Dash panel replacement

[73z-6sp]

I am replacing the metal dash panel on my 68 Camaro. I am curious how others who have done this re-installed the VIN plate. Are there replacement rivets made for this or did you just use pop rivets? Are there any legal issues doing this repair? I dont want anyone in the future to think I am trying to pass off a fake title/car/etc.

Thanks

Aaron

[ProdigyCustoms]

You need what are called rossette rivits. You can get them from a company called trim Tags, they are the ones that sell the repo Trim Tags. You will have to look them up.

[73z-6sp]

Thanks for the info! I will do a search for them.

[toxicz28]

I believe this is the link you want.
http://www.trimtags.com/index.html
But I didn't see any vin rivets on their site. I know that in most states, it is legal to remove vin/ cowl tags and replace the, providing it is necessary for the repair. Contact your states dmv to verify this.

[shoddy_f-body]

Why bother with the original rivets? I just used regular pop rivets.The only way you see the head of the rivet is with the dash pad off. If your not trying to fake anything who cares?you replaced the dash top like 1000's of others. Anyone who knows camaros knows that there are hidden VINS so a tag swap is easy to catch. You won't find those rivets for sale by any reputable companies.. Its a federal offense to even possess them,let alone sell them. You can find guys selling them at swap meets but why bother?

[Jim Nilsen]

OK, imagine you are in another state in a small town and you get pulled over by a very thinking he is smart officer of the law. He is looking for anything he can to right you up for but doesn't have anything on you that he can pin you with to get your car to the impound lot yet. The rules in his town are very unconstitutional but noone has taken them to the supreme court of their state so they do what they voted on since they can do that in a municpality. Fed law says you have to have rosette pop rivets in the vin tag to be legal and he notices you don't. Before you can get to a good lawyer and after your car is impounded, your car is gone at auction and you have nothing left to recover.

I know that most of us are laughing right now and it is as far fetched as it can be, but when you are in a place that the law is practicing the way they want to, then the world changes to guilty until proven innocent. Anyone who has ever been there before can tell you that it is a bad situation to be in and finding a lawyer that can help you is sometimes a hard thing to do at the time.

Anytime you can make sure your car is legal in anyway possible over something as small as a poprivet it is worth the extra few dollars.

Any car that has the side markers removed is a target for impound if the car was made 1968 or after. Yet many people still insist on removing them.

Just a point of view and not neccessarily fact but when the officer of the law uses his opinion over fact it makes things harder than you may think.

Don't drive around with an invitation if you don't have to.

Jim Nilsen

[shoddy_f-body]

So i suppose in this scenario the cop makes you remove your dash pad so he can look at your tag? Its not illegal to remove the tag and install it on the same vehicle to perform a repair.A lot of cars they were installed with the head pointing down so you would need to stick your head under the dash and try and see from there(good luck)This subject has been beat to death on camaros.net if you care to read more. If you really must have them buy some stainless rivets and file them.

[ProdigyCustoms]

The rivets do go in upside down, in other words, from the bottom. It is not illegal to possess them, there are multiple sources that sell them. I had a car that the VIN was lost. To be able to buy a new correct VIN plate, We had to have a police officer come by, verify the VIN from a hidden number and the motor (2 locations), along with a title to tell what the first numbers of the VIN were. We then were able to get a perfect repo of the VIN plate complete with Rosette rivets. The cop then came and verified the installation. No handcuffs for me yet.

Technically, you would need to contact DMV if you were touching the VIN in anyway, but nobody does when they are just changing a dash top.

I can tell you regular pop rivets are considered wrong by anyone, and pros won't do it.

[shoddy_f-body]

Whos going to know what kind of rivet it is if the head faces down unless you take stuff apart? Most guys just rivet them in with regular old rivets and forget about it. As long as your hidden VINS match your tag,how the tag is attached is really a non issue.Everyone knows camaro dashes rust out.
Not illegal to possess rosette rivets? Read -
from http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dn_0101_17630_7.pdf

VIN Tampering, Receiving and
Concealing Law—Public Act 217 went
into effect on October 1, 2000. This
legislation amends the receiving and
concealing section of the Michigan Penal
Code. It is now a felony for a person to
buy, receive, or obtain control of a motor
vehicle or motor vehicle part knowing
the identification number has been
removed, obliterated, tampered with, or
altered.
It is also a felony to knowingly
possess, buy, deliver, or offer to buy, sell,
exchange, or give away any
manufacturers’ VIN plate, federal safety
certification label, antitheft label,
posident die stamp, Secretary of State
VIN labels, rosette rivet, or any facsimile
thereof. The law contains several new
definitions including posident die stamps
and rosette rivets.

[ProdigyCustoms]

So it is in Michigan, I didn't know.

[MrQuick]

As far as I know when vin tags are reinstalled it must be replaced with original style rosette rivets and a document of replacment by DMV. It then gets inspected by either law enforcement officer or a DMV inspecter. As long as there is a paper trail there should be no problem.
To me its better to be cautious and do it right than be wrong down the line and lose your car or get a fine. But on the same note if the hidden vin locations numbers match the tag then that might save you.

[shoddy_f-body]

Most states have a similar law on the books. If it helps you sleep at night use rosette rivets and take it to DMV.
You could just grind the back off of the rivets, use a punch to tap the rivet out and reapply the tag to the new dash using a dab of epoxy or metal bond in the holes and sliding the head/shaft of the rivet back through the hole. A dab on the back of the tag wouldn't hurt either. I removed my original rivets that way, but then decided to just use regular rivets. The law isn't concerned about a remove and reinstall to make a repair.They are concerned about tag swapping.And to tell you the truth i have heard from auto theft detectives that they are not concerned about people restoring old cars.They are concerned about new car theft. Even if you have rosette rivets its going to be obvious that the dash panel was changed unless you use a welder that can duplicate factory spot welds. So if you have a dash panel thats mig welded in and rosette rivets who are you fooling?

[Jim Nilsen]

So what states and who still is able to sell or recieve rivets?
I'm in Illinois and need them. I wish I had gottten them before 2000 when I was still painting the car but I didn't feel the rush for them until the paint was done. By that time Trim tags had stopped advertising them for sale.

I wonder if my local DMV sells them?

Anyone in ILL. know for sure?

Jim Nilsen