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    1. #1
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Location
      St. George, UT
      Posts
      1,144
      Country Flag: United States

      ATS Spindles- A great product gets even better!

      Hey all- Most of you either own or have probably heard of ATS forged tall spindles. They've been leading the industry since their inception which is no surprise why Speedtech took over ATS along the way.

      Inspired by the new ExtReme spindle and suspension geometry numbers we recently went back to the design board and looked at ways to improve the tall spindle that's made for factory Chevelle/ A-body and G-Body frames. What we've come up with is a spindle that remains the same but we now have replaced the old steering arms with a new steering arm design that will be standard equipment for both applications from now forward. This new steering arm gives even better out-of-the-box bump steer numbers and Ackermann is now WAY better, giving you some serious turn-in through the corners. It doesn't stop there, both the A-body and G-body spindles now have an optional bump steer tuning kit for those that want to dial it in to your specific car and driving style.



      If you already run the ATS tall spindles on your A or G-body you can buy the new steering arm kit and simply replace your old steering arms to add that new geometry advantage! If you've purchased one of our ExtReme chassis, the ExtReme spindle already has awesome geometry numbers built in.

      Go to www.speedtechperformance.com, find your application and click on ATS spindles on the suspension page to learn more of the details!

      Taking the best and making it even better, well that's a win-win for everyone!



      -Ben, Creative Director at Speedtech Performance
      We sell some really cool parts, build cool cars, and do cool concept renderings too!
      435-628-4300 www.speedtechperformance.com
      My Pumkinator build thread- https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...ght=pumkinator


    2. #2
      Join Date
      Jun 2012
      Location
      South Lyon, MI
      Posts
      1,217
      Country Flag: United States
      Good work as always.

    3. #3
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Location
      St. George, UT
      Posts
      1,144
      Country Flag: United States
      Thanks Bill!
      -Ben, Creative Director at Speedtech Performance
      We sell some really cool parts, build cool cars, and do cool concept renderings too!
      435-628-4300 www.speedtechperformance.com
      My Pumkinator build thread- https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...ght=pumkinator

    4. #4
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Harriman, Tennessee
      Posts
      1,288
      Country Flag: United States
      Sweet! I have Global West upper and lower arms (for the B-Body spindle), will I need to change anything to run these?
      Why do termites eat houses?

      Because they have
      Munchausen Syndrome.

    5. #5
      Join Date
      Mar 2005
      Location
      St George Utah
      Posts
      1,243
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by ProTouring442 View Post
      Sweet! I have Global West upper and lower arms (for the B-Body spindle), will I need to change anything to run these?
      yes the control arms
      Blake Foster
      www.speedtechperformance.com
      435-628-4300
      St. George Utah.
      it's always sunny here.

    6. #6
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Harriman, Tennessee
      Posts
      1,288
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by killer69 View Post
      yes the control arms
      Why? They're made for tall spindles.
      Why do termites eat houses?

      Because they have
      Munchausen Syndrome.

    7. #7
      Join Date
      Nov 2002
      Location
      Georgetown,TX
      Posts
      2,557
      Quote Originally Posted by ProTouring442 View Post
      Why? They're made for tall spindles.
      Yours were made for tall B-body spindles.

    8. #8
      Join Date
      Mar 2005
      Location
      St George Utah
      Posts
      1,243
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by ProTouring442 View Post
      Why? They're made for tall spindles.
      the b body is a 10 deg KPI the ATS is 8 deg so in reality you should be able to use the lowers but have to order the spindle for the G Body to match the ball joint tapers then replace the upper control are with a stock length A body arm but swap the ball joint to a g Body ball joint.
      Blake Foster
      www.speedtechperformance.com
      435-628-4300
      St. George Utah.
      it's always sunny here.

    9. #9
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Harriman, Tennessee
      Posts
      1,288
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by killer69 View Post
      the b body is a 10 deg KPI the ATS is 8 deg so in reality you should be able to use the lowers but have to order the spindle for the G Body to match the ball joint tapers then replace the upper control are with a stock length A body arm but swap the ball joint to a g Body ball joint.
      Or I could replace the lower ball joint with an A-body ball joint. I don't have a problem with that.

      I am a bit confused about the "stock length" upper arm being necessary. Is the upper ball joint location on the ATS spindle in a different place so as to make it so proper camber can be achieved with the taller spindle?
      Why do termites eat houses?

      Because they have
      Munchausen Syndrome.

    10. #10
      Join Date
      Mar 2005
      Location
      St George Utah
      Posts
      1,243
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by ProTouring442 View Post
      Or I could replace the lower ball joint with an A-body ball joint. I don't have a problem with that.

      I am a bit confused about the "stock length" upper arm being necessary. Is the upper ball joint location on the ATS spindle in a different place so as to make it so proper camber can be achieved with the taller spindle?
      No you can not replace just the lower ball join as the housing is a different size.. THE B Body ball joint is in a different place compared to the factory or ATS spindle. if you use the B body upper control arm on the ATS spindle you would end up with maybe 5 deg Neg camber?? if you really want a set of ATS spindles we can make it work for you. upper control arm with a different ball joint and the spindles and steering arms. DONE.
      Blake Foster
      www.speedtechperformance.com
      435-628-4300
      St. George Utah.
      it's always sunny here.

    11. #11
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Harriman, Tennessee
      Posts
      1,288
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by killer69 View Post
      No you can not replace just the lower ball join as the housing is a different size.. THE B Body ball joint is in a different place compared to the factory or ATS spindle. if you use the B body upper control arm on the ATS spindle you would end up with maybe 5 deg Neg camber?? if you really want a set of ATS spindles we can make it work for you. upper control arm with a different ball joint and the spindles and steering arms. DONE.

      If I "really want"? "DONE"? I hope you didn't mean that to sound as snarky as it did.
      Why do termites eat houses?

      Because they have
      Munchausen Syndrome.

    12. #12
      Join Date
      Apr 2001
      Location
      The City of Fountains
      Posts
      15,971
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by ProTouring442 View Post
      If I "really want"? "DONE"? I hope you didn't mean that to sound as snarky as it did.
      I am sure he meant it as "Done deal" as in "no problem."

      Andrew
      1970 GTO Version 3.0
      1967 Cougar build
      GM High-Tech Performance feature
      My YouTube Channel Please Subscribe!
      Instagram @projectgattago
      Dr. EFI
      I deliver what EFI promises.
      Remote Holley EFI tuning.
      Please get in touch if I can be of service.

      "You were the gun, your voice was the trigger, your bravery was the barrel, your eyes were the bullets." ~ Her

    13. #13
      Join Date
      Apr 2001
      Location
      The City of Fountains
      Posts
      15,971
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by Ben@SpeedTech View Post
      Hey all- Most of you either own or have probably heard of ATS forged tall spindles. They've been leading the industry since their inception which is no surprise why Speedtech took over ATS along the way.

      Inspired by the new ExtReme spindle and suspension geometry numbers we recently went back to the design board and looked at ways to improve the tall spindle that's made for factory Chevelle/ A-body and G-Body frames. What we've come up with is a spindle that remains the same but we now have replaced the old steering arms with a new steering arm design that will be standard equipment for both applications from now forward. This new steering arm gives even better out-of-the-box bump steer numbers and Ackermann is now WAY better, giving you some serious turn-in through the corners. It doesn't stop there, both the A-body and G-body spindles now have an optional bump steer tuning kit for those that want to dial it in to your specific car and driving style.

      If you already run the ATS tall spindles on your A or G-body you can buy the new steering arm kit and simply replace your old steering arms to add that new geometry advantage! If you've purchased one of our ExtReme chassis, the ExtReme spindle already has awesome geometry numbers built in.

      Go to www.speedtechperformance.com, find your application and click on ATS spindles on the suspension page to learn more of the details!

      Taking the best and making it even better, well that's a win-win for everyone!



      Ben,

      Pretend I am stupid for a minute (I actually mostly am when it comes to suspension geometry).

      I have ATS spindles on my GTO. What are the real world advantages of these new arms and would I notice a difference, and if so, how would that difference manifest?

      Andrew
      1970 GTO Version 3.0
      1967 Cougar build
      GM High-Tech Performance feature
      My YouTube Channel Please Subscribe!
      Instagram @projectgattago
      Dr. EFI
      I deliver what EFI promises.
      Remote Holley EFI tuning.
      Please get in touch if I can be of service.

      "You were the gun, your voice was the trigger, your bravery was the barrel, your eyes were the bullets." ~ Her

    14. #14
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Location
      St. George, UT
      Posts
      1,144
      Country Flag: United States
      Great question Andrew. Does your car handle great as it is? Likely so, the old design ATS spindle that came with the company when Speedtech merged them with us was based on some leading thought and decent geometry, likely safe to say it set the pace for top Pro Touring performance. With the inception of the new ExtReme suspension package with much better overall geometry sparked the thought of can we improve on what we have here with the standard AFX tall spindle to take on some of the great attributes of the ExtReme suspnsion? The answer was yes. For a street cruiser when we tested it on Blake's 86 GN and Alan's 70 Chevelle we found an even smoother and less twitchy ride. Attribute a lot of that to bump steer improvements. On the track the big advantage is the turn in. Imagine the inner tire helping "pull" the outer through the turn. The result is faster and stickier cornering. Probably the best testimonial so far of this type of set up is Lance Hamilton with his "Barney" G-body Monte SS here on the forum. He said he felt a significant increase in tight cornering capability with this type of set up on his ATS spindles. Maybe he'll add to the discussion here, or he has a fantastic well logged build thread you can look up. Hope that helps, let us know if you have further questions!
      -Ben, Creative Director at Speedtech Performance
      We sell some really cool parts, build cool cars, and do cool concept renderings too!
      435-628-4300 www.speedtechperformance.com
      My Pumkinator build thread- https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...ght=pumkinator

    15. #15
      Join Date
      Aug 2012
      Location
      Peoria, AZ
      Posts
      1,758
      Country Flag: United States
      Andrew, I bet if you look at the steering arms on your ATS spindles, they curve inward toward the center of the car as they head out to where the tie rod end attaches. Basically these are now designed so that they can be flipped side to side so the steering arm can point outward toward the wheel instead of inward where the tie rod attaches. This along with the new bumpsteer kit which raises or lowers the tie rod end pivot where it attaches to the steering arm let you dial in both bump steer and Ackerman to your specific needs.

      I had a bumpsteer kit on my stock G-Body spindles and had already dialed that in to a near perfect state for my use which I retained when I put the ATS spindles on last fall as part of my brake upgrade. Ron Sutton had me reverse the steering arms on the ATS spindles to point outward which increased my Ackerman. On my first test drive after the install I hit a long high speed highway off ramp and could tell right away the inside front tire was working harder, very small inputs to the steering wheel resulted in immediate reactions from the front tires. It really helped secure the feel from the front tires. When I took it to the track the first time after I could really tell the difference, turn in was so much more precise...you could actually feel the inside tire digging in trying to help the car turn quicker.

      I haven't put the car on turnplates yet but will do so very soon as I just picked up a nice set of Longacre turnplates. Once I do I'll update the class on just how much Ackerman we have on Barney with these new arms.

      In regards to how much you would notice the difference these make, I can't know for sure. In my opinion it is more on the fine tuning end of the stick vs the just geometry correcting end...and will probably be noticed more when taking corners at speed than anywhere else. There are zero side effects so no reason not to do it that I'm aware of.

      Hope that helps... Obviously I'm a big fan of these new steering arms.
      Lance
      1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car

    16. #16
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Location
      St. George, UT
      Posts
      1,144
      Country Flag: United States
      Thanks Lance!!

      On top of what Lance said, I believe he got phase one of this upgrade where the arms that we had could be swapped side to side to point outward. Now we have completely new arms that have changed tie rod pick up points to also improve bump steer without the adjusting kit, and these arms will suffice for the bolt on and go folks. The adjusting kit is available as a separate option with it's own specific arm to dial bump steer in even more for your exact application.
      -Ben, Creative Director at Speedtech Performance
      We sell some really cool parts, build cool cars, and do cool concept renderings too!
      435-628-4300 www.speedtechperformance.com
      My Pumkinator build thread- https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...ght=pumkinator

    17. #17
      Join Date
      Mar 2005
      Location
      St George Utah
      Posts
      1,243
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by andrewb70 View Post
      I am sure he meant it as "Done deal" as in "no problem."

      Andrew
      Correct
      Blake Foster
      www.speedtechperformance.com
      435-628-4300
      St. George Utah.
      it's always sunny here.

    18. #18
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Harriman, Tennessee
      Posts
      1,288
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by killer69 View Post
      Correct

      Cool... It's typing, it doesn't always convey what we're trying to say! :D

      Thanks!
      Why do termites eat houses?

      Because they have
      Munchausen Syndrome.

    19. #19
      Join Date
      May 2010
      Location
      kitchener,Ontario,Canada
      Posts
      2,336
      Country Flag: Canada
      is there a major difference with tire wear by using the bumpsteer kit, or any other negatives ?
      Spinnin'my tires in life's fast lane

      Ryan Austin
      On twitter @raustinss
      On Instagram austinss70

    20. #20
      Join Date
      Mar 2005
      Location
      St George Utah
      Posts
      1,243
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by raustinss View Post
      is there a major difference with tire wear by using the bumpsteer kit, or any other negatives ?
      if anything it may lessen the tire wear as they do not scrub as much when turning
      Blake Foster
      www.speedtechperformance.com
      435-628-4300
      St. George Utah.
      it's always sunny here.

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