Ultimate Street Car Association

[SicMonte]

A new racing series was announced today at SEMA. Seems pretty cool...but I just can't help the fact that it just seems like the lil guys are being left behind in the dust here.

Maybe I'm just crazy but I was counting every penny I had this year just to attend 3 ASCS events as a spectator/helper. In 2012 I raced at a lot of events and it pretty much made me broke between gas for the truck pulling the trailer, hotels, registration, and constantly fixing the car! Now I really feel like I am missing out! lol

What do you all think?

http://ultimatestreetcarassociation.com/

[Project92rs]

I think I need to see more details before making any decisions. The vagueness of the points system as announced today would lead me to believe the series will favor people with the time, money, and/or sponsors to make the majority of the events so shop mules would appear to be favored here. But the overall rules are pretty vague at this point. There are some very interesting tracks listed though.

The real worry I have is what does adding more events to the calendar do to attendance at each of the events. Like you stated, Doug, there is only so much time and money to be spent on events for the majority of participants. Most of us can't afford to make it to more than a couple of events in a year and when you add in more events there is a chance the events won't fill when we have to choose which ones we take time off work for.

[HELLCAMINO]

If your the lil guy left in the dust then I must be the peon being swept up in the dust pan. I drive to every SCCA event I can afford to make it to and would love to be able to attend a USCA event. That is wishful thinking.
What is this "truck and trailer" you speak of?........LOL

[SLO_Z28]

This is an alternative to the ASS not in addition too. The ASS is exclusionary to a big segment of the automotive aftermarket that isn't pro-touring. This will be inclusive and professional at real big name tracks not parking lots. A consistent and planned event format will take a lot of confusion out of the events. This also provides a more logical progression to the end of year Optima Challenge. I'm game for Laguna Seca and AAA for sure, and possibly in for Portland as well. Looking forward to 2014 season!

[dontlifttoshift]

This should be cool, if they can come up with a


A consistent and planned event format

[howehot]

If run as passed Optima Qualifer/Faceoff events I have attended, each event will be very organized. Points will be for a selected few who have the time and $$$. I don't have the time or $$$ but do have an addiction for speed and this will help me get that high. I don't plan to win or place in the top 20, but that's not why I spend my money to participate. Friends, old and new, and the venue to run my Monte as it was built to is why I do it. Anything beyond that is just gravey.

[SicMonte]

True story Dan and I agree with you 100%. I will never win an event and I do it for the friendships and the fun.

I do have one thought though...with this new series, Goodguys and the ASCS the calendar just got real tight. Do you think attendance at the events will be affected due to the large number if events now?

And what about the sponsors? They have to pick now...

[dontlifttoshift]

http://ultimatestreetcarassociation.com/USCA.pdf

[SLO_Z28]

The USCA events are televised, I know where the sponsors are going to go. I don't think this new venue is going to hurt old ones as its going to attract a whole new level of cars and participants.

[dontlifttoshift]

http://forum.chumpcar.com/index.php?/topic/9125-the-usca-drift-circuit-what-they-are-and-arent/

[Project92rs]

http://forum.chumpcar.com/index.php?/topic/9125-the-usca-drift-circuit-what-they-are-and-arent/

If what is shown in the first post of this link is correct about full cages and 5 pt harnesses, then I don't know if we'll show up to any of these. Those rules could result in a lot of cars not being eligible. That rule definitely excludes the car we run at ASCS and SCCA events as it only has a harness bar and 4 pt harnesses which is a combination that still allows us to use it as a daily driver.

[justimagine]

Full roll cages and harnesses will be encouraged, but will not be required to attend and have fun in these events. Safety is our primary concern, but we also understand this is a street car series and cages and harnesses are not always practical. As well, the series is for all makes, models and years of real street cars. Participants are not required to participate in the points series and there will be more than one way to earn a spot in the OPTIMA Ultimate Street Car invitational.

We are still ironing out the rules and points systems, but rest assured that each event will be safe, organized and fun and will offer a bucket-list experience for street car owners of all skill levels at a competitive price.

We have 10 USCA events, ASCS will have at least five events and GoodGuys will have almost 20 Autocross events across the country. There will be something for everyone. The street car perfromance marketplace is a viable and robust market, and all of these series and events will serve to bring more attention to our hobby. The combination of all these events provides an experience for every year make and model of street car and we support them all.

[SparkyRnD]

I'd go to as many as possible. I have been to half a dozen ASCS events / goodguys events this year, and none of them did I have a vehicle to race with. I think I had a more fun time just spectating, hanging out with friends, and watching cars, without having to worry about my car / gear / breakage. Next year, when my car is done, I'll attend as many as my wallet will allow.

[PT Sportwagon]

Well looks like it does favor the people with the $$$$$$. But if I can attend an event. I will try. Maybe they will have an event at Miller motorsports park or Kerney.

Tim

[79-TA]

The big draw that the USCA has for me right now are some of the big name tracks, Laguna Seca in particular. Just how much track time can entrants expect to get on track? I've never gotten more than 30-35 minutes of road course time at RTTC. I'd want far more than that to make a drive to any distant big name track. Sharing events with Chumpcar seems like it will really limit track availability.

[Rod]

I see lots of cool stuff, how much??

[mpozzi]

I see lots of cool stuff, how much??

Depends on the track most likely. Lots of information forthcoming around January 1st. Each track will probably have Supplemental Rules and Requirements as well.

Mary Pozzi

[ohsolow]

This is going to be interesting, can't wait to see the rules package I know cars running 160+ at some of these tracks I personally like roll cages at that speed but that sure doesn't make it a true street car though or does it because my question is what is true street car? A radio ? Air conditioning or cup holders? Outside looking in this is going to be a tv motivated series which I'm good with, the sport can always use the exposure . With the tracks being all over the country it will be financially challenging without your rich uncle to run the series but hitting one or two might be fun I can't wait to see what it cost to race at Daytona you don't rent that place for $2500.00 bucks for the weekend!

[ChevelleNV]

I am really looking forward to this, I was fortunate enough to win a free entry to the first race of the year at the PT Dinner... kinda sucks my Chevelle is nowhere near done, but I do have something I can bring to the track my friends 2004 WRX STI ASP (A Street prepared) SCCA race car.

[James OLC]

This is going to be interesting, can't wait to see the rules package I know cars running 160+ at some of these tracks I personally like roll cages at that speed but that sure doesn't make it a true street car though or does it because my question is what is true street car? A radio ? Air conditioning or cup holders? Outside looking in this is going to be a tv motivated series which I'm good with, the sport can always use the exposure . With the tracks being all over the country it will be financially challenging without your rich uncle to run the series but hitting one or two might be fun I can't wait to see what it cost to race at Daytona you don't rent that place for $2500.00 bucks for the weekend!

One of the ways that the USCA is working to keep track rental costs down is by working in conjunction with the ChumpCar Series and sharing track time. You're absolutely correct facilities like Laguna, Fontana, and Daytona are very expensive to rent (we looked at Fontana for an event last year and were shocked at the daily rental cost) - even with 100 cars the daily rentals alone (net of insurance, fire, medical, etc.) would be tough to pass along to competitors. By working with another series and sharing some of the costs associated with track costs it helps to keep our costs down.

This should be a really fun series and although I doubt I'll be able to run more than a few of the events it's a great time for our hobby with lots of choices, opportunities, and friends.

[Mike Holleman]

Chump car runs three formats. Twin 7 hour, 12 hour and 24 hour. How do you fit a three day event into their schedule? And how do you put Joe Blow with his high powered street car on a VIR or Daytona safely? You cannot turn an inexperienced driver loose on high speed tracks without major safety requirements and training.

[TheJDMan]

Sounds interesting but I will need to see a lot more details before I make any plans to attend. I sincerely hope they put some sort of mechanism in place that will allow the little guys on a shoe string budget to compete with the big guys who can afford to attend many events. Maybe some sort of a weighted points system or better yet simply average the points earned from each event by the number of events attended. The bottom line is that if you want this new organization to succeed you need to get the little guys like me involved and feel we at least have a chance to compete. I suspect there are a lot more of us on limited budgets than there are those with unlimited funds.

[71RS/SS396]

Chump car runs three formats. Twin 7 hour, 12 hour and 24 hour. How do you fit a three day event into their schedule? And how do you put Joe Blow with his high powered street car on a VIR or Daytona safely? You cannot turn an inexperienced driver loose on high speed tracks without major safety requirements and training.

I agree with you Mike on the safety aspect. I know first hand how scary VIR can be in a high powered street car. 150mph-160mph are possible on the back/front straight in my car and with no aero the car is flat out spooky.

[bret]

I think the Ultimate Street Car Association is the next logical step in the popularity of our sport. Every trend, movement, or sport starts out with a small core group of supporters who work exponentially hard ( out of pure passion) to pursue their given sport. As time goes on (hopefully) the popularity grows and brings in new people and interest. We've seen this with the RTTH events, the Goodguys auto cross series, and OUSCI. As the sole originator of the Goodguys auto cross series, I was fully inspired by Bill Howells RTTH event. To this day I won't miss the Pigeon Forge event because its just a hell of a lot of fun. I ve also attended ( and plan to continue to attend) as many ASCS events as possible for the same reason. I was also the original (and now continuing) sponsor of the auto cross segment of OUSCI.
And now we have the Ultimate Street Car Series...the next logical step in the progression of popularity of our sport. As hotrodders, we now have even more opportunity to enjoy our sport. As businessmen we now have the opportunity to be seen by geometrically larger audiences. I see nothing but great things from this (and I've done a fair amount of thinking about it) RideTech will continue to support this series as a sponsor and a participant because it is not only good for business, it is good for the soul. While it is important to my ego that my car perform well, it is even more important that my family has a good time at these events. Anyone who saw me and my son Andy at OUSCI this weekend can tell that we did indeed have a great time. I do not see that dynamic changing with the expansion of the series.
Will there be kinks? Sure. Will absolutely everything be to every individuals liking? Obviously not. But think about the fact that the event promoters(Jimi Day and Wally Olzcak), the first two sponsors (Bret Voelkel from RideTech, plus Mike Copeland and Ken Lingenfelter from Lingenfelter Performance), and the overall Series sponsor, (Cam Douglass from Optima)... are hotrodders. This is the perspective that this group brings to this project. That is why I am comfortable that the events will be safe, fun, and well run...in that order.

Lets go have some FUN!!

[srh3trinity]

I agree that it is the next logical step. When I started lurking around this site, cars had upgraded leafs and shocks, 17 inch wheels, brakes and maybe an LT swap with the very rare LS swap. The game has evolved for many so there should be another stage. People are interested in auto-x but also big track experiences. It won't be for everybody and many wont be able to pay to play or be able to field a car for the series, but I am fairly certain most of these dream tracks would be otherwise above my and many other's pay grades. It looks like the right people are involved to make it happen and do it the right way.

[justimagine]

Ladies and gentlemen, enthusiasts, hot rodders,

The USCA is committed to safety first at all of these events. Secondly, we want to make the events fun and accessible to everyone, without regard to any specific economic demographics. And we are working hard to level the playing field. This series is not about prize money, it's about the cars and the people that drive them, that's what our street performance industry is all about. TV will not dictate the competition, it will cover it in a credible and respectable manner.

We don't have all the rules figured out yet, but we work on them daily. And safety requirements are at the top of our list. We know some of these tracks are very high speed or technical, and I've personally driven on every one of them, so I know. Our USCA group has organized and run hundreds of events at tracks all around the country and we have the necessary knowledge and experience to make the events fun and safe for all skill levels.

As for sharing track time with Chumpcar, I promise you will have a significant amount of track time at each one of these facilities. Our events will have five elements, and all the facilities have an adequate amount of space to run all the events. Our planned format will run Friday through Sunday, starting with a road rally and social event. Saturday will be Autocross and speed stop while Chumpcar is on the track, and we will run a track day on Sunday. At certain venues, we may take the track on Saturday and run AX and SS on Sunday. The format will be the same for every event, the run order may change based on facility.

We also know there will multiple ways to win your way into the Super Bowl, the OUSCI, besides just the points.

We will be posting important updates on our website, ultimatestreetcarassociation.com and to our facebook page, Ultimate Street Car Association. These are the only places where you will find the official information about the series.

I appreciate your patience as we work through the details - the time we spend we spend now will pay off in the near future. We will try to address any specific concerns as they are brought to our attention. We appreciate all of your enthusiasm, input and feedback as we move forward.

[1966longroof]

Chump car runs three formats. Twin 7 hour, 12 hour and 24 hour. How do you fit a three day event into their schedule? And how do you put Joe Blow with his high powered street car on a VIR or Daytona safely? You cannot turn an inexperienced driver loose on high speed tracks without major safety requirements and training.

Mike, welcome back from Vegas. I'll swing by this week and say hi.

And.....diddo on what mike said.

[So Cal Camaro]

Ladies and gentlemen, enthusiasts, hot rodders,

The USCA is committed to safety first at all of these events. Secondly, we want to make the events fun and accessible to everyone, without regard to any specific economic demographics. And we are working hard to level the playing field. This series is not about prize money, it's about the cars and the people that drive them, that's what our street performance industry is all about. TV will not dictate the competition, it will cover it in a credible and respectable manner.

We don't have all the rules figured out yet, but we work on them daily. And safety requirements are at the top of our list. We know some of these tracks are very high speed or technical, and I've personally driven on every one of them, so I know. Our USCA group has organized and run hundreds of events at tracks all around the country and we have the necessary knowledge and experience to make the events fun and safe for all skill levels.

As for sharing track time with Chumpcar, I promise you will have a significant amount of track time at each one of these facilities. Our events will have five elements, and all the facilities have an adequate amount of space to run all the events. Our planned format will run Friday through Sunday, starting with a road rally and social event. Saturday will be Autocross and speed stop while Chumpcar is on the track, and we will run a track day on Sunday. At certain venues, we may take the track on Saturday and run AX and SS on Sunday. The format will be the same for every event, the run order may change based on facility.

We also know there will multiple ways to win your way into the Super Bowl, the OUSCI, besides just the points.

We will be posting important updates on our website, ultimatestreetcarassociation.com and to our facebook page, Ultimate Street Car Association. These are the only places where you will find the official information about the series.

I appreciate your patience as we work through the details - the time we spend we spend now will pay off in the near future. We will try to address any specific concerns as they are brought to our attention. We appreciate all of your enthusiasm, input and feedback as we move forward.

Jimi & Wally, Thanks for all the hard work on this, as it is awesome that there will be 2 USCA series events in California this year and 2 more within a few days drive....and we still have the always great Run to the Coast event that ASCS puts on, which is also a blast to compete in...I just wanna race...more opportunity is a Win to me...

[Quikbrd]

So, the November race in Las Vegas, is that separate from OUSCI ? Like maybe the week before? Also, will the LV USCA track be Las Vegas Motor Speedway?
Inquiring minds want to know,,,,,,,,,

[mpozzi]

Lots of excellent comments and questions here and one I'd like to address is track selection and speeds involved. These events are no different than any others as each competitor drives to his or her own limits. While some will want to push these limits farther than others, there's no "rule" that says everyone must be equal in overall speed and cornering. Drive your car at your own level of ability and you will be fine. You'll also be able to drive your car home at the end of the event ...

Also, each event is a standalone event and like other series, enter the one(s) that you want to. I'm like everyone else as I don't have unlimited funds to chase points all across the country. I'll enter events from all three series (USCA, ASCS, and Good Guys) as my budget permits and be safe while having fun at each.

Mary Pozzi

[CurtiSS 69]

Lots of excellent comments and questions here and one I'd like to address is track selection and speeds involved. These events are no different than any others as each competitor drives to his or her own limits. While some will want to push these limits farther than others, there's no "rule" that says everyone must be equal in overall speed and cornering. Drive your car at your own level of ability and you will be fine. You'll also be able to drive your car home at the end of the event ...

Also, each event is a standalone event and like other series, enter the one(s) that you want to. I'm like everyone else as I don't have unlimited funds to chase points all across the country. I'll enter events from all three series (USCA, ASCS, and Good Guys) as my budget permits and be safe while having fun at each.

Mary Pozzi

Well said Mary: )

Regards

CurtiSS 69

[rustomatic]

Increasingly, I seem to feel the need to have the means to tow my car. This is not so much because I think my car might break, but more that I might crash and damage the car to a point where AAA just won't really help, given the distance some of these places are from home. That said, here's to the evolution of the events!

Regarding the street-level tests of streetworthiness, or whatever you want to call how our cars behave on the street, in places like Monterey, this would seem to be more of a parade/danger lap of town, given the quantity of tourism and lost drivers usually present on weekends. This would be interesting, and probably quite angering for many...

On a track like Laguna Seca (my most likely point of attendance), we could all see that as being awesome, and in many ways, if an autocross day preceded the track event, the level of safety and car handling might actually be nicely improved when the big track came into use. It's a neat concept, but one's adoration of such an event might diminish a bit when actual costs are confronted. It will be interesting to learn more!

[mpozzi]

Increasingly, I seem to feel the need to have the means to tow my car. This is not so much because I think my car might break, but more that I might crash and damage the car to a point where AAA just won't really help, given the distance some of these places are from home. That said, here's to the evolution of the events!

Regarding the street-level tests of streetworthiness, or whatever you want to call how our cars behave on the street, in places like Monterey, this would seem to be more of a parade/danger lap of town, given the quantity of tourism and lost drivers usually present on weekends. This would be interesting, and probably quite angering for many...

On a track like Laguna Seca (my most likely point of attendance), we could all see that as being awesome, and in many ways, if an autocross day preceded the track event, the level of safety and car handling might actually be nicely improved when the big track came into use. It's a neat concept, but one's adoration of such an event might diminish a bit when actual costs are confronted. It will be interesting to learn more!

Good thoughts and regarding the tourists (and the fact that most are generally regarded as moving traffic pylons ...), we usually do not get that many the first part of March. I've done some research on various and sundry areas for Rallye/Cruise travel routes and there are several that will offer some spectacular views, fun roads, and give the competitors a most proper taste of the Monterey Peninsula without much hindrance of those "pylons."

A well-kept secret is we get our best weather right now and it's usually foggy and cold in June thru August.

Mary Pozzi

[mpozzi]

Ooooops ... forgot to address the AAA Emergency Towing. I work for AAA and was the Regional Manager for the Contract Stations in this area of California. I'm guessing Pilot Hill is close to 200 miles from Laguna Seca and as such, you could be transported from here to there with a Premier membership as it offers one 200 mile tow per membership year.

There are also excellent repair facilities that love our type of cars and can perform most any repairs you'd need if the worst happened. And if the really, really worst happened, we've got some good body shops. From past events, it's rare to have a car suffer collision damage from an "off" and it's more common to see mechanical issues raise their ugly heads. Things like power steering leaks and operational problems, brake fade, overheating, tire issues ... stuff like that.

Trailering is an excellent idea if you've got the means and even though I'm 15 minutes from the track, I will be doing just that. I'll most likely take some heat for it but when other people's rides break down and need a means of getting to where they can get fixed or for tool borrowing, guess who will be most popular? Plus, if I've got the trailer then it's a guarantee my Camaro won't need it ...

Mary Pozzi

[howehot]

I'm all in! To get on the track at Daytona is a dream of mine and given a chance to run the Monte Carlo there, I will pay the price of admission, drive the 3000 miles round trip, and have the memory of a lifetime. Then my life will be complete. I won't be the fastest, I'm not worried about points, but this is what Josh and I built this car for and the El Camino that's in the works.

[bret]

I'm all in! To get on the track at Daytona is a dream of mine and given a chance to run the Monte Carlo there, I will pay the price of admission, drive the 3000 miles round trip, and have the memory of a lifetime. Then my life will be complete. I won't be the fastest, I'm not worried about points, but this is what Josh and I built this car for and the El Camino that's in the works.

The definition of what this is about. Cheers to you!

[TheJDMan]

Why is there such a stigma against trailering our cars to one of these kinds of events? To me it's just common sense. Back in the 70's I used to drive the 68 to the local drags. Until one night I blew the spider gears out of the

Sorry, I didn't mean to change the subject!

[BMR Sales]

I'm all in! To get on the track at Daytona is a dream of mine and given a chance to run the Monte Carlo there, I will pay the price of admission, drive the 3000 miles round trip, and have the memory of a lifetime. Then my life will be complete. I won't be the fastest, I'm not worried about points, but this is what Josh and I built this car for and the El Camino that's in the works.

Daytona is a Great Track, but be aware that it is a Very Hard Track to set your car up for. The Banking puts extreme forces into your car as the speed pushs it into the Track with a lot of G Force & when you get to the infield, it's flat & slippery.

T.C.

[1966longroof]

Daytona is a Great Track, but be aware that it is a Very Hard Track to set your car up for. The Banking puts extreme forces into your car as the speed pushs it into the Track with a lot of G Force & when you get to the infield, it's flat & slippery.

T.C.

All the warnings (which are excellent), just get me more interested. Sounds like fun in my non-areo dynamic brick on 235's.

[Jim Nilsen]

I have to say AAA is in my back pocket and got me back from Road America for FREE!!!!!!

I have put the cost down and found that trucks and trailers suck up all the money to ship your car home any way you like your car carried, your choice is up to you but it will cost less to have the card in your pocket that can get your car back home from where you are at than to trailer ANY day of the year. It takes planning but it is less to do than tax,title,license,inspection,etc.........
Love the big tracks with care, they take their toll on a car like nothing else.

[Jim Nilsen]

Sounds interesting but I will need to see a lot more details before I make any plans to attend. I sincerely hope they put some sort of mechanism in place that will allow the little guys on a shoe string budget to compete with the big guys who can afford to attend many events. Maybe some sort of a weighted points system or better yet simply average the points earned from each event by the number of events attended. The bottom line is that if you want this new organization to succeed you need to get the little guys like me involved and feel we at least have a chance to compete. I suspect there are a lot more of us on limited budgets than there are those with unlimited funds.

I had thoughts like that many times and after an event you go away understanding that is not what is important and to be on top is something to shoot for not something you will attain. The recognition comes from just being there and participating, the reward comes from learning and having fun with some of the most awesome people you could meet that love cars. The way it is set up works well when you have the right perspective and the place you will find yourself may surprise you or disappoint but it will be real and you will have competed with the best their is at some point.

I have invested very small amounts of time and change in my car over the last 4 years and have made surprisingly large gains in performance from practice and experience. The rules allow me to go out and do what I like to do and when I move up I know it is really not the rules that hold me back and not the money but the experience itself. Get the experience and you will not have need for the class rules that seem more fair or unfair.

Have fun a we will see you there.

[Ron Sutton]

Does it make sense to have classes kind of like GG does but with different names?

Pro ... for the hardcore machines
PT ... for less hardcore/more PT cars
SC ... Super Car
Truck ... for ahhh ... trucks
SR ... Street Rods

That tends to give a wider range of car guys something to shoot for, without feeling way overshadowed by the big dogs.

Food for thought. What do you guys think ?

[Rod]

Does it make sense to have classes kind of like GG does but with different names?

Pro ... for the hardcore machines
PT ... for less hardcore/more PT cars
SC ... Super Car
Truck ... for ahhh ... trucks
SR ... Street Rods

That tends to give a wider range of car guys something to shoot for, without feeling way overshadowed by the big dogs.

Food for thought. What do you guys think ?

that could work

[BMR Sales]

I have to say AAA is in my back pocket and got me back from Road America for FREE!!!!!!

I have put the cost down and found that trucks and trailers suck up all the money to ship your car home any way you like your car carried, your choice is up to you but it will cost less to have the card in your pocket that can get your car back home from where you are at than to trailer ANY day of the year. It takes planning but it is less to do than tax,title,license,inspection,etc.........
Love the big tracks with care, they take their toll on a car like nothing else.

I've gone both ways - I had a trailer & Sold it. Then drove my car to events stuffed with sticky tires, tools etc. Then bought another Trailer - I have a Permanent Trailer Tag which doesn't cost me a Yearly Fee & I drive my F-150 SuperCrew to work almost all the time so the State Licensing Fees are being put to use.

T.C.

[BMR Sales]

Sounds interesting but I will need to see a lot more details before I make any plans to attend. I sincerely hope they put some sort of mechanism in place that will allow the little guys on a shoe string budget to compete with the big guys who can afford to attend many events. Maybe some sort of a weighted points system or better yet simply average the points earned from each event by the number of events attended. The bottom line is that if you want this new organization to succeed you need to get the little guys like me involved and feel we at least have a chance to compete. I suspect there are a lot more of us on limited budgets than there are those with unlimited funds.

I Agree as I would/will do the two Events in Florida, but there is no way I can travel the Country to do this. But this Association with ChumpCar will be good in that I can Race ChumpCar & USCA in the same Weekend! :drive1:

[rustomatic]

Thanks for the honest reply, Mary--technically, my wife's family lives in Salinas (the actual location of Laguna Seca), so I guess being towed there would work. Eventually, it's good to separate one's stuff from an in-law's house as quickly as possible, regardless of how much they love you. I've got an old truck and 100-miles worth of AAA...


Ooooops ... forgot to address the AAA Emergency Towing. I work for AAA and was the Regional Manager for the Contract Stations in this area of California. I'm guessing Pilot Hill is close to 200 miles from Laguna Seca and as such, you could be transported from here to there with a Premier membership as it offers one 200 mile tow per membership year.

There are also excellent repair facilities that love our type of cars and can perform most any repairs you'd need if the worst happened. And if the really, really worst happened, we've got some good body shops. From past events, it's rare to have a car suffer collision damage from an "off" and it's more common to see mechanical issues raise their ugly heads. Things like power steering leaks and operational problems, brake fade, overheating, tire issues ... stuff like that.

Trailering is an excellent idea if you've got the means and even though I'm 15 minutes from the track, I will be doing just that. I'll most likely take some heat for it but when other people's rides break down and need a means of getting to where they can get fixed or for tool borrowing, guess who will be most popular? Plus, if I've got the trailer then it's a guarantee my Camaro won't need it ...

Mary Pozzi

[GrabberGT]

Im just happy to see a real event close enough for me to attend. Whats wrong with having events in the center of the country anyway. All these events are so spread out. The next closest event between both ASCS and USCA is in Madison IL some 10 hrs away. Luckily enough the Texas event is only 5 minutes away.

Now... I just need to save up for a new motor and install within the next 4 months... which leads to the other discussion about trailering. I recently attended OUSCI and experienced catastrophic failure on the way home. Its a 1200 mile trip each way for me. Sure there would have been more comfortable way of getting there but there is no greater feeling than driving the car through the mountains and over the roads. I had a blast and wouldnt do it any other way. I ended up trailering the car the last 400 miles at a cost of 300.00 and 10 hrs of hanging out with my Dad in a town I'd never been in before. A truck and trailer would have easily eaten that cost and the life experience. The greatest loss to me out of this was that final leg and satisfaction of a trip completed. LOL Oh well. I drove out there, beat the car mercilessly and drove it another 800 miles before the motor tried to chew up the recently liberated air cleaner stud. Great motor. Im going to miss it.

[mpozzi]

As anyone that competes in competitive events knows, quick lap times come more from educating that nut behind the wheel rather than spending bucketfuls of Benjamins on the car. And for this, we've got a solution.

http://www.hookedondriving.com/

For anyone that plans on attending the first Ultimate Street Car Association event at Laguna Seca, Hooked on Driving has a two-day HPDE two weeks beforehand. While its billed as a two-dayer, each day can be registered for separately. Keep in mind there is a maximum sound limit ... 90dB.

http://www.hookedondriving.com/event-details/Laguna_Launch_-_First_Laguna_Weekend_EVER_-_Feb._22-23

Hooked on Driving is an excellent way to learn this track before the first USCA event and the best thing is you get to do this in your own car. They have knowledgeable instructors that can communicate well. These guys and gals have miles of racing and lapping around Laguna Seca and know the track well. They'll help ramp up your learning curve and get you faster and more confident in no time.

The other cool thing is if you're out of the area and don't want to schlep your ride to the HOD event, then back home, and then make that return trip two weeks later, we have safe storage for trailers 15 miles away.

Mary Pozzi

[Ron Sutton]

Plus, if I've got the trailer then it's a guarantee my Camaro won't need it ...

Mary Pozzi

Hahaha ! That is too true.

In all of my racing, if we decided not to take the spare ________ (engine, rear end, car, etc) ... we always ended up needing it. So our little team joke was. "take it so we don't need it."

[SLO_Z28]

Keep in mind there is a maximum sound limit ... 90dB.


Im almost certain its 92db.

Great idea on the HPDE though.

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Im almost certain its 92db.

Great idea on the HPDE though.

Actually a good point James: Wondering if the USCA event @ Laguna Seca have a db limit?

[James OLC]

Im almost certain its 92db.

Great idea on the HPDE though.


Actually a good point James: Wondering if the USCA event @ Laguna Seca have a db limit?

Nope - the Hooked on Driving event is a 90 db day. There are very few 92 db days allowed next year.

[silvermonte]

I have to say AAA is in my back pocket and got me back from Road America for FREE!!!!!!

I have put the cost down and found that trucks and trailers suck up all the money to ship your car home any way you like your car carried, your choice is up to you but it will cost less to have the card in your pocket that can get your car back home from where you are at than to trailer ANY day of the year. It takes planning but it is less to do than tax,title,license,inspection,etc.........
Love the big tracks with care, they take their toll on a car like nothing else.

Most of the tracks that I plan to attend are around 400-500 miles away, a few are a bit further. I love the idea of driving my car to the event but Im worried to death if I broke a car at the event how I would get it home. Its out of the range of AAA and there is no guarantee that U-Haul would have a truck and trailer to get home.The truck pulling my car gets about the same MPG as the car, and the taxes and stuff are a moot point for me as I use them year round for many things. Can you list some options that I would have in a worse case situation, as I would much rather be driving my car to events and having a good time them pulling it on a trailer. It crosses my mind every time Im crossing Tennessee thru the mountains that I would rather be in the car then watching it sitting on the trailer thru the rear view mirror.

Sorry for the hi-jack but as more and more events pop up and they are further out I would like some other options to consider from people who are in the know on such things.

[Cobra 498]

Nope - the Hooked on Driving event is a 90 db day. There are very few 92 db days allowed next year.

Stock Vipers and Corvettes can exceed that db limit, it is very hard to meet if you have serious HP, last time I was there they kicked three cars out because they could not meet noise levels and they were not particularly loud. It would be a shame to travel a long distance to run and find out that you do not meet the db standards. Big efficient mufflers and exits that face away from the sound station are a must. I think Norcal SCCA has some good articles on what works and what does not on cars trying to meet sound at Laguna including intake noise, it would be worth a look, neither of my cars would come close so I won't even try.

[mpozzi]

Nope - the Hooked on Driving event is a 90 db day. There are very few 92 db days allowed next year.

Thank you, James. The 90dB was taken directly from the HoD website for this listed weekend.

Mary Pozzi

[mpozzi]

Most of the tracks that I plan to attend are around 400-500 miles away, a few are a bit further. I love the idea of driving my car to the event but Im worried to death if I broke a car at the event how I would get it home. Its out of the range of AAA and there is no guarantee that U-Haul would have a truck and trailer to get home.The truck pulling my car gets about the same MPG as the car, and the taxes and stuff are a moot point for me as I use them year round for many things. Can you list some options that I would have in a worse case situation, as I would much rather be driving my car to events and having a good time them pulling it on a trailer. It crosses my mind every time Im crossing Tennessee thru the mountains that I would rather be in the car then watching it sitting on the trailer thru the rear view mirror.

Sorry for the hi-jack but as more and more events pop up and they are further out I would like some other options to consider from people who are in the know on such things.

No issues at all with this question and my recommendation is to line up "possible solutions" in the event the worst happens and your car needs some mechanical or cosmetic R&R. James Shipka did this for each years One Lap event and we had a gazillion offers for help, shops, lifts, tools, towing, and more in case of that worst.

Usually, there's a few locals at the events you will be running at and they'll be the best for advice. Your AAA card will help get your car transported so upgrade to Premiere if it's offered. And, of course, make sure your ride is in the best condition and preparation possible before you go. And bring the basic spares ...

If you have a friend that will be towing a trailer, usually they'll be able to drive their car if yours breaks and needs that space for the trip home. We've done that for people, too.

Mary Pozzi

[SLO_Z28]

I guess it goes as low as 90. The days I normally do there are unlimited. The track favors momentum so it isnt a horsepower battle at that place, you dont need every last drop of power, so dont hunt for it in your exhaust system. Worst case scenario I learned a trick or two from the San Diego SCCA.

[Gratefuldiver]

Did I miss something in the link or it just common knowledge that entering these events are $$$. Im in STL and would love to hit up the event at Gateway. Not sure if it would be biting of more then I could chew as it would be my first event of this kind.

Is it open to anyone? I signed up for more info on the link. Im sure I would look like a total noob but if Im having fun who the hell cares.

[mpozzi]

Did I miss something in the link or it just common knowledge that entering these events are $$$. Im in STL and would love to hit up the event at Gateway. Not sure if it would be biting of more then I could chew as it would be my first event of this kind.

Is it open to anyone? I signed up for more info on the link. Im sure I would look like a total noob but if Im having fun who the hell cares.

These events are open to anyone that wants to have fun and enjoy a weekend with other car nuts. Make sure your car is safe and you've got the requisite gear for the competitive parts of the event. As we get closer to 2013, more information will be posted which will give you time to prepare your car and you.

Each individual event will have an entry fee that will cover the competition (track, autocross, braking challenge) and the rallye.

The advice I'd give applies to anyone that hasn't participated in these types of events before is just do it. They're fun, as safe as you make it, and don't worry about looking like a noob 'cause you won't. These events have many of us that will make your transition from rookie to experienced easy-peasy.

Mary Pozzi

[Gratefuldiver]

Cool Thanks for the feedback. Im pretty confident that my car will meet all the specs and is 100% safe for such a event. I don't know all the rules but it passed Auto X check out in June. Ill keep my eye open for all the info I can take in and look forward to having a great time. I like to think I built my car to drive and this sounds like just the place to test it out

[PT Sportwagon]

. With the tracks being all over the country it will be financially challenging without your rich uncle to run the series but hitting one or two might be fun I can't wait to see what it cost to race at Daytona you don't rent that place for $2500.00 bucks for the weekend!
I beg to differ. What about the Rocky Mtn area? Nothing close at all, closest track for me is 800+ miles one way. So it is not "tracks all over the country". I don't have the disposable income to throw the car on the trailer and head for Daytona, or CA. I don't trailer my rides, They are driven. If you do it is fine with me. Last year I had to forgo quite a few car events just to afford to attend my sisters wedding. Even then I came home with my new car needing almost $3500 in damage repairs.

When are we going to see general rules? I know that each track may add rules of there own.

Tim

[BMR Sales]

I think you will see some Rules coming out right at the start of 2014 - the 1st event is in March

T.C.

[Rod]

these will be fun events, cant wait to run them!! I do have to add a few more safety items, not that there necessary but I will just feel safer, I ran the small streets of willow earlier this year and even on that small track (we went clockwise) on the up hill dog leg just before the hair pin I was squeezing out 95mph on that turn, made me a little nervous

[Nothingface5384]

if I get my car done i'll be participating in the Wampum PA event..but def going to be there eitherway

[xxxturbo6]

A new racing series was announced today at SEMA. Seems pretty cool...but I just can't help the fact that it just seems like the lil guys are being left behind in the dust here.

Maybe I'm just crazy but I was counting every penny I had this year just to attend 3 ASCS events as a spectator/helper. In 2012 I raced at a lot of events and it pretty much made me broke between gas for the truck pulling the trailer, hotels, registration, and constantly fixing the car! Now I really feel like I am missing out! lol

What do you all think?

http://ultimatestreetcarassociation.com/ Doug,

I agree! I have been going to these events now for the last 9 yrs and it didn't start out this way, it truly started out as fun. In this hobby it seems as if everyone that is at or right at the top talks about attending these events to have fun, which is a good thing to say to keep the attendance coming in but in all seriousness the beginners also want to be competitive just like the ones at the top! What I do not understand is why, with the vast variety of cars and participants from Pro to beginner they don't have a separate class the pro's to compete in all by themselves and then a class for the rest of the beginners so they can "Have Fun and be Competitive" too just the pro's? Seems to me the majority of the participants that make these events successful would be more happy having Fun being competitive in their class than going home all the time getting the daylights beat out of them by the top drivers that attend pretty much every event!

Maybe once a certain time is reached by say a "beginner" it would now move him up to the other class?

[bret]

In any discipline, if a beginner could be as competitive as an expert, why bother practicing to be an expert?

[71RS/SS396]

Doug,

I agree! I have been going to these events now for the last 9 yrs and it didn't start out this way, it truly started out as fun. In this hobby it seems as if everyone that is at or right at the top talks about attending these events to have fun, which is a good thing to say to keep the attendance coming in but in all seriousness the beginners also want to be competitive just like the ones at the top! What I do not understand is why, with the vast variety of cars and participants from Pro to beginner they don't have a separate class the pro's to compete in all by themselves and then a class for the rest of the beginners so they can "Have Fun and be Competitive" too just the pro's? Seems to me the majority of the participants that make these events successful would be more happy having Fun being competitive in their class than going home all the time getting the daylights beat out of them by the top drivers that attend pretty much every event!

Maybe once a certain time is reached by say a "beginner" it would now move him up to the other class?

I don't want to clutter up this thread but I would suggest you read this thread https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/103820-Would-You-Pay-For-This

Driving schools, seat time, and dialing in your car are what are going to make you faster. When I was starting out I didn't worry about others times I raced against myself (and still do) and concentrated on constantly improving my times.

[xxxturbo6]

I don't want to clutter up this thread but I would suggest you read this thread https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/103820-Would-You-Pay-For-This

Driving schools, seat time, and dialing in your car are what are going to make you faster. When I was starting out I didn't worry about others times I raced against myself (and still do) and concentrated on constantly improving my times. Yep I already read that thread. I think some might have misinterpreted my post a little bit but it's all good. At the past several events the talk amongst other participant racers is that they mostly mention competing against the top people at all the events, that's all......

It would be nice to see a "Pro Class"?? Hell most of you guys end up competing against each other at these events anyway.... LOL

As I mentioned in Bill Howells thread recently the last 9 yrs I have done this for fun, I am not fast and really don't care to be faster, better or even participate in road courses, I enjoy these events and having fun with my friends..... Just was giving feedback on what I hear.

I did however manage my first entry into the Shootout at this years RTTH event! I happen to be very consistent with my times only once getting out of the 52 second range....

Back on topic!

[Ron Sutton]

Doug,

I agree! I have been going to these events now for the last 9 yrs and it didn't start out this way, it truly started out as fun. In this hobby it seems as if everyone that is at or right at the top talks about attending these events to have fun, which is a good thing to say to keep the attendance coming in but in all seriousness the beginners also want to be competitive just like the ones at the top! What I do not understand is why, with the vast variety of cars and participants from Pro to beginner they don't have a separate class the pro's to compete in all by themselves and then a class for the rest of the beginners so they can "Have Fun and be Competitive" too just the pro's? Seems to me the majority of the participants that make these events successful would be more happy having Fun being competitive in their class than going home all the time getting the daylights beat out of them by the top drivers that attend pretty much every event!

Maybe once a certain time is reached by say a "beginner" it would now move him up to the other class?

I couldn't agree more. There is a strong movement to build faster, higher tech cars with race level design & performance (myself included) ... and a strong movement by a different group to keep these cars more pro touring.

To make these events financially successful requires strong & varied participation. You don't want to end up with 20 classes with 5 cars in each class. But you don't want to have 100 cars in 1 class, or after awhile it will be 80, then 60, etc. as people become disillusioned and frustrated with the performance gap.

I believe there needs to be approximately 5 categories, different, but not too different, from what Good Guys does with their AutoX series. My thoughts on classes/categories would be ...

1. Pro Class
* Full safety equipment required, including roll cage & fire suppression system
* Unlimited performance rules, except TW200 tires
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

2. Street Car Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American car body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

3. Street Truck Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3100# minimum weight without driver (or 3250# with driver)
* 1955 & newer American truck body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

4. Supercar Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* Open to all years, makes & models foreign & domestic
* Must be a recognized factory production car
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

5. Pro Touring Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3200# minimum weight without driver (or 3350# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American body car or truck styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* 275 maximum tire size
* Air conditioning must be functional ?
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

Ok ... please don't flame me ... but I would like constructive opinions & viewpoints. Not that I or most of us on here have any control over how they run their events, but I suspect they're watching this thread and value input from people who actually plan to participate.

[71RS/SS396]

Ron, other than the carbon hood/decklid my car would fit in 2 classes.

[HellPhish89]

Seems like something that would/should be similar to blacktop/'Tarmac' rallies or even something with a pump gas drags type component to them.
hell a drag week 'no support vehicles allowed' sort of thing.

IE: A sanctioned point to point at the tail of the dragon or a requirement that 'race cars' drive a certain distance on the street before racing.

A street car series should be something based on the public streets. Just my opinion

Using the the roads would allow many more choices for venues.. if it was possible to convince towns/states to sanction such a thing.

[Ron Sutton]

Ron, other than the carbon hood/decklid my car would fit in 2 classes.

Tim, I'm not suggesting that fiberglass or carbon fiber fenders, hood or doors wouldn't be allowed. Just no reproduction shells or complete bodies.

[Ron Sutton]

Seems like something that would/should be similar to blacktop/'Tarmac' rallies or even something with a pump gas drags type component to them.
hell a drag week 'no support vehicles allowed' sort of thing.

IE: A sanctioned point to point at the tail of the dragon or a requirement that 'race cars' drive a certain distance on the street before racing.

A street car series should be something based on the public streets. Just my opinion

Using the the roads would allow many more choices for venues.. if it was possible to convince towns/states to sanction such a thing.

Unfortunately, none of these things address the large differences in the performance of the cars. I can drive my 2800#, tube chassis, 900hp, fiberglass body 57 Chevy with high tech suspension on the street as far as anyone. But its not fair to compete in the same class IMHO.

[SSLance]

I like your class setup suggestion Ron. I might put a bit further distance between the street car and pro touring class... Basically as you have it is a 200 pound minimum weight difference and a tire size limit...Right?

Eh, that's probably good enough. I'm in...

I agree, you don't want to end up with 287 classes like the SCCA has, but they do need to be split up somewhat to keep everyone interested and participating.

[eric1967]

It is starting to sound like drag racing with the 275 street tire. I like it. It would be nice to have some rules in place to build a car towards. Many of the cars are getting pretty exotic. Weight limits may help.

[Ron Sutton]

Hey Lance,


I like your class setup suggestion Ron. I might put a bit further distance between the street car and pro touring class... Basically as you have it is a 200 pound minimum weight difference and a tire size limit...Right?

Eh, that's probably good enough. I'm in...

I agree, you don't want to end up with 287 classes like the SCCA has, but they do need to be split up somewhat to keep everyone interested and participating.


Three things ... one is my thought ...and the other two are looking for yours ...

1. I "think" getting 275 tires to fit on most PT cars is fairly doable without buying new frames, clips or suspensions. It's common now to see winning cars on 315's or 335's. In my experience 20% more tire on the ground is a big deal. Unfortunately, it is a big cost & a lot of work to achieve that for many cars. So the 275 max rule would be a cost control scenario ... and frankly allow a lot of PT folks to participate that don't want to modify their cars to fit 315/335's.

2. What is your thoughts on requiring functional air conditioning in the Pro Touring class?

3. What other thoughts do you or anyone have to keep the costs in check and create classes that make sense to compete in?

[SSLance]

Ron,

(1) 275s all the way around are in my plans...it's the very most tire I can fit on my car without major modifications. I like this.

(2) Functional AC required for Pro Touring class... AC can be fickle, especially in older cars... How about AC system fully installed? (not necessarily functional)

(3) How about some sort of "novice" ranking for the lower classes, where beginners can compete against other beginners? It could be inside the Pro-Touring class, like a sub class. That might be a place for a beginning driver or lower prepped car to play in to see how they like it.

[howehot]

My Monte Carlo s a family car and this causes a problem with a cage. Every class listed above requires a cage and 5 point harness. This eliminate my car from being a street car #1 and "event" car, not race car #2. I don't have to attend the national events and pay the $300 plus entry fee, travel, and lodging. I can attended local Iowa SCCA events for $35 and still have a ball without modifying my car beyond what it is, a street car. But I do spend $$$$ to travel and run the car for the manufactures that have helped with the build and meet the friends I made along the way and plan to continue do so. Safety is a huge concern. I have no desire to hurt myself or others and sustain damage to the car we built. I have been concerned about the road course portion since my first time on one at OUSCI. Pretty big event for a first timer and I was nervous as hell. My attitude then is the same as now. Safety first don't drive over my head, and have fun. I never enter an event with the expectation of winning anything or beating him or her so classes are of no importance to me.

I think everyone needs to step back and wait out the rules package and then start this discussion. The organizers have stated this is a series for street cars. They stated the need for safety. They want you to have fun. If this isn't achieved the likely hood of success is minimal. Who will attend a second event if the dislike the first and how many people will they tell of their poor experience.

Just my thoughts.

[HellPhish89]

Unfortunately, none of these things address the large differences in the performance of the cars. I can drive my 2800#, tube chassis, 900hp, fiberglass body 57 Chevy with high tech suspension on the street as far as anyone. But its not fair to compete in the same class IMHO.

Point taken.


The other ideas would be:

-base weights on the lightest factory curb weight (production more than 1000 units) so people arent gutting their cars

-limiting cars to stock (for the model not model year) or stock style suspension (stock type for that brand)

-cost caps that exempt safety equipment and include values of parts not just price paid

-like you already laid out: stock, non-tube frame, chassis

-again, already laid out: tire size. an alternate idea for a slightly faster class would be to limit it in a way that requires stock wheel wells with tires having to be under or flush to the stock fender or 1/4.

Just thinking out loud.

[Ron Sutton]

Thanks guys. Hopefully more people chime in with their ideas too.

[NOT A TA]

[B]

3. What other thoughts do you or anyone have to keep the costs in check and create classes that make sense to compete in?



If this is ULTIMATE Street car why have any classes? Or restrictions other than the car be street legal? They have already said it will be open to ALL types of cars. If there's classes for PT guys and trucks would there also be classes for modern exotics, modern sports cars, cars with power adders or without? If you're going to start leveling the playing field with classes and restrictions on tire size, materials, weight etc. where does it stop? Who polices it? Who decides if a driver is a "pro"?

I'd like to see this be an organization that draws the best of the best with few restrictions other than safety equipment and proof of previous track experience so the folks who go don't have to be concerned about running flat out on a road course in mega dollar machines while sharing it with first timers.

Because this new series would draw the best of the best and most people can't afford the time/money to go to every event scheduled by various organizations it would probably pull some of the top contenders dominating the current events to do battle with top contenders from other areas of the car hobby.

[GrabberGT]

I think the OP was referring more to how do we compete on a points basis with the guys who can afford to make every event. Not so much the large difference between cars. Like the GG autocross series, just being fast enough didnt get you into the finals. You had to also acquire enough points to stay in the top. Thats a lot of travel time/money. So how does one compete in a National series on a regional budget. Hopefully, there will be recognition given to the regional guys as well. I like the GG model of classes. Once you reach Pro, you no longer compete in the Classes. "Pro" is your class. But also, rather than resetting Pro every year. Car/driver combinations stay in pro from one year to the next. Surely that Car/Driver Combo isnt going to make changes to be slower than the previous year.

Now... Track safety is something completely different. If there is enough people the perhaps we can take the above GG model and split them into "Track Prepped" and "Track non-prepared" categorizes. This is where roll cage and other stringent safety requirements come into play. The "T-P" category gets the wide open track to play with. "T-NP" has chicanes or other method to keep the speeds down. Maybe even non competitive track driving. Parade laps or something.

I think splitting off into Pro could be a good thing. It then becomes the "Main Event" for the rest of us in attendance.

[SSLance]

Now... Track safety is something completely different. If there is enough people the perhaps we can take the above GG model and split them into "Track Prepped" and "Track non-prepared" categorizes. This is where roll cage and other stringent safety requirements come into play. The "T-P" category gets the wide open track to play with. "T-NP" has chicanes or other method to keep the speeds down. Maybe even non competitive track driving. Parade laps or something.

I think splitting off into Pro could be a good thing. It then becomes the "Main Event" for the rest of us in attendance.


Ya know, that's a pretty good idea...

[xxxturbo6]

.

Split them into "Track Prepped" and "Track non-prepared" categorizes. This is where roll cage and other stringent safety requirements come into play. The "T-P" category gets the wide open track to play with. "T-NP" has chicanes or other method to keep the speeds down. Maybe even non competitive track driving. Parade laps or something.

I think splitting off into Pro could be a good thing. It then becomes the "Main Event" for the rest of us in attendance. I agree 100%! This was exactly what I was thinking..... All participants I think would love to see a "Main Event" type show between the top cars. I myself don't have a roll cage and only a 4-point harness BUT I am only running auto-crosses and no road courses so I feel all that isn't necessary with a 98% family street car..

[Ron Sutton]

If this is ULTIMATE Street car why have any classes? Or restrictions other than the car be street legal? They have already said it will be open to ALL types of cars. If there's classes for PT guys and trucks would there also be classes for modern exotics, modern sports cars, cars with power adders or without? If you're going to start leveling the playing field with classes and restrictions on tire size, materials, weight etc. where does it stop? Who polices it? Who decides if a driver is a "pro"?

I'd like to see this be an organization that draws the best of the best with few restrictions other than safety equipment and proof of previous track experience so the folks who go don't have to be concerned about running flat out on a road course in mega dollar machines while sharing it with first timers.

Because this new series would draw the best of the best and most people can't afford the time/money to go to every event scheduled by various organizations it would probably pull some of the top contenders dominating the current events to do battle with top contenders from other areas of the car hobby.

Hi John,

I think what you're asking for, is the way it is, and what is planned. Frankly, for my own personal car plans, that fits perfectly. My only concern is participation will taper off after the first few years as the participants with less competitive cars become frustrated.

Are you planning to run the #14 car?

[71RS/SS396]

I think the OP was referring more to how do we compete on a points basis with the guys who can afford to make every event. Not so much the large difference between cars. Like the GG autocross series, just being fast enough didnt get you into the finals. You had to also acquire enough points to stay in the top. Thats a lot of travel time/money. So how does one compete in a National series on a regional budget. Hopefully, there will be recognition given to the regional guys as well. I like the GG model of classes. Once you reach Pro, you no longer compete in the Classes. "Pro" is your class. But also, rather than resetting Pro every year. Car/driver combinations stay in pro from one year to the next. Surely that Car/Driver Combo isnt going to make changes to be slower than the previous year.

Now... Track safety is something completely different. If there is enough people the perhaps we can take the above GG model and split them into "Track Prepped" and "Track non-prepared" categorizes. This is where roll cage and other stringent safety requirements come into play. The "T-P" category gets the wide open track to play with. "T-NP" has chicanes or other method to keep the speeds down. Maybe even non competitive track driving. Parade laps or something.

I think splitting off into Pro could be a good thing. It then becomes the "Main Event" for the rest of us in attendance.

Actually at the GG events if you had the fastest lap of the weekend you got an automatic invite to the finals in Scottsdale, accumulating points was simply another way of getting a spot.

I think you're going to see very few if any people go to every event, I don't see it making financial sense even for a vendor to spend all of your marketing dollars on 1 single series. I think this will be regional participation due to the spread out geographical locations. The fact is, with USCA having the design element in this you will only have limited control over your placing based on performance, the design element is going to be an opinion based wild card that will skew the results.

[dontlifttoshift]

I think USCA is making changes to the design portion to better represent the original intention of the category, prevent racecars from winning. If the indications I got at PRI are true, then it should work out quite well.

[dontlifttoshift]

I couldn't agree more. There is a strong movement to build faster, higher tech cars with race level design & performance (myself included) ... and a strong movement by a different group to keep these cars more pro touring.

Why not both? Why does it have to be moar street or moar race? Striking that balance to satisfy an individual's needs is what this whole thing is about.


To make these events financially successful requires strong & varied participation. You don't want to end up with 20 classes with 5 cars in each class. But you don't want to have 100 cars in 1 class, or after awhile it will be 80, then 60, etc. as people become disillusioned and frustrated with the performance gap.

Disagree, the Motorstate Challenge has grown every year, it is safe, organized, and accessible. 4 classes to separate early and late cars and manufacturers are broke into their own early/late.



1. Pro Class
* Full safety equipment required, including roll cage & fire suppression system
* Unlimited performance rules, except TW200 tires
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

This is vague, maybe on purpose, but is this the top of the heap? or the bottom. Licensed and insured is great but I would like to see "registered to driver or spouse" on their as well. Prevents hired shoes.......that's not what this is.



2. Street Car Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American car body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

5 pts, will put a lot of people out, myself included.
Minimum weights only encourage building to the minimum weight, saving weight is a rich mans game
no year cut off, split them with abs/non abs
if you can afford a carbon fiber body to race at a pro touring event for virtually nothing to win.....good for you! Bring it.
Yep
Yep

I don't know anything about trucks, McGregor can fill you in on that.


4. Supercar Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* Open to all years, makes & models foreign & domestic
* Must be a recognized factory production car
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

5. Pro Touring Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3200# minimum weight without driver (or 3350# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American body car or truck styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* 275 maximum tire size
* Air conditioning must be functional ?
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

Nothing to add here that I didn't address earlier save for two things. I don't care for the max tire size at all. Maier has 315s on his car with a set of bolt on fenders. 70 mustangs and Camaros will both take 295s with DSE clips and minor sheet metal mods.

I don't think AC should be required, but that is where USCAs new point system will help. By giving bonus points for having street car accessories like HVAC or a radio you earn points that tally up in the final scoring. Not subjective at all, do you have a heater _yes_ cool 1 point.

I very much dislike rules, If they are not for my safety or someone elses safety, I don't see any reason to make things complicated. ESPECIALLY when both ASCS and USCA are pushing fun and good times above all else.

[xxxturbo6]

I don't think AC should be required, but that is where USCAs new point system will help. By giving bonus points for having street car accessories like HVAC or a radio you earn points that tally up in the final scoring. Not subjective at all, do you have a heater _yes_ cool 1 point.I think the heater and A/C thing can easily get confusing, I am sure something like an All 'Vendor/sponsor car Class" would be Much more easy seeing as the vendors / Sponsor cars seem to be at the top at most events....This don't have to get crazy involved with rules and tire sizes to make something like this work....




I very much dislike rules, If they are not for my safety or someone elses safety, I don't see any reason to make things complicated. ESPECIALLY when both ASCS and USCA are pushing fun and good times above all else.

I have attended Bills pro-touring events RTTH - (ASCS) for the past 9 years and speaking from a participants stand point and what I have heard from other participants while being at each one, I have heard people mention about having to compete against the Vendor /Sponsor cars from at least 3 different people per event.... Spoke to some others yesterday who have also heard the same thing from participants so I know I'm not the only one hearing this from people! I personally don't mind it but like any business, it's a smart thing to listen to the people who make the business possible in the first place. I don't see a separate class hurting anything at all, but actually making more people happy.... Just my thoughts.

[NOT A TA]

Hi John,

I think what you're asking for, is the way it is, and what is planned. Frankly, for my own personal car plans, that fits perfectly. My only concern is participation will taper off after the first few years as the participants with less competitive cars become frustrated.

Are you planning to run the #14 car?



I would run The 14 Car if there isn't a 200 TW tire limit. I'd probably run Daytona because it's on my bucket list and Sebring because it's one of my favorite tracks.

More and more people are running street cars on track and many have plans to do it eventually. Not just in the PT community but also other areas in motorsports. This would keep participation up for many years.

[dontlifttoshift]

I have attended Bills pro-touring events RTTH - (ASCS) for the past 9 years and speaking from a participants stand point and what I have heard from other participants while being at each one, I have heard people mention about having to compete against the Vendor /Sponsor cars from at least 3 different people per event.... Spoke to some others yesterday who have also heard the same thing from participants so I know I'm not the only one hearing this from people! I personally don't mind it but like any business, it's a smart thing to listen to the people who make the business possible in the first place. I don't see a separate class hurting anything at all, but actually making more people happy.... Just my thoughts.

Not directed at you, you bring up good points so here is the other side.

I thought the competition was supposed to be secondary to the fun? That is what all the other threads are saying. If that is the case then what does the classing really matter?

3 people out of a 100 is very much a minority and in my experience is about the percentage of people that you just can't please any how.

And define novice please, when do you stop being a novice? New to ASCS? your a novice, but Tony Stewart has never been there either. When you look at it like that, WE ARE ALL NOVICES. Anything that resembles a pro driver usually puts a whooping on the whole field, so as a community we have a lot to learn.

As far as business goes, trying to please everyone typically results in pleasing no one.

[Project92rs]

I have attended Bills pro-touring events RTTH - (ASCS) for the past 9 years and speaking from a participants stand point and what I have heard from other participants while being at each one, I have heard people mention about having to compete against the Vendor /Sponsor cars from at least 3 different people per event.... Spoke to some others yesterday who have also heard the same thing from participants so I know I'm not the only one hearing this from people! I personally don't mind it but like any business, it's a smart thing to listen to the people who make the business possible in the first place. I don't see a separate class hurting anything at all, but actually making more people happy.... Just my thoughts.

I know I've mentioned it a few times at events that there are enough vendor/sponsor cars running that I don't see us winning the overall fastest time award. But, who knows, given enough track time, we might pull off a surprise or two somewhere along the line. The biggest factor on a lot of the autox courses isn't build level as much as seat time. And most of the sponsor/vendor drivers have us all beat in that category. But it also isn't so bad to finish 4th if the cars that beat your were the 3 of the shop cars. We've had a lot of fun finishing mid pack at events for the last 3 years and that's what really matters.

[SicMonte]

Man what have I started?? LOL. There's a lot of good info and comments in here!


Not sure if you all knew this but back in 2004-2006 I ran a 1983 RX7 in the SCCA SPEC-7 class in the "Mid Atlantic Road Racing Series" (MARRS). I got the car turn key and race ready for $2500 and the driver even gave me his Sparco fire suit bc we were the same size. Score!! I had to attend two seperate, three day each, driving schools in order to get my SCCA competitive license and even then I had my "novice permit". I had to show my skill level and kind of prove myself to the SCCA before I could be a full blown member of the series. After a couple clean races I graduated and became a member of the series and then raced for points...when in my mind it was just fun and a great experiance. This was wheel to wheel racing, in a full caged car wearing a full fire suit, fixed back seat with a 5 point harness, nomex head sock/socks/shoes/gloves, with a neck restraint (HANS wasn't required back then). It was fun but TERRIFYING at the same time. For those of you who know Summit Point Raceway...imagine 30 cars heading to turn 1 at 110 mph...all within inches of each other. Yeah...clean your shorts worthy.

All that being said I now have my monte carlo that I decided to build into a Pro Touring autox/road course car. It is fun but far far far from being really track worthy. I have made it safe but there's no way I would want to really push it out on a track. I have had it out on Summit Point, NJMP, and Mid Ohio and it is a handful to say the least, and my car is on the lower side of the pro touring cars on this site. I know my limits and my vehicles limits pretty well.

I just really hope the USCA gets the safety rules, regulations and tech right! Seeing half these cars on a big track scares the crap out of me.

[BMR Sales]

I couldn't agree more. There is a strong movement to build faster, higher tech cars with race level design & performance (myself included) ... and a strong movement by a different group to keep these cars more pro touring.

To make these events financially successful requires strong & varied participation. You don't want to end up with 20 classes with 5 cars in each class. But you don't want to have 100 cars in 1 class, or after awhile it will be 80, then 60, etc. as people become disillusioned and frustrated with the performance gap.

I believe there needs to be approximately 5 categories, different, but not too different, from what Good Guys does with their AutoX series. My thoughts on classes/categories would be ...

1. Pro Class
* Full safety equipment required, including roll cage & fire suppression system
* Unlimited performance rules, except TW200 tires
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

2. Street Car Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American car body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

3. Street Truck Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3100# minimum weight without driver (or 3250# with driver)
* 1955 & newer American truck body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

4. Supercar Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* Open to all years, makes & models foreign & domestic
* Must be a recognized factory production car
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

5. Pro Touring Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3200# minimum weight without driver (or 3350# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American body car or truck styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* 275 maximum tire size
* Air conditioning must be functional ?
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

Ok ... please don't flame me ... but I would like constructive opinions & viewpoints. Not that I or most of us on here have any control over how they run their events, but I suspect they're watching this thread and value input from people who actually plan to participate.




If the so-called "Pros", aren't out to have Fun, they have a Problem


T.C.

[Finch]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.

[David Pozzi]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.

I like it! I just want to drive my car. It would be fun to pass Mary on the track...

[SicMonte]

I like it! I just want to drive my car. It would be fun to pass Mary on the track...

ooohhh....that just happened!!!

Mary...are you going to take this??? hehehehe :box2:

[GrabberGT]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.

I had more fun following you around Spring Mountain at OUSCI than I had running on my own. I tell people you were trying you hardest to get away from me. LOL

[1966longroof]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.

Brian, your a man of few words. But makes sense.

(rules make half happly and the other half pi_sed off)

[Finch]

I had more fun following you around Spring Mountain at OUSCI than I had running on my own. I tell people you were trying you hardest to get away from me. LOL

You were stuck like glue, hope the bad lines did not throw you off during race time.

[Finch]

Brian, your a man of few words. But makes sense.

(rules make half happly and the other half pi_sed off)

Thanks David, I plan on spending alot more time this year helping people get faster in a safe and controlled manner and not worry about what the timer says.

[dontlifttoshift]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.

I don't disagree but then how do you gauge improvement? For me the fun is in improving and doing it better than the last lap. I don't care if I beat you, Kyle, Popp or anyone else that shows up as long as I am faster at the end of the day than I was at the beginning.

[mpozzi]

ooohhh....that just happened!!!

Mary...are you going to take this??? hehehehe :box2:

I've been muzzled ... can't comment much more than this.

Mary

[David Pozzi]

There are phone apps & other devices that can record your lap times.

[Finch]

I don't disagree but then how do you gauge improvement? For me the fun is in improving and doing it better than the last lap. I don't care if I beat you, Kyle, Popp or anyone else that shows up as long as I am faster at the end of the day than I was at the beginning.

You will know you are getting better when the laps get smoother, you dont have to fight the car around the course and your able to take it deeper into the turns before braking. When you take a corner just right you can feel it.

The main point I was making is that the driving is just an excuse for us to get together. Dont let the timers take away from the original aim for most, To have fun.

[Bad94]

An easy way to get back to the fun side of things, is to throw out the stop watches and just enjoy some time on the track burning up tires.


So true. But I think times are still very helpful.

[sccacuda]

All this sounds great and will work the first few years, and then like everything else, who has the most money wins.
Just a suggestion, but when I raced karts, they had multiple classes. Each class had a minimum allowed lap time. Go faster, and your in the next class, all the way to unlimited. This keeps it fair and fun for everyone and keeps the money from taking over all but the unlimited class.
Their are still those that will sand bag and lay back on the straights, but it is VERY difficult to bracket race a one time weekend use course.

[ohsolow]

Intresting

[MonzaRacer]

So the minimum weights blow one of my cars out of the water as its factory curb weight was at/below the minimum.
Why not no more than a say a 20% reduction of car over lowest factory recorded weight. THEN factor for V8s, forced induction, weight reduction panels can only be bolt on items like hoods, fenders, properly made doors, trunk lids, bumpers. That sort of thing. THEN require them to add weights too meet minimum standards.
Just saying, %age off stock weights make more sense.

[SLO_Z28]

My thoughts on the rules.

Rule 1 : We all know who this is aimed at, and is very poorly worded and excludes a huge segment.

Rule 8 : The SCCA words this as "publicly available" on like march 31st of the year of competition. I run a tire that is not commercially available, it is manufactured by Hoosier for Continental for the CSCC races, but it is available from resalers to the public so it is legal for SCCA. I dont think adding a date of like Jan 31st is going to affect competition and will keep things fair. I know for a fact that an entire conex container of tires that are new to the 200TW wars just showed up in the port from Japan. and these tires will have a commercial release in the middle of the USCA season. It wouldnt be fair to let someone like me that already has a set of these tires to compete on them if they offer a unfair advantage even though they were for public sale a week before an event. Shaving and heat cycling tires like Tire Rack offers is much safer, more on this in the next comment.

Rule 9 : I have talked with engineers at length about this. One of the main factors in a tire being unsafe in a track enviroment is being brand new. The first time a tire heats up it finishes the cure process. There are long chains of molecules that expand, break, and re form after the first heat cycle. Every subsequent heat cycle will repeat this process until the traction falls off sharply. Tires are manufactured in a mold and have mold release in them so they can get out (think of Pam) and getting the "stupid" off tires is important to safetey. with a Time on the shelf matters, as any tire not heat cycled within a year of manufacture will never reach its potential, however it is not unsafe. Being extreemly conservative Bridgestone gave my work guidlines of fire years, and were talking about cars that run 24 hours a day, at race car speeds on the street, in vastly different weather conditions. 5 years is a conservative number.

Rule 12 : Ban all tire warmers, its in the spirit of the events IMO.

Rule 20-21 : So I am banned from winning, as are a lot of people in this forum. This "significant" portion of this is REALLY ambiguous. Guys like Howell, Finch, the Tuckers were all on R U Faster and I guarantee they were paid very well, that makes them pros. Other drivers are sponsored by parts I consider significant (as a Baer big brake kit costs more than the car im running this year), so I would say this excludes them? Wouldn't everyone in run group A be a pro by definition(possession of a comp license, or the credentials to do so)?

I am buying a seat in the race that weekend, and schedule allowing I can help with tech if you guys need it at laguna seca?

[James OLC]

rule 20-21 : So i am banned from winning, as are a lot of people in this forum. This "significant" portion of this is really ambiguous. guys like howell, finch, the tuckers were all on r u faster and i guarantee they were paid very well, that makes them pros. other drivers are sponsored by parts i consider significant (as a baer big brake kit costs more than the car im running this year), so i would say this excludes them? Wouldn't everyone in run group a be a pro by definition(possession of a comp license, or the credentials to do so)?

I am buying a seat in the race that weekend, and schedule allowing i can help with tech if you guys need it at laguna seca?

lol

[BonzoHansen]

lol

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2014/01/popcorn-1.gif

[Bill Howell]

My thoughts on the rules.



Rule 20-21 : Guys like Howell, Finch, the Tuckers were all on R U Faster and I guarantee they were paid very well, that makes them pros.

LOL, Funniest thing I have read in a while and absolutely not true.
1.Money or payment thereof certainly didn't make me a "PRO" in anyone's mind.
2.While I am bounded by contract not to talk "money received" for my part of the show, let me assure you of this..... I can guarantee you that you made more money that 14 days than I did filming the show.

[mpozzi]

Rule 12 : Ban all tire warmers, its in the spirit of the events IMO.

HOLY CRAP!!! I've finally found that ONE THING James and I agree on.

Mary Pozzi

[Todd in Vancouver]

Last night I made a post and then took it down because I didn't want to ruffle any feathers. I really don't have involvement in this issue, because I will most likely never get to one of these events. But, after receiving a very nice PM from another member who saw it I am going to redo this to best of my memory today and please realize I'm just sharing my thoughts on this.


"Originally Posted by Ron Sutton View Post


I couldn't agree more. There is a strong movement to build faster, higher tech cars with race level design & performance (myself included) ... and a strong movement by a different group to keep these cars more pro touring.

To make these events financially successful requires strong & varied participation. You don't want to end up with 20 classes with 5 cars in each class. But you don't want to have 100 cars in 1 class, or after awhile it will be 80, then 60, etc. as people become disillusioned and frustrated with the performance gap.

I believe there needs to be approximately 5 categories, different, but not too different, from what Good Guys does with their AutoX series. My thoughts on classes/categories would be ...

1. Pro Class
* Full safety equipment required, including roll cage & fire suppression system
* Unlimited performance rules, except TW200 tires
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

2. Street Car Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American car body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

3. Street Truck Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3100# minimum weight without driver (or 3250# with driver)
* 1955 & newer American truck body styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

4. Supercar Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3000# minimum weight without driver (or 3150# with driver)
* Open to all years, makes & models foreign & domestic
* Must be a recognized factory production car
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

5. Pro Touring Class
* Specific safety equipment required, including roll bar & 5-point harness
* 3200# minimum weight without driver (or 3350# with driver)
* 1950-1990 American body car or truck styles
* No reproduction fiberglass or carbon fiber body shells
* 275 maximum tire size
* Air conditioning must be functional ?
* Full street car trim including glass windshield, wipers, turn signals,
* Must be licensed & insured as a street car

Ok ... please don't flame me ... but I would like constructive opinions & viewpoints. Not that I or most of us on here have any control over how they run their events, but I suspect they're watching this thread and value input from people who actually plan to participate.

There is a theme that seems to be running throughout this thread and that is one of driver's ability.
Mary posted earlier that the best money we can spend to go faster is in our own driver ability and I agree with this statement 100%. Rather than spending Oodles more cash on making the cars faster we ought to be spending it on how we can get ourselves around the track quicker. But there is, in my opinion, a bit of a disconnect on how we divide the drivers by only looking at their cars. We need to take the drivers ability and experience into consideration when said driver shows up an event with their car and the intention of racing it. I’ve posted on a couple of other threads that we really should be looking at a graduated progressive hierarchy and how the drivers work their way up into the top classes similar to what the NHRA does. I’m a drag racer from over a decade ago and that is my experience and I’ve always built my cars to an appropriate class. That’s where I think we may have an issue, especially for guys like myself who are in the middle of building our cars.

For example; If I show up at an event with my ZL1 with its big tires, big brakes and Supercharged horsepower would you put me in the class with the big boys on the track? I sure as heck hope not because I have no business being out there with the likes of Pro drivers and at the speeds they drive at. I would be a hindrance and only get in the way regardless of my car. Do you remember the SLAP heard around the world on RUFTR? That’s the kind of mistakes a rookie like me makes because we just don’t know any better regardless of the performance ability of my car.

There are some awesome cars being built on this website and I am really enjoy the journey in both building my car and watching others. But that is no way an endorsement that I want to be out on the track at high speeds with any of them if they don’t know what they are doing. That includes myself because I am willing to bet that 90% of us have no business being out there in our homemade super-cars driving at those speeds. In all honesty do any of you Pro-Drivers (I mean that in the nicest way to folks like Brian, Bill, Mark, Bret, Mary, Dave, Larry, etc.) really want to be stuck behind my slow a$$ driving around a track as you lap me and folks like me who don’t understand what a line is, and not knowing what I’m going to do next? I think not.

There HAS to be a class for the Pro-type drivers and some for Novices and Intimidates regardless of what car we show up in. I’m learning a lot from Ron’s safety thread and its changing the direction of my build. My question to you is do you want to be on the track with me as I “learn” how to race just because I showed up in a car with all the race qualified goodies on it. Just because I can build it or buy it doesn’t mean I have any clue how to race and drive it.

On the subject of having fun. It’s one thing to say throw out the timer and we are all here to enjoy ourselves and another to get blown away. I’m all for having a good time but nobody likes to get blown out of the water when they are having fun on the track or anything else for that matter. We all want to be close but the reality is that’s never going to happen with the different driving abilities of the people on the track and their cars. There needs to be a division of the cars and drivers into appropriate classes for everyone to be competitive and keep it close. Just like the NHRA does with classes and progression through those classes. As you get faster you move up through the classes and the safety requirements change so you are ready with both skill and safety requirements relevant to the speeds you are going. The whole fun thing will only carry you so far, for example; when Canada and the USA play hockey, we all like to have a close game but, when Canada blows the USA out 25-2 there is no enjoyment in it. :poke:

Just my thoughts on the subject and I hope to someday get to an event and watch all of you rip up the track and have fun, safely.

[Project92rs]

My thoughts on the rules.
Rule 20-21 : Wouldn't everyone in run group A be a pro by definition(possession of a comp license, or the credentials to do so)?


I highly doubt this. I had 2 individuals at my house on New Years Day getting some parts off a parts car for their track toy. Both have competition licenses as they race things that are certified to do the 1/4 mile in under 8 seconds. Neither of them make any money from driving their cars at the track though. At least not officially at the track. But the speeds require certain certs to be out there.

As for the rest of the rules, there are a couple of bullets I'd like to see more details on. And I'd really like to see the tech card in advance of registering but none of these rules really surprised me. Some of them are less strict than the SCCA and ASCS guidelines we've been working to for a few years.

[James OLC]

The whole Pro vs. Joe thing is being seriously overthought... I thought that the USCA's rules were pretty self explanatory and I would guess that James is being slightly/deliberately obtuse. If you wanted to make it easy to follow then you could have simply stated "If you made more money in cash and/or parts last year then you spent then you are a PRO." I think on that basis it is safe to say that nobody in this little community is a Pro. But then what? Bring your tax forms to tech?

[79-TA]

The whole Pro vs. Joe thing is being seriously overthought... I thought that the USCA's rules were pretty self explanatory and I would guess that James is being slightly/deliberately obtuse. If you wanted to make it easy to follow then you could have simply stated "If you made more money in cash and/or parts last year then you spent then you are a PRO." I think on that basis it is safe to say that nobody in this little community is a Pro. But then what? Bring your tax forms to tech?

"If competitive driving is not currently, or ever has been, your primary or significant source of income, you are an amateur."

I didn't find the rule hard to interpret, but I did find its existence a bit odd. Are we that afraid that Leh Keen might show up or something?

[James OLC]

"If competitive driving is not currently, or ever has been, your primary or significant source of income, you are an amateur."

I didn't find the rule hard to interpret, but I did find its existence a bit odd. Are we that afraid that Leh Keen might show up or something?

Having "raced" with Leh for the last four years... Yes. Yes I am.

Most of the rules are carry overs from the OUSCI truly set where you did have pro drivers show up (or at least seriously talk about it). I remember turning to the guy beside me at the drivers meeting in 2010 and it taking a minute to register that it was Paul Tracy. You'd be surprised what some vendors would do to place well.

[David Pozzi]

Randy Pobst is at my house now building my Camaro...

[Cobra 498]

Randy Pobst is at my house now building my Camaro...

When he is done he will be completely revamping my Cobra and adding a 200 shot nitrous system for the straits, he said he can make most of the USCA dates.

[Badger]

The registered owner or an immediate family member should be the only driver.... period. If you can't drive your mega hp pro-touring machine, then learn. If you're not gonna learn why do you have it?!

I don't understand the kit car rule either. As long as its a replica of a car that was produced why not allow it? Example: I could build and run a C2 Corvette using a Morrison or Roadster shop chassis, custom body panels, LS engine, T56, Forgeline wheels, etc and make it look like a Grand Sport but I couldn't buy a 63 Grand Sport replica kit build it with very similar parts and run it?!?!

[David Pozzi]

I think the rules will evolve over time. This is just the first shot at doing this series & they will improve it as they go.

[BMR Sales]

Randy Pobst is at my house now building my Camaro...

I thought Randy was at Daytona for the Tudor "Roar before the 24"!

[Cobra 498]

I thought Randy was at Daytona for the Tudor "Roar before the 24"!

David,

Some how, I think our attempts at humor have failed, like Randy would help either of us or drive our cars, NOT! I am not sure he even knows how to turn a wrench at the required levels.

[Smittys]

Looks like the sponsors are stepping up for this.


88213882148821588216

[mpozzi]

I thought Randy was at Daytona for the Tudor "Roar before the 24"!

No ... we cloned him at OUSCI. Between Bruce and Dave, we have the only "copies" and as the Christmas giving season is over, we ain't sharing.

Our Randy is exceptional at building a car due to the addition of DNA from Mark Stielow. I managed to get a hair follicle that was embedded in Mark's helmet (unfortunately, there was only one ...) when he left it unattended and, voila, we now have Marandy Stiepoblow at our beck and call.

Mary Pozzi

[CarlC]

I put air in Randy's tires at the OUSCI. Does that make me a a "pro"?

[dontlifttoshift]

Marandy Stiepoblow

I saw her in a dirty movie once!

[ChevelleNV]

I saw her in a dirty movie once!

lol....

[mpozzi]

Okay ... I'm putting on my "Serious Stuff" cap and found some really good information on how to meet sound at Laguna Seca. Those of you who are contemplating entering the first USCA event that's going to be held at this track are not the first (nor the last ...) to have feared the dB meter and here's a link to peruse at your leisure. We are about two months out and there's plenty of time to get that exhaust on your ride healthy,happy, and quiet.

http://www.norcal-saac.org/track/soundadvice.html

Study up, do your homework, and we will see your bad selves come March.

Mary Pozzi

[mpozzi]

... and there's more!

Here's some excellent information about track driving and a tutorial on specifically for Laguna Seca.

http://www.norcal-saac.org/track/

Between this and the information on being compliant for sound, you have NO excuses.

Mary Pozzi

[lzdick]

Lmao

[71RS/SS396]

... and there's more!

Here's some excellent information about track driving and a tutorial on specifically for Laguna Seca.

http://www.norcal-saac.org/track/

Between this and the information on being compliant for sound, you have NO excuses.

Mary Pozzi

I have plenty of excuses Mary, non of them are good but I have plenty of them. I doubt I will go to the trouble of changing up my exhaust for one track.

[DesertFox]

... and there's more!

Here's some excellent information about track driving and a tutorial on specifically for Laguna Seca.

http://www.norcal-saac.org/track/

Between this and the information on being compliant for sound, you have NO excuses.

Mary Pozzi
Thanks Mary!
(But I always have an excuse.... ;) )

[mpozzi]

You are all funny ...

Mary P.

[mpozzi]

Ha, Tim. You've got a most excellent excuse. You're about 3,000 miles away from the event.

Mary

[BMR Sales]

No ... we cloned him at OUSCI. Between Bruce and Dave, we have the only "copies" and as the Christmas giving season is over, we ain't sharing.

Our Randy is exceptional at building a car due to the addition of DNA from Mark Stielow. I managed to get a hair follicle that was embedded in Mark's helmet (unfortunately, there was only one ...) when he left it unattended and, voila, we now have Marandy Stiepoblow at our beck and call.

Mary Pozzi

I beat Randy in a Race, Does that make a Pro?

[79-TA]

So, I'm still dying to figure one thing out. How much track time can we reasonably expect at these events? How about Laguna Seca in particular?

This assumes a reliable car that won't miss any sessions due to mechanical difficulties.

[Damn True]

I beat Randy in a Race, Does that make a Pro?

Pie eating contests don't count

[DesertFox]

So, I'm still dying to figure one thing out. How much track time can we reasonably expect at these events? How about Laguna Seca in particular?

This assumes a reliable car that won't miss any sessions due to mechanical difficulties.

I kinda wondered that too. However my viewpoint is I'll try the first one. If I like it I'll do another. If I don't like, I won't go to another. Even if it sucks, I get a fun road trip out of it and get to see people I know, so it wouldn't be a total loss.

Of course how much bang for the buck falls into play here. I'm waiting to see pricing on this thing.

[bret]

I kinda wondered that too. However my viewpoint is I'll try the first one. If I like it I'll do another. If I don't like, I won't go to another. Even if it sucks, I get a fun road trip out of it and get to see people I know, so it wouldn't be a total loss.

Of course how much bang for the buck falls into play here. I'm waiting to see pricing on this thing.

In my experience of participating in OUSCI events [and I have participated in ALL of them] you will likely be too tired to run the last session[s]. I have never heard anyone say they didn't get enough track time.

Another thing...In my experience these events run like clockwork. You'll have a printed schedule that will be adhered to. Only the largest of unforseen track problems will affect that schedule.

It won't suck. :)