Toyota - Nissan - Mercedes hybrid project..

[V8-190E]

*New name for the project*

I am currently building a Mercedes 190e...which will have a Toyota 1uz-fe (32v V8) mated to a Nissan 6 speed and diff center section. There have been a couple other threads on here with 190's so I thought I would add this here as well. These cars terrorized the European DTM circuits in the late 80's with the 16v engine versions. This car was bought for cheap of CL as it had a blown rear end....how do you blow a rear end with a 103hp automatic Mercedes 4cyl? The car came with a decent Eibach suspension and neat wheels...

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The 4 litre 1uz-fe Toyota motor is rated at 265hp/275tq stock. It is all aluminum and will weigh in at just about 400# the way i will have it dressed. Factory forged crank and rods, 6 bolt main caps, dohc's and 10:1 compression. Pretty neat motor for how cheap they are in wrecking yards. Capable of holding 15psi of boost in stock form which is pretty impressive. Motor, trans and diff pics...

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Motor out Ewww gross...

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Nice and clean

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One of the big drawbacks of these cars and V8 swaps is the steering box and drag linkage has to go in favor of a R&P set-up. Engineering a R&P system is a bit beyond my skills...luckily I found a guy who has done it successfully with a SBF powered 190 track car. He was nice enough to share part #'s and locations that worked well for him. This is the bolt on rack mounting plate I made - that also ties in the rear A arm pivot points.

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I went to a wrecker and bought another rear sub frame and modified it to work with the larger Nissan diff - 3.91:1 ratio and limited slip!

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....And that is where I am at so far.

PW

[Later-A-body]

I think your build is a pretty cool idea. The Toyota V8 is a stout motor. How much boost do you plan to run?

[V8-190E]

No boost initially - after everything works and it is driven for a bit I may turbo it. I am planning on using ITB's and megasquirt out of the gate though.

[no go nova]

Nice thinking outside of the box. What nissian trans is that?

[Damn True]

Interesting. Curious as to why you didn't go with a modern AMG mill?

[IrishBoxer92]

Gotta love them itb's, I'm looking forward to seeing how this turns out

[V8-190E]

Nice thinking outside of the box. What nissian trans is that?

Trans is from a 350z

[V8-190E]

Interesting. Curious as to why you didn't go with a modern AMG mill?

Waaay to expensive for this project and complicated to deal with electrically. Apparently the anti theft key system is a real challenge.

Motor,trans and diff for this project cost less than $1000.

[nathankershaw]

Loving it.
I'll be watching closely :)

[Supra510]

Nice.

[ADiCarlo]

1uzfe's are fun motors, there all over the junkyard in lexus SC400's and it a light car are awesome.

Can I ask how your going the get the 350z trans the mate to the 1uzfe. I've only seen conversion kits for the W58 and the R154.

[Motorcitydak]

Awesome build, will be watching very closely. I came very close to buying a 190e Cosworth a few years ago, such cool cars!

[V8-190E]

1uzfe's are fun motors, there all over the junkyard in lexus SC400's and it a light car are awesome.

Can I ask how your going the get the 350z trans the mate to the 1uzfe. I've only seen conversion kits for the W58 and the R154.


These guys sell them:

http://www.suprastore.com/uzsecltr.html

[V8-190E]

A few pics of the sub frame finished:

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And painted with silver "Hammerite" paint..
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[V8-190E]

The motor/trans adapter plate came in the mail today! Which means the motor and trans can finally go in soon.:headbang:

Also came with custom bolts for perfect alignment....

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[V8-190E]

I bought a 350z stock composite drive shaft last night off of the local Craigslist for $40.

Interestingly....the 190e wheelbase is listed at 2664mm....and the 350z is listed at 2649mm - only 15mm difference. There is a vague possibility that the stock 350z drive shaft could work as is depending on where I end up placing the engine and transmission.... Considering that it will bolt directly to the rear diff without modification and slip into the trans this would be a pretty convenient outcome.

If it does not work then I will "re-tube" it with a steel pipe to the correct length using the rear U-joint and the front slip yoke.

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[dangina]

love the 1uz, except the starter placement. I've gone through 2 starters so far, their fun in a small car!

mine in my ae86

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/IMG_20120803_171523_zpsb80869cf-1.jpg

[ADiCarlo]

love the 1uz, except the starter placement. I've gone through 2 starters so far, their fun in a small car!

mine in my ae86

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/05/IMG_20120803_171523_zpsb80869cf-1.jpg

Being one of the I'm kind of shocked at the amount of guys here who have tuned imports at least one time in there life.

PS that 86 must been fricken awesome. I wanted to do that to my te72.

[jp455]

Nice! Love it when parts from various brands come together. I actually had a 190E not that long ago, about 2 years ago. Was planning on fitting an S2000 engine/trans in it but got a company car which made 3 cars too many. look forward to seeing this finished!

[V8-190E]

Finally got around to changing the driver's seat covers. When I got the car the interior was really good except the seat - sagging base and cracks in the vinyl.

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I got a mint black cover set on ebay and bought another nice blue seat at the wrecker to use instead of the stock one.I may change the front seats later to something lighter but I do like the stock seats classic look and feel.

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[V8-190E]

Adapter fits perfect!
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I took the old iron block 2.3 and auto trans to a local metal recycler yesterday. According to their scale the complete fully dressed motor and transmission weighed in at 564lbs (without oil and trans fluid).

The Toyota V8 weighs in right around 400lbs (configured as I will be running it), the 350z trans weighs in right around 125lbs and the adapter plate, flywheel and clutch assembly are about 50lbs.


So....the V8 swap looks like it will be close to even or only add about 10 lbs to the car. The VW rack I used is probably at least 10 lbs lighter than the heavy bowling ball sized steering box I removed... so all in all it is going to be pretty close.....but with about 170-180 hp more than with the 4.

[brawls43]

Awesome looking build, super excited to follow this. I have a couple extra 1UZ's laying around from my race car, a 92 SC400. I did the W58 swap, but I like the look of the 350Z trans plus diff. I'm running a Supra TT-auto diff with the stock LSD. So are you running the newer 96-97 engine for the higher compression and power? Did you go with an SC400 engine for the rear sump vs the LS400 with the front sump oil pan? I can't wait to see how your ITB's go, I've been eyeing that mod for awhile. Would love to see more info on how that at the megasquirt goes.

[V8-190E]

Awesome looking build, super excited to follow this. I have a couple extra 1UZ's laying around from my race car, a 92 SC400. I did the W58 swap, but I like the look of the 350Z trans plus diff. I'm running a Supra TT-auto diff with the stock LSD. So are you running the newer 96-97 engine for the higher compression and power? Did you go with an SC400 engine for the rear sump vs the LS400 with the front sump oil pan? I can't wait to see how your ITB's go, I've been eyeing that mod for awhile. Would love to see more info on how that at the megasquirt goes.

The motor is the early style from a '92 LS400 - front sump. I did not think the rear sump SC400 set-up would fit with the MB cross member very well.

[brawls43]

The motor is the early style from a '92 LS400 - front sump. I did not think the rear sump SC400 set-up would fit with the MB cross member very well.

I think the front sump was the way to go for your cross member for sure. What clutch and flywheel are you going with? Are you doing a hydraulic throwout bearing?

[john31s]

Subscribed

[V8-190E]

The transmission I have has a standard slave cylinder/fork type throwout.

I bought a machined flywheel from the same place that I got the adapter from. I am awaiting the correct ARP bolts to show up so I can bolt it up. I haven't decided on which clutch yet. It will have a 350z disc and a Toyota plate though.

I lifted the motor into the engine compartment to have a look at what issues will need to be addressed...not too bad.

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And a shot from the trans tunnel at the back side of the motor.
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Looks like the corvette C6 motor mounts will work fine once I flatten the top of the cross member a bit. There is a decent amount of room to make headers as well.
Passenger side
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Drivers side
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The left rear (passenger) side of the head hits the part of the firewall that hides the battery. I hit it in a little bit with my hammer but I think it needs some better attention.
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The rear of the oil sump hits the front of the stock cross member. I will need to cut it back about an inch or so to get the motor back a bit. I may have to make a new rack plate without the cut outs...
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Once that happens the front of the sump will clear the stock sway bar better and the rear of the oil pan will be in the best position for clearance above the steering rack.

The steering rack has some cast in threaded bosses that will need to be ground down as well for better clearance - they are touching now.
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[brawls43]

Hopefully piecing together the 350Z disc and Toyota pressure plate goes okay. It seems like its getting to be a common swap, so I'm sure there are options out there. We run a Stage 1 Exedy clutch and its done great so far. It was easier with the W58 trans, I just needed a 3VZ (4Runner) clutch.

Looks like the engine fits pretty well, everything considered. Can't wait to see more!

[brawls43]

Also, what ITB setup are you going with? The OBX one's from ebay? Or something else?

[V8-190E]

Also, what ITB setup are you going with? The OBX one's from ebay? Or something else?

I think the OBX ones - that company is pretty hit and miss with quality.... but I have not heard anything bad about the ITB's for the 1uz except that the manifold requires a small area to be clearanced to fit properly. There are a lot of guys running them online successfully.

[brawls43]

I've read the same about the OBX. Seems like for the price, its worth the little work clearancing, and maybe even port matching them. Really thinking about doing this over the next winter. ITB's sound SO glorious.

[V8-190E]

Custom flywheel is bolted on now with new ARP bolts..
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I cut the offending bolt bosses off the steering rack and smoother it a bit. This combined with the editing the front of the cross member should allow the motor to sit in the right spot. Also, I am hoping that since the rack is a bit higher than where others have placed theirs I might be able to get away without clearancing the the top of the lower control arms....we will see fairly shortly.


Before
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Now
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[chevyz240]

Very nice project! I like the mixing and matching of different brand components!

[V8-190E]

I have been cutting and editing the factory cross member motor mount area. The 1uz stock mount location is very close to the same width as the holes in the factory cross member.... But on the cross member they are not the same height or on a flat plane.

I cut open the top sloped areas:
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I ran a somewhat pre-shaped piece of 3mm plate all the way across to make sure both sides were perfectly flat and level:
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Once it was square and flat I welded it in where it touched the cross member and cut out the center:
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I cut open the front of the cross member and welded in a piece of 1.25" x 1.25" x .25" wall tubing to beef things up. I also installed and welded in the rack plate and finished the mount boxing in:
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I will finish welding in the front of the cross member when I take the motor back out...but the sump clears it, the steering rack and the sway bar now.

Drivers side mount:
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Passenger side mount:
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Sway bar clears:
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Rack clears - about .25" everywhere even though it does not look like it in this pic :)
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Cross member clears:
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[V8-190E]

Oh...and no more ITB's planned for the project.
I think this will be a better option :yum:

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[2ndroundko]

Who needs throttle response when you have brute force? Nice build!

[driveit]

Keep it up I want to see where this is going.

[V8-190E]

I am starting to edit the stock lower manifold to accept a new plenum above for the supercharger to sit on. Certainly could be a worse manifold design to start with.

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In this pic the blue arrows show how much needs to be cut away/machined flat to make this work - all the way down to the red arrows.

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The SC looks pretty good sitting on there right now but the hood does not close all the way - it is pretty close..like 2" more at the front and it would shut. This may improve once the manifold is done but I have resigned myself to the possibility this may not all fit under the hood...and I may need to graft on a bit of a hood bulge.

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[V8-190E]

I cut off the tops of the lower manifold and then had my friend mill it flat so I can weld a new plenum to the top to receive the supercharger.


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So far it is working great and with a mocked up 1.5" tall plenum the hood is really close to closing all the way. I may have to do a bit of grinding (nicely) and re-tap the bolts a bit lower to the SC where the throttle body inlet mounts to get it down all the way.

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[brawls43]

Freaking awesome! The 1UZ's love boost, so this should work great! Are you going to ditch the hydraulic fan and go electric?

[V8-190E]

Freaking awesome! The 1UZ's love boost, so this should work great! Are you going to ditch the hydraulic fan and go electric?

Not sure - I have found that stock engine driven fans always seem to work the best. I may have to though depending on final engine placement front to back.

[LS1-IROC]

Sweet project!

[brawls43]

Not sure - I have found that stock engine driven fans always seem to work the best. I may have to though depending on final engine placement front to back.

We've been running a shortened belt, and 2 LS400 fans for about 4 years in our race car. Its not ideal being pusher fans, but when we get the coolant system properly burped (which can be a pain), we haven't had any fan problems.

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[dangina]

I can't wait to see how you do this sc setup! thats my next step. The manifolds offered on the net for a sc are so damn expensive...I also can't tell are you running power steering?

[V8-190E]

I can't wait to see how you do this sc setup! thats my next step. The manifolds offered on the net for a sc are so damn expensive...I also can't tell are you running power steering?

No power steering or AC for this car. The stock pulley location on the SC snout is not long enough to allow the SC to sit in an acceptable location on the manifold plenum so I am going to try and use a M112 one (03-04 Cobra SC). The pulley needs to be at least an inch forward.

[Thomo5150]

Hi, have you measured the pivot points on your suspension to the steering rack? The racks pivot points look a few inches shorter to the Mercedes lower suspension pivot points in your photos. There is a science to rack and pinion conversions, since you have used someone else's set up I'd check it. Plenty of info on suspension design that can help you.

[V8-190E]

Hi, have you measured the pivot points on your suspension to the steering rack? The racks pivot points look a few inches shorter to the Mercedes lower suspension pivot points in your photos. There is a science to rack and pinion conversions, since you have used someone else's set up I'd check it. Plenty of info on suspension design that can help you.

Good eye - the pivot points are actually on the inboard side of the inner tie-rods - not shown in the earlier pics. Once they are threaded onto the rack ends the pivot points look to be really close to being in line with the lower arm pivots.
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[Thomo5150]

That photo answers my question. Cheers

[V8-190E]

I have the plenum extrusion cut and opened up to expose the manifold ports. I have to do some serious die grinding to smooth out the butcher job I did with the plasma torch by hand though....
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[V8-190E]

Been busy with other things as of late but got a bit of time to work on the manifold set-up. I bolted the manifold to a flat steel jig to keep it flat when it is welded.


The port opening have been smoothed pretty well - ready to have the plenum welded onto the shaved manifold.

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The supercharger mount plate will be welded on from upside down after the plenum is welded... then the end caps will be welded on last. Once all the welding is done I will have it lightly milled to ensure it is flat on the top and cut the openings for the supercharger inlet.

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Blower fits on and clears the stock fuel rails.

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[V8-190E]

I found a factory GT500 shelby throttle body for a good deal and it fits without modification so looks like that is the one I will use - twin 57mm butterflies should be just fine for flow....I just have to convert it from drive by wire to throttle cable.

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I also removed the 2.6" diam pulley that would have given way too much boost to start off with - about 15psi with the stock crank pulley. It also placed the grooved belt area too far back for this application. I can use a pulley originally designed for the Ford Lightning pick-ups to bring the boost down to about 9psi and place the ribs in a more forward location.

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This is not mine but has had the same pulley offset treatment - the stock location is in the pic below.

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[brawls43]

Could also look for 03-04 Mustang Cobra throttle bodies. I think they were still drive by wire, twin bores, and supercharged.

[impala65maniac]

Cool build, I had thought about using the 1uz in my mk3 supra before I sold it. Cheap reliable engines and easy to find. Keep up the good work man.

[V8-190E]

Some welding progress - got the plenum fully welded top (inside) and underneath to the stock milled down manifold. I will position and weld the end and top plates on once I have my pulley offset figured out on the SC.

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[PhillipM]

Looking great. Enjoying watching the work go in. Keep it up.

[V8-190E]

Looking great. Enjoying watching the work go in. Keep it up.

Thanks - my first car was a White 64 Studebaker Daytona....I have been following your awesome build as well!

[V8-190E]

Not a lot of progress as of late....I sold my old Miller MIG (110volt/135amp) welder a few weeks ago and have been waiting to buy the right replacement. I now have a new Thermal Arc Fabricator 211i (220volt/210amp) MIG/TIG/Stick machine with an aluminum spool gun. Now I can finally finish fabbing the intake manifold.

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I was also lucky enough to buy a new snout for the supercharger from a ford Lightning/03/04 Cobra supercharger. It is about 1.5" longer and will make it easier to line up the front pulley and have the SC base in the right place on the plenum. These are really hard to find used as the Mustang 4.6 crowd uses them to swap in the bigger GT500 SC. The older, longer snout bolts up directly to the newer SC. In the 2nd pic you can see the difference in snout length between the 03 Cobra and mustang GT500 type superchargers.

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I also have to get a larger SC pulley - the one on the snout now will push about 15psi with the current crank pulley...too much to start with!

[V8-190E]

The SC snout finally showed up! Now I can finish mocking up where it will sit on the manifold and in turn finish welding.

It is a good 1"+ longer than the stock one on there now.

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I had to notch the front of the plenum to clear the front cast water jacket pipe.

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[V8-190E]

Just about finished the manifold....A bit uglier than I would have liked welding wise...but should be strong enough and air tight.

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Another piece of the puzzle sorted last night....I got a great deal on a Snow Performance stage II water/meth injection kit! This will be used to cool the intake charge instead of an intercooler.

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[chunger]

I'm curious about the water/meth injection kit. Does it spray all the time or is it activated by boost pressure / throttle position?

[V8-190E]

I'm curious about the water/meth injection kit. Does it spray all the time or is it activated by boost pressure / throttle position?

From their website:
"This kit uses manifold boost pressure to determine when and how much water methanol to inject. Proportionally injecting according to boost pressure gives the most accurate delivery of water-methanol and allows the most cooling and performance improvement over the widest range. More power and driveability is the result. It can be used on any forced induction engine: carbureted, fuel injected, turbocharged, positive displacement or centrifugal blowers."

[V8-190E]

A while ago I noticed that when I test fit the axles....the cv boots would rub on the sub-frame...So I had to cut and box in some reliefs.

Each side got boxed in completely and small gussets to help brace the suspension mount point. I can push in pull out and twist the axles around and the boots do not touch anywhere. This whole clearance issue is because the CV's and the center section are quite a bit wider than the stock MB unit. Finally ready to install in the car...

Cut open with the plasma carefully:
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Testing boot clearance during welding:
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Everything all done, painted up and fits!
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[dangina]

looks like its coming along just nicely!

[dusterbd13]

damn. this is a cool build. I really like the truly oddball stuff.

mind if I share this over at GRM?

[V8-190E]

mind if I share this over at GRM?

Sure - no problem.

[V8-190E]

I have the motor back out to finish boxing in the areas that I cut away to clear the head and oil pan. A few more things to fix and then I can do a few skims of bondo to smooth things out before repainting in there.


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[cl08]

cool and different!!!

[sixfivepost]

Cool stuff! Please don't take this the wrong way, but I'm a welder and am just trying to help. I hope you NDTd (non destructive testing) all of the welds to ensure there isn't any porosity, cracks, or other issues. Definitely don't want any of those issues in the forced induction system. Also, some of the aluminum welds have black soot. That usually indicates dirty base metal or not enough gas. Some soot is unavoidable, but if really clean and with enough gas, there should be little to none. Also, did you have any issues welding to the cast manifold? Cast aluminum can be tricky and if not properly pre and post heated, it can crack fairly easily or porosity can occur.

Again, not trying to muck up your thread, just trying to pass along some info.

Overall, looks good and the project is kick ass.

[driveit]

Looks like you are still moving along.

[V8-190E]

Cool stuff! Please don't take this the wrong way, but I'm a welder and am just trying to help. I hope you NDTd (non destructive testing) all of the welds to ensure there isn't any porosity, cracks, or other issues. Definitely don't want any of those issues in the forced induction system. Also, some of the aluminum welds have black soot. That usually indicates dirty base metal or not enough gas. Some soot is unavoidable, but if really clean and with enough gas, there should be little to none. Also, did you have any issues welding to the cast manifold? Cast aluminum can be tricky and if not properly pre and post heated, it can crack fairly easily or porosity can occur.

Again, not trying to muck up your thread, just trying to pass along some info.

Overall, looks good and the project is kick ass.

Thanks for the suggestions - I had a professional welder pre-heat and weld the plenum to the cast manifold :) he welded it from the top and the underneath to make sure it was sealed well. I did the flat top plate to the plenum...and I think the results are sealed well enough and will work. I did go over any spots that after I wire brushed it that looked suspect or could have any holes. That is also partly why it looks kind of crappy.

[V8-190E]

I recently bought some 300e spindles, calipers, vented discs and steering arms. The stock 190e front brakes brakes have 10.2" solid discs and these direct bolt-ons are 11.5" and vented with larger calipers and pads. These are basically the same brakes that MB put on the Cosworth 16v 190e cars for racing.

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I need to cut the steer arms down 1.25" so that they will work properly with the Jetta rack. This is what they look like before editing. I will cut them down and jig them up but won't be doing the welding myself. It is too important that a pro does this and I have contacted a long time well regarded local race car fab shop to TIG them back together for me.

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It will be done similar to these BMW arms that were shortened:

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It was sooo lucky I managed to contact the owner of this V8 1090e and that he shared all of his measurements and engineering regarding the R&P swap! My interpretation is slightly different but what a great starting point from a known sorted car that works well. His has a 400+hp SBF/5 speed in it and is apparently a terror on track.

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[V8-190E]

I cut down and tacked the steering arms...now awaiting TIG welding at a local race car fabricator. They should be finished by tomorrow afternoon.

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I also picked up a Jetta mkii steering shaft with the correct lower u joint - power racks and manual racks have different splines... The length as is is pretty close but it needs a different upper u-joint to work with the 190 column shaft profile.

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Using the stock shorter snout as a drilling guide I drilled out the missing hole on the new SC snout. I need to mill a flat area for the bolt head to seat on still which may require more backside JB...

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I filled in the back of the casting with JB weld around where the new hole was as it was partially going to be in the void area.

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[V8-190E]

I cut down the tie rods today and checked for fit and clearance above the lower A arm. It clears the arm easily and everything looks pretty good so far.

Cut and beveled with 2" removed.
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I welded the rod and then ground it flat and then sleeved it and welded it again.
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Some pics of the drivers side tie rod installed.
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All of this is going to come back out to clean and paint when I swap in the bigger brakes and new struts.

[V8-190E]

Well after a few months of having the benz in storage (while we reno'd our new house) I am about to get back into this project!

In the downtime I built another CNC plasma table. It turned out great and I thought it would be a useful to make a plan set and "quick start" parts pack available to others. Designed for the DIYers that might want to get a head start on their own CNC plasma project.

http://www.hotrodfab.com

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The rest of the fabricating on the 190 will take advantage of having this set-up close by in the new shop!

[brawls43]

Nice looking set up!

[V8-190E]

Nice looking set up!

Thanks - this is cnc table design version 5 for me. :)

[Poopy]

Sweet! I love 190e's, and UZ motors... :)

[brawls43]

Still a little bummed you didn't go the ITB route. haha.

[V8-190E]

Sweet! I love 190e's, and UZ motors... :)

Haha I am in Abbotsford too!

[Poopy]

Haha I am in Abbotsford too!

Well crap, we'll have to go on an oddball mixed duck car cruise some day. lol

[brawls43]

How's this project coming these days?

[V8-190E]

How's this project coming these days?

Well not at all....It was eventually sold after we moved due to a lack of space to work on it. The car is still around although it was sold without the drivetrain - Getting a Nissan RB motor swap instead now. The drive train went into an early Toyota corolla.

[brawls43]

Bummer, I really liked this build. Cool the engine went in something fun. A benz with a RB would be cool to see too.

How's the cnc table plans biz going instead?

[Michaels 69]

How's the cnc table plans biz going instead?

I'm curious too on this.

[V8-190E]

I'm curious too on this.

The plasma kit sales have been pretty good - especially considering how little advertising we do. We are at around 100 kits in the field and table build sizes have ranged from 2'x2' up to 4'x8'. Really good feedback from customers who have stayed in touch. Some we never hear from again which is fine too.

On the car front I bought a 1987 IROC Z convertible to play with - Quite rare to find a vert with 4 wheel disc, 3:42 posi, oil cooler and 5 speed TPI. Very few Iroc convertibles in 1987 (744) and of that only 10-15% were 5 speeds.

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