Back Space for DSE Camaro?

[badazz81z28]

Does anyone know the correct back spacing for 18" wheels on a 1970-74 Camaro with the DSE frame and Mini-Tubbed Quadra-link?

They reccomend 6.125" on the front with a 18x10 but what is the safe max?

I think I saw the DSE Camaro has 315s on the front and 335s on the back.

[Z06vet]

Not sure on 2nd gen, but my instructions for the first gen subframe list several wheel sizes & backspacing as well as tire sizes. Can probably read thru the 2nd gen instructions on their website. I noticed they modify the inner fenders on a lot of their builds. I'mjust guessing but with a 315 id think it would at least need some massaging. Sounds like youre planning a nice build. Scott

[MuscleRodz]

should be 5.5

[badazz81z28]

Well now that I'm actually measuring, looks like 5.750 and 6.00 give you the clearence from the lip.mis 5.5" expecting you to roll or shave the horizontal fender lip?

[badazz81z28]

Here is 5.750" backspace, you can visualize what it wouldb be 1/4" pushed mire outward to 5.5" BS

[badazz81z28]

Here's the other side. A little manufacturing defect in the production line with the inner and outer fender. I will have to clean ths side up

[badazz81z28]

Here's with it at 5.5",


I need advice...should I shave the fender lip to gain "more" clearence where the tow tie down is of tuck it in.

[badazz81z28]

Did another mock-up again...I don't know, IF this wheel works 45 IS accurate, 5.750" is what is needed to clear to the lip. Here I thought the tool would put my mind at ease.

[badazz81z28]

More

[icemanrd19]

stop overthinking it. I did the same

I posted in your other thread but heres what you need to do

Use the DSE specs.

Whatever the difference in total length between dse rear end and your rear end you then split it in half and either add or subtract from dse rim measurement of 5.5

Example you rear end is 1 in total length longer than dse well you need to subtract that from the wheels. So you need to bring the wheels in .5" each wheel. if dse suggest 5.5 you then need to run 6" in backspace.

If your rear end is longer than dse then add to the 5.5 backspace. If your rear end is shorter subtract from the 5.5 backspace

[badazz81z28]

It's actually DSEs spec'd 56.250" rearend and they said 5.5" and as you can see it doesn't fit unless I trim 1/4 off the lips or roll them.

I know I'm pulling my hair out, but we are talking about $5k rims!

[icemanrd19]

Like i said i did the same exact thing and ordered the same tool you ordered. I wasn't happy with that tool.

I used dse specs on the rear of my 1st gen.

[badazz81z28]

Like i said i did the same exact thing and ordered the same tool you ordered. I wasn't happy with that tool.

I used dse specs on the rear of my 1st gen.

Did you have to roll or trim the fender lips?

[icemanrd19]

nope. NO triming or anything.

there has to be someone on here that has a junk 18 x12 rim.

[badazz81z28]

nope. NO triming or anything.

there has to be someone on here that has a junk 18 x12 rim.


As you can see in my pics, something isn't right. This is 5.5" backspace

[icemanrd19]

http://www.forgeline.com/wheel_fitment.php


double check using this

[Forgeline Wheels]

I would agree with Icemanrd19. Load the suspension so that the car is at ride height and measure from the WMS ( wheel mating surface) to the fender lip and then from the WMS to the bolt that seems to be limiting your backspace.

Send me this info and I will look at the numbers and see what makes sense. Measure both sides to make sure they are the same.

[badazz81z28]

Mark,

Those pictures are weight on the suspension. What is the minimal inside clearance? If I run more BS, hitting the tie down is the concern, as you can see the wheel fit tool lip has about 1/2" clearance

[Forgeline Wheels]

Ideally, 1/2" to 3/8" clearance on the inside and outside. The wheel will measure 1" wider than stated size as the flange thickness is 1/2" per side.

[badazz81z28]

I took some measurements of the tool and about 13" end to end. I so much feel 5.75" is the right number but everyone it seems are running 5.5". I'm missing something.

All my tool pictures are set at 5.75" BS

[icemanrd19]

LOL split it. 5.6125

Do you have any rims sitting around that will bolt up? The wider the better. If so i have an idea

[badazz81z28]

LOL split it. 5.6125

Do you have any rims sitting around that will bolt up? The wider the better. If so i have an idea



Just the ones on my car now. 17x9 with 275s, 5" back space

[icemanrd19]

To far in? If so add 1/2 spacer to the rim and kick it out. see how it fits on the inside of the inner fender. Keep adding spacers till you get the inner position perfect. Plenty of places sell cheap spacers or you can cut down some pipe to kick the rim out. After that you know the backspacing you need and then order your rims

Make sense?

[carbuff]

I was also going to suggest: you are better served to have too much BS vs. not enough (at least in small amounts). When I was in between numbers, I went up (more BS) and realized I could use a 3/16" to 1/4" spacer if I needed to. Which is exactly what I do now (1/4" on both sides).

I'm about to get a new set of shells from Mark to stuff way-too-much front tire under my Firebird. I'll be doing the same thing with the new setup as well: running a spacer to get it just right. I am struggling with my outer shell width. I only have one choice for the inner since my centers are already cut...

Good luck.

[badazz81z28]

I was also going to suggest: you are better served to have too much BS vs. not enough (at least in small amounts). When I was in between numbers, I went up (more BS) and realized I could use a 3/16" to 1/4" spacer if I needed to. Which is exactly what I do now (1/4" on both sides).

I'm about to get a new set of shells from Mark to stuff way-too-much front tire under my Firebird. I'll be doing the same thing with the new setup as well: running a spacer to get it just right. I am struggling with my outer shell width. I only have one choice for the inner since my centers are already cut...

Good luck.


What are you running right now?

I like idea of splitting it lol...5.6125, never crossed my mind lol...I would really like to see how close other sec gens run to the lip

[carbuff]

What are you running right now?

I like idea of splitting it lol...5.6125, never crossed my mind lol...I would really like to see how close other sec gens run to the lip

I don't use the DSE components, so my numbers won't help you any...

[badazz81z28]

I don't use the DSE components, so my numbers won't help you any...



Not DSE specific, just how close people run their tires to the fender lip

[icemanrd19]

Im telling you. Put your 17" rim on there and add spacers till the inside part of the rim and tire is your liking. You know that offset is 5". That gives you a darn good starting point. If you have a extra half inch of clearance on your current rims on the inner half to where it would be comfortable then you know your backspacing. The inside lip to the hub is the same for all rims if the backspacing is the same. Doesn't matter if you have a 15x6 with 5" backspacing or a 18x12 with 5" of backspacing. Both inner part will be in the same area. Put your old rims on

[Forgeline Wheels]

I took some measurements of the tool and about 13" end to end. I so much feel 5.75" is the right number but everyone it seems are running 5.5". I'm missing something.

All my tool pictures are set at 5.75" BS

You can always run a thin spacer if you need. We have several car builders that will use thin spacers to fine tune a fitment. If you feel that 5.75 is best and DSE recommends 5.5, worst case is that you will need a .250 spacer. We can make a nice spacer if you want or you can get one from an autoparts store. Many places have them available.

[rickpaw]

Dude, you're overthinking it. Looks like you're getting your wheels from Forgelines. Just use your wheel fitment tool and make your measurements, or consult with Forgelines on how to measure it, as others had stated already. DSE specs are what they use on their cars, but most of everyone on here will know that these cars were never the same, even when brand new from factory.

We followed DSE's specs on the front wheels on a 65 Mustang with Aluma Frame. We ended up adding a small spacer since the wheel had too much BS to our liking.

For the wheels on my Firebird, I added some additional BS from the recommended numbers, just so that I can fine tune the fitment.

[badazz81z28]

I
Dude, you're overthinking it. Looks like you're getting your wheels from Forgelines. Just use your wheel fitment tool and make your measurements, or consult with Forgelines on how to measure it, as others had stated already. DSE specs are what they use on their cars, but most of everyone on here will know that these cars were never the same, even when brand new from factory.

We followed DSE's specs on the front wheels on a 65 Mustang with Aluma Frame. We ended up adding a small spacer since the wheel had too much BS to our liking.

For the wheels on my Firebird, I added some additional BS from the recommended numbers, just so that I can fine tune the fitment.

I agree, but it seems nobody has veered off from DSE'd reccomendations which makes me question myself. I have the tool and Yes I am getting DS3 Forgelines. Looking to see if I can get pictures of other people's fender lips to see where the majority tire rest on their car.

[badazz81z28]

Seems a lot of people are not using DSEs front frame recommendation. Why is this? Are you all hitting or rubbing with 6.5 BS?

[Rod]

You can always run a thin spacer if you need. We have several car builders that will use thin spacers to fine tune a fitment. If you feel that 5.75 is best and DSE recommends 5.5, worst case is that you will need a .250 spacer. We can make a nice spacer if you want or you can get one from an autoparts store. Many places have them available.

if you do any autocross or racing running thin spacers allow you to adjust track width....I run spacers front and rear and by simply removing or adding i can make the car push or oversteer

[MrQuick]

I'd go towards the cautious side. All cars are different. You will find that once you load the wheels and suspension it will pull in anywhere from 3/16" to 1/4" which is why we use test wheels.

If it were me i'd run the 5 3/4" and run spacers to fine tune it. 5.5" but I would smooth the lip and open up the outer wheel house.

[badazz81z28]

I wish I had mock up rims to install! The suspension is loaded with weight on the axle in the pictures.. I wish I could find folks with the same axle width to compare. Where is the tire supposed to end up? Inside that lip? Or where it does with 5.5 and trim that lip?

[Nine Ball]

You are doing it the right way, measuring for fitment. I would not personally suggest planning for spacers, that is why we take careful measurements - to avoid doing that. These older cars vary too much to just use published data. Quarter panels that have been replaced might stick out further than original. Right and left sides can vary a little. A lot of factors.

Two things I noticed:

1. Could you flip those grade-8 bolts on the lower shock mount, so that the head of the bolt faces the tire? That would give you a little more clearance.
2. It appears your quarter panel on the driver side was repaired by just laying it over the top of the original quarter panel. I see two lips there. I'd be tempted to cut those down, or roll them, on both sides.

Just measure carefully, and pick the backspacing that is the worst case from either side. That way you know that both wheels will fit both sides.

Tony

[Alponcho]

I wish I had mock up rims to install! The suspension is loaded with weight on the axle in the pictures.. I wish I could find folks with the same axle width to compare. Where is the tire supposed to end up? Inside that lip? Or where it does with 5.5 and trim that lip?

Curious about what you ended up going with and how it worked out. I'll be needing to purchase my wheels and tires soon and am looking for examples of what has worked for others with similar set-up (I too am 56.25 total).

[badazz81z28]

I went with DSE Specs. Trimmed the fender Lips and actually rolled them for peace of mind.