bit into them. Many are doing the S10 Blazer dual piston front brakes and spindles. Geometry is exactly the same as a stock g body spindle, but there are several companies that make adapter plates to fit 13", 14" and even larger rotors and 4 piston calipers on them. Using all stock GM parts from C6 Vettes. Take a look at Detroit Speeds front Tru-turn kit. That takes care of the a-arms and will make it handle awesome. Lots of choices, almost too many to make a decision! Whatever you do stick with one brand otherwise you may have issues when it's time for an alignment.... Personally I'm saving my pennies for the DSE kit. SC&C, Hotchkis, Global West, UMI, and Spohn are some other popular ones.

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

New Wheels
235/45/17 Front, 245/50/17 Rear

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/05/20150522_130723_zpsrmdnc72z-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/05/20150522_130706_zpsi0fzhgmn-1.jpg

[Justin@EntropyRad]

that thing is awesome

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Nice score on the project car, looks like a great start. Big blocks are fun but generally small block/ LS are the choice for good handling. With that said, maybe some light weight heads as has been said and a fiberglass hood would help. Ultimately you want to get the car closer to 50/50 weight distribution for optimum handling. With some good research and decisions on what parts combination to use you can get really good handling no matter what engine you have. If you plan to autocross the car the grunt of the 454 will help you pull out of corners provided you are able to keep tire spin to a minimum.

There's a lot that can be done to a G body to make it handle, there are all the basics and then from there, like any car platform, you can get pretty crazy with it. Watch out for marketing gimmicks that give you cool gismos, rather focus on what will make a real difference in making the car handle and you'll find your money is better spent. Stay away from cheap ebay parts. In the Pro Touring world cheap means junk rip off designs that use cheaper materials and processes and haven't been tested to make sure they do what they're supposed to. Look for value not necessarily price, and sales folks that are really interested in making your particular car handle better rather than excitedly just pushing parts.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

When deciding on a suspension strategy really you have to decide up front what you're after- a nice daily driver that feels more stable than the factory suspension or an autocross terror, or something in between. Most importantly is to start with correcting the junk factory geometry so the tires stay planted while cornering. If the tires grip, you're golden. If the suspension is fighting itself and the tire contact patch isn't there, you're sliding. Here's just a few basic thoughts based on personal experience and what I've learned working in the industry. The whole how to make it handle question can go way deeper than this but it's a good start...

Resist the urge for mainstream dropped spindles. Often they are designed to lower the car and not do anything to help correct geometry, sometimes they make things worse. Our ATS spindles will do more for correcting geometry than any other spindle out there. As mentioned it does have caliper brackets that are of a C5/C6 Corvette configuration.

Tubular front arms arent tubular to just look cool. They lighten things up, reduce flex, have better bushings, and hopefully they help correct geometry. Our front control arms do correct geometry, improvements are designed into both the upper and lower arms. With several built in beneficial features, they aren't just tubular arms, they're designed to help the car corner better. Out back you need to strengthen things up and get rid of the bind which are both your handling enemy. While you're shopping take a look at our rear trailing arms. They are a two piece design based on endurance off road trailing arms- they rotate back and forth to allow the rear suspension to free up and move in a more fluid like motion. They're adjustable to get the correct driveline angle and we use greaseable Delrin bushings to eliminate flex and noise. They're near indestructible and create free moving joints that don't throw off geometry as the suspension travels through it's range of motion.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

A frame mounted rear sway bar will be more effective than a trailing arm mounted bar. You can't go too crazy with rear sway bars in G bodies though unless you really beef up the front. G bodies have a tendency to have oversteer (slide the back around) if you don't get the front to rear combination correct.

Shocks do wonders for handling. If you have the budget, adjustable Coilovers will give you the most tuneability. There are several decent shock options out there, we use Vikings as a standard with all our suspension packages because they make a great shock at a great price which equals a decent value. I have their new Crusader autocross valved coilovers in my car and they're pretty awesome.

The right spring rate will help hold the weight of that big block through the corners. G bodies have a natural shorter front suspension travel range in their configuration so a heavier spring won't feel as stiff as it might in other applications. I currently have 700# springs up front in my small block powered daily driver that has a stripped engine bay. To me it rides great- firm but not too stiff, and autocrosses well with my current combo. We would normally recommend 650+ for a car like yours. Ride height will affect handling. Most G body guys run 6-7 inches under the frame just behind the front tire. Less than that, although it looks cool, can throw off front geometry.

There's lots of info available out there about making a G body handle well. Some research and chatting with the guys that have pretty decent set up cars will help you make good decisions and avoid doing things twice. While shopping I hope you take a moment to check out our line. I can say from firsthand experience that I first went with what was the "popular" G body suspension parts. I tried that route and it was "OK", but later on wanting better handling performance I switched to a full Speedtech suspension and I am in much better shape now for what I wanted- a daily driver that is very competitive at the autocross. Here's a link to our G body parts page, check it out- Click here. (http://www.speedtechperformance.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=results/category_id=19/mode=cat/cat19.htm)

Good luck and feel free to ask specific questions, that's the best way to learn.

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

Thanks for the info, Ben.

Put some KYB stock replacement shocks in the front yesterday. What a difference over the 35 year old stock ones I pulled out! lol...

Just needed something until I can afford coilovers... and control arms...

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Thanks for the info, Ben.

Put some KYB stock replacement shocks in the front yesterday. What a difference over the 35 year old stock ones I pulled out! lol...

Just needed something until I can afford coilovers... and control arms...

Good on ya! This is a great example of how important shocks can be for handling. When I first took the jump from an old school street/ strip Nova to building my G body into a Pro Touring car, I had no idea about performance handling suspension geometry, shock valving, spring rate and such. If you're like me at all you're in for a great education. I went from upgraded non adjustable shocks to single adjustable traditional shocks to double adjustable coilovers to double adjustable specific autocross valved coilovers. It was a valuable learning experience to see the improvements/ changes in the car's feel they made along the way.

By putting the KYBs on there you're also getting a feel for what the right improvements can do. If you do upgrades step by step you'll also get the vantage point of seeing how much each part will help/change handling. Keep us posted on how things go!

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

I wish I could simply do everything at once and see an extreme difference, but I guess doing one thing at a time has it's advantages. It is nice to see/feel every small increase in performance per part installed

[Grayel]

What are the dimensions of these wheels? How tall are the tires? I'm new to pro-touring as well and would like to know, when it comes to handling, does it matter if tire/wheels are staggered sizes or the same size on all 4 corners?

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

these are 17 x 7.5 with a 6" backspace, but with 2" spacers

[Ben@SpeedTech]

I wish I could simply do everything at once and see an extreme difference, but I guess doing one thing at a time has it's advantages. It is nice to see/feel every small increase in performance per part installed

You got it. I sort of did it this way and I think I've gained a better understanding of making a car handle this way.

Grayel-

In a recent seminar with Ron Sutton he said although staggered tires sizes look cooler, for better handling he felt it was better to have the same size all around. His explanation included you can still make staggered sizes work fine but you end up detuning the rear suspension to compensate for the larger contact patch. Another thing to consider- I put a lot of miles on my car every year. I used to have it staggered with 275s out back and 255s up front and the tires are directional. For rotations all I could do was go side to side and I got charged to dismount the tires and mount and balance again each time, which can get costly over time. I now have 275s all around and I can at least rotate them front to back at no charge at the tire store for that. The car works great with all 4 tires the same.

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

New ball joints... should have done springs while I was in there lol. Steering's a lot more firm now

[Ben@SpeedTech]

:cool:

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

Brainstorming.....


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151130_192305_zpswjusgygl-1.jpg

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Yeah buddy!!

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

Coming Along....


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151209_200819_zps8hejasui-1.jpg
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151210_195013_zpsl2tmvam1-1.jpg

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

More mockup


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151230_201928_zpsz8bvti1j-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151230_201857_zpsb1zrcsq0-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2015/12/20151230_205552_zpsijtaegvn-1.jpg

[andrewb70]

What are the specs on the turbo?

Andrew

[Dayzedandkonfuzed]

94mm 1.41 a/r turbine, 55 trim. It might be a little big for the 454 but I think I'll be investing in a quick spool valve

[18tilidy]

I live in Quesnel,B.C.Would you interested in a 1980 Malibu car for parts?