Ridetech, hotchkis, etc. Why no discounts?

[Robsutt]

Every time I look around for suspension parts they always seem to say something like "no further discounts apply". Am I shopping for this stuff at the wrong websites?

I've got time before I need it as I'm just about to have unibody repaired in my 68 camaro. So was hoping to wait and find a sale like Classic industries does every now and again.

[spacepirate]

If you order directly from Hotchkis ask them for a discount. I've done that a couple times and got 10-15%. Also join their email newsletters and they'll send you discounts that way too.

[Schwartz Performance]

Some companies have an established dealer network and do not want to "steal" their dealers potential customers by offering sales. RideTech is a good example. They often offer free shipping, free tshirt, etc, but let their dealers work out discounts if necessary.
Were a dealer for RideTech btw.

-Dale

[Robsutt]

Interesting. Classic offers 10% but won't apply their additional sales percentage. I'm pretty sold on the ridetech 4 link rear. Still working out what to do in the front. Reading up on other posts. Thanks for the info.

[bret]

The reason for no discounts is both logistical and philosophical. I beleive that a product needs to be priced fairly for the end user while allowing the manufacturer to create enough profit to allow development of the next new technology or product. Along with that there needs to be at least some margin for the dealer who will administer the sale...explaining the features and benefits, answering tech questions, following up on the order, etc.
Some manufacturers build in a large retail price knowing that discounts will be given to the end customer. When you buy a RideTech product you pay a fair price [no matter who you buy it from, dealer or direct], we make enough profit to continue more product development, and the dealer [if they make the sale] makes enough to service the sale. If a discount is given on a product that means that whoever offered the discount beleives that his product or service is worth less than the retail price. If I believed that I would have lowered the retail price to begin with. I think you'll find that most premium products are sold that way. Porsche, Tumi luggage, Apple, and any really nice restaurant come immediately to mind. Companies like these increase value instead of lowering the price.

Being a hotrodder way before I was in this business, I can tell you that targeting value in the form of tech support, superior design, reliability, and function will make you much happier than the search for the absolute lowest price. In this age of instant access to information, no one is capable of overcharging for their products. The competition is just too tight.

Thanks for enduring another rant :)

[BMR Sales]

The reason for no discounts is both logistical and philosophical. I beleive that a product needs to be priced fairly for the end user while allowing the manufacturer to create enough profit to allow development of the next new technology or product. Along with that there needs to be at least some margin for the dealer who will administer the sale...explaining the features and benefits, answering tech questions, following up on the order, etc.
Some manufacturers build in a large retail price knowing that discounts will be given to the end customer. When you buy a RideTech product you pay a fair price [no matter who you buy it from, dealer or direct], we make enough profit to continue more product development, and the dealer [if they make the sale] makes enough to service the sale. If a discount is given on a product that means that whoever offered the discount beleives that his product or service is worth less than the retail price. If I believed that I would have lowered the retail price to begin with. I think you'll find that most premium products are sold that way. Porsche, Tumi luggage, Apple, and any really nice restaurant come immediately to mind. Companies like these increase value instead of lowering the price.

Being a hotrodder way before I was in this business, I can tell you that targeting value in the form of tech support, superior design, reliability, and function will make you much happier than the search for the absolute lowest price. In this age of instant access to information, no one is capable of overcharging for their products. The competition is just too tight.

Thanks for enduring another rant :)

Well said, Bret!

Another aspect - many companies offer Sales to move Unsold Inventory. Our Business is way Up & Inventory Turns are very quick. To run a Sale right now, would lower margins on the same Inventory Turns & create Backorders.

We typically run a Sales after Thanksgiving to let the GearHead a chance to buy himself something special at X-Mas at a Great Price while we keep the guys in the shop busy during the off-season.

T.C.

[badazz81z28]

Well said, Bret!

Another aspect - many companies offer Sales to move Unsold Inventory. Our Business is way Up & Inventory Turns are very quick. To run a Sale right now, would lower margins on the same Inventory Turns & create Backorders.

We typically run a Sales after Thanksgiving to let the GearHead a chance to buy himself something special at X-Mas at a Great Price while we keep the guys in the shop busy during the off-season.

T.C.


the the best way to get discounts are places like Summit racing. They don't discriminate when it comes to brands. When they offer 10%, there are no hidden disclaimers. You can get Hotchkis products cheaper from them than Hotchkis themselves.

I have been looking for a deal on a DSE frame....waiting for Ricks camaros sale and have Summit price match.

[UMI Tech]

Thanks for your thoughts on this Bret. We are in the same boat. Rant appreciated.


The reason for no discounts is both logistical and philosophical. I beleive that a product needs to be priced fairly for the end user while allowing the manufacturer to create enough profit to allow development of the next new technology or product. Along with that there needs to be at least some margin for the dealer who will administer the sale...explaining the features and benefits, answering tech questions, following up on the order, etc.
Some manufacturers build in a large retail price knowing that discounts will be given to the end customer. When you buy a RideTech product you pay a fair price [no matter who you buy it from, dealer or direct], we make enough profit to continue more product development, and the dealer [if they make the sale] makes enough to service the sale. If a discount is given on a product that means that whoever offered the discount beleives that his product or service is worth less than the retail price. If I believed that I would have lowered the retail price to begin with. I think you'll find that most premium products are sold that way. Porsche, Tumi luggage, Apple, and any really nice restaurant come immediately to mind. Companies like these increase value instead of lowering the price.

Being a hotrodder way before I was in this business, I can tell you that targeting value in the form of tech support, superior design, reliability, and function will make you much happier than the search for the absolute lowest price. In this age of instant access to information, no one is capable of overcharging for their products. The competition is just too tight.

Thanks for enduring another rant :)

[badazz81z28]

Thanks for your thoughts on this Bret. We are in the same boat. Rant appreciated.


With all the superb examples of pro touring cars owned by these companies, profit margin isn't good? Those cars like DSE /heidt/wildwood etc etc are not cheap, plus all the travel and up keep.

[68zz502fi]

I'd suggest going with the complete RideTech suspension, as it's engineered to work together. You'll probably be much happier in the end, and have less problems with parts working together.

As far as getting discounts, just ask around, contact RideTech dealers. You can often get a better than list price from a dealer, as some of them actually understand it's better to make a little less vs lose a sale altogether. RideTech IS good stuff no matter what dealer you get it from, why not try to get the best price. They're still making money, or they wouldn't sell it to you at whatever price.

[MonzaRacer]

I'd suggest going with the complete RideTech suspension, as it's engineered to work together. You'll probably be much happier in the end, and have less problems with parts working together.

As far as getting discounts, just ask around, contact RideTech dealers. You can often get a better than list price from a dealer, as some of them actually understand it's better to make a little less vs lose a sale altogether. RideTech IS good stuff no matter what dealer you get it from, why not try to get the best price. They're still making money, or they wouldn't sell it to you at whatever price.



Take this from a guy working in auto repair industry, there are formulas to let businesses "build in" discounts. BUT,,,
Issue #1: some flyby night dealer will sign up ,say with Bret and Ridetech, sell these parts SOOOO cheap then go out of business.
or
Issue #2 swap in underpriced knock offs and pocket the difference and keep good parts or sell them elswhere and go out of business.
or
Issue #3 under sell part, starve to death and go under giving screaming deals

Now lets talk business attitude and ethics.
Low cost materials, offshore work = cheap parts + LARGE mark up = HUGE discount sales. % off deals etc.
OR High volume parts mixed with low volume parts percentage and salesmen have daily "allowed discount percentage" IE it takes them a 60% profit margin (internal review information) too keep people fed, paid, lights on etc. so you get "that extra discount".

As long as all salesmen are on same page and at end of day they "break even" or "come in under" they make MORE money on commission.
In out industry many of them DONT play that game.
They build quality parts "in house" or "in contract" with set costs, they know the salary of the people, ie no big sales commissions (remember Wall Street bail outs, those bonuses were actually contracted and cost of doing business regardless of where company money came from, if they shut down ,got no help from government the company would pay them FIRST).
I am sure Ridetech, BMR, Speedtech, Hotchkis and others(sorry guys just had too throw up solid names) are in business too sell solid well build part from quality materials and use qualified and verified assemblers,welders,machinists, etc. to give you best part with no compromise.

I saw a "knock off "company that competes with Ridetech selling their "copy" (a word I use lightly) of a ShockWave, they were at least half price and lo and behold I get an ALIBABA flier and whats in it, those knock off parts. And if you saw the limited cost on buying those POS parts in bulk, like a ShockWave knock off costing LESS than $200 each with shoddy Chinese air springs on them. I was blown away considering I KNOW what some of the current air springs cost from reputable makers like Firestone cost.

As for DEEP discounts, I doubt you will ever see them from any of the P-T parts makers, they KNOW what it takes to make a quality part, make a profit and keep people fed, paid and lights on.

Here is what I tell people who ask me about their daily driver, do they trust it, is it due for major repair (ie trans, engine) major corrosion issues.
If not ,drive it, do the maintenance and PICK a car you want and amount you can sped on it or go car shopping, find out if what you want fits your budget.
THEN set up an account, start saving that amount. what ever you save, every 10 months add a zero to end of that number. IE saving $250 month, 10 months =$2500.

Gee is you think about it, decide what part you want, find what you can save every month, divide total price by that, there is numebr of months you have to get to point of ordering baring a price change.

Hoping for a sale too save $1000 isnt gonna happen very often, but if you decide on parts, start saving for them the they happen ta da you get parts early.

I have hopes to move up in job soon as I WANT more flexibility in my finances. Time will tell either a new job, a raise or opening my own shop are my plans.
As for little discounts, as said before asking for them might get you one or free shipping.

But dont expect too see Ridetech throw out 1/2 price level 3 set ups, They work hard too keep prices reasonable and quality top notch.

A LOT of Classic's parts tend to be priced high so they CAN dump some price and many of their parts are offshore parts either in production or raw materials. Nothing against that but the higher percentage of buyers either have money, credit or big dreams and could care less if they have a door panel coming for their car that cost them $199 and has $25 in parts aand an hour of labor in it. and off shore labor is LOW COST.

[XTRMEASURES]

Very very well said guys.....
If you ask whomever you are buying from to give you some kind of discount I'm sure they will be more then happy to do so. I've bought shocks from Mr. Dale and plan on buying again from him. As he said he's a dealer for Ridetech and that's my next shock to try.

[vintageracer]

How about this idea.

Let's get ALL manufacturer's and therefore their authorized dealers to RAISE the list price of their parts so they could then offer "discounts" on their parts so we will all feel good about receiving the "discount" we desperately seek all the while paying the same price you can the parts for NOW!

[Robsutt]

So this turned into an interesting thread and went a bit left when I thought it would go right. Heh. My goal was to make sure I wasn't the sucker that paid more than others just because I didn't know. Consider me educated now.

Glad I now know that there are knock off companies out there. Wouldn't have thought that in a nitch market like this. Guess there's a-holes everywhere trying to screw someone.

Appreciate the well thought through answers.

[68zz502fi]

Yup. Like I basically said, do some "leg work" and be a smart/savvy consumer. You'll get much better than list price, and the exact same parts and service.

[Robsutt]

Yup. Like I basically said, do some "leg work" and be a smart/savvy consumer. You'll get much better than list price, and the exact same parts and service.

Thanks man.

[CFster]

A company that returns emails and phone calls gets my business. Much more important than saving a few bucks.

[68zz502fi]

Thanks man. Glad to help anytime.


A company that returns emails and phone calls gets my business. Much more important than saving a few bucks. I agree, plus I saved some money... Best of both worlds.

[Boatmark]

Pricing and discounts have been somewhat *******ized over the years. There was a time that a sale was a tool to move excess or obsolete inventory. The monies lost by the discount were offset by the need to pull the money back out of the non-moving inventory. Now, most every consumer wants some sort of discount on any sale, so in essence if you are going to play that game in many industries . . you have to build in some increase to cover the discount.

But shopping solely by pricing and discounts is short sighted. Smart money shops value.

Since Brett has chimed in already, lets use Ridetech as an example. There are cheaper knock-off's of their products out there for much less money. So what do you receive when you spend more money with RideTech?

- Superior quality - American made parts built with quality materials
- Tech support from knowledgeable people who have the expertise to answer your questions, and provide application and build advice.
- A company that will be around to provide warranty and support year in and year out.
- A company that writes the checks to sponsor events and contingencies in the hobby / sport.

All of which provides value for the dollars spent. All of which cost money to provide. All of which generally goes away with discount offshore parts.

- And on a personal rant as a business owner / sometimes manufacturer - This idea that a deep discounted sale is better than no sale is actually a myth. Sometimes it is necessary, most of the time it is just throwing money out the window. Business Economics 101.

[TheJDMan]

"Smart money shops value."

I think that one statement sums it up best. I paid good money for my DSE subframe but I know I got a good value for my money. The same applies to RideTech products. I see this same scenario in retail everyday. There are basically two types of customer I deal with, one shops only for price the other shops for the best value. Customers who only look at price are not concerned about quality and there is a whole segment of the industry that caters to building the cheapest product possible just for them. On the other hand the customer who shops value is more concerned about the quality of the product and that segment of the industry is focused on building a quality product and pricing it fairly.

If you want cheap, buy cheap. If you want quality, buy value.

"Smart money shops value."

[Paraman1]

"Smart money shops value."

If you want cheap, buy cheap. If you want quality, buy value.

"Smart money shops value."

My motto has always been , "Buy Quality , Cry Once " .

That being said I had my suspension system picked out and was saving my money for it when I noticed Summit had it on sale for about 450 bucks less than I had budgeted for it originally so I bought it a little earlier than I had anticipated . The money I saved makes a nice start towards other portions of the project .

The fact that many of the higher end suspension components are made in the USA is also a plus to me . The job I save buying their product instead of the Ebay knock off might be my own .

[killer69]

I think Bret said something that most are afraid to say. "we need to make profit" the dealer needs to make PROFIT. Everyone who touches the item needs to make money from the raw material supplier to the box company. When I look at how many times the individual parts are touched just before the end user opens the box for the last time it is amazing. Speedtech is in the same boat with Sales and Discounts. We normally do a monthly "SALE" for different products weather they are new or overstocked, but we don't discount our parts pricing. But we will give you the best service both before and after the sale we can. and we stand behind our product.

[Robsutt]

My motto has always been , "Buy Quality , Cry Once " .

That being said I had my suspension system picked out and was saving my money for it when I noticed Summit had it on sale for about 450 bucks less than I had budgeted for it originally so I bought it a little earlier than I had anticipated . The money I saved makes a nice start towards other portions of the project .

The fact that many of the higher end suspension components are made in the USA is also a plus to me . The job I save buying their product instead of the Ebay knock off might be my own .

Yea this was exactly my point to the post. Not that these guys need to start doing bed bath and beyond type coupons (that crap drives me nuts but my wife's eats it up). But where and what should I expect when making a purchase of one of their products. I'm not looking for knock offs but the real deal and to know I'm not over paying just cause I didn't know to check summit for example.

[killer69]

Yea this was exactly my point to the post. Not that these guys need to start doing bed bath and beyond type coupons (that crap drives me nuts but my wife's eats it up). But where and what should I expect when making a purchase of one of their products. I'm not looking for knock offs but the real deal and to know I'm not over paying just cause I didn't know to check summit for example.

Speedtech for Example, if you go to the web site find the part you want, the price is listed right there. if you are paying more than that price then you are paying too much. you can do a Google search by part number and see what comes up.

[Classic Nova & Performance]

the the best way to get discounts are places like Summit racing. They don't discriminate when it comes to brands. When they offer 10%, there are no hidden disclaimers. You can get Hotchkis products cheaper from them than Hotchkis themselves.

I have been looking for a deal on a DSE frame....waiting for Ricks camaros sale and have Summit price match.

I don't want this to come across as a rant, but as food for thought.

There are a couple of things to keep in mind with this strategy.
1. Summit cannot always get the complete product line or upgrades for a given manufacturer. If a base kit is what you are after, then its not a problem. If you want upgrades it will be a problem.
2. Summit doesn't install parts, and to most of them it is just a part number in their computer system. Quite likely they have no hands on experience with the parts.

As the owner/operator of a small shop that builds cars, sells & installs parts we have been used in that way multiple times, as recently as last week. A potential customer contacts us for an estimate on Ridetech parts. They also had numerous technical questions about the installation of the parts. After spending 20+ minutes on the phone walking them through the installation I put together the estimate and emailed it to him. The next day he emails us to ask if we will beat Summit's price on the kit, along with a copy of their offer to beat our price.

My hope is that people realize that the value of a product or service is not just a question of where you can get it the cheapest. We are competitive on our pricing, but feel the added value we give our customers is our product knowledge and experience working with the products we sell. We are in the process of scheduling a week to go work with one of our manufacturers so we can expand our familiarity with their product lines, as well as the manufacturing process. This is expensive for a shop to do, but adds value to what we can offer our future customers. I do understand the financial side of building cars. I just hope people will consider the true value of what an independent shop/dealer has to offer.

[Robsutt]

I don't want this to come across as a rant, but as food for thought.

There are a couple of things to keep in mind with this strategy.
1. Summit cannot always get the complete product line or upgrades for a given manufacturer. If a base kit is what you are after, then its not a problem. If you want upgrades it will be a problem.
2. Summit doesn't install parts, and to most of them it is just a part number in their computer system. Quite likely they have no hands on experience with the parts.

As the owner/operator of a small shop that builds cars, sells & installs parts we have been used in that way multiple times, as recently as last week. A potential customer contacts us for an estimate on Ridetech parts. They also had numerous technical questions about the installation of the parts. After spending 20+ minutes on the phone walking them through the installation I put together the estimate and emailed it to him. The next day he emails us to ask if we will beat Summit's price on the kit, along with a copy of their offer to beat our price.

My hope is that people realize that the value of a product or service is not just a question of where you can get it the cheapest. We are competitive on our pricing, but feel the added value we give our customers is our product knowledge and experience working with the products we sell. We are in the process of scheduling a week to go work with one of our manufacturers so we can expand our familiarity with their product lines, as well as the manufacturing process. This is expensive for a shop to do, but adds value to what we can offer our future customers. I do understand the financial side of building cars. I just hope people will consider the true value of what an independent shop/dealer has to offer.

Indeed. It's the total package.

[Buryingthesun]

I could care less about saving $20.00 on a $500-$800 coilover set up as long as the manufacture responds to emails and phone calls with questions and concerns about a product. Id rather spend my money with a company that wants to do business with me then a company that just wants to collect my money by cutting the throats of others

[BonzoHansen]

A potential customer contacts us for an estimate on Ridetech parts. They also had numerous technical questions about the installation of the parts. After spending 20+ minutes on the phone walking them through the installation I put together the estimate and emailed it to him. The next day he emails us to ask if we will beat Summit's price on the kit, along with a copy of their offer to beat our price.
"That guy" sucks. I used to run into that all the time when I ran a tire outlet. It's abborent behavior IMO.

[bret]

I could care less about saving $20.00 on a $500-$800 coilover set up as long as the manufacture responds to emails and phone calls with questions and concerns about a product. Id rather spend my money with a company that wants to do business with me then a company that just wants to collect my money by cutting the throats of others

Can I make a T shirt out of this?

[Classic Nova & Performance]

Bret, I'll take an XL if/when you do!! :-)